A Supply Problem in China

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A Supply Problem in China - 12/4/2013 6:48:47 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

I'm truly mystified why I'm having a supply problem in China for the Japanese side. I set up the Japanese HQ Umezu in Nanchang, hex 84,145. In my first game in the first turn I noticed that I missed that some of the rail lines running into Nanchang were still Nationalist Chinese controlled from the set up. Big oops so I decided to set the game up again.

On my second set up I set up Umezu near Shanghai and walked him to Nanchang while in supply. However once in Nanchang it went out of supply yet again and units that could trace a basic supply path to Umezu couldn't.

So I decide to rail Terauchi down to hex 83,147, three hexes from Shanghai and four hexes from Umezu. I thought for sure that after Terauchi was reorganized on the third turn I'd have supply all the way to Umezu.

Now all of this is happening during Fine weather, so I should have a four hex supply path. I even set Terauchi three hexes away to have that one last hex for sea supply tracing. I reread the Rules as Coded about supply paths and I'm mystified why Umezu isn't in supply.

First of all I can trace a line of Japanese controlled rail hexes from Nanchang to Shanghai so according to the supply pathing rule I should be able to trace supply from Umezu to Shangai as no hexes used since all hexes can be traced along rail lines. With Terauchi at hex 84,143 I should be able to trace a basic supply path from Umezu to Terauchi of 4 hexes, regardless of rail lines. Then from Terauchi to Shanghai for three hexes saving one for sea supply.

I completely understand the Figure 2.4.2.B on page 15 of the Rules as Coded. What I can't understand is why I still can't trace supply to Umezu and then from Umezu as a primary source for units within 4 hexes. I have units adjacent to Changsha in hexes 84,143 and 85,143 and they are always out of supply for combat, I can never use them to attack the Chinese unit in Changsha.

I have Yamamoto tracing supply back to Canton just fine. I have convoy points in the correct sea area and a few turns I even have transports in the sea area as I ship units to Canton from Japan or other parts of China.

On turn three I had Fine weather and on the first movement phase I saw that Umezu was in supply as were all units within 4 hexes of Umezu. However when the combat phase turned up not one of the units adjacent to Changsha could attack.

I'm really mystified why I can't make this attack from Nanchang to Changsha work when it sure looks like I have the supply net set up correctly and I should have all units adjacent to Changsha in supply in every phase. My attack northwards from Canton using Yamamoto as a primary supply source is working just fine, right now he's just two hexes from Canton.

Any ideas why my Umezu HQ in Nanchang isn't in supply when I have every rail hex from Nanchang to Shanghai Japanese controlled? Is there some kind of special supply rule in China that I'm missing because of the change in map scale from the original board game to MWiF's new scale? Or have I found some kind of program bug that needs fixing? It sure looks like it's a program bug because I've double checked the rules and the map and can see no reason why Umezu shouldn't always be in supply.

Omnius

Post #: 1

RE: A Supply Problem in China - 12/4/2013 6:52:41 PM

Centuur

Posts: 8802
Joined: 6/3/2011
From: Hoorn (NED).
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There is a bug there. Work around is to save and than reload the game (supply should be recalculated correctly at that moment).

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Post #: 2

RE: A Supply Problem in China - 12/4/2013 7:09:09 PM

markb50k

Posts: 1224
Joined: 7/1/2004
From: Spring, TX
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

There is a bug there. Work around is to save and than reload the game (supply should be recalculated correctly at that moment).

Yeah, have the same issue with Yamamoto driving on Changsha in that same area. Its a troublesome spot and I suspect there's a bug associated with that area of the map. My guess would be that either some terrain feature/hexside/road/rail showing up on the map isnt being accounted for correctly.

But yes Centuur is correct, usually exiting out of the game and restoring to the phase you need will "rethink" supply and you'll be able to move on.

