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Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/25/2021 7:27:33 PM   
actrade

 

Posts: 283
Joined: 11/3/2006
Status: offline 		We all know German law on this but I know we had the historical Nazi flag 1 day after WitE came out. Hopefully one of you artsy guys are getting this done? Thanks in advance!
Post #: 1
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/25/2021 8:14:27 PM   
melnibonian

 

Posts: 137
Joined: 7/30/2010
From: Sweden
Status: offline 		Hello

I have made a quick version of it. It is not ideal but it will get you started.

I have kept the Original files (named original) in case you need them and forget to backup them or don't use JSGME to install your mods

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by melnibonian -- 3/25/2021 8:16:02 PM >

(in reply to actrade)
Post #: 2
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/25/2021 8:27:10 PM   
fritzfarlig


Posts: 422
Joined: 1/13/2016
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		thanks I hope its ok I upload them in our community group

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join:
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Post #: 3
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/25/2021 8:54:46 PM   
melnibonian

 

Posts: 137
Joined: 7/30/2010
From: Sweden
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: fritzfarlig

thanks I hope its ok I upload them in our community group


Absolutely. Please feel free to share, edit, alter to your heart's content

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Post #: 4
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/25/2021 9:57:19 PM   
RFalvo69


Posts: 1380
Joined: 7/11/2013
From: Lamezia Terme (Italy)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: actrade

We all know German law on this but I know we had the historical Nazi flag 1 day after WitE came out. Hopefully one of you artsy guys are getting this done? Thanks in advance!

Actually the law was changed almost three years ago. I don't know why many software houses still apply it, but I guess it is their choice.

Germany lifts total ban on Nazi symbols in video games
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-45142651

_____________________________

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"Oh dad... so you were a God-damned cook?"

(My 10 years old daughter after watching "The Hunt for Red October")

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Post #: 5
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/25/2021 10:18:58 PM   
Hanny


Posts: 422
Joined: 7/5/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: actrade

We all know German law on this but I know we had the historical Nazi flag 1 day after WitE came out. Hopefully one of you artsy guys are getting this done? Thanks in advance!


Germany lifted its ban on the use of Nazi symbols in historical computer games in 2018, so I don’t know which law you mean, is there an EU law on this?.


< Message edited by Hanny -- 3/25/2021 10:36:26 PM >

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Post #: 6
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/25/2021 11:06:59 PM   
RFalvo69


Posts: 1380
Joined: 7/11/2013
From: Lamezia Terme (Italy)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hanny

quote:

ORIGINAL: actrade

We all know German law on this but I know we had the historical Nazi flag 1 day after WitE came out. Hopefully one of you artsy guys are getting this done? Thanks in advance!


Germany lifted its ban on the use of Nazi symbols in historical computer games in 2018, so I don’t know which law you mean, is there an EU law on this?.


There was never a EU law. Germany was, IIRC, the sole exception.

_____________________________

"Yes darling, I served in the Navy for eight years. I was a cook..."
"Oh dad... so you were a God-damned cook?"

(My 10 years old daughter after watching "The Hunt for Red October")

(in reply to Hanny)
Post #: 7
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/26/2021 4:24:57 AM   
Hanny


Posts: 422
Joined: 7/5/2011
Status: offline 		G
quote:

ORIGINAL: RFalvo69


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hanny

quote:

ORIGINAL: actrade

We all know German law on this but I know we had the historical Nazi flag 1 day after WitE came out. Hopefully one of you artsy guys are getting this done? Thanks in advance!


Germany lifted its ban on the use of Nazi symbols in historical computer games in 2018, so I don’t know which law you mean, is there an EU law on this?.


There was never a EU law. Germany was, IIRC, the sole exception.


Ok, ta, so it’s in reference to the imposed ban on Nazi symbols imposed on West Germany as part of post war Allied de Nazification, maintained by Germany ever since, and from 2018 has relaxed it for computer games, and other media.


_____________________________

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Post #: 8
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/26/2021 12:19:22 PM   
actrade

 

Posts: 283
Joined: 11/3/2006
Status: offline 		In any event....the mod works great. Thanks!

(in reply to Hanny)
Post #: 9
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/26/2021 4:31:12 PM   
Templer_12


Posts: 1700
Joined: 1/5/2009
From: Germany
Status: offline 		The new legislation always leads to misunderstandings.

1. The depiction of swastikas and other symbols and signs from the Nazi era are permitted in games if they are in a historical context.
It is still forbidden and punishable to display and use it if they glorify, prais or play down the Nazi era and/or those responsible.

