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Placement of transport groups? - 2/17/2022 6:46:03 PM   
rocketman71

 

Posts: 441
Joined: 2/20/2007
Status: offline 		I'm in my first campaign, at turn 18, and am struggling with finding good placement for the transport groups. My supply is getting strained and the constant rain doesn't help (I need to apeace the rain gods). My problem is that either they are out of range to my intended targets or they have range but not to any depots with large amounts of freight. I have continously moved AOGs forward as I advance, but this aspect is out of grasp for me somehow. Any insights would be appreciated.
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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/17/2022 7:57:19 PM   
Stamb

 

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Joined: 10/26/2021
Status: offline 		"My supply is getting strained and the constant rain doesn't help"

Probably you are playing as an Axis side.
Try to get ju52 transport planes (as they can use additional fuel loadout to extend their range) from other TBs to a map. You should have 3 transport AOGs with a maximum of 5 groups in each.

If Leningrad is not taken and you have supply problems in the North then you can use Pskov and nearby airfields.

For the center Orsha/Minsk/Mogilev works.

In the south - Kiev/Poltava or D/Z cities.

Depends where you can get freight.

But typically this cities are where I keep my planes in `41

Also I expand airbases as I need. Cuz that planes need a lot of space.

Some time ago I was asking a question if I should use fuel loadout even if my planes can reach my targets without it. And there was no clear answer. Unless somebody makes a test I have no idea what is better.

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/17/2022 10:29:33 PM   
rocketman71

 

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Joined: 2/20/2007
Status: offline 		Yes, axis side. Good point about getting transports from the TBs. Good thing I have control over them. Had forgotten about the option to change loadout. Will try and see if it improves my situation.

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/18/2022 2:09:52 AM   
DarkHorse2

 

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Joined: 2/4/2022
Status: offline 		You start getting the 323's around turn 6 or 8? (but never in large numbers really)

However, you can still make good use of them if you organize your transport stab units into one group.

I usually put them in 'zb V3' as a habit.

Anyways, since the stabs are small, you can switch over to the Me 323s. With 3 or 4 stabs, you should be able to have 12-16 Me 323s active in one AOG.

At that point, their very large cargo capacity becomes evident and usable.

Their range is somewhat limited; however they can carry quite a load at short hops, like Odessa to Yevpatoriya (Crimea).

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/18/2022 3:18:12 AM   
CarstenJansing

 

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Status: offline 		put theTransport AOGs on large depots like Minsk, Riga oder Kiew

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/18/2022 6:38:35 PM   
rocketman71

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkHorse2

You start getting the 323's around turn 6 or 8? (but never in large numbers really)

However, you can still make good use of them if you organize your transport stab units into one group.

I usually put them in 'zb V3' as a habit.

Anyways, since the stabs are small, you can switch over to the Me 323s. With 3 or 4 stabs, you should be able to have 12-16 Me 323s active in one AOG.

At that point, their very large cargo capacity becomes evident and usable.

Their range is somewhat limited; however they can carry quite a load at short hops, like Odessa to Yevpatoriya (Crimea).

I have a bunch of those in a pool, but don't think I have ever had any on map or in reserves.

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/19/2022 2:31:29 AM   
DarkHorse2

 

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quote:

I have a bunch of those in a pool, but don't think I have ever had any on map or in reserves


You will have to explicitly change out your current transport AC to make use of them.

You don't have the quantities of Me323s to change out anything larger than your stab-sized formations for some time.

But, I find it is worth the trouble.

I make extensive use of German transports. Where they are the most valuable are airbases that can accumulate a lot of excess freight.

So, think! Where are these?

* Minsk? - no, rarely has any excess freight.
* Riga? - yes, often has excess freight. In fact, you want to expand it to size 3 airbase to allow more transports there.
* Parnu? - yes
* Tallinn? - yes
* Smolensk? - no
* Velikye Luki? - yes, surprisingly it does tend to draw a lot of freight
* Odessa? - yes
* Kiev? - eventually yes
* various bases in Romania tend to accumulate a lot of excess freight

In general, AGC has very difficult time accumulating excess freight. As a result, not a good place to base Air Transports - unless you like carrying air.

