2 highlighted added features

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

2 highlighted added features

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> WarPlan >> 2 highlighted added features

Page: [1] 2 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

2 highlighted added features - 6/5/2019 4:43:54 PM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

These were discussions beta testing had and was implemented into the game.

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

Post #: 1

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/5/2019 6:30:18 PM

typhoon

Posts: 387
Joined: 4/2/2002
From: United Kingdom
Status: offline

Nice!!!!!

_____________________________

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)

Post #: 2

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/8/2019 8:39:28 AM

sPzAbt653

Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline

Based on your familiarity and work with Strategic Command, I was wondering what you were able to accomplish with WarPlan that is different ?

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)

Post #: 3

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/8/2019 2:27:34 PM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

WarPlan is close to World in Flames and War in the East than Strategic Command. If you look at the other posts I answered you can see the different.

But if you want some differences

SC decision events based on questions
WP strategic and operational decisions based on deep thinking.

SC single unit per hex = less clutter
WP land, air, naval fleet stacking per hex (fleet = 1 or more naval groups)

SC attack 1v1 at a time for more tactical feel
WP attack with odds for more operational feel

SC focuses more on graphics
WP focuses more on interface

Also read the product page.

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

(in reply to sPzAbt653)

Post #: 4

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/8/2019 4:41:12 PM

sPzAbt653

Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline

quote:

WarPlan is close to World in Flames and War in the East than Strategic Command.

Ah, my misunderstanding! Neither of those games is for me, and I have SC3 so no sense in getting something similar, but thanks for taking time to answer and best wishes on success for WP!

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)

Post #: 5

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/8/2019 5:08:38 PM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

Well they are all similar. The common thing it does have with SC3 is it's simple to play which is a key element.

Anyways if you aren't sure just wait till some play videos come out and you can see for yourself if you want to get it or not.

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

(in reply to sPzAbt653)

Post #: 6

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/8/2019 7:10:30 PM

welk

Posts: 865
Joined: 9/17/2006
From: France
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

Ah, my misunderstanding! Neither of those games is for me, and I have SC3 so no sense in getting something similar, but thanks for taking time to answer and best wishes on success for WP!

You will miss something very good : I played SC1, SC2,SC3 and Warplan

SC1 was a little wargame but perfect for the "grand strategique" scale

SC2 and SC3 are good games, but I stopped to use them and returned to Strategic Command 1

Why ? : because, even tough SC 1 is too simple, the "grand strategique scale" is respected, not in SC2/SC3. There are good games, but is is not "grand strategic" scale : when I have to use on map AA units in 1 hex, and AT units in one hex, that is a mix of "grand strategic scale" and "tactic scale" : I have not the sensation to conduct a war at "grand strategic scale" even if playing with these 2 games gives pleasure).

With the arrival of Warplan, I have exactly this sensation : to conduct the war at "grand strategic" scale. It's difficult to explain, but I think that a player of SC2/SC3 should try warplan, to see that these games come from very different conception

< Message edited by welk -- 6/8/2019 7:12:44 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to sPzAbt653)

Post #: 7

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/8/2019 10:03:09 PM

Michael T

Posts: 4443
Joined: 10/22/2006
From: Queensland, Australia.
Status: offline

I can't stand SC games. I hope WP is nothing like them. I love games like Third Reich or AWAW. ETO/PTO. All board games. I am yet to find a PC game that comes even close to them. A PC version of AWAW would be perfect.

_____________________________

(in reply to welk)

Post #: 8

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 7:03:51 AM

Uxbridge

Posts: 1505
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline

I think your problems describing the difference between the games, Welk, in fact describes it very well.

I have played SCWaW since Christmas, and with the help of your map, IronX counters and some of my own modifications, I have enjoyed it a lot. But I don't like, just accept, some of it's peculiarities. It will be nice to try something devoid of AT and AA corps, one-unit-at-the-time-attacks and "let's see if we can find some uboats-clicking".

But how does War Plan handle politics?

