What improvements you still want to see with the AI?

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What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/4/2006 8:25:32 PM

verizon32

Posts: 168
Joined: 5/23/2006
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What improvements you still want to see with the AI?

Hopefully Shaun can tweaks and fix some things before the next patch. So list them here.

< Message edited by verizon32 -- 7/4/2006 8:26:36 PM >

Post #: 1

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/4/2006 10:35:27 PM

matt0177

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Joined: 6/17/2006
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I've seen it happen several times: Runner on second, 2 outs, fly ball to the outfield which results in an error, and the runner only goes to third. So obviously, the AI as to runner behavior with 2 outs could use a tweak.

(in reply to verizon32)

Post #: 2

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/5/2006 12:22:43 AM

PadresFan104

Posts: 1223
Joined: 8/8/2005
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Off the top of my head:

- Look into the trade AI. A few people seem to think it's too easy to take advantage of the AI, especially in multi-player deals.

- The AI does not know when it's an important game and will sometimes rest important position player for an important game. (Like game 7 of the WS!!!)

- The "Pitch Out" strategy seems like a cheat. It works almost every time, and it's not clear that there is a penalty for using it.

- Fly balls and tagging up is still not working right. The chance for success on a tag up with decent to fast runners on a ball hit deep to any field should be very good, but right now it's not. Most players can jog home on a tag up to deep center IRL, but not in this game. It needs to be tweaked...

(in reply to matt0177)

Post #: 3

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/5/2006 12:54:22 AM

looneyluden

Posts: 68
Joined: 6/15/2006
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This isn't an AI issue, but something that my need to be tweaked. One thing I noticed is sacrafice bunts have very rarely been successful for me or my opponents. Laying down a bunt is one of the fundamental things that pitchers practice, but not in PS I think. There was a thread about this a few weeks ago i think.

Overall so far I am impressed with the computer AI.

(in reply to verizon32)

Post #: 4

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/5/2006 12:58:18 AM

PadresFan104

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Joined: 8/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: looneyluden

This isn't an AI issue, but something that my need to be tweaked. One thing I noticed is sacrafice bunts have very rarely been successful for me or my opponents. Laying down a bunt is one of the fundamental things that pitchers practice, but not in PS I think. There was a thread about this a few weeks ago i think.

LOL.. Maybe the AI has been watching too many Padres games. Worst sac bunting team I've ever seen.

(in reply to looneyluden)

Post #: 5

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/5/2006 6:39:23 AM

JimboJ

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Joined: 10/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: matt0177

I've seen it happen several times: Runner on second, 2 outs, fly ball to the outfield which results in an error, and the runner only goes to third. So obviously, the�AI as to runner behavior with 2 outs could use a tweak.

I've seen this too many times as well. I think even with less than 2 outs, runners should be able to score more easily from second on a base hit to the outfield. Thats why they call it "scoring position".

(in reply to matt0177)

Post #: 6

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/5/2006 7:13:13 AM

KG Erwin

Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboJ

quote:

ORIGINAL: matt0177

I've seen it happen several times: Runner on second, 2 outs, fly ball to the outfield which results in an error, and the runner only goes to third. So obviously, the�AI as to runner behavior with 2 outs could use a tweak.

I've seen this too many times as well. I think even with less than 2 outs, runners should be able to score more easily from second on a base hit to the outfield. Thats why they call it "scoring position".

Disagree. If the runner has a very good speed rating, yes, but a guy with treestumps for legs shouldn't be expected to always lumber his way to home from second on a single.

(in reply to JimboJ)

Post #: 7

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/5/2006 7:25:34 AM

verizon32

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Joined: 5/23/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboJ

quote:

ORIGINAL: matt0177

I've seen it happen several times: Runner on second, 2 outs, fly ball to the outfield which results in an error, and the runner only goes to third. So obviously, the AI as to runner behavior with 2 outs could use a tweak.

