Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather?

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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather?

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Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 12/31/2005 4:18:58 PM

ADavidB

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From: Toronto, Canada
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Mike, Eric -

Why does the Game have so much bad flying weather over so much of the entire map so regularly when Advanced Weather Effects are turned "on"?

Are non-arctic regions supposed to receive rain, heavy rain and thunderstorms every day for weeks at a time?

Should periods of good weather be able to last for more than a day or two?

Was the Game always this way or was something changed in the weather routines during one of the version upgrades?

I'm currently running v1.602 with "Advance Weather Effect" set to on.

Can Advanced Weather effects be turned off after a PBEM starts?

Thanks -

Dave Baranyi

Post #: 1

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 12/31/2005 4:43:51 PM

Sneer

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Monsoon time ? maybe
this slows game so maybe it is really good
does anybody knows india climat ?

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RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 12/31/2005 6:35:06 PM

el cid again

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quote:

Why does the Game have so much bad flying weather over so much of the entire map so regularly when Advanced Weather Effects are turned "on"?

Boy are we in a different universe!!! I want to know why there is so much good flying weather?

Japan is socked in to the point bombers cannot see any target 85% of the time! The Aleutians in much of the year are shrouded by fog over 90% of the time (the summer excepted). Neither of these cases is clear in the game system.

The situation over Japan was the reason we stopped strategic bombing. Going over to mine warfare, we cut the heart out of Japan's economy - mines were worse than submarines - and combined with submarines the US Strategic Bombing Survey (dominated by USAAF people) concluded it created a strategic situation for victory - one of only two factors created by US forces (another factor being the Soviet intervention). The OTHER factor was the decision to fire bomb. You did not have to see the target - just hit the general area and start lots of fires. Kill the people, and you kill the industry they serve. This was justified (although illegal in our own understanding of law) on the basis of many Japanese small shops. It also was more effective than in other parts of the world because of Japanese construction with wood and paper. The firebombing campaign killed more Japanese CIVILIANS in five months than the Japanese MILITARY lost in a decade of war (saying the war started in 1935 - one of the China incidents - count ALL military losses you get only 600,000 - but WE say 800,000 civilians died - it was really millions).

Weather was the main reason the B-29 was a technical failure over Japan. Its great "successes" were

A) the mine campaign, unpopular with senior USAAF generals, because it was not part of their theory of air warfare

B) the fire bombing campaign, forbidden by JCS, and very controversial in a political and moral sense, nevertheless, it must be admitted the vast majority of Japanese cities were utterly destroyed by it - and IF you think that is warfare - it certainly had economic and strategic effects.

All the effort to create "precision" bombers came to naught - due to weather. Norden bomb sights could not see their targets - the weather was too bad!

(in reply to ADavidB)

Post #: 3

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 12/31/2005 7:09:47 PM

ADavidB

Posts: 2464
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From: Toronto, Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sneer

Monsoon time ? maybe
this slows game so maybe it is really good
does anybody knows india climat ?

I'm not speaking only of India. The West Coast of the US has had rain, heavy rain and thunderstorms 28 days out of the month for June, July and August. (I used to live in California - I KNOW what the summer weather is like.)

Australia is showing the same continuous rain weather pattern - particularly in the central desert and the Southeast Coast.

Every turn that I look at Japan I find clouds covering most of it.

Something seems wrong.

Dave Baranyi

(in reply to Sneer)

Post #: 4

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 12/31/2005 7:14:07 PM

ADavidB

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From: Toronto, Canada
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quote:

Boy are we in a different universe!!! I want to know why there is so much good flying weather?

Japan is socked in to the point bombers cannot see any target 85% of the time! The Aleutians in much of the year are shrouded by fog over 90% of the time (the summer excepted). Neither of these cases is clear in the game system.

I've been to Japan, I know what the weather is like there, particularly in the summer.

However, I am mainly talking about the Aleutian-style weather that I have been getting in the West Coast, and particularly in San Diego and Los Angeles, all game long. Plus the constant rain over all of Australia.

Something seems wrong with the way that "Advanced Weather" is behaving in my PBEM with Tophat. I don't remember it behaving this way in earlier versions.

Cheers -

Dave Baranyi

(in reply to el cid again)

Post #: 5

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 12/31/2005 8:50:51 PM

KDonovan

Posts: 1157
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From: New Jersey
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el nino??

