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Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 3:11:41 AM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
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Do you like the Artillery Casualties showing up as they do in SPWAW, or do you prefer the way they are modelled in H2H, where you cant tell if your arty hits any infrantry unless they retreat, pullback, or make smoke.("SO rifle Sqd pulling back") this text still remains in H2H and still gives away enemy position anyway, you just dont know how many men you have killed.

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 3:31:17 AM

Orzel Bialy

Posts: 2664
Joined: 4/4/2002
From: Wisconsin USA
Status: offline

Nix the reports if possible. You wouldn't know for sure how badly your fire-support had mauled the enemy in real life...so IMO you shouldn't get that extra information in the game either.

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 3:49:38 AM

John Galt

Posts: 223
Joined: 1/31/2001
From: Salem, NH, USA
Status: offline

I like the arty casualties showing up.

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Post #: 3

RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 3:56:07 AM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline

One other question
does H2H show ANY casualties??
are they removed too, or just the artillery ones??

< Message edited by Alby -- 3/29/2006 5:42:14 AM >

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 3:56:31 AM

Svennemir

Posts: 542
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From: Denmark
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Perhaps they should be toggled as a realism preference. It's fun when you know you're hitting something (take THAT! HA! HA!), but not realistic. Unfortunately it's frequently possible to sense that they are hitting something even if there are no reports. This is because the barrage animation slows down slightly while people die (perhaps it does a lot of lengthy calculations). Maybe this doesn't happen on very fast computers.

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 4:01:24 AM

Major_Mess

Posts: 451
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From: The True North. Strong and Free
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Alby:

I like the way it's done in the H2H version. Another improvement would be if the text that accompanies the arty was to disappear completely ................. that would be cool.

What I'd REALLY like to see is the ability to toggle the *Willy Meter* On or Off.

Oh! ........ Oh! ........... Oh! ........................ I gotta another idea!
I wonder if the *Willy Meter* for each unit could be checked (??? I can't think of the right term, sorry) each turn, or even after movement, just like the spotting routine - better experience means better ability to sense the enemy / raw recruits can't sense bugger all.

That ................................ IMHO would be Real COOL.

FWIW

Major Mess

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 4:05:28 AM

KG Erwin

Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: John Galt

I like the arty casualties showing up.

So do I. One thing that's unrealistic (in Playing vs the AI), i sthat the AI, as compensation for its lack of acumen, gets a hell of a lot of onboard artillery. I want at least a chance to see if my offboard counterbattery fire is having any effect.

As for firing against on-board infantry, if one out of ten blasts results in a
kill, I wanna see that, too.

Conversely, a complete "fog of war" game might obviate all this info. That might be the ultimate "vs AI" way to play.

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 4:09:48 AM

Alby

Posts: 4855
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From: Greenwood, Indiana
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Well the only text I see in H2H is
"Such and Such unit firing Bombardment>>>>>"
and the "Has no spotter" or "Spotter has no LOS"

Unless enemy units retreat,disperse, pullback, or make smoke, then you willl see that text during arty phase.

In regular SPWAW, The willy meter can be toggled off now but only for your units. for instance your pbem opponent would have to turn it off as well to not see it.

hitting the "TAB" button cause all text to vanish unti hit again.

< Message edited by Alby -- 3/29/2006 9:23:57 AM >

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 4:11:57 AM

Korpraali V

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From: Finland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alby

The willy meter can be toggled off now but only for your units. for instance your pbem opponent would have to turn it off as well to not see it.

Was that the *-button?

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Post #: 9

RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 4:19:18 AM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Korpraali V

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alby

The willy meter can be toggled off now but only for your units. for instance your pbem opponent would have to turn it off as well to not see it.

Was that the *-button?

Shift plus * I believe

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Post #: 10

RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 6:59:23 AM

m10bob

Posts: 8622
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From: Dismal Seepage Indiana
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I prefer the H2H style hiddenresults block..I want to retain the info on people I have hit on the frontline with small arms, THEY, I can SEE..
Blocking Arty affects will also prevent a human player from being overly cocky against the AI..
Besides, if he designates his Arty properly, he should KNOW he has hit a viable target, (otherwise he needs to go help the girls pass out donuts at the USO trailer, and not tote his gear to my battlefield.)

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Post #: 11

RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 7:42:19 AM

Alby

Posts: 4855
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From: Greenwood, Indiana
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I need to re ask this

does H2H show ANY casualties??
are they removed too, or just the artillery ones??
I must specify Also I am refering to the small text at the bottom of the screen.

Also what is everyone preference as to the wiley meter??
The little * that lets you know you are spotted.

