One thing I've noticed

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One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 11:15:11 AM

JudgeDredd

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I'm no expert at this series, but if you could have a look at this in the future, I'd be a happy bunny (if indeed it is what I suspect....and annoyance)

I've noticed on the scenarios I've played that the units are spread all over the place, and not necessarily anywhere near each other, never mind their HQ.

I presume the HQ's have a command radius and that the command radius grows the higher the HQ, but the units are all over the place....I spend most of my time at the beginning of a scenario moving units together...so they are a unit...and by the time I've done that (and I'm not even talking about the big baby scenarios), I can't be arsed to tactically move units....

Now, I am not a big fan of PDF's, so it will be a while before I read the manual...and it may well be that units don't have to be close together to be effective, or that an HQ necessarily has to be that close to it's units (although I do think they have to)....so if I am thinking wrong, then feel free to point this out to me...'cos as is, it's a right pain in the ass going into a scenario!

Thx for listening to my wee rant.

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 11:23:44 AM

jynx11

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Heya,
Reference the HQ's, maybe u already know, but if you hit W key, u will get a radius of the HQ's.

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 11:25:49 AM

JudgeDredd

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I didn't...I did print off a key list the other day...I'll use it tonight when I have a look again. Thx

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 11:26:35 AM

jynx11

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I forgot, you have to have the HQ highlighted then hit the W key. half sleeping here.

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 12:32:00 PM

ojuzu

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I'm definitely not an expert either so maybe someone else can give you more detail. However, I have read the entire manual so based on that I have a basic understanding of the game.

So, at least with the default rules the only thing the HQ affects is the ammo resupply for each turn. If a unit is outside of the HQ's effective area then it won't be resupplied and it's attack value for that turn will be halved if I remember correctly. But the command area is pretty large. On the smaller maps you should only have to move the HQ once, if at all.

Now in terms of unit proximity (unless I completely missed part of the manual) this is not a factor with the exception of assaults where it's a combined attack and the addition of a leader to a hex which boosts a unit's attack value if it's in the leader's organization. Otherwise, all direct fire is based purely on the attacking and defending units stats combined with the terrain as a modifier and that's it.

The more I've read the rules and the intricacies of the combat system, the more impressed I am with this game. It seems to be an extremely well balanced and very well thought out game. It's complex without being obtusely so and in a way that feels like it makes sense and is "fair" if you know what I mean.

As a side note, I got the most benefit from going through the Rising Sun Boot Camp document and scenarios and then reading the manual for the specifics and pressing F3 is a great reference for the numbers in game. I felt that it explained the various areas better than the tutorial in the manual did.

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 12:36:34 PM

JudgeDredd

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quote:

Now in terms of unit proximity (unless I completely missed part of the manual) this is not a factor with the exception of assaults where it's a combined attack and the addition of a leader to a hex which boosts a unit's attack value if it's in the leader's organization. Otherwise, all direct fire is based purely on the attacking and defending units stats combined with the terrain as a modifier and that's it.

That does ring a bell from when I played it all those years ago.

It might pay me to visit bootcamp, 'cos I keep having my ass handed to me!

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 3:02:56 PM

O`Connor

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hi,

Was this in the dynamically generated scenarios? This was a "feature" in the Campaign series which people complained about from the beginning. Any time the computer generated a battle, you would get formations scattered the breadth of the map, resulting in lots of out-of-supply (and therefore mainly useless) units. I remember battles which some of your units effectively never took part in - they'd spent the whole length of the scenario trying to crawl back into supply/command range of their HQ.

I remember the defence put forward was this represented the disorganisation you would alwasy find on a battlefield, which I never really found convincing, seemed too obviously like bad design, given the generally below-par AI. If I played the game now I would always play the canned scenarios which would avoid such problems.

If this and other AI-type problems were solved I'd buy this game in a second. But, without a programmer...

cheers

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 3:54:57 PM

JudgeDredd

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Well this is in the stock scenarios. But I could be a little unkind, as I haven't read the manual yet...

But the units are spread all over the place....a bit annoying at the beginning of the scenario spending so much time just moving the units to the same part of the map.