(in reply to ADavidB)

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RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 12/31/2005 10:40:32 PM

ADavidB

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lt. Calley

I seriously doubt the game takes any account whatsoever of the weather differences between deserts and tropical rain forests.

I agree. But I wonder why I didn't notice such extensively bad weather in earlier versions of the Game. (I've been playing it since it first came out.)

Thanks -

Dave Baranyi

Post #: 7

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 12/31/2005 10:52:03 PM

dtravel

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Well, I do know that weather is not determined by hex. It is determined by unit. The program only checks to see if it should generate weather if there is a unit in the hex and if the unit moves the weather moves with it. (At least for LCUs it does. I've seen too many stacks of three or more LCUs moving where the first unit moves, the cloud remains in the hex it came from, the second unit moves, the cloud changes hexes leaving the third unit now in clear weather. Air units are moved during the orders phase, before weather is generated so its moot for them. I don't know about TFs, the screen doesn't show their actual movement. And weather is probably generated after they move anyways.) I can easily see something getting broken so that instead of only one weather check per hex you get a weather check per unit with the worst weather generated being applied.

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Any bugs I report are always straight stock games.

(in reply to ADavidB)

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RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 4:58:06 AM

dtravel

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Calley, re-read the last sentence of my post. I think that will answer your question.

_____________________________

This game does not have a learning curve. It has a learning cliff.

"Bomb early, bomb often, bomb everything." - Niceguy

Any bugs I report are always straight stock games.

Post #: 9

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 5:21:30 AM

michaelm75au

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ADavidB

Australia is showing the same continuous rain weather pattern - particularly in the central desert and the Southeast Coast.
Dave Baranyi

Gee. We could do with some that rain at the moment.
Hot as Hades here (Sydney) at the moment.

Michael

(in reply to ADavidB)

Post #: 10

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 5:31:45 AM

Raverdave

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quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelm

quote:

ORIGINAL: ADavidB

Australia is showing the same continuous rain weather pattern - particularly in the central desert and the Southeast Coast.
Dave Baranyi

Gee. We could do with some that rain at the moment.
Hot as Hades here (Sydney) at the moment.

Michael

42C yesterday, overnight low of 27C.......currently raining and 24C

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RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 1:22:55 PM

el cid again

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quote:

The West Coast of the US has had rain, heavy rain and thunderstorms 28 days out of the month for June, July and August. (I used to live in California - I KNOW what the summer weather is like.)

I was home ported in Long Beach, and I have lived in Oregon and Washington. Only the latter is famous for lots of rain - but except for the Olympic Penninsula it is not very justified by facts. NONE of these places get 28 days of rain in a month in ANY season. Look up the official records.

(in reply to ADavidB)

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RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 2:57:20 PM

Terminus

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I think I read somewhere that the weather engine has a tendency to swing wildly to one extreme of the weather spectrum and then keep it there.

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RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 4:11:06 PM

ADavidB

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From: Toronto, Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

I think I read somewhere that the weather engine has a tendency to swing wildly to one extreme of the weather spectrum and then keep it there.

That sounds like what Tophat and I are experiencing. Let's hope that Mike is looking at it.

Thanks -

Dave Baranyi

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 14

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 5:01:34 PM

rtrapasso

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

I think I read somewhere that the weather engine has a tendency to swing wildly to one extreme of the weather spectrum and then keep it there.

Right - usually it tends to lock in at one end of the spectrum (in my case, and i think most people's experience - at the heavy rain end).

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 15

RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 6:37:13 PM

tsimmonds

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

I think I read somewhere that the weather engine has a tendency to swing wildly to one extreme of the weather spectrum and then keep it there.

Right - usually it tends to lock in at one end of the spectrum (in my case, and i think most people's experience - at the heavy rain end).

This was pure speculation by Halsey and me, a result of much discussion about the weather we were seeing, and of considerable effort to reverse-engineer a system that could account for our observations. But however scientific and reasoned, it is still a WAG.

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RE: Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather? - 1/1/2006 7:26:53 PM

rtrapasso

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quote:

This was pure speculation by Halsey and me, a result of much discussion about the weather we were seeing, and of considerable effort to reverse-engineer a system that could account for our observations. But however scientific and reasoned, it is still a WAG.

The REASONS you gave may have been a WAG, but i think the observations are valid (extremes in weather).

(in reply to tsimmonds)

Post #: 17

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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Mike, Eric - Why so much bad flying weather?

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