I've seen this too many times as well. I think even with less than 2 outs, runners should be able to score more easily from second on a base hit to the outfield. Thats why they call it "scoring position".

Disagree. If the runner has a very good speed rating, yes, but a guy with treestumps for legs shouldn't be expected to always lumber his way to home from second on a single.

What if the outfielder has a bad arm rating?

(in reply to KG Erwin)

Post #: 8

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/5/2006 8:19:39 AM

PadresFan104

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I believe there is some room for improvement here. Just had a game where my 7 (out of 10) runner is on second with 2 outs and a ball is hit back up the middle for a single. With 2 outs, the runner is going on contact and should score, or at least be waved around.

(in reply to verizon32)

Post #: 9

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/5/2006 8:36:09 AM

Claymore Cut

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Computer Managers being able to Double Switch. Vital to the game IMO.

(in reply to PadresFan104)

Post #: 10

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/6/2006 1:05:56 AM

Amaroq

Posts: 1100
Joined: 8/3/2005
From: San Diego, California
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Yeah, definitely.

1. Computer manager using its best lineup in the playoffs.

2. Computer managers double-switch-ing.

3. Intentional walks taking into account 'who's on deck'.

4. Trade evaluation function taking into account
- 'delta' at the positions involved (need/opportunity cost)
- long-term planning
- number of years left on the contract

5. AI GM's trying to renew contracts prior to the trade deadline, and trying to trade away last-year players who are unwilling to renew.

6. Pinch-hitter AI taking into account the need to save some bench hitters for the pitchers' slot in extra innings (I think its too likely to pinch-hit for the #8 hitter with its last bench player, when the pitcher in the #9 slot needs to be pinch-hit for.)

7. AI making fewer moves based on 'stats' and poor performance; it feels like it will bench or demote 'stars' for statistically insignificant poor performance by June, for example. I usually find that my team 'breaks away from the pack' through June, July, and August, as the AI managers bench their starters or send them to the minors, and I rarely agree with the AI's starting lineups through a September stretch drive or playoff series.

(in reply to Claymore Cut)

Post #: 11

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/6/2006 2:31:28 AM

JimboJ

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Joined: 10/8/2005
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quote:

Disagree. If the runner has a very good speed rating, yes, but a guy with treestumps for legs shouldn't be expected to always lumber his way to home from second on a single.

I didnt say a runner should be able to score from second on every single hit. It should take into account the runner's speed, the fielder's arm, the number of outs, and where the ball was hit. I'm just saying that overall, it doesn't seem to happen as often as it does in real life.

< Message edited by JimboJ -- 7/6/2006 2:32:03 AM >

(in reply to KG Erwin)

Post #: 12

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/6/2006 2:39:22 AM

JimboJ

Posts: 70
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Amaroq

Yeah, definitely.

1. Computer manager using its best lineup in the playoffs.

2. Computer managers double-switch-ing.

3. Intentional walks taking into account 'who's on deck'.

4. Trade evaluation function taking into account
- 'delta' at the positions involved (need/opportunity cost)
- long-term planning
- number of years left on the contract

5. AI GM's trying to renew contracts prior to the trade deadline, and trying to trade away last-year players who are unwilling to renew.

6. Pinch-hitter AI taking into account the need to save some bench hitters for the pitchers' slot in extra innings (I think its too likely to pinch-hit for the #8 hitter with its last bench player, when the pitcher in the #9 slot needs to be pinch-hit for.)

7. AI making fewer moves based on 'stats' and poor performance; it feels like it will bench or demote 'stars' for statistically insignificant poor performance by June, for example. I usually find that my team 'breaks away from the pack' through June, July, and August, as the AI managers bench their starters or send them to the minors, and I rarely agree with the AI's starting lineups through a September stretch drive or playoff series.

Great list! +1 for every one of these.

Despite all the improvements Shaun has made to the in-game experience, I still get the feeling he is more concerned with stats and how they are presented than he is with making the games themselves more realistic and making the manager smarter.