< Message edited by Alby -- 3/29/2006 9:22:19 AM >

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 4:07:40 PM

omegaall

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Ok simple question:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alby

One other question
does H2H show ANY casualties??
are they removed too, or just the artillery ones??

Why do they have to be removed?

Some like it some don't. Some people play for the game, while others what to simulate a form of conflict.

Why can't this just be a question asking if we want this ability toggled on or off?
To me the approach of removing things as this, is a knee jerk reaction to solve some issues for some but something which may not be an issue for others.

I don't see why it has to be totally removed. I DO see it as toggle issue.

There are times when I see posts here in that the game is being treated as something it never was.
With respect to this old lady; it is a good and sound game, enjoyable to play. It is not a combat simulation piece of software. I doubt the underlying code could be modified to do that without a whole rewrite. Then as a real combat simulation piece it will stop being fun.

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Post #: 13

RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 4:51:17 PM

m10bob

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From: Dismal Seepage Indiana
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quote:

ORIGINAL: omegaall

Ok simple question:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alby

One other question
does H2H show ANY casualties??
are they removed too, or just the artillery ones??

Why do they have to be removed?

Some like it some don't. Some people play for the game, while others what to simulate a form of conflict.

Why can't this just be a question asking if we want this ability toggled on or off?
To me the approach of removing things as this, is a knee jerk reaction to solve some issues for some but something which may not be an issue for others.

I don't see why it has to be totally removed. I DO see it as toggle issue.

There are times when I see posts here in that the game is being treated as something it never was.
With respect to this old lady; it is a good and sound game, enjoyable to play. It is not a combat simulation piece of software. I doubt the underlying code could be modified to do that without a whole rewrite. Then as a real combat simulation piece it will stop being fun.

Good point!

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Post #: 14

RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 5:26:41 PM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: omegaall

Ok simple question:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alby

One other question
does H2H show ANY casualties??
are they removed too, or just the artillery ones??

Why do they have to be removed?

Some like it some don't. Some people play for the game, while others what to simulate a form of conflict.

Why can't this just be a question asking if we want this ability toggled on or off?
To me the approach of removing things as this, is a knee jerk reaction to solve some issues for some but something which may not be an issue for others.

I don't see why it has to be totally removed. I DO see it as toggle issue.

There are times when I see posts here in that the game is being treated as something it never was.
With respect to this old lady; it is a good and sound game, enjoyable to play. It is not a combat simulation piece of software. I doubt the underlying code could be modified to do that without a whole rewrite. Then as a real combat simulation piece it will stop being fun.

Nothing has to be removed.
I am just asking what the majority of players prefer

As of now you can simply hit the tab key to hide the casualty reports and you can also Toggle on or off the The Wiley meter.
This works for Solo play but online and PBEM is a different matter.
You have to really trust your opponent.

< Message edited by Alby -- 3/29/2006 6:31:22 PM >

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 7:27:51 PM

junk2drive

Posts: 12907
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From: Arizona West Coast
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For the sake of new players that are trying to learn the game, it has to be an option item.

Well designed scenarios vs the AI I need all the cheats I can get, lol

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Post #: 16

RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 9:27:33 PM

KG Erwin

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From: Cross Lanes WV USA
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RE: The "Willy" Meter. I never pay attention to that, anyway. Besides, I know I've been spotted when the enemy's arty starts pounding me.

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Post #: 17

RE: Question for you Players - 3/29/2006 11:14:18 PM

parusski

Posts: 4804
Joined: 5/8/2000
From: Jackson Tn
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I too would like the toggle method. I am torn as to which way this should be done, so just let the players decide in the game prefrences.

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Post #: 18

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 4:41:44 AM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline

I think someone at The Depot has come up with a great idea.
I think this is the way to go

Just create a small Mod that has the willy meter and casualty reports removed for those who dont want them.
That way we dont "force" anyone into something they dont want.
This way the player retains the option to use or not use something.
This could be done easily and the mod would be very small in size.

the casualty report one is the one that
this small mod would really help. because if you "toggle" them off by hitting the tab key, you also lose all other messages too.
you cant really "toggle off" just the casualty reports.

< Message edited by Alby -- 3/30/2006 4:51:38 AM >

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 9:06:52 AM

Major_Mess

Posts: 451
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: The True North. Strong and Free
Status: offline

I love it already

MM

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Post #: 20

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 10:09:44 AM

Zardoz

Posts: 80
Joined: 2/20/2006
From: Essen (Germany)
Status: offline

I would like the toggle alternative....to increase realism

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Post #: 21

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 12:42:26 PM

omegaall

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Joined: 7/28/2003
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alby

Nothing has to be removed.
I am just asking what the majority of players prefer

As of now you can simply hit the tab key to hide the casualty reports and you can also Toggle on or off the The Wiley meter.
This works for Solo play but online and PBEM is a different matter.
You have to really trust your opponent.