_____________________________

(in reply to Michael T)

Post #: 9

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 7:34:25 AM

welk

Posts: 865
Joined: 9/17/2006
From: France
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Michael T
I love games like Third Reich

Me too : I was a 1000 % lover of Third Reich PC, and War plan is a great successor for it. I can say that Warplan is a real wargame, not just a map with lot of units and lot of details and lot of micro gestion : like in Third Reich, you have to conduct the war with intelligence and take great decisions (but no any fastidious micro gestion to do).

< Message edited by welk -- 6/9/2019 7:52:50 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to Michael T)

Post #: 10

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 7:50:39 AM

welk

Posts: 865
Joined: 9/17/2006
From: France
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Uxbridge

But how does War Plan handle politics?

Units in Warplan may move and attack sevreal times : if a unit has needed potential, it may move 1,2,2 etc times. And same for attacks. But you have to take care, because oil is spent for some units in move and combat, and attacks causes attrition for your units...

Diplomacy may be set "on" or "off" (player choice what he want in options). If set "on", you may (like in Third Reich) declare war, but you may also propose peace, sometimes agreement, or try to intimidate (see attached, that shows the diplomacy panel

In addition, you may receive importations from some of neutrals or from your allies, and you may send exportations (help) to your allies (like in Third Reich).

I have to say that SC2/SC3 are very good games for players who want manage lot of units on map with single action for each unit, and who like to mix strategic and tactic

But for players who prefer have less units on map with several actions for each unit and do not want to mix strategic and tactic, Warplan is the good way (like Third Reich, you have not large number of units on the map, but you have to use them with hability)

What I may say also is that : as old wargamer, I had decided to stop the hobby because I love not the new orientation of wargames PC (lot of 3D kitch, no strategic depth, etc). By chance, I have seen on a french wargamers forum a information about warplan and I did go just "to see". In addition, for a last try before to stop wargames, I decided to candidate for beta, to see the game closer. My intention was to let it if bad game and to quit the beta, after I have seen. But at first seconds, I have seen immediatly that I had found a second Third Reich PC : gret pleasure, a real re-birth of wargame

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by welk -- 6/9/2019 8:04:35 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to Uxbridge)

Post #: 11

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 8:26:17 AM

Uxbridge

Posts: 1505
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline

Sounds splendid.

I played Third Reich in the 80's as a board game and liked it much. I bought the computerized version, but never understood how to play it. But this looks so good. I would really like a game the way you describe it.

_____________________________

(in reply to welk)

Post #: 12

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 8:39:22 AM

welk

Posts: 865
Joined: 9/17/2006
From: France
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Uxbridge

Sounds splendid.

I played Third Reich in the 80's as a board game and liked it much. I bought the computerized version, but never understood how to play it.

In my case, I had to translate from english the complete PC manuel before to understand this PC version, and it took me 1 entire month ! But after that, I had years of pleasure, you missed something great : Third Reich PC was Third Reich without any manual calculation (odds, etc) : just the pleasure of Third Reich game = great, great game

In Strategic Command 1 (the first of the serie), I found the same pleasure as Third Reich but the map was too little and not very detailled

With Warplan, I have again a perfect "Third Reich -Avallon Hill" pleasure to play

_____________________________

(in reply to Uxbridge)

Post #: 13

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 8:52:21 AM

Uxbridge

Posts: 1505
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline

I suppose I had other options at the time of the PC-version of Third Reich. Regrettably, I never took your pains to learn it.

The board game that held me captive longest was SPI/TSR's European Theatre of Operations. That is what I would like to see in a computerized verion, but nothing as yet has ever come close. War Plan might just be that game.

_____________________________

(in reply to welk)

Post #: 14

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 9:09:05 AM

ncc1701e

Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Michael T

I can't stand SC games. I hope WP is nothing like them. I love games like Third Reich or AWAW. ETO/PTO. All board games. I am yet to find a PC game that comes even close to them. A PC version of AWAW would be perfect.

A shame GMT has not decided yet to do mounted maps for AWAW even inside the 3rd Printing.

_____________________________

Chancellor Gorkon to Captain James T. Kirk:
You don't trust me, do you? I don't blame you. If there is to be a brave new world, our generation is going to have the hardest time living in it.

