Allied Depot Supply

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Empires in Arms the Napoleonic Wars of 1805 - 1815 >> Allied Depot Supply

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Allied Depot Supply - 6/6/2009 12:56:35 AM

pzgndr

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quote:

7.4.2.2 ALLIED DEPOT SUPPLY: Major powers may have their forces live off the depots and/or supply chains of their allies, but those allies must pay the costs involved. Naturally, permission is required for this.

Marshall has previously indicated several times this EiA rule cannot be implemented in EiANW. The EiANW rules are not clear about how this is handled and should be clarified. More importantly, how should this be handled?

A. MPs provide their own supply to their loaned corps and pay the costs; depot limits may restrict distant operations, eg, Russia in France.

B. The allies provide supply to the loaned corps but the owning MPs pay the costs; may be most convenient option.

C. The allies provide supply to the loaned corps and pay the costs; owning MPs may be expected to loan money to allies to defray costs.

12.3.1 SUPPLY LIMITS PER DEPOT has also been suggested and Marshall has indicated this cannot be implemented either (Mantis #65). To compensate, the options above may need to be reconsidered. Which option may be best for both allied supply and unlimited supply per depot??

Just curious what the concensus is and how the EiANW rules should read.

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/6/2009 4:54:00 AM

Thresh

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The easiest solution within the current framework would be to loan the corps in question to� the MP paying supply for it...
Beyond that there are a couple of options, but they would require some coding...

Todd

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/9/2009 1:52:18 AM

pzgndr

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The EiANW loaned corps rules are not so different in effect as the original EiA combined movement and allied depot supply rules. Operational control and logistical support are split functions. Operational control means moving allies together and engaging in combat together, and this happens either as a combined function in the boardgame or a loaned function in EiANW. The end effect is essentially the same except for some move order considerations. Logistical support means who checks supply and pays for it, and players had a choice in the board game -- either Option A or Option C. When supply is checked for loaned corps in EiANW, currently during the allies turn, probably excludes Option A from consideration unless Marshall is willing to rework things. Could Option A be implemented? If supply limits per depot cannot be easily implemented, then the depot limits per MP and MP's forced to provide their own logistics calculated during their turn may be optimal. Or could players have a choice??

The game could keep things as they are and the rules get clarified accordingly. Anyone besides Todd with constructive thoughts to share? Looks like we should keep things as they are...

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/9/2009 11:42:57 AM

Marshall Ellis

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I believe C would be the answer. The MP that has the forces (NOT the original owner) should supply and pay the cost. Is this what everyone is seeing?

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Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/9/2009 9:27:15 PM

Jimmer

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How about simply allies with any loaned corps being allowed to use the other major powers depots for supply? To make this work, you might need to code the idea of a "generic depot", and covert both teams to using that pseudo-generic depot for supply. It's a little less precise than the original, but it would at least allow one to maintain some sort of control over it.

Note that the current rules cause HUGE problems if the alliance is broken with troops scattered in someone else's territory.

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/9/2009 11:41:26 PM

Dancing Bear

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I like this idea.

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/10/2009 12:47:05 PM

Marshall Ellis

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There could be a delay cost if I have to use genric depots because it increases the possibilities of supply depots for units i.e. France only need scan French depots for its supply today. This could also confuse who pays what for what???

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Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/10/2009 1:03:14 PM

pzgndr

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quote:

This could also confuse who pays what for what???

Perhaps allow players to define the logistics support for their loaned corps, if this is possible to implement. IE, Option A where MP provides own supply and pays for it or Option C where ally gaining the loaned corps provides their supply and pays for it. Noting Jimmer's concern, if an ally is becoming unstable then switching to Option A would be the way to go. Having options would be nice, like players have in the board game.

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/10/2009 8:32:10 PM

Jimmer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

There could be a delay cost if I have to use genric depots because it increases the possibilities of supply depots for units i.e. France only need scan French depots for its supply today. This could also confuse who pays what for what???

Very true. But, that could either be handled between the players (X gives Y $5 to make up for supply costs Y spent). Alternately, one party (X) could be "billed" for the supply, but then at the end of the turn, the game could ask "How much of this bill should Y be charged?" and then transfer the money as appropriate. There might be some issues if an alliance is broken, but players will know it's to rectify a different problem. I think they'll be OK with something like that.

Note that nothing in the above requires an alliance relationship, so the money-swap might even happen after an alliance is broken. People would be on their honor to do it right, even if they no longer like their former ally.

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/10/2009 8:34:21 PM

Jimmer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: pzgndr

quote:

This could also confuse who pays what for what???

Perhaps allow players to define the logistics support for their loaned corps, if this is possible to implement. IE, Option A where MP provides own supply and pays for it or Option C where ally gaining the loaned corps provides their supply and pays for it. Noting Jimmer's concern, if an ally is becoming unstable then switching to Option A would be the way to go. Having options would be nice, like players have in the board game.

Good idea.

_____________________________

At LAST! The greatest campaign board game of all time is finally available for the PC. Can my old heart stand the strain?

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RE: Allied Depot Supply - 6/11/2009 12:42:54 PM

pzgndr

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Reposting this from the other thread.

For supply, does it really matter if supply for your loaned units is determined during your ally's turn or your turn, if players could have that option? B may want to loan to A but retain supply control, so A controls units during its turn and fights a combat, checking its units for supply prior to combat, and then afterwards during B's turn, without being able to control its loaned units yet, B's units are checked for supply after combat. Granted there may not be as many factors to check depending on the combat results, but is this critical? In some cases your own loaned unit supply would be checked before the ally's turn and sometimes after, depending on turn order, if you selected an option to provide your own supply, so this should average out over the long run. Just a thought.

(in reply to Jimmer)

Post #: 11