2. It is also often misunderstood: the flag offered here is the flag of the Nazi party, the NSDAP.
It is not the so-called Reichskriegsflagge (Reich War Flag) 1935 to 1945, the flag for wartime.

Personally, I believe that War in the X does not glorify anything from this period, that the Reichskriegsflagge and the SS runes add to the historically accurate overall picture.

Many would like the historical Reichskriegsflagge 1935 to 1945 as a good quality mod, and also the SS officers in the game to be clearly identified by the SS runes.

(in reply to actrade)
Post #: 10
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/26/2021 5:24:11 PM   
melnibonian

 

Posts: 137
Joined: 7/30/2010
From: Sweden
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Templer_12

The new legislation always leads to misunderstandings.

1. The depiction of swastikas and other symbols and signs from the Nazi era are permitted in games if they are in a historical context.
It is still forbidden and punishable to display and use it if they glorify, prais or play down the Nazi era and/or those responsible.

2. It is also often misunderstood: the flag offered here is the flag of the Nazi party, the NSDAP.
It is not the so-called Reichskriegsflagge (Reich War Flag) 1935 to 1945, the flag for wartime.

Personally, I believe that War in the X does not glorify anything from this period, that the Reichskriegsflagge and the SS runes add to the historically accurate overall picture.

Many would like the historical Reichskriegsflagge 1935 to 1945 as a good quality mod, and also the SS officers in the game to be clearly identified by the SS runes.


I totally agree with your points.

I have attached the Reichskriegsflagge in case anyone prefers it (JSGME-ready for those who use it)

Please feel free to alter, edit, change and share to your heart's content


Attachment (1)

< Message edited by melnibonian -- 3/26/2021 5:25:19 PM >

(in reply to Templer_12)
Post #: 11
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/26/2021 8:36:32 PM   
Simulacra53


Posts: 632
Joined: 5/16/2015
Status: offline 		Das Reichsflaggengesetz vom 15. September 1935 besagte:

„Die Reichsfarben sind Schwarz-Weiß-Rot.“
– Reichsflaggengesetz, Artikel 1
„Reichs- und Nationalflagge ist die Hakenkreuzflagge. Sie ist zugleich Handelsflagge.“
– Reichsflaggengesetz, Artikel 2

(in reply to melnibonian)
Post #: 12
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/27/2021 2:33:18 PM   
supersixfour

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 3/12/2014
Status: offline 		Added the national flag into top right corner UI panel and Axis Iniative panel.

Attachment (1)

(in reply to Simulacra53)
Post #: 13
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/27/2021 3:46:15 PM   
melnibonian

 

Posts: 137
Joined: 7/30/2010
From: Sweden
Status: offline 		Thank you very much.

Now I can start the offensive

(in reply to supersixfour)
Post #: 14
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/27/2021 10:46:53 PM   
jacktimes2


Posts: 153
Joined: 7/11/2015
From: NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: melnibonian

quote:

ORIGINAL: Templer_12

The new legislation always leads to misunderstandings.

1. The depiction of swastikas and other symbols and signs from the Nazi era are permitted in games if they are in a historical context.
It is still forbidden and punishable to display and use it if they glorify, prais or play down the Nazi era and/or those responsible.

2. It is also often misunderstood: the flag offered here is the flag of the Nazi party, the NSDAP.
It is not the so-called Reichskriegsflagge (Reich War Flag) 1935 to 1945, the flag for wartime.

Personally, I believe that War in the X does not glorify anything from this period, that the Reichskriegsflagge and the SS runes add to the historically accurate overall picture.

Many would like the historical Reichskriegsflagge 1935 to 1945 as a good quality mod, and also the SS officers in the game to be clearly identified by the SS runes.


I totally agree with your points.

I have attached the Reichskriegsflagge in case anyone prefers it (JSGME-ready for those who use it)

Please feel free to alter, edit, change and share to your heart's content


This is great, thank you. Is there any chance you could upload a Reichskriegsflagge equivalent to the above "top right corner UI" and "Axis Initiative" panel mods?

< Message edited by jacktimes2 -- 3/27/2021 10:47:31 PM >

(in reply to melnibonian)
Post #: 15
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 3/30/2021 1:01:36 AM   
gRaider2001

 

Posts: 17
Joined: 12/31/2012
Status: offline 		Thanks for sharing the mod. I added it to my install.

