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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Logistical Nightmare? Page: [1]
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Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 5:50:26 PM   
Alexander Seil

 

Posts: 196
Joined: 4/22/2003
Status: offline 		I've just recently bought the game, although still did not have enough time to actively play it, other than some turns in the Coral Sea scenario.

Now, the question is, how do experienced players manage the myriad civilian transport ships? Now, of course, troops require supply and it is their task to bring it to them, but in what quantities, how often, escorted or unescorted, continuous supply or in separate taskforces? How many do you actually use and how many do you keep in reserve?


Also, sealane interdiction - is it possible to set just some sub TFs to computer control, but not all? Is there any point in operating subs in groups, rather than individually (I'm trying to cut down on micromanagement)?
Post #: 1
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 6:09:55 PM   
TulliusDetritus


Posts: 5521
Joined: 4/1/2004
From: The Zone™
Status: offline 		I love the "logistical nightmare". Anyway, I will let the experienced players tell you their tips. I am a mediocre player

(in reply to Alexander Seil)
Post #: 2
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 6:42:56 PM   
Tom Hunter


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/14/2004
Status: offline 		You can use either lots of little TF or few big ones to move supplies and troops.

Oleg and I just discussed this in my Lunacy AAR including some maps looking there might be helpful.

(in reply to Alexander Seil)
Post #: 3
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 6:45:38 PM   
Graycompany


Posts: 511
Joined: 8/19/2004
Status: offline 		Well that would depend, It is a bit Different for the Allies and Axis.

Sometimes to small outlaying places, a small group unescorted who will be out of harms way is fine. Some guys like small continous runs back and forth. Some use Big Transports, 30 or more ships which allows you have a more heavily escorted group. I like to use combinations of the above, For the Allies, I use Big groups running from West Coast to Pearl, with Little escort. I use PH as a staging base, and from there I tranport smaller groups to midway, Canton, ect. I like to use Pago pago as a weigh station, East bound convoys fill up with fuel, and escorts that need to rest stay over for a few weeks. West bound convoys can switch out escorts and refuel if needed and Troops can be stagged. Everyone has there own system, and you may have to adjust as the Enemy reacts.

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(in reply to Alexander Seil)
Post #: 4
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 7:27:50 PM   
Rob Brennan UK


Posts: 3685
Joined: 8/24/2002
From: London UK
Status: offline 		My strategy ( if it is one )

Troop covoys get decent escorts DD's DM's etc. as many as i feel i can spare at the time .. no set ratio.

I send huge 50+ convoys to say 10 hexes east of pago on do not retire ( usually unescorted). then sort out who wants what when they arrive .. i.e canton/suva/noumea/australia and nz.. usually take them away from the computer generated routes which seems to help a lot.

As a rule of thumb .. can't ever have too much supply. run the AK's ragged for 4-6 months and the entire pacific will be fully supplied. fuel is even faster and i often find TK's superflous after a while. Runs to anchorage can also be unescorted (unless its troops)

My biggest fear is losing A/c groups at sea. i do not however split them up before hand as i think this helps the unit disapearing bug ( which i very rarely encounter, 1 unit in 4 games ) escort these 1-1 with whatever is available. and sent them on odd routes i.e 'do not retire' to obscure hexes then set the homebase to where you want them to go.

the huge AK force in karachi can supply perth and N australia (even round to sydney ) extremely well. load up sent to hex west of ceylon (near map edge) homebase perth. voila !

hope this helps a bit .. as for how much any given unit needs i have no clue .. i always send as much as i can.



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(in reply to Graycompany)
Post #: 5
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 7:48:59 PM   
Ron Saueracker


Posts: 12121
Joined: 1/28/2002
From: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
Status: offline 		In this game if there is a resource centre at the base don't bother bringing in supplies, they will magically appear there. Poof...taadaaaa. This game is only a logistical nightmare if one is interested in a simulation...the nightmare being the lack of a decent supply/logistics model.

_____________________________





Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan

(in reply to Rob Brennan UK)
Post #: 6
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 7:57:05 PM   
el cid again

 

Posts: 16922
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Some guys like small continous runs back and forth.


IF you play with realistic rules for loading at ports (these are house rules just now - there is NO limit to loading - a million ships can loat at a level 1 port!)

OR IF you play with future releases like RHS (certainly) or CHS (possibly), you are going to have to use this method for many places.
Large convoys will be unable to load/unload at many minor places. In the real world, Noumea had ships at anchor for many months waiting to load - and that was not a totally minor port!

There is an ancient debate about this in naval theory. Wars have shown that convoys work - even when thought to be "obsolete." Convoys are NOT defensive - but offensive - in USN doctrine. The enemy must fight where you can be organized to fight - or let you pass. The problem is, big convoys impose a huge cost in terms of you MUST move at the rate of the slowest ship AND you MUST wait to assemble/load/unload.

