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Economy - 4/17/2010 6:59:31 PM   
Gargoil

 

Posts: 389
Joined: 1/6/2008
Status: offline 		Every game I play, I say this time I will keep my economy under control.

But every game, sooner or later I drop into the red and keep dropping.

I scrapped 3 out of 5 construction ships. I scrapped down to a maximum of 2 troops per colony except I kept 4 on my homeworld. I had only 1 cruiser, 6 destroyers, 5 frigates and 5 escorts for a empire with 10 colonies in 8 systems. I had 4 exploration ships. I had most colonies at around a 30-35% tax rate (a couple of these colonies where a few hundred mill pop, independents that I invaded. Others were small a few tens of millions and growing). I had small space ports at each colony. I even scrapped additional ships and bases that I discovered along the way.

The only thing I had lots of was mines. Which I thought is a good thing for the economy. I felt very weak and vulnerable having only 6 fleets of 3 ships each to cover my empire. Was I to drop to even a lower amount of ships? Should I have built less mines? Less space ports? Colonize slower?

< Message edited by Gargoil -- 4/17/2010 7:00:50 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: Economy - 4/17/2010 7:07:51 PM   
Malevolence


Posts: 1781
Joined: 4/3/2010
Status: offline 		Did you use the pre-designed ships and bases?

Check your ship designs to make sure you are using designs that are effective. Make sure your small space port was designed correctly for example. Were you getting your bonuses? Enough cargo space in freighters?

What did the happiness look like at your colonies? How was their development going?

Can you post a screen shot of your empire screen?




_____________________________

Nicht kleckern, sondern klotzen!

*Please remember all posts are made by a malevolent, autocratic despot whose rule is marked by unjust severity and arbitrary behavior. Your experiences may vary.

(in reply to Gargoil)
Post #: 2
RE: Economy - 4/17/2010 7:20:55 PM   
Gargoil

 

Posts: 389
Joined: 1/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Malevolence

Did you use the pre-designed ships and bases?


I redesigned everything. Everything I put on ships and bases made logical sense. For example, I reduced my Destroyer down to size 200 - give it 1 extra fuel tank.
quote:


Check your ship designs to make sure you are using designs that are effective. Make sure your small space port was designed correctly for example. Were you getting your bonuses? Enough cargo space in freighters?

I suppose my spaceport is effective. It didn't have a lot of fat on it. Can it have to much cargo? It a a few weapons and shields - not excessive.
quote:


What did the happiness look like at your colonies? How was their development going?

Every colony was better than +15 and everyone I set the tax so they would be at 99% complience, except one or two of the newest and they were getting better and developing.

(in reply to Malevolence)
Post #: 3
RE: Economy - 4/17/2010 7:23:29 PM   
Sliverine

 

Posts: 155
Joined: 4/15/2010
Status: offline 		same problem as you. saw what was wrong. too many mines is a bad thing since if you arent in need of them, the additional resources they bring in are just going to get stockpiled and you have to keep footing the maint fees.

The only thing that brings in money is colonies. The trick is to hunt for as many colonies as possible at the start. At game start design or load a design for explorer ships that have loads of fuel tanks so they can go further. Make bout 5-7 of those if you can and then manually assign one or two to explore each of your adjacent sectors. If its still too slow group each explorer vessel to a hotkey from 1-0 and manually control them. While you are doing that you can give the AI control of your economy or if you are a control freak like me, just multitask everything :)

(in reply to Malevolence)
Post #: 4
RE: Economy - 4/17/2010 9:35:10 PM   
Gargoil

 

Posts: 389
Joined: 1/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sliverine

same problem as you. saw what was wrong. too many mines is a bad thing since if you arent in need of them, the additional resources they bring in are just going to get stockpiled and you have to keep footing the maint fees.

The only thing that brings in money is colonies. The trick is to hunt for as many colonies as possible at the start. At game start design or load a design for explorer ships that have loads of fuel tanks so they can go further. Make bout 5-7 of those if you can and then manually assign one or two to explore each of your adjacent sectors. If its still too slow group each explorer vessel to a hotkey from 1-0 and manually control them. While you are doing that you can give the AI control of your economy or if you are a control freak like me, just multitask everything :)



The too many mines thing makes sense. I did have a very high maintenance bill from them. I think it was something like 20K for them alone. Thats a lot for a small starting empire that is bringing in only about 58k total.

But this now begs the question of what is the proper number of mines? I have tried to watch my stockpiles for where I am low. But I guess you can have too much of a good thing.

