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Managing the Farm - 12/24/2006 12:24:07 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline 		This is an area I'm still having trouble with. I disregard age when assigning players to the levels -- instead, I rely on ratings/potential. So, I have a 17-year-old pitcher in AAA, and a 19-year-old pitcher in AA.

I am loath to demote a guy, but I know I'll be forced into doing so sooner or later.

To my mind, this is the toughest aspect of Pure Sim to get a handle on.

So, any hints on properly maintaining the farm system?

< Message edited by KG Erwin -- 12/24/2006 12:37:24 AM >
Post #: 1
RE: Managing the Farm - 12/24/2006 4:18:51 AM   
lynchjm24

 

Posts: 240
Joined: 8/21/2005
Status: offline 		Don't disregard the age. It will kill you. Look at the XML, it's all spelled out in there.

It works like this. Players have a hidden peak age. I think the default XML puts them between 26-32. Then there is a correct 'level' they should be at based on their age in relation to peak.

Something like A: 5-6 years from peak AA: 3-4 years from peak AAA: 1 year from peak. I don't know what's in the default XML, I changed mine, so those are estimates.

So if a player's peak age is 29, then having him in AAA before age 27 is only going to slow his development.

Age is king, the ratings and stats don't really matter, except to help you figure out when his peak might be.

< Message edited by lynchjm24 -- 12/24/2006 4:29:21 AM >

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 2
RE: Managing the Farm - 12/24/2006 5:41:33 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lynchjm24

Don't disregard the age. It will kill you. Look at the XML, it's all spelled out in there.

It works like this. Players have a hidden peak age. I think the default XML puts them between 26-32. Then there is a correct 'level' they should be at based on their age in relation to peak.

Something like A: 5-6 years from peak AA: 3-4 years from peak AAA: 1 year from peak. I don't know what's in the default XML, I changed mine, so those are estimates.

So if a player's peak age is 29, then having him in AAA before age 27 is only going to slow his development.

Age is king, the ratings and stats don't really matter, except to help you figure out when his peak might be.


Ok, I re-evaluated my minors, and made a few changes. It's the "peak" factor that I need to concentrate on, then. That being the case, I've got a couple of guys who could be monsters by the time they reach the majors.

(in reply to lynchjm24)
Post #: 3
RE: Managing the Farm - 12/24/2006 6:06:00 AM   
Hitandrun

 

Posts: 37
Joined: 7/15/2006
Status: offline 		I think Amaroq wrote a good general guide on handling minor leaguers.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=1134126

< Message edited by Hitandrun -- 12/24/2006 6:15:59 AM >

(in reply to KG Erwin)
Post #: 4
RE: Managing the Farm - 12/29/2006 9:32:05 PM   
Amaroq

 

Posts: 1100
Joined: 8/3/2005
From: San Diego, California
Status: offline 		Thanks for the recommendation, Hitandrun.

Keep in mind I wrote that before the in-season ratings modifications, which should give you some hints as to whose at the right level before you've wasted an entire year on them.

(in reply to Hitandrun)
Post #: 5
RE: Managing the Farm - 12/30/2006 5:06:14 PM   
akw4572

 

Posts: 96
Joined: 2/6/2005
Status: offline 		Are you sure you want your players in AAA 1 year before they peak?  I'd think you'd want them in the majors a decent amount of time BEFORE they hit their peak? Just because Andruw Jones didn't peak until about 27, that shouldn't mean you keep him in the minors until he's 26. 

(in reply to Amaroq)
Post #: 6
RE: Managing the Farm - 1/1/2007 8:51:36 PM   
modred

 

Posts: 64
Joined: 8/19/2005
Status: offline 		The relevant section of the xml looks like 

<!-- Bonus/Penalty based on what level a player is playing at -->
<!-- Lookup value is [Player Peak - Player Age].  Optimal Levels are 2=Majors, 1=AAA -2=AA -33=A -->
<!-- * Players younger than their peak age that are not at their optimal level may not improve -->
<!-- * Players older than theie peak age that are not at their optimal level will possibly decline more, and be more likely to retire -->
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="8" RangeMax="99" optimal_level="-3" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="5" RangeMax="7" optimal_level="-2" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="2" RangeMax="4" optimal_level="1" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="-99" RangeMax="1" optimal_level="2" />

which does seem to correspond to my experience of having a young player be the second or third best hitter on my team in the majors one year but because he is not at his optimal level his ratings tank and he ends up back at AAA for a year. After that year his ratings rebound nicely then his ratings tank again. Rinse, lather,repeat until he hits his peak age. I really wish talent relative to the league the player is in played a configurable part in the process.