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Post #: 16
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 4/24/2021 5:59:40 AM   
MishaTX


Posts: 79
Joined: 8/13/2015
Status: offline 		Thanks for this! I still find it curious that it's considered quite acceptable to use the historical insignia for, say, the Soviet Union which was even more murderous than Nazi Germany (which is saying quite a bit!), but heaven forbid a historical flag for Germany sneak its way into a historical wargame.

< Message edited by MishaTX -- 4/24/2021 6:00:19 AM >

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Post #: 17
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 4/25/2021 5:55:41 PM   
OberGeneral

 

Posts: 205
Joined: 10/9/2018
From: Canada
Status: offline 		Thanks for this!

(in reply to MishaTX)
Post #: 18
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 4/25/2021 5:57:51 PM   
Bamilus


Posts: 973
Joined: 4/30/2010
From: The Old Northwest
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MishaTX

Thanks for this! I still find it curious that it's considered quite acceptable to use the historical insignia for, say, the Soviet Union which was even more murderous than Nazi Germany (which is saying quite a bit!), but heaven forbid a historical flag for Germany sneak its way into a historical wargame.


Legal and political reasons. Some laws have changed in Germany but there's still lots of regulations in other countries and they vary across the board. Much easier to just let players add it in themselves versus risking any issues.

Although to your point, Soviet symbolism is banned in Ukraine, as well. Mortal Kombat 11 got pulled from that country because of Soviet symbolism. But that's a more recent law and the only one I'm aware of that applies to Soviet symbolism in games.

< Message edited by Bamilus -- 4/25/2021 6:00:04 PM >

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Post #: 19
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 5/18/2021 12:31:58 AM   
CJM

 

Posts: 61
Joined: 10/12/2014
Status: offline 		Worked like a charm! Thank you to all the moders!

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The Wehrmacht that set out to conquer Russia in 1941 was a poor army with strictly limited resources.
- Supplying War (1977)

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Post #: 20
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 5/20/2021 2:20:18 AM   
Rick402

 

Posts: 90
Joined: 3/28/2019
Status: offline 		that **** law still applys to Military Scale models though. which sux cause when i build i build to the most Historical accurate model i can and Want

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Post #: 21
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 5/20/2021 2:54:55 AM   
Dreamslayer

 

Posts: 452
Joined: 10/31/2015
From: St.Petersburg
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MishaTX

the Soviet Union which was even more murderous than Nazi Germany (which is saying quite a bit!)

Who is here, the Nazi fan? I guess that USSR was too merciful to Germany and its puppets.

_____________________________


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Post #: 22
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 5/22/2021 4:22:24 AM   
Hagar

 

Posts: 181
Joined: 8/11/2016
From: Rural Overijssel, the Netherlands
Status: offline 		In all fairness, Stalin's track record isn't exactly spotless... Katyn certainly comes to mind, for one, and that is even without the suffering of the Soviet people during Stalin's regime. But that does nothing to belittle the atrocities of the Nazis, and one can understand why Soviet soldiers weren't exactly in a forgiving mood after what the Germans did to the Soviet population in the USSR. Who was worse is up to debate, but if we limit it to Hitler vs. Stalin one can easily agree both were pretty much out there.

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Post #: 23
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 5/22/2021 6:19:23 AM   
Dreamslayer

 

Posts: 452
Joined: 10/31/2015
From: St.Petersburg
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hagar
Who was worse is up to debate, but if we limit it to Hitler vs. Stalin one can easily agree both were pretty much out there.

Of course for Western people it is up to debate. Because most of them know nothing about the real war like it was on Eastern Front. Main their blame to Hitler its a what is commonly called Holocaust. So its Nazi politics to Jews but who cares about millions of USSR population right?
Why do you think that most of that Western people know about USSR, Eastern Front, Stalin etc. are not actually fake or propaganda of Western governments? How you can try to get a neutral analysis about the subject if you only have access to Western sources?
Stop to read various pulp fiction from Guderian/Mainstein or others Germans from Historical Division of US Army. Try something more actual like "Notizen aus dem Vernichtungskrieg Die Ostfront 1941/42 in den Aufzeichnungen des Generals Heinrici" ,I'm not sure if there is English edition already. Or maybe modern Russian history books/articles.
The other problem imho is that after "Cold war" ended and "Iron Curtain"(yes another one Western cliche) gone its only happened for Russia because on the West people still live with it. They can't get something normal about USSR/Russia. That's why I speak with somebody from the West (Western Europe, US, Australia) I often have feeling like this person stucked in 50s and The Caribbean crisis just happened =D