(in reply to Sliverine)
Post #: 5
RE: Economy - 4/18/2010 3:08:12 AM   
Sliverine

 

Posts: 155
Joined: 4/15/2010
Status: offline 		err u dont really need alot of mines. You prolly need bout maybe like about say 10 tops for the whole game. After the initial stage, colonizing planets became a breeze (due to other races being merged into yr empire) and so, mines were almost not needed anymore. And even if you dont make mines, the private sector will still create miners to make up for any resource lack so mines should be seen as a way to bolster any resources of which u lack rather then a requirement.

An example is, if you dont put any Caslon mines, gas miners will automatically collect caslon as demand for it rises. The problem with relying on miners alone is that sometimes (tho they are not supposed to do this), they dont actually move until some port somewhere needs it, then they start going. This causes quite a bit of delay in yr resource collection which isnt good. Static mines are a way of ensuring a constant resource flow since mines are always running and freighters pick up resources more often then miners going out to mine. Therefore it is only correct that you should put mines for critical resources that you cannot afford to have a bottleneck occuring. One mine alone is able to mine pretty fast (a 40 mining rate mine can mine 2400 of a 50% resource in one minute. You typically need about 100-200 of the more common resources per vessel you make and each vessel uses about 15 components (of which 5-8 actually require that much) so 3-4 mines working at full steam with each mining a variety of resources can probably handle all of your construction needs early game and by late game, you will be so swamped with colonies you wont even need any mines anymore!

(in reply to Gargoil)
Post #: 6
RE: Economy - 4/18/2010 8:49:48 AM   
lostsm

 

Posts: 170
Joined: 7/10/2009
Status: offline 		seems colonies is the key right? the colony taxation pays for everything? mines/gas stations/etc are just a bare pittance from what you can extract from the settled populations of planets

(in reply to Sliverine)
Post #: 7
RE: Economy - 4/18/2010 9:04:44 AM   
Sliverine

 

Posts: 155
Joined: 4/15/2010
Status: offline 		yea colonies is the KEY. <--- capitalised.

mines are merely supportive elements to help you jumpstart your colonies (which u can do without either...just build a starbase on it with recre/med facilities) and to enable you to construct your ships without having to wait 30 minutes.

(in reply to lostsm)
Post #: 8
RE: Economy - 4/18/2010 9:11:15 AM   
Malevolence


Posts: 1781
Joined: 4/3/2010
Status: offline 		You can buy colonies from other empires cheap in the first few minutes after they colonize them. Good way to get other races into your empire quickly. Also good to make sure your empire doesn't share a system with other empires (which will eventually drive your staunchest ally to attack you).




_____________________________

Nicht kleckern, sondern klotzen!

*Please remember all posts are made by a malevolent, autocratic despot whose rule is marked by unjust severity and arbitrary behavior. Your experiences may vary.

(in reply to Sliverine)
Post #: 9
RE: Economy - 4/18/2010 9:15:02 PM   
Gargoil

 

Posts: 389
Joined: 1/6/2008
Status: offline 		OP here. I thank everyone who posted replies here. I have a handle on mines now. In my current game the ecomony is doing fine. Not only did I build less mines - I have started to scrap some as acquire better locations and colonies.

(in reply to Malevolence)
Post #: 10
RE: Economy - 4/18/2010 10:38:06 PM   
Interesting

 

Posts: 120
Joined: 4/4/2010
Status: offline 		When we start playing, we think "more mines = better".
I wish it was like that.
Like when I played Warcraft 1, or the first Age of Empires, I always tried to deplete all the resources, cut all trees and so on. Because more often than not, I would need them all, or I would like to prevent my enemy from having them.

Here,
the resources you get are a thousand times more abundant than you will ever need and you get them 10-20 times faster than you will actually use them.
And the maintenance cost of a mine will end up turning it into a drag, rather than an asset! But then again, having just 2-3 colonies with max population and development relativizes the former by a hundred times itself, so even if you have a bunch of useless mines (mining stuff you already have and you will never use) costing maintenance, in the end colony revenue generation is ridiculous, so any maintenance cost is relativised by it.

You only need one source of each type of resource within 1.000.000 range of each other or something. (based on freighters unknown game mechanics behaviour, god I hate not being in control)

When you make a mine, make sure it has more cargo, weapons, shield, reactors, extractors than the default design.

(in reply to Gargoil)
Post #: 11
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