(in reply to akw4572)
Post #: 7
RE: Managing the Farm - 1/2/2007 1:36:33 AM   
akw4572

 

Posts: 96
Joined: 2/6/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: modred

The relevant section of the xml looks like 

<!-- Bonus/Penalty based on what level a player is playing at -->
<!-- Lookup value is [Player Peak - Player Age].  Optimal Levels are 2=Majors, 1=AAA -2=AA -33=A -->
<!-- * Players younger than their peak age that are not at their optimal level may not improve -->
<!-- * Players older than theie peak age that are not at their optimal level will possibly decline more, and be more likely to retire -->
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="8" RangeMax="99" optimal_level="-3" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="5" RangeMax="7" optimal_level="-2" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="2" RangeMax="4" optimal_level="1" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="-99" RangeMax="1" optimal_level="2" />

which does seem to correspond to my experience of having a young player be the second or third best hitter on my team in the majors one year but because he is not at his optimal level his ratings tank and he ends up back at AAA for a year. After that year his ratings rebound nicely then his ratings tank again. Rinse, lather,repeat until he hits his peak age. I really wish talent relative to the league the player is in played a configurable part in the process.


If that's the case, is there a possibility for differences among players? I.E, One player might develop differently, or is this the end all, be all?

(in reply to modred)
Post #: 8
RE: Managing the Farm - 1/2/2007 2:35:23 AM   
lynchjm24

 

Posts: 240
Joined: 8/21/2005
Status: offline 		The difference between players is that they all have different peak ages.

I added peak ages in my XML from 23-33 - very low frequency at the edges (1 in a 100 peaks at 23, 1 in 100 peaks at 33).

I also changed the level they should be at by age - allowing them to be in the majors 2 years before their peak, although I've been thinking about moving that to 3.

Maybe Shaun can answer how badly that would mess up the AI controlled teams with respect to their player placement?

(in reply to akw4572)
Post #: 9
RE: Managing the Farm - 1/2/2007 8:31:19 PM   
Amaroq

 

Posts: 1100
Joined: 8/3/2005
From: San Diego, California
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: modred

The relevant section of the xml looks like 

<!-- Bonus/Penalty based on what level a player is playing at -->
<!-- Lookup value is [Player Peak - Player Age].  Optimal Levels are 2=Majors, 1=AAA -2=AA -33=A -->
<!-- * Players younger than their peak age that are not at their optimal level may not improve -->
<!-- * Players older than theie peak age that are not at their optimal level will possibly decline more, and be more likely to retire -->
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="8" RangeMax="99" optimal_level="-3" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="5" RangeMax="7" optimal_level="-2" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="2" RangeMax="4" optimal_level="1" />
<OPTIMAL_LEVEL RangeMin="-99" RangeMax="1" optimal_level="2" />

which does seem to correspond to my experience of having a young player be the second or third best hitter on my team in the majors one year but because he is not at his optimal level his ratings tank and he ends up back at AAA for a year. After that year his ratings rebound nicely then his ratings tank again. Rinse, lather,repeat until he hits his peak age. I really wish talent relative to the league the player is in played a configurable part in the process.

Yeah, I've seen that happen a few times, as well. I wish 'talent relative to league' were the dominant variable in this equation.

(in reply to modred)
Post #: 10
RE: Managing the Farm - 1/2/2007 11:11:30 PM   
dnelms

 

Posts: 42
Joined: 8/19/2005
Status: offline 		This is an area that in trying to "simulate" a close relation to reall baseball, we come off track. Most of your "top" prospects come from AA rather than AAA these days. This is where I guess you have to forget what "real" baseball does. I have been very hesitant to mess with the minor levels, but may give it a try here in the new year.

(in reply to Amaroq)
Post #: 11
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