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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign

 
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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 5:20:14 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vahauser

Alby and Riun T,

Now you see why FlashFyre said this campaign was best for single players and not involving other players.

Each of the three of us has a different way of playing and different preferences.

Is there any way that we could all agree on how to set up the campaign together?



My settings equal your list almost exactly...

My core force however would differ greatly...LOL


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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 6:28:01 AM   
vahauser


Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Alby,

How does this sound?


AI Advantage – ON

AI Level – 200

True Troop ON/Rarity OFF

Reduced Squads – OFF

LIMITED Ammo – ON

Weapon Breakdowns – ON

Vehicle Breakdowns – ON

Mines – ON (but the human player may NEVER use mines, barbed wire, or dragon’s teeth)

Command & Control – OFF for Alby and ON for VAH

Use the Hard (x2) setting for all battles.

Set Spotting to 70% for Player 1, 100% for Player 2

Historical Ratings – ON (you really have no idea how much I detest these ratings being called “historical”, since they are not)


1. Select one of the 6 major nations for your HQ, but then only buy allied equipment (if British, only buy Indian, for example)
Which nation shall we play? I'm leaning towards choosing the US Army and then using Free French. How does that sound?

2. Initial points for core. 2500? 3000? 3500? Something else?
You prefer 2500 and I prefer 3000… How about a compromise of 2750?

3. Core composition. Limits to artillery? Armor? Something else?
You describe the core limits you want and I will abide by your conditions (although I reserve the right to negotiate with you a little)

4. Reinforcements. Allowed? Not allowed? Something else?
Reinforcements NOT allowed

5. Standard 8.4? Enhanced FV? Something else?
Enhanced FV.1 agreed


We only have a few points to agree on and then we can start. This could be fun. If we do this right, then we can use this as a tactical learning tool and both improve our games.


< Message edited by vahauser -- 9/21/2006 6:52:52 AM >

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 6:50:34 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		Ooops I started one already before I saw your post.
SO HQ then switched to Poland for my forces.
Using LWP forces May 1943 (Enhanced HTH Mod)
the LWP formations are a mess in vanilla spwaw and even in Enhanced FV so I used an "alternate" mod, I am working on, where I have corrected and cleaned up the mistakes. I am making it for PBEM/Online, and Long Campaign play only.
Not good for pre made scenario stuff, removing units that are seldom used in PBEM and Long Campaign play and am adding alot more variety of units.

I even removed the FOs from the german armor cars formations and got rid of the "Elite Armor" formations yu hate so much...lol
read here...

http://spwaw.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=11043&sid=02728c724f60007b2d3112e736b53876

preferences differ some from yours.
I have to Advance VS. Germans over open ground so I am in trouble..






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< Message edited by Alby -- 9/21/2006 7:18:00 AM >

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 6:53:47 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		forces





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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 6:54:34 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		Units starting at V are support units.





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< Message edited by Alby -- 9/21/2006 6:56:33 AM >

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 7:04:17 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		No need to compare anything or see who does better.
I suck anyway.
Just play for fun, this one should be interesting...



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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 7:29:09 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		German MGs cutting me to Pieces!!!






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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 7:41:48 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		getting frustrated now






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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 2:25:58 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		I am advancving into a hornets nest...
not good!!



BTW other prefs I didnt list
Hard battle x2
Willy Meter OFF

< Message edited by Alby -- 9/21/2006 2:35:06 PM >

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 3:03:46 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		Crap!!
German armor now spotted!
Think I needed more points in this one.
perhaps hardx2 was too much for my LWP forces as well..






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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 7:05:21 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		German armor counter attacking form all directions
I feel my advance is doomed to fail..





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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 9:45:48 PM   
vahauser


Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Alby,

I'll be happy to talk with you about your battle if you want some feedback.

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Post #: 102
RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 10:32:59 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		go ahead
I am outgunned and outmanned
heheheheh


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Post #: 103
RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 10:46:38 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		No hope for my LWP forces.
panthers appeared and wiped me out..
I get a whole 98 support points for next battle and cannot repair all my stuff..could be a sad day again.






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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 11:23:03 PM   
vahauser


Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Alby,

I'm going to deal with generalities rather than specifics.  Specifics make us bog down in details.  Generalities help us see the larger picture.

1.  I don't have a clue how the HTH rules work, and I don't have a clue what your custom OOB looks like.  Since we don't have a common frame of reference, then I pretty much cannot comment on those aspects of your campaign.  I recommend starting over using Enhanced FV.1.  That way I can see exactly what is going on instead of just guessing.  I also recommend starting over because most campaigns end whenever you suffer a decisive deafeat (in this case, Stalin would have you shot).

2.  Core size.  Raising your initial core from 2500 to 3000 (or higher) will only result in a proportionally larger German force against you.  I'm not saying you shouldn't redo your core with more build points, but I am saying that it will not necessarily give you an advantage.

