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Hello and please help! :)

 
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Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 2:41:52 PM   
captsocrates

 

Posts: 7
Joined: 12/23/2006
Status: offline 		Hello folks.
I am new to the game and am amazed at how truly awesome, deep, and replayable this game is. Truly an awesome game. I know already I will be playing this for years!!
Quick newbish question for you all:
I fare pretty well now when playing, having gone through the tutorials and playing now about 2 weeks, but something is bugging me. I'll make this as simple as possible:

It is my understanding that any armored enemy unit can only be damaged by a weapon that is capable of"penatration"., that is, a weapon that has penatration stats listed. Is this true? For instance, my Opp Fire many times is with a 7.92 cal gun which, I think, is ineffective ALWAYS against armored tanks. Is this the case? I think its ineffective but the fact that the game constantly allows for this in Op fire makes me wonder. Set me straight please, gents!

Asking this silly question has made me remember another I have had occasionally.
Whilst in combat many times an enemy unit is hit, but with "no effect" I've been assuming this means no damage effect, but lately I was wondering if this has anything to do with the morale of the unit. Does it? Does hitting the enemy, with no damage effect, effect the unite morale?
Thanks all. I've been lurking here about as long as I've been playing this great game and you all seem like a nice bunch of folks. And thanks for tolerating my noob question.

CaptSocrates...........



Post #: 1
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 4:10:44 PM   
sabrejack


Posts: 158
Joined: 9/9/2005
Status: offline 		A weapon with no PEN can usually not do any damage, but it will still cause suppression, often causing an armoured unit to 'button up'. This makes the armoured unit far more vulnerable to attack from other units (possibly a close assault from an infantry unit with an AT weapon), and also reduces the effectiveness of any attacks the suppressed unit might make.

If you're interested in developing your skills, you may want to check out the Academy at www.spwaw.com . You'll find plenty of information there, much of which is specifically aimed at helping newer players improve their game.



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SPWAWWiki: http://spwawwiki.eltacodiablos.com

(in reply to captsocrates)
Post #: 2
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 4:12:01 PM   
Elwro

 

Posts: 55
Joined: 12/2/2006
Status: offline 		I'm a complete newb at this game myself (having bought it only a few days ago), but I think that a "no effect" hit still means the target unit accumulates suppression points. According to the manual (page 67) this decreases the unit's accuracy and, depending on its morale, may cause it to reach "pinned" status or even worse.

edit: OK, simultanous posts :-) I didn't know about the unit being more vulnerable. I'll take a look at the Academy myself.

< Message edited by Elwro -- 12/23/2006 4:21:41 PM >

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Post #: 3
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 4:36:30 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		picture yourself inside a tank while a MG blazes away at it...



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Post #: 4
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 5:02:32 PM   
captsocrates

 

Posts: 7
Joined: 12/23/2006
Status: offline 		Thanks all for the replies.
So once I have a tank buttoned is it fruitless in your opinion to shoot nonPEN weps at it? What do you guys do?

Thanks again!

(in reply to Alby)
Post #: 5
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 5:10:57 PM   
FlashfyreSP


Posts: 1193
Joined: 7/6/2002
From: Combat Information Center
Status: offline 		The penetration model in the game is a pretty complicated piece of math; it allows for a number of variables that are not directly related to the penetration capability of a weapon. For instance, it allows for 'vulnerable location' hits, which reduces the armour value significantly for that facing and may result in damage from weapons that, under normal circumstances, wouldn't be capable of harming the vehicle.

The Op Fire question is interesting: if I understand correctly, you have a weapon of 7.62mm that is Op Firing at an armoured vehicle, and you want to know why it is doing so if it can't damage the vehicle? Well, any incoming fire will put Suppression on a unit, even small arms fire from infantry against tanks, Suppression reduces the effectiveness of a unit; the more it has, the less shots it can fire, and, eventually, it will retreat. Even tanks will 'run away' from this...which is why it is a good tactic to learn to handle armoured vehicles.


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Post #: 6
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 5:16:25 PM   
captsocrates

 

Posts: 7
Joined: 12/23/2006
Status: offline 		THanks very much. Things are clearer now.

(in reply to FlashfyreSP)
Post #: 7
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 7:55:33 PM   
vahauser


Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline 		captsocrates,

Even more, sometimes machineguns and rifles (when they are at higher or lower elevation) can get "top hit" or "bottom hit" results against an AFV.  When this happens then they can sometimes knock out an AFV even if that AFV has pretty thick armor normally.

Also, you will find that a good place to post and to read about these sorts of questions is in the SPWAW Training Center sub-forum.

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Post #: 8
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/23/2006 8:07:46 PM   
captsocrates

 

Posts: 7
Joined: 12/23/2006
Status: offline 		So its definitely worth my while to shoot everything I have at AFv's. Thanks for the response and advice, mates

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Post #: 9
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/24/2006 7:20:29 PM   
Kuokkanen

 

Posts: 3545
Joined: 4/2/2004
Status: offline
quote:

any incoming fire will put Suppression on a unit, even small arms fire from infantry against tanks, Suppression reduces the effectiveness of a unit

What if I would like my unit OpFire something it can kill instead? Any settings for that?


quote:

Even tanks will 'run away' from this...

Immobilize tank and its crew WILL run away. Which is bit silly if badass tank is immobilized by light AA cannon and no heavier weapons are around which could do more damage. Any settings to order crew stay on tank? Or order bail out if they decide stay?

_____________________________

You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

MekWars

(in reply to captsocrates)
Post #: 10
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/24/2006 7:59:52 PM   
Orzel Bialy


Posts: 2664
Joined: 4/4/2002
From: Wisconsin USA
Status: offline 		guys...remember that tank crews bailing from their immobilized AFV due to sustained small arms fire isn't far fetched at all.