(in reply to Michael T)

Post #: 15

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 9:11:56 AM

welk

Posts: 865
Joined: 9/17/2006
From: France
Status: offline

quote:

SPI/TSR's European Theatre of Operations

Nice wargame
https://boardgamegeek.com/image/284143/world-war-ii-european-theater-operations

_____________________________

(in reply to Uxbridge)

Post #: 16

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 9:43:07 AM

Uxbridge

Posts: 1505
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline

Yes, it had exactly the right scale for everything, including tactical battles between capital ships. It took a while to learn all the rules, but I think I bought ETO three times in different versions. All of them are lost now.

_____________________________

(in reply to welk)

Post #: 17

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/9/2019 9:15:21 PM

Michael T

Posts: 4443
Joined: 10/22/2006
From: Queensland, Australia.
Status: offline

I only play AWAW via vassal these days as I have no local opponents.

If you liked Third Reich you would love AWAW.

Warplan sounds good so far. I hope it has nice PBEM or PBEM++ features.

_____________________________

(in reply to Uxbridge)

Post #: 18

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/10/2019 12:14:24 AM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

it has PBEM and PBEM++ on the server

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

(in reply to Michael T)

Post #: 19

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/10/2019 3:43:18 AM

Michael T

Posts: 4443
Joined: 10/22/2006
From: Queensland, Australia.
Status: offline

Great, as PBEM/PBEM++ is the only way I play. Playing against the AI has no interest for me, though I acknowledge this method of play is favoured by many.

For me the challenge of competing with another human is the most fun.

_____________________________

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)

Post #: 20

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/10/2019 1:22:58 PM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

You can't possible make a challenging A.I. in a game at this scale. There are too many variables. A game like Unity of Command you can because it is limited scale with defines parameters. This year I read a really good article by the developers and how they designed the A.I. and what made it special. I am hoping to implement some of their tactics after the bugs are cleared.

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

(in reply to Michael T)

Post #: 21

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/10/2019 4:38:19 PM

Zovs

Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline

I disagree, Gary has created AIs for WITE/WITW, SP, SPII, and SPIII, John has done it for the Campaign, Panzer and Squad series, Norm amazingly did it for TOAW, COW, and TOAW III, and Karl has done it for CWIE2.

TOAW alone is way more complex than most folks envision.

_____________________________

Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific
Valor & Victory
DG CWIE 2
SPWW2 & SPMBT scenario creator

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)

Post #: 22

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/10/2019 6:13:08 PM

stormbringer3

Posts: 875
Joined: 7/26/2007
From: Staunton, Va.
Status: offline

I'm one who only plays vs. the AI. How would you compare your AI vs. SC3 World at War?
Thanks.

(in reply to Zovs)

Post #: 23

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 6/10/2019 6:43:29 PM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

The games you mentioned are the kind of games you can do it for. Like WitE is pretty straight forward. I was able to make a really good A.I. for Assault on Communism. The Pacific War is also far easier to implement an A.I. for.

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

(in reply to stormbringer3)

Post #: 24

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 9/17/2019 8:47:08 AM

sillyflower

Posts: 3509
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Back in Blighty
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fuzzypup

WarPlan is close to World in Flames

I hope it isn't like WIF. I assume it was a great boardgame (I've never ever seen it being played) but it must be a contender for the least playable computer game ever and made me wish that Matrix had a refund policy like Steam.
However, that won't put me off WP

I'm a very old gamer who just looks for a very good game. I'm probably not as fervent a fan of Third Reich as some. Perhaps something to do with the failure of my Germans to capture even Minsk the first time I played, but probably because I prefer to have bigger maps and more counters.

What makes a really good game for me? First, balance: In PvP, each side has an equal chance of winning which includes the absence of exploitable rules/OP'd units/bugs. This almost impossible for the designers even after umpteen updates, not least because a game perfectly balanced for 2 middling players may be not be for 2 very experienced players.

PvE is different again with WiF being the Game too Far.