Saying that, I have to look at the W key for command radius...it could be a moot point

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 4:30:56 PM

Jason Petho

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Well this is in the stock scenarios. But I could be a little unkind, as I haven't read the manual yet...

But the units are spread all over the place....a bit annoying at the beginning of the scenario spending so much time just moving the units to the same part of the map.

Saying that, I have to look at the W key for command radius...it could be a moot point

Which scenario is this?

Keep in mind is that the command radius is the 50% limit chance of resupply, HQ's can provide supply at a further range, just a limited chance the further you go.

Jason Petho

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 5:11:39 PM

1925frank

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It's been a long time since I've played a Dynamic Campaign, but my recollection is that at the very start of each battle, the first thing you did was place and organize your units. Your units were splashed across the map randomly, but you could place them (within limits - your half of the map or something comparable) on the map in accordance with your strategy. After you were finished moving your units (not hex by hex but like in the scenario editor), you'd hit the next turn button, and, only then did the battle begin like in a normal scenario. If you're in a Dynamic Campaign, you may be inadvertantly skipping the first and most important phase -- orgainizing your units.

Regarding supply, I've taken a stab at how I think it works under the thread, "Supplies: Air, Smoke, Ammo."

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 5:33:07 PM

O`Connor

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ah yes - I'd forgotten this was how it worked. You had control over placement, it was just a pain to locate all the units that belonged together. I was sure there were situations where you had no choice about placement and units were all over teh place. Maybe that was the original pre-patch version. It's been a long time since I first played this...

cheers

O'Connor

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 5:38:21 PM

1925frank

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What JudgeDredd is describing sounds like a battle within a Dynamic Campaign. We may not be using the same terminology. For me, a scenario is a stand-alone battle that someone has designed. A Dynamic Campaign or a Linked Campaign will have a series of independent battles that play just like a stand-alone scenario. My understanding is a Dynamic Campaign battle is randomly generated by the computer, and my experience is that that units are randomly thrown all over the map, but, as I mentioned before, my recollection is you had a "Set-up" phase to organize your units. I think there was also a feature for randomly created or generated battles (that was eliminated in Divided Ground), but I don't remember if there was a set-up phase in those. That may be what JudgeDredd has tapped into. I wouldn't refer to the randomly generated battles as scenarios either because nobody designed them. I'm not trying to be critical (or anal retentive). I'm just trying to get on the same page as JudgeDredd.

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 5:45:33 PM

1925frank

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Regarding locating units that belong together, I think the "Highlight Organization" button works during the set-up. That's the easiest way to figure out which unit goes with other units. It works at company level as well as higher levels, so if you click on the general and hit "Highlight Organization," all the units will light up, which won't help you, but if you click a platoon and click on it, only the other units in the company will light up. The "Hightlight Organization" button is a lifesaver and will eliminate most, if not all, of the frustration associated with keeping units together.

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/13/2007 11:27:28 PM

warhead2

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the highlight org button is your friend
use it

and as jason mentioned there's a command radius that I believe represents the 50% resupply chance
as the unit "moves" closer to the HQ this 50% increases
as you move farther outside the 50% demarcation line so to speak
your chances of resupply decrease

it's still possible to have a unit multiple kilometers from it's HQ to get resupplied
just the chance is around 5%

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/14/2007 12:22:19 AM

jbunnelle

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Yeah, I was under the impression that this had been improved upon. But they're as scattered and random as ever. It would be better not to auto-place them at all and let the player do so. Would save tons of time. And I end up moving almost every single one eventually anyway. Obviously that's way more coding than I expect. Just speaking in "what should be" terms.

< Message edited by jbunnelle -- 6/14/2007 12:23:00 AM >

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RE: One thing I've noticed - 6/14/2007 12:33:22 AM

MartNick

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I've found with the CS series that its usually speed wins the game, so an ideal supply all the time is not the primary concern, especialy in attack, but having a good usage of the units available to take positions is the way to go.

I always have to move the HQ units to follow the front, but try to make sure that my troop movements suit the terrain to get to those far flung victory hexes.

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