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Cover art - yuck!

 
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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [American Civil War] >> Forge of Freedom: The American Civil War 1861-1865 >> Cover art - yuck! Page: [1]
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Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 6:57:34 PM   
andysomers

 

Posts: 157
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline 		You guys are absolutely shooting yourselves in the foot with that cover art. This game is great, and that art, quite honestly, is 100% awful. There is not one redeeming quality about it at all. It speaks so incredibly poorly for your marketing. You don't sell a brand new Mercedes right after the pigeons crap all over it. The car and what's inside is still a Mercedes and may be great, but people are not going to look past the bird crap.

The US rifleman is dressed in an artillery coat (red NCO stripes and piping) and is carrying a two-banded musket (not the more common three-bander). His kepi looks like it is made of rubber and doesn't fit his head worth a hoot. It is awful.

I've been an avid follower of this forum and am very impressed with the game so far and very happy with my purchase. But, if I was your marketing manager, I would fire whoever put together the cover art. Do yourselves a big favor and put an honest effort into something that looks at least halfway decent. You've done 99.9% of the hard work, but have neglected perhaps the most vital 0.1% - making a good first impression. Again, no skin off my back, but do this and I guarantee your sales will boost 10% at least.

Buy a copyright permission from Rick Reeves, Don Troiani, or Keith Rocco if you can't make some good art in house, but PLEASE do something.

AS
Post #: 1
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 7:22:50 PM   
andysomers

 

Posts: 157
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline 		Here's two good examples of what I think is good cover art:


Note that the latter of the two games rates one star of five on amazon, and is available for $4.99. However, the cover art is so superior, that an uneducated shopper is probably 10 time more likely to overlook your product based on price and the perception the cover art is going to give as to quality of the game for that pricetag.

Of all the posts that I have made during the development of this game, I feel by far the most passionate about this one - you guys absolutely have to make a change for te sake of your bottom line.

Once again, my compliments on a job very well done, all of this aside.

AS

(in reply to andysomers)
Post #: 2
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 7:26:50 PM   
Gil R.


Posts: 10821
Joined: 4/1/2005
Status: offline 		Andy,
Thanks for your nice comments about the game itself.

I have to wonder how correct you are about this impacting sales -- after all, the game right now is only available over the Web, so people who are deciding to buy it have all sorts of information at their disposal before deciding whether to purchase it. If FOF sells very well and gets positive reviews there is a chance at store distribution, and it seems to me that packaging is only an issue when it comes to store sales.

(in reply to andysomers)
Post #: 3
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 7:31:50 PM   
Temple

 

Posts: 529
Joined: 7/31/2002
Status: offline 		There's a cover?

(in reply to Gil R.)
Post #: 4
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 8:24:47 PM   
Marc von Martial


Posts: 10875
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Bonn, Germany
Status: offline
quote:

Buy a copyright permission from Rick Reeves, Don Troiani, or Keith Rocco if you can't make some good art in house, but PLEASE do something.


This is what we would have done for a retail release. And if we do a retail release, we will certainly do it.

We spent our resources well thought. Do not worry.


< Message edited by Marc Schwanebeck -- 12/1/2006 8:29:10 PM >

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RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 8:26:43 PM   
Marc von Martial


Posts: 10875
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Bonn, Germany
Status: offline
quote:

Again, no skin off my back, but do this and I guarantee your sales will boost 10% at least.


You wanna bet that for the normal release it will not boost 10%


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Post #: 6
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 8:27:24 PM   
Joram

 

Posts: 3198
Joined: 7/15/2005
Status: offline 		Sorry Gil, guess you gotta go, Sommers has spoken!

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Post #: 7
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 8:30:24 PM   
Marc von Martial


Posts: 10875
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Bonn, Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joram

Sorry Gil, guess you gotta go, Sommers has spoken!


Actually I would have to fire myself and take Jason with me

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Post #: 8
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 8:47:40 PM   
Gil R.


Posts: 10821
Joined: 4/1/2005
Status: offline 		Yeah. I suffer from arrested development when it comes to art -- I still draw at a third-grade level...

(in reply to Marc von Martial)
Post #: 9
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/1/2006 9:17:06 PM   
genie144

 

Posts: 60
Joined: 1/5/2005
Status: offline 		Well hurry up and take your turn and practice your art skills later :)

Sam

(in reply to Gil R.)
Post #: 10
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 12:12:05 AM   
andysomers

 

Posts: 157
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline 		Gil - no offense toward you guys on what I've said.  I'm just being honest with you from someone who runs his own business.  You've got a great product, I just want you guys to get top dollar on it. 