3.  Core composition.  In general, I find it best to put the killers in the core and the cannon fodder in the support.  By this, I mean that you want your heavy hitters in your core.  I tend to use my support points to buy recon and transport and additional artillery.  This way, you tend to lose support units and not core units which makes your repairs after the battle less expensive.

4.  General tactics. 
A.  With the willy meter OFF, you MUST have LOTS of recon units.  The best recon units are those that can take punishment and not get wiped out in one shot.  This means motorcycle and light armored cars are your best options (for the LWP in 1943).  I would buy as many of these as I possibly could with support points.
B.  Don't advance directly into the middle of the enemy defenses because he can attack you from all directions as you advance.  Not good.  Instead, better is to outflank the enemy rather than have the enemy outflank you.
C.  Use as much artillery (I prefer mortars) as you can to create a "rolling barrage" in front of your advance as possible.  The Soviets historically used LOTS of artillery, so don't be bashful or shy about using LOTS of artillery yourself. Since you have a finite amount of support points, concentrate first on recon, and then on artillery.
D.  Smoke is your friend.  If I end a battle and still have lots of smoke rounds left on my artillery units, then I don't feel that I did a very good job.  The game provides you with historical smoke rounds.  Use them.  Use them all.

I hope this helps.  I'll be happy to continue discussing this with you if you want.

--Victor




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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/21/2006 11:58:53 PM   
Lt. Quito

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline 		Hi there everyone, I'm new to the forums but I've been playing for a couple years off and on.  I've kinda been following this thread and have a couple questions about the set up FlashFyre.  First, when you say Major Six, you mean the two US, Britain, Soviet, German and Japan right, are Italy and France considered minor allies?  Second, do you have to take the HQ of that force or could you select say an ANZAC HQ?  Third, do all the units have to be from the same ally, like all Indian forces, or Canadian, or Italian (if they are minor)?  I think that is all for now, I've never played with C&C on but there has to be a first time.

< Message edited by Lt. Quito -- 9/22/2006 12:00:58 AM >

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Post #: 106
RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 12:31:07 AM   
azraelck

 

Posts: 581
Joined: 1/16/2006
Status: offline 		The "Major" 6 are the six nations you can choose to play as for a long campaign. All others are 'minors'; often denoted in vanilla SPWaW by being also unplayable due to poor ratings. So yes; Italy and France would be considered 'minors'.

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 12:46:47 AM   
vahauser


Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Lt. Quito,

FlashFyre is the only person who can really answer your questions, but he recently left on a trip to India.

When you choose one of the "Big Six", then that will be the nationality of your HQ. Using build points during the campaign to change your HQ to another nationality might have an effect, but I'm not sure about that.

Japan and the USSR don't have allies. Indeed, the USMC might also be considered to not have allies either. I'm not sure what FlashFyre intended when he mentions the Big Six in the first phrase, and then allies in the second phrase. My guess is that he really only intends this campaign format to be played with one of the Big Four (or Big Three) that do have allies.

Next question then becomes, which allies go with which Big Four (or Big Three) nation? Again, I think only FlashFyre knows for sure what he intended. Obviously, even if you go with "historical" allies for the Big Four (or Big Three), you still can get some pretty weird situations. For instance, you choose the US Army in December 1941. Historically, the US Army has as "allies" (I'm defining "allies" as those nations that the Big Nation supplied and/or equipped): Philippines, China, Free French (I'm sure of these, there may be others). Let's say you pick China. Now, the campaign allows the US Army to fight in Europe and Pacific Theaters. So, you could end up fighting with a Chinese core in North Africa in 1942/43 and then Europe in 1944/45. Heh. My personal belief is that FlashFyre didn't have time before he left on his trip to fully explore all the implications and ramifications of his idea here. We'll have to wait for FlashFyre to return before we get a full and comprehensive answer here. For now, your guess is as good as anybody else's.

Also, I personally believe that FlashFyre intended that you only have ONE "minor" ally in your core (I can't imagine Hungarian and Romanian units in the same core, for instance).

Here are some combinations that I think can work okay.
1. Choose Germany and start the campaign in July 1941, and then pick ONE of Italy or Romania or Hungary or Czechoslavakia or Finland core. Fight your campaign on the Eastern Front. There are problems here, but not horrible.
2. Choose US Army and start in October 1942, and then pick Free French core. Fight in Europe Theater. This should work well.
3. Choose Britain and start in May 1940, and then pick Canadian core. Fight in Europe Theater. This should work well.
4. Choose Britain and start in May 1941, and then pick EITHER India or ANZAC core. Fight in any Theater you wish. This should work pretty well.
5. There might be other combinations that work okay, but I'll leave that exercise for you.

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 1:32:20 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline 		A multi-national "theater" force never appealed to me, and still doesn't, but for extending the possibilities for the long campaigns, I suppose it's worth exploring for some of you.

An Army Group South "polyglot" of German and Rumanian forces for the Eastern Front might be worthwhile. 

