Matrix Games Forums

 Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

Bagration Part II

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Norm Koger's The Operational Art Of War III >> Bagration Part II Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Bagration Part II - 7/6/2006 6:40:57 PM   
RooseBolton

 

Posts: 28
Joined: 6/30/2005
Status: offline
After going thru the OoB there are indeed duplicates of some German Panzer Divisions.

8th Panzer: In both 3rd Pz Korp & 11th SS Korp

14th Panzer: In both 4th Korp & 57th Pz Korp

Is it possible to edit the OoB in the premade scenarios?

Steve
Post #: 1
RE: Bagration Part II - 7/6/2006 7:44:41 PM   
a white rabbit


Posts: 2366
Joined: 4/27/2002
From: ..under deconstruction..6N124E..
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RooseBolton


After going thru the OoB there are indeed duplicates of some German Panzer Divisions.

8th Panzer: In both 3rd Pz Korp & 11th SS Korp

14th Panzer: In both 4th Korp & 57th Pz Korp

Is it possible to edit the OoB in the premade scenarios?

Steve


..yup, but better to contact the author


_____________________________

..toodA, irmAb moAs'lyB 'exper'mentin'..,..beàn'tus all..?,

(in reply to RooseBolton)
Post #: 2
RE: Bagration Part II - 7/6/2006 9:57:35 PM   
rhinobones

 

Posts: 1540
Joined: 2/17/2002
Status: offline 		Looking at the OOB does not tell you the time or place where units are deployed.

I’ll make a guess that the Panzer Divisions are initially assigned to one Corps, are withdrawn for refit, and reassigned to different Corps. Check the equipment in both divisions and see if one has a later equipment TO&E than the other. Also, open the scenario in the editor, go to the Axis deployment screen and see the turn and event used to deploy the divisions. Would wager that these duplicate divisions are not deployed at the same time.

Regards, RhinoBones

(in reply to RooseBolton)
Post #: 3
RE: Bagration Part II - 7/7/2006 2:07:17 AM   
golden delicious


Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rhinobones
Would wager that these duplicate divisions are not deployed at the same time.


Nope. I checked the scenario (version 3) and 8. Panzer is on the map in two places at the same time; with III Panzerkorps at 49,51, and with XI SS Corps at 34,47. Even more exciting, the two versions of the division have two different TO&Es.

For the record, on 22nd June 1944, 8. Panzer Division was apparently part of III Panzerkorps. And in case anyone was wondering, 8. SS Division was Florian Geyer, a cavalry division. This was reorganising in Croatia at the time this scenario takes place.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to rhinobones)
Post #: 4
RE: Bagration Part II - 7/7/2006 3:53:00 AM   
rhinobones

 

Posts: 1540
Joined: 2/17/2002
Status: offline 		Well, now I'm forced into actually looking at this scenario. I don't see it listed on the most popular sites . . . where is it available?

Regards, RhinoBones

(in reply to golden delicious)
Post #: 5
RE: Bagration Part II - 7/7/2006 4:09:31 AM   
a white rabbit


Posts: 2366
Joined: 4/27/2002
From: ..under deconstruction..6N124E..
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rhinobones

Well, now I'm forced into actually looking at this scenario. I don't see it listed on the most popular sites . . . where is it available?

Regards, RhinoBones


...errr, it comes with the game


_____________________________

..toodA, irmAb moAs'lyB 'exper'mentin'..,..beàn'tus all..?,

(in reply to rhinobones)
Post #: 6
RE: Bagration Part II - 7/7/2006 5:43:22 AM   
rhinobones

 

Posts: 1540
Joined: 2/17/2002
Status: offline 		Then I'll just wait for the postman.

Regards, RhinoBones

(in reply to a white rabbit)
Post #: 7
RE: Bagration Part II - 7/7/2006 7:47:38 PM   
golden delicious


Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline 		In general, Brian Topp (the designer in this case) tends to make scenarios which are quick and fun but not so much on the historical vigour. As Rhinobones well knows, my tastes generally lie elsewhere, but I have a bit of a soft spot for some of Brian's work. You do get some of the feel of the Eastern Front even if the detail leaves a lot to be desired.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to rhinobones)
Post #: 8
RE: Bagration Part II - 8/28/2006 9:55:24 PM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline 		Well the detail in these suckers is fairly comparable to (sometimes strangely similar to, even) the professionally-designed board wargames i tend to model these scenarios on.

I stated playing wargames in 1975 (S&T subscription) and for me the appeal of TOAW has always been the joy of a computer opponent for some of my favourite games (ie something to play against) versus using TOAW to explore the details of OOBs.

But this one sounds like a plain old mistake -- another on the list for eventual revisions! Thanks for flagging it roosebolton

(in reply to golden delicious)
Post #: 9
RE: Bagration Part II - 8/29/2006 1:28:11 AM   
golden delicious


Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: briantopp

Well the detail in these suckers is fairly comparable to (sometimes strangely similar to, even) the professionally-designed board wargames i tend to model these scenarios on.


Oh, no doubt. The nature of TOAW means that one can't help but give more detail than in the old manual games.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to briantopp)
Post #: 10
RE: Bagration Part II - 8/29/2006 2:26:06 AM   
pbhawkin1

 

Posts: 158
Joined: 4/4/2001
From: Mudgee, Australia
Status: offline 		For me the big (initial) attraction with TOAW 1 was the ability to play FiTE as I used to play Europa series of board games but with NO local opponents and NO space for the maps to sit for months on end it was always going to be a dead horse. Then TOAW came along and despite it's deficiencies in replecating(?) Operation Barbarossa I was hooked, TOAW 1-> TOAW 2 -> ACOW-> TOAW 3!
ANS when my wife lets me I will start pbem play again.

regards
Peter

_____________________________

Regards

(in reply to golden delicious)
Post #: 11
RE: Bagration Part II - 8/30/2006 7:52:18 PM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline 		Yep me too. I loved Fire In the East/Scorched Earth and had it set up in my basement for years -- played through it solitaire four or five times. THe "Operation Barbarossa" scenario I've worked on is a hex-by-hex, counter-by-counter port of that game. It's tricky to get to work for sure.

(in reply to pbhawkin1)
Post #: 12
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Norm Koger's The Operational Art Of War III >> Bagration Part II Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

3.578