This is all coming from someone who has not seen your market research, target audiences, all that stuff.  In fact, I am under the assumption that you sell in stores and not just online.  My perspective was from someone perusing over games at Best Buy or CompUSA or the like.

You've got good other very good artwork in the game (i.e. period photographs etc.), I'd use it for my first impression if/when a box is released.

AS

(in reply to genie144)
Post #: 11
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 12:22:52 AM   
andysomers

 

Posts: 157
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

I have to wonder how correct you are about this impacting sales -- after all, the game right now is only available over the Web, so people who are deciding to buy it have all sorts of information at their disposal before deciding whether to purchase it. If FOF sells very well and gets positive reviews there is a chance at store distribution, and it seems to me that packaging is only an issue when it comes to store sales.


I now read what nullfies my argument!  Nevermind! 

Based on this I respectfully decline the bet offer on the 10% sales increase.  And for what it's worth, I take my crow medium rare.

MY parting shot - DON'T release a box with that art on it!

AS


< Message edited by andysomers -- 12/2/2006 12:29:55 AM >

(in reply to andysomers)
Post #: 12
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 12:44:20 AM   
Hard Sarge


Posts: 22741
Joined: 10/1/2000
From: garfield hts ohio usa
Status: offline 		been trying to keep my mouth shut, and anyone who knows me, know how HARD that is going to be

Andy, all I can say is the old stand by

don't judge a book by it's cover




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Post #: 13
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 12:47:58 AM   
histgamer

 

Posts: 1455
Joined: 11/30/2006
Status: offline 		Not to advertise for another game here or anything, but the Take Command Series is really great, i seriously hope they switch over from Paradox to Matrix games with their third title whenever they make it.

(in reply to Hard Sarge)
Post #: 14
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 12:57:53 AM   
Gil R.


Posts: 10821
Joined: 4/1/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: andysomers

Gil - no offense toward you guys on what I've said. I'm just being honest with you from someone who runs his own business. You've got a great product, I just want you guys to get top dollar on it.

This is all coming from someone who has not seen your market research, target audiences, all that stuff. In fact, I am under the assumption that you sell in stores and not just online. My perspective was from someone perusing over games at Best Buy or CompUSA or the like.

You've got good other very good artwork in the game (i.e. period photographs etc.), I'd use it for my first impression if/when a box is released.

AS



Hey, you have our best interests in mind, which I can appreciate. Of course, I'm not the artist... (Now if someone starts writing nasty things about the governors, which I put together, Hard Sarge will have to hold me back...)

(in reply to andysomers)
Post #: 15
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 1:00:05 AM   
Adam Parker


Posts: 1848
Joined: 4/2/2002
From: Melbourne Australia
Status: offline 		I like Marc's art.

I just printed the graphic and am using pencils and rules on it like "skids" because this is the only Civil War, wargaming I'm getting out of this $50 baby right now.

(in reply to histgamer)
Post #: 16
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 2:19:24 AM   
Johnus

 

Posts: 615
Joined: 5/23/2002
Status: offline 		The box is very small so it's hard to be sure, but it looks like the same two guys that border the quotes while the game loads. Now those guys are hard to look at; they give new meaning to the phrase: "Look Away." Also the colors on that screen clash. It's just cartoonish and ugly. Please have the first patch provide a period photo as the background for the game-loading quote screen. This need not be a first priority.

The graphics of the game itself, by contrast, are very pleasing and utilitarian. The word "elegant" comes to mind. The map and screens are nice to look at and evoke the period. Bravo.

The game itself, so far, great.


(in reply to Adam Parker)
Post #: 17
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 2:26:29 AM   
chris0827

 

Posts: 441
Joined: 11/17/2006
Status: offline 		Hire a couple reenactors to come in and do a photo shoot. It would look a lot better than that art.

(in reply to Johnus)
Post #: 18
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 3:03:33 AM   
JudgeDredd


Posts: 8573
Joined: 11/14/2003
From: Scotland
Status: offline 		Well, I'm not American, so not so "anal" (in the non offensive use of that phrase) when it comes to the American Civil War...so to my ignorant eyes, I think the art that comes with the game is damned fine.

I can att least tell the difference between CSA and USA!...for a Brit, that's a start!


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Post #: 19
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 3:20:24 AM   
tc237

 

Posts: 93
Joined: 7/1/2005
Status: offline 		They look like the Duke boys to me.
"Just the good ol' boys, Never meanin' no harm,
Beats all you've ever saw, been in trouble with the law since the day they was born..."