If you are inside a AFV that can not move...is under sustained enemy fire...and you don't know what else is lurking around out there out of your immediate LoS (for all you know an enemy tank, maybe an enemy FO not far off calling in an arty barrage or even some roving infantry tank-hunter units sneaking up from the flanks with an ATM or some other anti-tank weapon) chances are you are not going to sit tight and wait to become "crew flambe".

You as the game player may know that there are no direct enemy threats close by a disabled AFV...but those virtual guys inside don't know that!

< Message edited by Orzel Bialy -- 12/24/2006 9:38:56 PM >

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Post #: 11
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/25/2006 9:22:14 AM   
vahauser


Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Matti,

The only way to get your units to op-fire at a target of your choice is to turn your Op-Fire Confirm setting ON.  I always play with mine turned OFF for many reasons (mainly because I think it gives the human player an unfair advantage that the computer does not have).


Note to Moderator:  Should this thread be moved to the SPWAW Training Center sub-Forum?

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Post #: 12
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/25/2006 9:47:30 AM   
Korpraali V


Posts: 659
Joined: 7/11/2005
From: Finland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen
Immobilize tank and its crew WILL run away. Which is bit silly if badass tank is immobilized by light AA cannon and no heavier weapons are around which could do more damage. Any settings to order crew stay on tank? Or order bail out if they decide stay?


Immobilised tank won't move unless the crew manages to fix its tracks. Pressinf F9 bails the crew out from any vehicle, gun or bunker... anything that has a crew inside.

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Post #: 13
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/27/2006 2:18:55 AM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
Joined: 12/6/2004
From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline 		Do the crews have to be outside of their respective unit in order to repair it?

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Post #: 14
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/27/2006 2:24:12 AM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Zap

Do the crews have to be outside of their respective unit in order to repair it?

no

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Post #: 15
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/27/2006 2:26:03 AM   
robot


Posts: 1438
Joined: 5/9/2000
From: Covington Ky USA
Status: offline 		No zap they dont have to be outside to repair. In spwaw they can fix there tank from the inside out. Its a miracle I know but that seems to be the way a lot of things work in this game. Like a squad that fires on you for six times and doesnt reveal there hiding place to you so you can return fire. A fog of war im told I say a fog of mind .


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Robots wear armor for skin.Grunts wear skin for armor.

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Post #: 16
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/27/2006 2:46:42 AM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
Joined: 12/6/2004
From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline 		Oh, I'm okay with that. I understand that the crew went outside the tank to repair it. I just did not have to manage it.

No opinion on your other point robot, just that they must be well hidden.

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Post #: 17
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/28/2006 5:24:27 PM   
Kuokkanen

 

Posts: 3545
Joined: 4/2/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: robot

a squad that fires on you for six times and doesnt reveal there hiding place to you so you can return fire.

There should be seen message which displays distance. In addition I've seen muzzle flashes, though I'm not sure does this apply for standard infantry weapons. Anyways there should be enough information to locate potential hiding place(s) for some suppressive fire.

_____________________________

You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

MekWars

(in reply to robot)
Post #: 18
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 12/28/2006 7:07:07 PM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		just watch the location in relation to your own units inthe between turn red-lined "OP fire" screens and then "Z" fire to those hexes come your turn.

(in reply to Kuokkanen)
Post #: 19
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 1/2/2007 7:36:12 AM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
Joined: 12/6/2004
From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline 		I need a little help to download the enhanced scenarios/campaigns. I know Alby had something in these threads.But for the life of me I can't find it.

Basic Q. where again do I download the zipped scenario files. The same Q. for the campaign files. DO I need modswapper.

I'm illiterate with computers. So be gentle with me

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Post #: 20
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 1/2/2007 4:03:01 PM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		I've got a question about that too, do u only use the modswapper? or do u need the OOB's editor too?? now u see why I haven't installed "ENHANCED"

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Post #: 21
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 1/2/2007 4:41:51 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		Download the files wherever you want to, just somewhere you can find them...
Enhanced Scenarios and Campaigns are found here
http://spwaw.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=103
Scenarios get unzipped to the SPWAW/Scen folder
Campaigns to the SPWAW/campaigns folder

These Scens and Campaigns were reworked for use with SPWAW Enhanced.

Modswap has nothing to do with downloading and installing Scenarios and Campaigns.

< Message edited by Alby -- 1/2/2007 4:53:56 PM >

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Post #: 22
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 1/2/2007 4:59:33 PM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		Thank u kind sir, you sure made that sound easy.do u have to delete or remove the old files that the zip covers, or does it just overwrite the existing ones?

(in reply to Alby)
Post #: 23
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 1/2/2007 5:04:32 PM   
FlashfyreSP


Posts: 1193
Joined: 7/6/2002
From: Combat Information Center
Status: offline 		Most of the Enhanced revision scenarios/campaigns replace the originals; they have the same filenames, so you will be asked if you want to overwrite the existing files. Suggest you open these in a temporary location, check the file names, and backup the originals (in case you want to play them with the original game engine). The replace them with the Enhanced versions. Alternately, you could rename any of the Enhanced files to 'empty' scenario or campaign slots, and have both copies in one folder.

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Post #: 24
RE: Hello and please help! :) - 1/2/2007 6:47:28 PM   
Riun T

 

Posts: 1848
Joined: 7/31/2004
Status: offline 		think I'll finish what I'm playin before tackling this thou!!

(in reply to FlashfyreSP)
Post #: 25
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