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 3

RE: A Supply Problem in China - 12/4/2013 7:15:20 PM

Ingtar

Posts: 194
Joined: 8/1/2004
Status: offline

It must have something to do with the multiple rail lines and the lake. Thank you for asking this. I thought I was seeing things as the supply status kept changing.

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Post #: 4

Thanks for Confirmation - 12/4/2013 7:24:43 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

Centaur, markb50k and Ingtar,
Thanks for confirming my suspicion that something is amiss in China around Changsha for supply purposes. Thanks also for the save and restore work around, I'll have to try that by going back to the Axis save for their first combat phase in Turn 3 to see if restoring that autosave will correct my supply problem. I hope Shannon is paying attention and adding this bug to the fix list. I'm sure glad I didn't go further with my Allied phases and into another Axis turn where I might have saved over the first combat phases's save and started sending units away.

Omnius

Centaur, I just tried that work around and went back to the Land Combat Declaration phase and sure enough those Japanese units adjacent to Changsha are now all green and good to go for attacking Changsha with a +12 attack.
Thanks!

< Message edited by Omnius -- 12/4/2013 8:29:23 PM >

(in reply to Ingtar)

Post #: 5

RE: Thanks for Confirmation - 12/4/2013 7:44:12 PM

markb50k

Posts: 1224
Joined: 7/1/2004
From: Spring, TX
Status: offline

On the subject of saves, one strategy i use is every time the DoW popup shows up, i automatically do a save, naming it with the turn, month, and impulse number

ex:

T01 SO39 I01 (i.e. turn 1, septoct39, impulse 1. Yeah turn and the month are somewhat synonymous, but this allows me to keep all the saves in alphabetical order and easier to search through if i need to)

whenever i have an issue i can easily jump back to the start of any impulse.

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 6

Smart Saves - 12/5/2013 3:46:27 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

markb50k,
Yep I save often, though I don't clutter up my hard drive with so many superfluous saves. I do find the automatic phase saves to be sufficient to being able to go back to the beginning of some phase to redo something where there was a problem later on.

I did get into my game and restore the automatic Land Combat Declaration Phase for the Axis. I was able to declare a combat against Changsha with the Japanese. I also had two German combats in France to fight and they came up first in the combat screen so I started to resolve the German combats first. After my first German combat the screen came back and declared that the Japanese attack on Changsha was cancelled because the Japanese units were out of supply, an illegal combat. So back to land combat declaration where I declared the battles over again and this time I did the Changsha battle first. I'm now wondering if this limits Japan to one battle per phase for an HQ around Nanchang tracing back along the rail line to Shanghai?

Anyway thanks for the suggestion regarding saving and restoring at the beginning of a phase where supply to an HQ near Nanchang isn't working properly. I sure hope this gets fixed soon, am concerned I'm not seeing Shannon chime in here so I know he's aware of this supply problem. I guess I'll go to the tech area and write up a bug report.

Omnius

(in reply to markb50k)

Post #: 7

RE: A Supply Problem in China - 12/6/2013 2:13:58 AM

Vanman

Posts: 80
Joined: 11/23/2012
Status: offline

I had similar problems, when Umezu was in 83,144 he was out of supply and I could not figure out why since by my calculations all was fine. When I moved him back to 82,145 he was in supply (and of course everyone else using him as a secondary supply source). Although I recall reading in the manuals that roads were equivalent to rail in regards to supply (and in another spot it only mentioned rail, not road so not sure...but then my memory may be faulty), perhaps the Yangze River Road did not have a railroad equivalency?

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 8

RE: A Supply Problem in China - 12/6/2013 4:16:27 AM

Courtenay

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Joined: 11/12/2008
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In my current game Umezu is in 83, 140 in a blizzard, and is in supply. Thus my Yangtze River Road may be used to trace supply, as otherwise he would be nowhere close to being in supply. I have no idea why you are not in supply, but it is not the river road not functioning.

Have you tried saving your game and restarting? Doing so cleans up a lot of supply problems.

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(in reply to Vanman)

Post #: 9