Can I ??

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

Can I ??

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Norm Koger's The Operational Art Of War III >> The War Room >> Can I ??

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

Can I ?? - 9/17/2006 1:30:55 AM

Janet Reno

Posts: 29
Joined: 3/26/2004
Status: offline

Can a person do arty. and air assualts and resolve those attacks before doing the ground attack? If so how?

_____________________________

"You can get further with a gun and a kind word than just a kind word alone"-Al Capone

Post #: 1

RE: Can I ?? - 9/17/2006 2:43:02 AM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline

Either;
a) make them as a separate set of attacks. Don't launch any ground attacks at all. Of course then you run the risk of failing the force proficiency check.
b) make sure your bombardments involve less equipment than your ground attacks.

Pure bombardments (i.e. with no ground units involved) are pretty ineffective in TOAW as in reality (see the Somme), so they're only useful for airfield attacks and in some unusual circumstances.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to Janet Reno)

Post #: 2

RE: Can I ?? - 9/17/2006 8:52:49 AM

Janet Reno

Posts: 29
Joined: 3/26/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

Either;
a) make them as a separate set of attacks. Don't launch any ground attacks at all. Of course then you run the risk of failing the force proficiency check.

And what is that?

b) make sure your bombardments involve less equipment than your ground attacks.

Pure bombardments (i.e. with no ground units involved) are pretty ineffective in TOAW

I was just interested in making the pile to deal with smaller before I use my guys.

as in reality (see the Somme), so they're only useful for airfield attacks and in some unusual circumstances.

Thank you very much for taking the time to help me.

_____________________________

"You can get further with a gun and a kind word than just a kind word alone"-Al Capone

(in reply to golden delicious)

Post #: 3

RE: Can I ?? - 9/17/2006 2:32:55 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Janet Reno

quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

Either;
a) make them as a separate set of attacks. Don't launch any ground attacks at all. Of course then you run the risk of failing the force proficiency check.

And what is that?

At the end of each combat round, provided you have more than 10% of your turn left, the game runs a check against the remaining % of your turn and your force proficiency. If both fail, your turn ends.

quote:

I was just interested in making the pile to deal with smaller before I use my guys.

You'd be better of just jumping straight in with the artillery in support. However you might want to start off with only a few ground units if you don't think you can carry the hex immediately.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to Janet Reno)

Post #: 4

RE: Can I ?? - 9/17/2006 6:02:15 PM

a white rabbit

Posts: 2366
Joined: 4/27/2002
From: ..under deconstruction..6N124E..
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

Either;
a) make them as a separate set of attacks. Don't launch any ground attacks at all. Of course then you run the risk of failing the force proficiency check.
b) make sure your bombardments involve less equipment than your ground attacks.

Pure bombardments (i.e. with no ground units involved) are pretty ineffective in TOAW as in reality (see the Somme), so they're only useful for airfield attacks and in some unusual circumstances.

..like 3* min loss attacks to lift troops out of trenches, then add some bombers and a few fighters for spice, and then, just to remind Ben, hi-shell weight artillery works directly on supply level, and so on readiness, (ranged leader effect in toaw-acow mods right? the 0 AP / in the thousands shell-weight tests, just so i could get Alexander...)

_____________________________

..toodA, irmAb moAs'lyB 'exper'mentin'..,..be�n'tus all..?,

(in reply to golden delicious)

Post #: 5

RE: Can I ?? - 9/17/2006 6:17:00 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: a white rabbit

..like 3* min loss attacks to lift troops out of trenches, then add some bombers and a few fighters for spice, and then, just to remind Ben, hi-shell weight artillery works directly on supply level, and so on readiness,

You can squeeze a little extra performance out of the pure bombardments- or you could add a couple of infantry units on minimise losses and triple the effect.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to a white rabbit)

Post #: 6

RE: Can I ?? - 9/17/2006 9:16:07 PM

Chuck2

Posts: 830
Joined: 10/12/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: a white rabbit

..like 3* min loss attacks to lift troops out of trenches, then add some bombers and a few fighters for spice, and then, just to remind Ben, hi-shell weight artillery works directly on supply level, and so on readiness,

You can squeeze a little extra performance out of the pure bombardments- or you could add a couple of infantry units on minimise losses and triple the effect.

What if the defending unit is fortified? They get 8x times the strength IIRC. Therefore, a bombardment makes sense to try to get the unit in mobile status before attacking. Also, bombardments guarantee you won't have a "turn buring" attack where several rounds are used up in one attack.

< Message edited by Chuck2 -- 9/17/2006 9:43:00 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to golden delicious)

Post #: 7

RE: Can I ?? - 9/18/2006 2:28:21 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chuck2

What if the defending unit is fortified? They get 8x times the strength IIRC. Therefore, a bombardment makes sense to try to get the unit in mobile status before attacking. Also, bombardments guarantee you won't have a "turn buring" attack where several rounds are used up in one attack.