I'm not complaining, because I LOVE this game. I just want to see more focus on improving the in-game AI. I want it to the point where if I am managing a game against the computer with teams of equal talent, then I have to really struggle to beat it every time. Kind of like a chess program set on a high difficulty level.

(in reply to Amaroq)

Post #: 13

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/6/2006 3:57:12 AM

dneely

Posts: 227
Joined: 8/20/2005
Status: offline

This one is not an AI issue but I sincerely wish we could take over the controls of more than one team, especially for a replay. I am always torn and never seem to stay happy with the teams I pick. I would much prefer to be able to pick and AL and a NL team in my historical replays.

Hope Shaun is listening. BTW I second or third the idea of the computer mgr being able to do a double switch! definitely a biggie!

DNeely

(in reply to JimboJ)

Post #: 14

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/10/2006 2:09:25 AM

JimboJ

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bump

(in reply to dneely)

Post #: 15

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/10/2006 5:15:13 AM

hano13

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Joined: 6/14/2006
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I'd like to see closers come in occasionally in non-save situations. I know it is rare that this happens in real life, but it does sometimes. In my main association (currently in 1987) Tom Henke has pitched in 36 games so far and has 36 saves for the Blue Jays. For almost all closers in the association saves+blown saves=appearances. I'm up for XML tweaks to correct this if someone has 'em.

Another thing that's been mentioned a couple times on this thread in various forms that I'd like to see is more base coach input. I'd like to get the chance to wave a runner around third on a single with a man on second (similar to when it asks me if I want to tag up from first when I always say no - but I'm still glad it asks). I would still like the runner to occasionally ignore my signal to give it a taste of realism, but at least let me give the signal! Oh, and same deal on a single with a man on first - let me wave the guy to third or hold him at second.

I also have some ideas for how the AI should build batting orders, but that would be getting a little too geeky - I won't get into that unless Shaun is interested. I think it does a decent job, right now, so that's at the bottom of my list.

None of these things are deal-breakers by any means. I'm loving this game in its current form.

(in reply to JimboJ)

Post #: 16

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/11/2006 3:21:59 AM

Edward

Posts: 140
Joined: 9/21/2005
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in real player format, I would like to see the AI draft future HOF or future AS players.
I'm in a 30 team league in the 1990's and no matter how far down I draft or what round
I always end up with players that turn into studs 3 years or less down the road.

(in reply to hano13)

Post #: 17

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/11/2006 3:44:12 AM

biggerboat

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Joined: 7/1/2006
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way way way too many 18 and 19 year olds in AAA...and the Majors on occasion. Not realistic by any means.

(in reply to verizon32)

Post #: 18

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/11/2006 6:12:12 AM

KG Erwin

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From: Cross Lanes WV USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: biggerboat

way way way too many 18 and 19 year olds in AAA...and the Majors on occasion. Not realistic by any means.

You can manually assign players to any level.

(in reply to biggerboat)

Post #: 19

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/11/2006 6:39:23 AM

biggerboat

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Joined: 7/1/2006
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You can manually assign players to any level.

....true, but the AI should not be doing that in the first place...just something that could stand a little tweaking

(in reply to KG Erwin)

Post #: 20

RE: What improvements you still want to see with the AI? - 7/11/2006 3:16:19 PM

gipat

Posts: 27
Joined: 3/29/2004
Status: offline

Still think AI overvalues MR in trades, Ex: v.1.18-replay 1952 Brooklyn Dodgers--put Joe Black excellent MR on block--received amazing offers of #1/#2 starters having great years--traded for Richie Ashburn with Phillies (hes having a great year and is by far best player on team)--then as experiment tried to trade him back to phillies for Black and was turned down. Does trade AI still overvalue MR's? (by the way I manually changed Balck-Ashburn back to original teams for obvious-to me-reasons)