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Post #: 24
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 5/22/2021 9:23:09 AM   
Hagar

 

Posts: 181
Joined: 8/11/2016
From: Rural Overijssel, the Netherlands
Status: offline 		As I recall, about 6 million Jews died under the Nazi regime, but well over 20 million died due to Nazism, most of them in the Soviet sphere. Stalin accounts for about 30 million or so, albeit in a longer timeframe. And Nazi atrocities in the East were brutal... The last thing I want to do is to downplay those. Nor did MishaTX intend to, methinks. Both the Stalin regime and the Nazis have plenty of blood on their hands. And neither of them cared much for their own population. The Soviet Union as a whole is a different matter, as you can't compare the days of Stalin to that of the post-1953 era.

_____________________________

CORE Minister of Propaganda

Ex-CORE for Arsenal of Democracy developer

COREd War in the East 2 - reworked aircraft, ground and leader imagery

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Post #: 25
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 5/23/2021 2:34:21 AM   
MishaTX


Posts: 79
Joined: 8/13/2015
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dreamslayer


quote:

ORIGINAL: MishaTX

the Soviet Union which was even more murderous than Nazi Germany (which is saying quite a bit!)

Who is here, the Nazi fan? I guess that USSR was too merciful to Germany and its puppets.

Normally I wouldn't even dignify an insult like that with a response, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here and assume that you simply misunderstood what I was saying.

My point was NOT to say "yeah, but others were bad too, so it doesn't matter what the Nazis did", because that would be crazy. One horrifying regime's deeds do not make another horrifying regime's atrocities any less of an issue. They're BOTH issues, and they should BOTH be remembered. So why aren't they? Why aren't the Stalinist purges and forced relocations taught as well? And what about the Holodomor?

Two wrongs don't make a right.

I do agree with you, however, that the atrocities committed by the Nazis in Russia and the Ukraine aren't nearly documented enough, at least not here in the West, but that's finally changing. It has nothing to do with what my point was, though.

Peace.

(in reply to Dreamslayer)
Post #: 26
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 5/23/2021 1:41:44 PM   
malyhin1517


Posts: 1426
Joined: 9/20/2015
From: Ukraine Dnepropetrovsk
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MishaTX


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dreamslayer


quote:

ORIGINAL: MishaTX

the Soviet Union which was even more murderous than Nazi Germany (which is saying quite a bit!)

Who is here, the Nazi fan? I guess that USSR was too merciful to Germany and its puppets.

Normally I wouldn't even dignify an insult like that with a response, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here and assume that you simply misunderstood what I was saying.

My point was NOT to say "yeah, but others were bad too, so it doesn't matter what the Nazis did", because that would be crazy. One horrifying regime's deeds do not make another horrifying regime's atrocities any less of an issue. They're BOTH issues, and they should BOTH be remembered. So why aren't they? Why aren't the Stalinist purges and forced relocations taught as well? And what about the Holodomor?

Two wrongs don't make a right.

I do agree with you, however, that the atrocities committed by the Nazis in Russia and the Ukraine aren't nearly documented enough, at least not here in the West, but that's finally changing. It has nothing to do with what my point was, though.

Peace.

25-30 million is the total number of victims of the Soviet regime and famines for the period from 1921 to 1954! But this is not the death toll! The exact death toll is unknown. About 700 thousand people were shot and some more died in prisons and camps, as well as during famine in different regions of the Soviet Union (Ukraine, the Volga region and other regions). This is a huge figure, but over a long period. The Germans killed several times more people in just a few years, therefore, in the eyes of the Russian people, Hitler is much more terrible than Stalin. Therefore, Western propaganda has had little success in Russia and other countries of the former USSR. In addition, on the part of Hitler, genocide was applied not only to the Jews, but also to other nationalities of the USSR, and on the part of Stalin, these were selective repressions, usually associated with the class principle.

_____________________________

Sorry, i use an online translator :(

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Post #: 27
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 8/23/2021 6:20:57 PM   
Lurberri

 

Posts: 35
Joined: 5/13/2021
Status: offline 		Thanks

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Post #: 28
RE: Historical Flag Mod Coming? - 11/30/2021 1:42:41 PM   
supersixfour

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 3/12/2014
Status: offline 		I was about to post updated flag mod but now it seems I need to have 10 messages and on top of it wait a week after that.
Funny how I could share previous one at 3 posts.

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Post #: 29
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