I'd really still recommend attaching a ground unit to the attack. A single such unit on minimise losses should break off from combat fairly quickly- but it will also serve to multiply the losses the defenders suffer.

The joy of combined arms.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to Chuck2)

Post #: 8

RE: Can I ?? - 9/28/2006 2:39:20 AM

a white rabbit

Posts: 2366
Joined: 4/27/2002
From: ..under deconstruction..6N124E..
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: a white rabbit

..like 3* min loss attacks to lift troops out of trenches, then add some bombers and a few fighters for spice, and then, just to remind Ben, hi-shell weight artillery works directly on supply level, and so on readiness,

You can squeeze a little extra performance out of the pure bombardments- or you could add a couple of infantry units on minimise losses and triple the effect.

..at the cost of a percent of the turn, whereas pure artillery, if not moved, and in a fair state of readiness can get in "free" shoots, lifting the dug-ins and exposing them to real attacks

_____________________________

..toodA, irmAb moAs'lyB 'exper'mentin'..,..be�n'tus all..?,

(in reply to golden delicious)

Post #: 9

RE: Can I ?? - 9/28/2006 5:35:28 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: a white rabbit

..at the cost of a percent of the turn, whereas pure artillery, if not moved, and in a fair state of readiness can get in "free" shoots,

Not without exploiting a bug in the game system. Any attack will always use at least 10% of the turn otherwise.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to a white rabbit)

Post #: 10

RE: Can I ?? - 9/28/2006 5:52:01 PM

a white rabbit

Posts: 2366
Joined: 4/27/2002
From: ..under deconstruction..6N124E..
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: a white rabbit

..at the cost of a percent of the turn, whereas pure artillery, if not moved, and in a fair state of readiness can get in "free" shoots,

Not without exploiting a bug in the game system. Any attack will always use at least 10% of the turn otherwise.

..exploit away, while it still lasts...

..come on, artillery, with loadsa cannon balls, powder charges and stuff stacked next to the cannon, or in the caissons just behind, takes no time at all to go bang bang bang, whereas your pbi takes time to walk across the battlefield...

..not a bug, an encouragement to keep your artillery in light green and near to the supply train, and so benefit from being a perceptive, careful planning little bunny

_____________________________

..toodA, irmAb moAs'lyB 'exper'mentin'..,..be�n'tus all..?,

(in reply to golden delicious)

Post #: 11

RE: Can I ?? - 9/29/2006 12:01:36 AM

macgregor

Posts: 990
Joined: 2/10/2004
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

You can squeeze a little extra performance out of the pure bombardments- or you could add a couple of infantry units on minimise losses and triple the effect.

Or just one. A very small one. I thought this kind of gamey tactic was going to be addressed in this version.

< Message edited by macgregor -- 9/29/2006 12:03:10 AM >

(in reply to golden delicious)

Post #: 12

RE: Can I ?? - 9/29/2006 8:21:28 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor
Or just one. A very small one. I thought this kind of gamey tactic was going to be addressed in this version.

That would be nice, wouldn't it? Hopefully in the near future. In the meantime, us designers will have to keep the number of ant units to a minimum.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to macgregor)

Post #: 13

RE: Can I ?? - 9/29/2006 8:23:14 PM

golden delicious

Posts: 5575
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: London, Surrey, United Kingdom
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: a white rabbit

..come on, artillery, with loadsa cannon balls, powder charges and stuff stacked next to the cannon, or in the caissons just behind, takes no time at all to go bang bang bang,

Not in the real world, unfortunately.

quote:

..not a bug,

Actually, yes, a bug. Acknowledged as a bug by the community and by TOAD. Executing combat rounds should always consume at least 10% of the turn. The only way it will not do so is if you save the game and then reload.

_____________________________

"What did you read at university?"
"War Studies"
"War? Huh. What is it good for?"
"Absolutely nothing."

(in reply to a white rabbit)

Post #: 14

RE: Can I ?? - 10/2/2006 12:40:16 PM

a white rabbit

Posts: 2366
Joined: 4/27/2002
From: ..under deconstruction..6N124E..
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: a white rabbit

..come on, artillery, with loadsa cannon balls, powder charges and stuff stacked next to the cannon, or in the caissons just behind, takes no time at all to go bang bang bang,

Not in the real world, unfortunately.

quote:

..not a bug,

Actually, yes, a bug. Acknowledged as a bug by the community **and by TOAD. Executing combat rounds should always consume at least 10% of the turn. The only way it will not do so is if you save the game and then reload.

..mmm, real world...lessee, one arrow striking the target, two in the air (or was that 3)and one leaving the bow, and the french cavalry are still nowhere near..how far do you want to take rate of fire vs time to cover ground on foot, or horse ?

..**except me, gosh Ben, you a commune (ist, ard )..