AGN has easy time accumulating excess freight due to those Baltic ports. Those make good Air Transport hubs.

AGS is mixed with the Black Sea ports having an easier time. From Odessa and Kherson, you can heavily augment Crimea supply. From Botsani (Romania), you can reach Kiev for air drops. From Kherson, you can reach Dnepropetrovsk for air drops.

Any airbase you decide to use as a major Air Transport supply hub needs to be expanded to Level 3 as soon as you can. I start working on some of those in Romania beginning turn 1.

(tip: if you want to expand an airbase, they need to have a construction engineer assigned. you can risk it and hope the AI assigns for you (which many times it doesn't) or you can explicitly assign one yourself at the cost of an AP. For me, I have tight schedule and need those airbases ASAP, so I spend 3 or 4 AP on turn 1 to insure they are not sitting idle and expand.)

(tip2: start moving the bulk of your excess construction engineers to OKH to make it easier for both you and the AI to use. additionally, those construction engineers eat a bunch of supply each turn, better to have them supplied via OKH than having the additional supply burden down at the Corp-level. I do limit Corps to just 1 construction engineer (not be to confused with pioneers) for local fort-building purposes.)

(tip3: key an eye on enemy interception of your transports or they will eat through them pretty fast. unfortunately, assignment of transport-escorts is extremely flakey. grrr.... so you will have to experiment.)

(tip4: do NOT use the multiple mission drops until you know it is safe from enemy interception!!!)

-----

The air base suggestions pertains mainly through 1941. Beginning 1942, you may find your depot logistics have changed to allow others to be alternatively used.




< Message edited by DarkHorse2 -- 2/19/2022 6:54:18 PM >

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/19/2022 5:00:31 PM   
rocketman71

 

Posts: 441
Joined: 2/20/2007
Status: offline 		All very good points, thanks. Will definitely have a closer look att the Me323. Haven't thought about the need for excess freight, just freight in general. Wish there was an option for Air Freight Depots.

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/19/2022 5:54:19 PM   
Jeff_Ahl

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rocketman71

All very good points, thanks. Will definitely have a closer look att the Me323. Haven't thought about the need for excess freight, just freight in general. Wish there was an option for Air Freight Depots.


+1

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/19/2022 6:26:25 PM   
DarkHorse2

 

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quote:

Wish there was an option for Air Freight Depots


Indeed, that would be nice.

But, as it is now, you are at the mercy of the AI-Logistics system and have to be aware of where freight naturally pools up.

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/19/2022 6:38:28 PM   
Stamb

 

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Status: offline 		You can use depot priority 4 to have freight there. There is no problem to get freight into a cities that I mention in a post 2, even in `41.

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RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/19/2022 7:04:11 PM   
DarkHorse2

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Stamb

You can use depot priority 4 to have freight there. There is no problem to get freight into a cities that I mention in a post 2, even in `41.


Will have to agree to disagree on this one. Even at priority 4, I have found Minsk simply does not accumulate enough excess freight to cover both the fuel demands of JU-52s (using the additional fuel tanks) and accumulate enough excess freight to justify basing a full compliment of JU-52s (3 x 40 twin engine AC).

Really need airbases that can accumulate at least 750+ excess freight on a regular basis.

Keep in mind, you will be flying multiple air transport missions out of that same base in one turn. (at least 2-3 per turn). In this manner, that freight goes really fast when covering both the fuel requirements + the transport load capacity.

AGC airbases, no matter what priority is used, simply do not accumulate this level of excess freight.

< Message edited by DarkHorse2 -- 2/19/2022 7:15:12 PM >

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Post #: 12
RE: Placement of transport groups? - 2/19/2022 7:27:34 PM   
Stamb

 

Posts: 1030
Joined: 10/26/2021
Status: offline 		This is not my experience. Minsk and nearby depots in Orsha/Mogivel can accumulate freight without a problems. Maybe you do something different. I do not know.
I use ju52 with additional fueltanks as well.

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