So you have to trust them even now. There have been several threads already on the subject of cheating.. So ??

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alby
I think someone at The Depot has come up with a great idea.
I think this is the way to go

Just create a small Mod that has the willy meter and casualty reports removed for those who dont want them.
That way we dont "force" anyone into something they dont want.
This way the player retains the option to use or not use something.
This could be done easily and the mod would be very small in size.

the casualty report one is the one that
this small mod would really help. because if you "toggle" them off by hitting the tab key, you also lose all other messages too.
you cant really "toggle off" just the casualty reports.

Oh and who is going to write this special MOD?? You are talking of modifying the basic exe file.
Or has someone decided to hexedit the original exe file.

If Mike is willing to write a special MOD version of the exe file, if so all well and good, else the process may run into some legal propblems.

BUT in online and PEBM games how will you actually know the other person is using the MOD version vs the standard one???

Back to TRUST! Funny about that..

The only way to eliminate this trust problem is have the MOD version test the other PEBM persons exe same thing with online games. Nice bit of code to write and just because of TRUST, or LACK of it.

Its always nice to talk of these things but there are time the real implementation is forgotton. ie how hard it is to do it and the amount of work for the real end result.

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Post #: 22

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 4:08:31 PM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline

do you ever have anything positive to say?

download it or don't
doesnt matter to me.

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Post #: 23

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 4:16:57 PM

m10bob

Posts: 8622
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From: Dismal Seepage Indiana
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Alby, my friend..In this life, there will always be good people like yourself who try to offer and contribute.
There too, will always be those who have nothing to contribute, but criticisms....
Fact of life, Alby, and like Shakespeare said, "We shall all be undone by fools, knaves, idiots."
(Apologies to The Bard for any misquote.)

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RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 4:18:26 PM

Svennemir

Posts: 542
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From: Denmark
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It wouldn't be necessary to check .exe files, however the network code should surely transmit version information, and the different versions should be denoted differently so the incompatibility is handled correctly.

It's a pity that the code is not available, yeah. But it has happened more than once that the powers that be actually decided to fix game code, so it's not an entirely unrealistic proposition.

Still there are some more important fixes one could hope for *cough*too much smoke*cough*

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Post #: 25

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 4:23:49 PM

Svennemir

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From: Denmark
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However I think Omegaall raises an important issue. The amount of mods should be kept at an absolute minimum for reasons of compatibility. While many mods may contain substantial improvements at least in certain areas, it poses a serious problem to all PBEM/online players who will have to administer multiple installations.

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Post #: 26

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 4:38:51 PM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Svennemir

However I think Omegaall raises an important issue. The amount of mods should be kept at an absolute minimum for reasons of compatibility. While many mods may contain substantial improvements at least in certain areas, it poses a serious problem to all PBEM/online players who will have to administer multiple installations.

Understood. exactly why this is a MULTI Mod.
It has multiple mods combined into one.
Sounds,Icons,Terrain,Lbms,OOBs.
can't get more minimum than one...lol

A wiley meter mod(lack of better name) if there is one would make it two.
Sometimes we throw out "feelers"
doesnt mean anything will happen, but also doesnt mean it wont.

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Post #: 27

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 4:40:05 PM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: m10bob

Alby, my friend..In this life, there will always be good people like yourself who try to offer and contribute.
There too, will always be those who have nothing to contribute, but criticisms....
Fact of life, Alby, and like Shakespeare said, "We shall all be undone by fools, knaves, idiots."
(Apologies to The Bard for any misquote.)

Quoting Shakespeare??

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Post #: 28

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 5:03:04 PM

bud

Posts: 105
Joined: 7/16/2000
From: N.J.-USA
Status: offline

Alby i vote for a MOD with the casualty report and willy meter gone - now i see a concerned from some players about trust ( or lack of ) and possibility of getting mixed up with different mods -- but as you stated there will only be 2 mods now -- and i believe when players are joining for a game the oob`s must match -- so no problem with trust or wrong mods . after all i see players posting for game all over the place with what there playing with -- h2h - 8.2 , 8.3 - etc -- and as you said this is a easy option for players who would like to try out the real - fog of war --

-- (aka ICED ) --

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Post #: 29

RE: Question for you Players - 3/30/2006 5:53:43 PM

FlashfyreSP

Posts: 1193
Joined: 7/6/2002
From: Combat Information Center
Status: offline

To whom it may concern:

1. If you don't like the Mod, don't use it.
2. If you don't like Mods at all, don't use them.
3. If you like the status quo, use the vanilla 8.3 game.
4. If you don't have anything constructive to say about the project, SHUT UP.

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