A US Army PTO campaign offers several possibilities, too.  It all depends on the battle and availabile support points.  For battles in New Guinea, yeah, buy some ANZACs to beef up your USA core. 

Please note that my desire is for a notional "historical" force mix.   I already assume that I'm gonna win.   The only question is by how much.

The Marines are a special case --  from Guadalcanal on, often US Army and USMC units fought side by side.   No problem.   The condition is that they are used as support points, NOT part of your core.  

Of course, I'm loath to ask for help from the grunts, but as time goes on and the fight gets tougher, I might get a few flame tanks from them, some of their heavy arty/air, and MAYBE even some of their ground-pounders.    

(in reply to vahauser)
Post #: 109
RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 1:45:03 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		 playing the AI, I do not use tactics I would use against a human, going around the flanks..ect ect....
so i often get slaughtered



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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 1:50:09 AM   
vahauser


Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Alby,

Even if you ignore flanking tactics, the other points I made about recon and core composition and artillery and smoke are still valid (just less effective).



Erwin,

The point behind the FlashFyre Long Campaign format is that you MAY NOT have ANY of the Big Six nations' units in either your core or your support (Long Campaign here, remember).

< Message edited by vahauser -- 9/22/2006 2:35:46 AM >

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 7:01:19 AM   
Lt. Quito

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline 		Well I've tried all the settings Flashfyre suggested and played through a couple turns.  I don't think I've figured out the objective flag thingy yet, I had a delay so I set them to be behind my troops (since from what i gather it is a fighting retreat starting by turn ~21).  This makes it so none of my troops can move...at all??  I think I will just stick to C&C off, one thing I have noticed is that there are a lot of different ways to enjoy this game no matter the reason you play.

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 2:03:32 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		For C an C on you have to set the Obj Flags to where you want your men to move to.

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 4:18:15 PM   
vahauser


Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Lt. Quito,

Alby is correct.  Learning how to play with C&C ON takes a lot of practice.  It's how I learned to play, so playing with C&C OFF is what feels un-natural to me.  It's all what you are used to. 

Since 99% of the SPWAW players I know play with C&C OFF, then learning to play with C&C ON is not terribly useful if you plan to play online or PBEM against other players.

FlashFyre's campaign format is intended to make the campaign as difficult as possible.  And for people who are not veteran players with C&C ON, then the FlashFyre campaign format becomes especially difficult.

< Message edited by vahauser -- 9/22/2006 5:36:27 PM >

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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/22/2006 11:15:34 PM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		Hey guys I think he means,that he doesn't know the "M" button toggles between stances and u have to turn it off defend so they can "advance {actually retreat} toward your set objective for delay/defend missions.
Sorry to all that I have not had the time to show more battles,the wife is going threw nasty mornin sickness so the duties around here are keepin me hopping,but I'm 4 turns into my LUZON fight!
AND since your on Alby thanks for posting your fight,too bad about the loss,,, that was enhanced was it not,, IT LOOKED SCARY,cause your experience #'s values between yours and theirs wasn't that drastic,, they just fought better. show us the next attempt for sure and keep experimenting

< Message edited by Riun T -- 9/22/2006 11:20:25 PM >

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Post #: 115
RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/23/2006 1:36:55 AM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		here's some quick map shots of the areas of action, and my HQ perimeter{compound}




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Post #: 116
RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/23/2006 1:39:07 AM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		AND are they ever crack on with their artillary,I don't think I'm gonna last too long!!




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Post #: 117
RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/23/2006 1:40:52 AM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		that the end of turn 5 on a meeting advance in the rain, with 7 vis.




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RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/23/2006 6:47:46 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline 		Well, you guys have at it, but I have no use for C&C restrictions.  This takes away any initiative on the part of individual company/platoon commanders.  For certain countries (Soviet Union, for example), this may provide an example for historical communication isues, but for the USA/USMC, it doesn't apply.

Even with C&C off, the only real role for the battalion CO is to provide an extra rally chance, and to call in off-board arty/air missions.  

I look at this, and it makes me wonder why the so-called "historical" ratings were bumped up.   If you really want a challenge, play with the original 8.4 ratings -- in this fashion, the elaboration of C&C  isn't needed.   Your simple concern, IF you're the Romanians or whoever, is simply to keep your line from disintegrating.

That being said, I like the 8.403 Enhanced mech.exe, and have accepted the ratings as given.    
  

(in reply to Riun T)
Post #: 119
RE: FlashFyre Demonstration Long Campaign - 9/23/2006 7:29:28 AM   
azraelck

 

Posts: 581
Joined: 1/16/2006
Status: offline 		I have never been fond of C&C. While it removes alot of the initiative from the men who should have juristrition over what they do to reach an objective, it also seems somewhat off to limit the number of orders a CO can give his subordinates. The CO should be able to order as many times as he/she can, though a good one won't ask his troops to do things that they are not capable of.

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