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One in a Million? - 11/26/2001 12:59:00 AM   
Polrbear

 

Posts: 54
Joined: 6/17/2000
From: Plano, TX, USA
Status: offline 		What are the odds that a moving unbuttoned Panther would be destroyed by a Russian 82mm Mortar barrage? What a great game!

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- 11/26/2001 1:18:00 AM   
Warrior


Posts: 1808
Joined: 11/2/2000
From: West Palm Beach, FL USA
Status: offline 		Happens frequently enough so I always target tanks with mortars.

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Post #: 2
- 11/26/2001 5:04:00 AM   
sebagonzalez

 

Posts: 156
Joined: 9/11/2001
From: Uruguay
Status: offline 		To destroy it with a 82mm the odds are very, very low. I would not be surprised with a 105mm or more but 82!!..it´s one in a thousand times.

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Post #: 3
- 11/26/2001 11:28:00 PM   
lnp4668

 

Posts: 517
Joined: 11/10/2000
From: Arlington, TX, USA
Status: offline 		How about killing a Kingtiger with 75mm FH? I guess if you throw enough shells at it, anything could happen

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(in reply to Polrbear)
Post #: 4
- 11/26/2001 11:42:00 PM   
gnoccop

 

Posts: 162
Joined: 7/26/2001
From: Cento, Italy
Status: offline 		Saturday I've destroyed a TIGER E with a 57mm AT (US Army) at about 10 hex (Front Hull).
It was my second shot; first shot missing ->Tiger op fire -> few points of suppression -> 2^ shot hit!

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"Violence is the last resource of incompetents". (I. Asimov)

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Post #: 5
- 11/27/2001 2:04:00 AM   
Frank W.

 

Posts: 1958
Joined: 10/18/2001
From: Siegen + Essen / W. Germany
Status: offline
quote:

Originally posted by gnoccop:
Saturday I've destroyed a TIGER E with a 57mm AT (US Army) at about 10 hex (Front Hull).
It was my second shot; first shot missing ->Tiger op fire -> few points of suppression -> 2^ shot hit!
57mm US A.T. is one of the best guns in the game !!

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Post #: 6
- 11/27/2001 2:38:00 AM   
AbsntMndedProf


Posts: 1780
Joined: 7/6/2001
From: Boston, Massachusetts
Status: offline 		From what I've read previously here, I would guess the factor that might make it easier for mortars to kill a heavy AFV would be the condition of the AFV in question. A Tiger E in mint condition, straight from the factory, that had seen no action, would probably survive hits by lighter artillery/mortars. However, most AFVs are not in mint condition, and have sustained hits that didn't destroy them, but may have damaged their armor plate. Also repairs and patches may weaken the overall ability of a given AFV to survive subsequent hits. Just a thought. Eric Maietta

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Post #: 7
- 11/27/2001 2:48:00 AM   
Frank W.

 

Posts: 1958
Joined: 10/18/2001
From: Siegen + Essen / W. Germany
Status: offline
quote:

Originally posted by AbsntMndedProf:
From what I've read previously here, I would guess the factor that might make it easier for mortars to kill a heavy AFV would be the condition of the AFV in question. A Tiger E in mint condition, straight from the factory, that had seen no action, would probably survive hits by lighter artillery/mortars. However, most AFVs are not in mint condition, and have sustained hits that didn't destroy them, but may have damaged their armor plate. Also repairs and patches may weaken the overall ability of a given AFV to survive subsequent hits. Just a thought. Eric Maietta
don´t foret the supression EVERY tank gets from arty shelling... if it is a tiger II or a sherman. and supression lowers hit change and shots....