Enough rambling. I wish WP well - not least because I will get it

< Message edited by sillyflower -- 9/17/2019 9:32:06 AM >

_____________________________

web exchange

Post: I am always fearful that when I put this game down on the table and people see the box-art they will think I am some kind of neo-Nazi

Reply: They already know you're a gamer. What other shame can possibly compare?

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)

Post #: 25

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 9/17/2019 3:16:57 PM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

WP was made with great consideration to UX and UI interface so it's easy to use. Other games take 7-8 clicks to make an attack with 3 units WP uses 2 for example. The complexity is in the depth of strategy not how to use the game. Straight forward how to start one. You don't get overwhelmed with options because all the rules are built in. The game doesn't contain what I call "absolute decisions". These are things you must always do 100% of the time to play the game correctly that leads to tediousness. If the UK want's to invade Norway before the Axis there is a price to pay in that Norway raises a Waffen corps for Germany from volunteers and Spain's status shifts closer to the Axis. Spain's shift means it is easier for the Axis to get them on their side. How do the Axis get them on their side? Invading the UK. So the UK's invasion just made it more temping for Germany to invade the UK. Where before they needed to take X key areas to get Spain in the war not they need X - 1.

Balance in a scenario is always something I am working on. In Beta testing we try to get close but it doesn't compare to when the game is out and I get hundreds of replies. There is also balancing between player skills. I played plenty of wargames and the skill differential is quite a bit between players. Sometimes it's hard to find the right balance. It takes time.

Being Gamey. This is something am trying to eliminate. Decisions of actions always have a cost to balance out the benefit.

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

(in reply to sillyflower)

Post #: 26

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 9/17/2019 8:49:34 PM

sillyflower

Posts: 3509
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Back in Blighty
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fuzzypup

You can't possible make a challenging A.I. in a game at this scale.

I agree. With all respect to Zovs, AI gets weaker compared to a human (probably exponentially) to the number of variables. AIs have been able to beat the best chess players for many years. Chess has very simple mechanics with only 6 types of unit on 64 squares. With all the computer games, to be any good the AI has to 'cheat' ie be given lots of extra bonuses which can include being able to do things the human player cannot.

I am in awe of the skills of GG and the others Zovs mentions, but it is always relatively easy to work out how the AI behaves and to go on to exploit that knowledge to beat it in anything resembling 'a fair fight.' With a poor AI, games are just embarassing in PvE. Mocking History, as I always called it, was particulaly poor in this regard. An alleged WWII game, it was v. easy for Germany to conquer the whole map by well before WWII actaually started. I have fond memories of the wehrmacht with 1960s tech conquering the USSR in '37 or '38 while the AI was relying in on airships to get past my jets to destroy my armoured units equiped with Leopards. I think my Russians would conquer Germany in '36 but I might be exaggerating about the date. It was many years ago...........

_____________________________

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)

Post #: 27

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 9/17/2019 9:58:01 PM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

I originally had only 4 levels of difficulty.

Now it has 11 experience levels and 5 supply levels.

The top experience level is called Ubermensch!

Playing on Optimal Ubermensch.... I'd be impressed if someone wins that level.

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

(in reply to sillyflower)

Post #: 28

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 9/18/2019 9:17:35 AM

Titan

Posts: 482
Joined: 8/28/2000
From: new Zealand
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fuzzypup

I originally had only 4 levels of difficulty.

Now it has 11 experience levels and 5 supply levels.

The top experience level is called Ubermensch!

Playing on Optimal Ubermensch.... I'd be impressed if someone wins that level.

Is that because Ubermensch is a cronic cheater or just damn good ? :)

(in reply to AlvaroSousa)

Post #: 29

RE: 2 highlighted added features - 9/18/2019 3:01:15 PM

AlvaroSousa

Posts: 9927
Joined: 7/29/2013
Status: offline

It's how all A.I. levels work in games. They give them help to compensate for lack of human intuition and ability to process things abstractly.

_____________________________

Creator Kraken Studios
- WarPlan
- WarPlan Pacific

Designer Strategic Command
- Brute Force (mod) SC2
- Assault on Communism SC2
- Assault on Democracy SC2
- Map Image Importer SC3

(in reply to Titan)

Post #: 30