much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2

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much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2 - 12/31/2009 1:38:30 AM

jackyo123

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Joined: 2/4/2008
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much better japanese performance on asw missions. they are actually attacking my subs now. still think DC damage should increase by maybe 20%, but overall a much better ASW atmosphere against my allied subs

well done

Post #: 1

RE: much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2 - 12/31/2009 12:15:22 PM

khyberbill

Posts: 1941
Joined: 9/11/2007
From: new milford, ct
Status: offline

I think that ASW is now tilted towards Allies. Allies have more subs and more merchant ships thus the new "weak" ASW benefits them. In my three PBEMs as Allied command, I am losing about as many merchant ships per turn to subs as my foes in 42 and doing better in 43. This is a war of attrition that I can win. I escort all merchant convoys. I have not lost a sub to ASW since the code was tweaked and have only sunk one sub but in my one game that has reached 43 my subs are wreaking havoc on Japanese shipping, netting two or three merchant ships per day.

< Message edited by khyberbill -- 12/31/2009 7:53:44 PM >

_____________________________

"Its a dog eat dog world Sammy and I am wearing Milkbone underwear" -Norm.

(in reply to jackyo123)

Post #: 2

RE: much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2 - 12/31/2009 6:46:18 PM

jackyo123

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Joined: 2/4/2008
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I think that Depth charges are not quite effective enough; but the # of attacks against my suibs is MUCH higher than in pre-patch versions (my air attacks against jap subs also seems to have increased - onm average, i have abour 40 b17's flying asw missions on any given turn, and i usually get 2 to 3 attacks against jap subs per turn. pre patch, my air units,except for catalinas, would almost never attack jap subs, even with experience levels in the 60's and asw values in the 40's.

if DC's damage gets increased about 20%, i think the asw model will be almost done.

Of course, i dont know what will happen in 1943/44. IRL, DD England sunk *5* japanese destroyers just before the marianas turkey shoot, and 17 japanese subs were sunk in a 25 day period during the prelims to the saipan invasion. I've *hit* a good number of jap subs, but since sub damage is repaired in about 5 days, no matter how bad, having a sub take 3 or 4 DC hits simply wont kill the sub. I've had wounded subs limp back from the phillipines to Pearl after taking 5 hits. Those subs should have bit the dust.

(in reply to khyberbill)

Post #: 3

RE: much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2 - 12/31/2009 8:18:01 PM

Mike Scholl

Posts: 9349
Joined: 1/1/2003
From: Kansas City, MO
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: khyberbill

I think that ASW is now tilted towards Allies. Allies have more subs and more merchant ships thus the new "weak" ASW benefits them. In my three PBEMs as Allied command, I am losing about as many merchant ships per turn to subs as my foes in 42 and doing better in 43. This is a war of attrition that I can win. I escort all merchant convoys. I have not lost a sub to ASW since the code was tweaked and have only sunk one sub but in my one game that has reached 43 my subs are wreaking havoc on Japanese shipping, netting two or three merchant ships per day.

ASW should be "tilted towards the Allies". The Brits had been fighting "the Wizard War" against German U-Boats for over 2 years, and the Americans were about to get a "crash course" in early 1942. The Japanese were barely even "players" in the competition from the beginning, and didn't realize how bad they were at it until far too late.

(in reply to khyberbill)

Post #: 4

RE: much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2 - 12/31/2009 10:40:35 PM

khyberbill

Posts: 1941
Joined: 9/11/2007
From: new milford, ct
Status: offline

quote:

ASW should be "tilted towards the Allies". The Brits had been fighting "the Wizard War" against German U-Boats for over 2 years, and the Americans were about to get a "crash course" in early 1942. The Japanese were barely even "players" in the competition from the beginning, and didn't realize how bad they were at it until far too late.

I agree, and it still isn't tilted enough. But one has to take what one gets.

_____________________________

"Its a dog eat dog world Sammy and I am wearing Milkbone underwear" -Norm.

(in reply to Mike Scholl)

Post #: 5

RE: much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2 - 12/31/2009 11:17:34 PM

FatR

Posts: 2522
Joined: 10/23/2009
From: St.Petersburg, Russia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Scholl

ASW should be "tilted towards the Allies". The Brits had been fighting "the Wizard War" against German U-Boats for over 2 years, and the Americans were about to get a "crash course" in early 1942. The Japanese were barely even "players" in the competition from the beginning, and didn't realize how bad they were at it until far too late.

I beg to disagree. In 1942 Japanese subs scored quite significant successes, taking down 2 carriers (Yorktown probably would have been saved if not for the finishing blow), and keeping the third one out of the war for most of the year, damaging at least two battleships and overall being a major help to IJN. Their effectiveness degraded later, of course, as they were forced to operated in very suboptimal conditions, routinely perform transport and evacuation tasks, and Allied ASW assets grew in numbers and strength.

(in reply to Mike Scholl)

Post #: 6

RE: much better japanese asw post 1096 hf2 - 1/1/2010 4:23:43 AM

Mike Scholl

Posts: 9349
Joined: 1/1/2003
From: Kansas City, MO
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: FatR

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Scholl

ASW should be "tilted towards the Allies". The Brits had been fighting "the Wizard War" against German U-Boats for over 2 years, and the Americans were about to get a "crash course" in early 1942. The Japanese were barely even "players" in the competition from the beginning, and didn't realize how bad they were at it until far too late.

I beg to disagree. In 1942 Japanese subs scored quite significant successes, taking down 2 carriers (Yorktown probably would have been saved if not for the finishing blow), and keeping the third one out of the war for most of the year, damaging at least two battleships and overall being a major help to IJN. Their effectiveness degraded later, of course, as they were forced to operated in very suboptimal conditions, routinely perform transport and evacuation tasks, and Allied ASW assets grew in numbers and strength.

And what, prey tell, does any of that have to do with ASW? Japanese ASW was poor to begin with, and never really got much better. Allied was a bit better to begin with, but improved by leaps and bounds during the war. Ever hear of the DE England?

(in reply to FatR)

Post #: 7