In the real world SOME ships ignored this "fact" - notably the Queens - sailed with 5000 troops per voyage each - unescorted - and alone - and in these waters too!


(in reply to Graycompany)
Post #: 7
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 10:19:56 PM   
rogueusmc


Posts: 4583
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: Texas...what country are YOU from?
Status: offline 		I use like transports in groups of five with an escort...uless it is an invasion TF.

My transports move to waypoint ports (Christmas Island, Pago Pago and Noumea) then dole out from there. Five 7k AKs carry 35000 in supply. Good for to take care of any base for a while usually.

I disband them when they get back to origin to repair damage. If I wait for them to get to zero each time, it gives a good rotation and always have some transports available.

I limit myself to one of each kind of TF (AKs, APs or TKs) starting each day to load.

< Message edited by rogueusmc -- 12/17/2005 10:21:15 PM >

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There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines: Marines and the enemy. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion.

Gen. William Thornson, U.S. Army


(in reply to el cid again)
Post #: 8
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/17/2005 10:35:17 PM   
Treetop64


Posts: 926
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: 519 Redwood City - BASE (Hex 218, 70)
Status: offline 		As I've gained experience with WitP, I've realized that it is more of a wartime naval logistics simulator than a strategic war simulator. I spend way more time managing the merchant fleet than I do with the combat fleets. However, that is only natural since your combat fleets are chopped liver without the support of the AKs, TKs, AD, etc, etc...

It's highly recommended that you manage all your own transport routes. It will take some time to get the hang of it and establish some sort of rythm, likely several weeks or more, but it's worth it. Besides, it will give you something to do on turns where there is little or no action between combat units.

Have fun with it!

_____________________________



(in reply to rogueusmc)
Post #: 9
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/18/2005 12:49:02 AM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		The auto convoy helps alot. You do have to be careful though and not put front line bases on the list or next thing you know...some AK's will sail right in regardless of the presence of enemy forces. Every once in a while too the pathing will get wierd but overall it lightens my load enough that i can manage my important convoys without investing an afternoon just for one turn.


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Post #: 10
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/18/2005 1:54:12 AM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline
quote:

Now, the question is, how do experienced players manage the myriad civilian transport ships?

One by one.....

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Fear the kitten!

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Post #: 11
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/18/2005 2:57:59 AM   
dereck


Posts: 2800
Joined: 9/7/2004
From: Romulus, MI
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alexander Seil

I've just recently bought the game, although still did not have enough time to actively play it, other than some turns in the Coral Sea scenario.

Now, the question is, how do experienced players manage the myriad civilian transport ships? Now, of course, troops require supply and it is their task to bring it to them, but in what quantities, how often, escorted or unescorted, continuous supply or in separate taskforces? How many do you actually use and how many do you keep in reserve?


Also, sealane interdiction - is it possible to set just some sub TFs to computer control, but not all? Is there any point in operating subs in groups, rather than individually (I'm trying to cut down on micromanagement)?



I have cargo (AK) and tanker (TK) convoys continuously running between the West Coast and Pearl Harbor; Pearl Harbor and Kwajalein; and Kwajalain to Ulithi. I have accumulated tons of supplies in bases such as the Admiralty Islands, etc that I use to supply New Guinea until I build up Ulithi.

Anyways, for the West Coast->Pearl Harbor route I will have multiple 25 ship AK task forces working out of different West Coast ports. In the task force's home port on the West Coast I also have 10 dedicated AKs who sole purpose is to replace the 5 AKs in the task force with the highest SYS damage. I do that in each main "supply hub". I constantly keep the convoys moving (set destination, and then set to computer controlled and it will keep delivering supplies without you having to do anything) and only check them when they get back to their home port(s) to pick up supplies. By rotating the 5 ships with the highest SYS damage I also keep the ships well maintained and it's not really that hard once you get used to it.

I also do the same for my tanker task forces to keep fuel moving and keep the ships repaired.

_____________________________

PO2 US Navy (1980-1986);
USS Midway CV-41 (1981-1984)
Whidbey Island, WA (1984-1986)
Naval Reserve (1986-1992)

(in reply to Alexander Seil)
Post #: 12
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/18/2005 4:30:54 AM   
Treetop64


Posts: 926
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: 519 Redwood City - BASE (Hex 218, 70)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

quote:

Now, the question is, how do experienced players manage the myriad civilian transport ships?

One by one.....



Yeah, he's not kidding, either...

_____________________________



(in reply to tsimmonds)
Post #: 13
RE: Logistical Nightmare? - 12/18/2005 5:14:18 AM   
scout1


Posts: 2899
Joined: 8/24/2004
From: South Bend, In
Status: offline
quote:


quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

quote:

Now, the question is, how do experienced players manage the myriad civilian transport ships?
One by one.....



Yeah, he's not kidding, either


Ain't that the truth......

(in reply to Treetop64)
Post #: 14
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