(in reply to JudgeDredd)
Post #: 20
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 5:21:10 AM   
Williamb

 

Posts: 594
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Dayton Ohio
Status: offline 		I still like this photo of Ashby



< Message edited by William Amos -- 12/2/2006 5:24:41 AM >

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Post #: 21
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 5:30:11 AM   
Vyshka


Posts: 275
Joined: 4/13/2002
From: Chandler, AZ
Status: offline 		If the cover art is the biggest complaint against this game, then I think it is doing pretty good. :)

(in reply to Williamb)
Post #: 22
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 5:47:17 AM   
AU Tiger_MatrixForum


Posts: 1606
Joined: 10/9/2006
From: Deepest Dixie
Status: offline 		I am glad ya'll will be changing the cover art if/when it goes to stores. Frankly, when I saw the cover of the manual, my first thought was "The Sims Go To War."

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Post #: 23
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 9:18:25 AM   
tc237

 

Posts: 93
Joined: 7/1/2005
Status: offline 		One thing about the Duke boys being on the Mainscreen,
it makes me want to hurry and start the game quicker.

(in reply to AU Tiger_MatrixForum)
Post #: 24
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 1:51:18 PM   
Marc von Martial


Posts: 10875
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Bonn, Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Vyshka

If the cover art is the biggest complaint against this game, then I think it is doing pretty good. :)


Exactly my thought.

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Post #: 25
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 4:20:57 PM   
Sarge


Posts: 2841
Joined: 3/1/2003
From: ask doggie
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: andysomers

Here's two good examples of what I think is good cover art:


Note that the latter of the two games rates one star of five on amazon, and is available for $4.99. However, the cover art is so superior, that an uneducated shopper is probably 10 time more likely to overlook your product based on price and the perception the cover art is going to give as to quality of the game for that pricetag.

Of all the posts that I have made during the development of this game, I feel by far the most passionate about this one - you guys absolutely have to make a change for te sake of your bottom line.

Once again, my compliments on a job very well done, all of this aside.

AS




Thats not ART

Its cut a past

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Post #: 26
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 12/2/2006 4:30:35 PM   
Sarge


Posts: 2841
Joined: 3/1/2003
From: ask doggie
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc Schwanebeck


quote:

ORIGINAL: Vyshka

If the cover art is the biggest complaint against this game, then I think it is doing pretty good. :)


Exactly my thought.



I like original art work,

Not this cut a past crap you see on the other ACW titles. Hell a ten year old could have mocked those boxes up as far as we know, the only talent there is from the original artist.

Stick with your work Marc


PS: I know you don’t like it, but I still think HTTR is some of your best work


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Post #: 27
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 3/12/2007 12:02:46 AM   
christof139


Posts: 980
Joined: 12/7/2006
Status: offline 		The cover art on the Bull Run game is actually a painting of the 4th Michigan fighting for its colors in the Wheatfield at Gettysburg. The Union Officer is the commander of the 4th Mich., and he was bayonetted and the colors were lost. He is the only *recorded* Officer in the war to have died of a bayonet wound. The 4th Mich. was engaged to front and rear, and the color bearer actually dropped the colors and ran. They were being overwhelmed. They were an elite regiment, and the first to defeat Wheat's Tigers at New Bridge, VA, where the 4th Mich. inflicted 161 casualties on the CSA troops and routed them, also capturing 2 Arty. pieces and losing only 3 men itself. The 4th Mich. was outnumbered about 5 to 1 at New Bridge. Every unit in a war comes up on the short end of the stick at least once, everyone gets their buttocks kicked at least once.

The cover art on the TS Gettysburg game may be of the Western Iron Brigade on the 1st Day, and it might portray the 24th Michigan, I don't know for sure, but it surely looks like it.

Chris



< Message edited by christof139 -- 3/12/2007 9:54:52 AM >

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RE: Cover art - yuck! - 3/14/2007 5:50:10 AM   
Jakerson

 

Posts: 565
Joined: 8/15/2006
Status: offline 		I'm ok to have my copy of game with cheaper price without the cover art please.

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Post #: 29
RE: Cover art - yuck! - 3/14/2007 5:53:01 AM   
christof139


Posts: 980
Joined: 12/7/2006
Status: offline
quote:

I'm ok to have my copy of game with cheaper price without the cover art please.


Yeah, OK, I'll buy that Whitebox Special. Pics and artwork are nice though, especially of Michigan ACW units but I guess one has to be from Michigan to appreciate that. Chris

< Message edited by christof139 -- 3/14/2007 9:51:08 AM >

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'What is more amazing, is that amongst all those approaching enemies there is not one named Gisgo.' Hannibal Barcid (or Barca) to Gisgo, a Greek staff officer, Cannae.
That's the CSS North Carolina BB-55
Boris Badanov, looking for Natasha Goodenov

(in reply to Jakerson)
Post #: 30
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