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Post #: 8
- 11/30/2001 10:35:00 AM   
Capt. Pixel

 

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline 		I always try to land a little artillery on any known threats - I've popped enough AFVs over the years with "The King of the Battlefield" to realize it's well worth the plot. And, as mentioned earlier in this post, any artillery landing in a hex with a unit is going to cause some suppression.
But I don't use any caliber of artillery anymore for the express purpose of destroying units. Quite the contrary. I find it a much more useful tool for fixing and suppressing the enemy into place while I follow-up with the more effective ground units for the kills.
Even if you don't succeed in pinning all of the enemies units down, you'll strip away enough of advancing units by reducing or even stopping them.
And in an assault situation, a good ground pounding with a land mattress or even an 81mm is far preferable to waltzing up to an un-supressed defensive line.
Does anyone here have a feel for the overall relative effective ability to supress units between the larger caliber, slow firing, widely spreading incoming HE versus small or medium caliber with better on-target concentration and a higher ROF?
I tend to go for more, smaller tubes and count on rolling supression to fracture an enemies formation over time and slow him down. This seems to give me the ability to destroy him piece-meal and effectively give me a mobility advantage. (That is, of course, unless he's returning the favor )

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Post #: 9
- 11/30/2001 7:55:00 PM   
Mikimoto

 

Posts: 511
Joined: 11/6/2000
From: Barcelona, Catalunya
Status: offline
quote:

Originally posted by gnoccop:
Saturday I've destroyed a TIGER E with a 57mm AT (US Army) at about 10 hex (Front Hull).
It was my second shot; first shot missing ->Tiger op fire -> few points of suppression -> 2^ shot hit!
57mm AT-gun killing Tigers from the front at 500 yards: I think there is something wrong here...
Same for artillery destroying tanks with annoying frequency... Something wrong, repeat.

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Desperta ferro!
Miquel Guasch Aparicio

(in reply to Polrbear)
Post #: 10
- 11/30/2001 8:22:00 PM   
TheZel66

 

Posts: 210
Joined: 4/6/2001
From: Phila, PA
Status: offline 		in MCNA, i killed two Matilda II's with a PSW222, and it took only three shots.. granted the PSW was in an adjecent hex to both.

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Post #: 11
- 11/30/2001 8:34:00 PM   
generalrichmond

 

Posts: 178
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: richmond, va
Status: offline 		OK, I am gonna tell you that one is wrong.

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Post #: 12
- 12/4/2001 8:31:00 AM   
Capt. Pixel

 

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline 		A little update - In a PBEM earlier today, I had a situation where a Patton with a .50 cal and a bazooka had just crossed a small stream in front of a section of Shermans and an enemy M4 105 sherman had taken up residence in a pile of rocks in front of my main advance. I targeted a couple of 81mm SPMs on the Patton and another 81mm SPM on the M4 105. KILLED THEM BOTH!!! Mind you, my only intention was to surpress them until I could move AT assets up on the next turn to dispatch them. Sometimes you get lucky, sometimes you get REALLY lucky. (I think my opponent is gonna surrender after that turn. )

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"Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible. "
- Stonewall Jackson

(in reply to Polrbear)
Post #: 13
- 12/4/2001 8:33:00 AM   
john g

 

Posts: 984
Joined: 10/6/2000
From: college station, tx usa
Status: offline
quote:

Originally posted by TheZel:
in MCNA, i killed two Matilda II's with a PSW222, and it took only three shots.. granted the PSW was in an adjecent hex to both.
Don't knock that 20mm apcr. It is a real killer.
thanks, John.

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Post #: 14
- 12/4/2001 9:42:00 AM   
tracer


Posts: 1865
Joined: 11/22/2000
From: New Smyrna Beach, FL USA
Status: offline
quote:

Originally posted by Capt. Pixel:

But I don't use any caliber of artillery anymore for the express purpose of destroying units. Quite the contrary. I find it a much more useful tool for fixing and suppressing the enemy into place while I follow-up with the more effective ground units for the kills.
Try dropping 150mm or above on infantry and watch what happens In a PBEM last week I had 3 platoons hidden (in cover) in a vineyard that my opponent must have thought looked 'suspicious'. I watched my troops melt away during a 2-turn downpour of GE 150mm; the adjacent-hex hits were the worst, killing up to half a squad. You will rarely see casualties with 75 or 81mm tubes. Point is, even if you're only going for suppression, the larger guns will give more and over a wider area too. There's a reason they cost more

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Jim NSB

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Post #: 15
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