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Mod Query - 1/16/2007 10:07:12 PM   
argaur


Posts: 277
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What mod do you prefer?

1.- Nik mod
2.- CHS
3.- CHS + nik variant
4.- Others?(sorry i don´t know more, Big B maybe?)





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RE: Mod Query - 1/16/2007 10:10:55 PM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8683
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From: Olympia, WA
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CHS Experimental mod

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fair winds,
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Post #: 2
RE: Mod Query - 1/16/2007 10:11:57 PM   
rtrapasso


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next one i do is going to be CHS + Nik

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Post #: 3
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 12:17:26 AM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 10398
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I prefer the standard CHS mod myself.

Bill

(in reply to argaur)
Post #: 4
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 12:32:48 AM   
drw61


Posts: 894
Joined: 6/30/2004
From: South Carolina
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CHS + nik variant
and
RHSEOS (EOS = Empire of the Sun) This is still a work in progress but almost ready.

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Post #: 5
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 1:03:56 AM   
Halsey

 

Posts: 5069
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CHS scenario 155.
It's the standard version.


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Post #: 6
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 1:24:49 AM   
FeurerKrieg


Posts: 3397
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Denver, CO
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CHS 160

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Post #: 7
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 1:36:14 AM   
Bombur

 

Posts: 3642
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Nik mod v5.3

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Post #: 8
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 2:23:54 AM   
BrucePowers


Posts: 12094
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I am plaing Terminus' Mare Bellum.

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Post #: 9
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 3:48:32 AM   
John 3rd


Posts: 17178
Joined: 9/8/2005
From: La Salle, Colorado
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I like Nik 1.3 and am interested in trying BigB's Mod.

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Post #: 10
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 4:51:23 AM   
ctangus


Posts: 2153
Joined: 10/13/2005
From: Boston, Mass.
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For me AB's map is a must - I won't play without it anymore.

The Nik Mod A2A adjustments have made the game a lot more enjoyable to me, too. With stock A2A a base can be closed down in a day or two. With Nik Mod I've had air battles last for a month or more. It seems much more real to me. And it seems to eliminate "Uber-Cap" problems.

Big B's mod seems promising as well as far as air-to-air engagements go, but I haven't had a chance to try it yet myself.

CHS provides a much more detailed and accurate OOB than stock. And there's two scenarios that also have Nik-mod air-to-air adjustments (Scen 157 & 158). (I'm playing one of each.) However the detail of CHS has become almost too cumbersome for me by mid-'43.

So my current preferences are:

1. Scenario 140 - Nik Mod on AB's map.
2. Scenario 157 or 158 - CHS with Nik-mod adjustments

Big B's Mod might fit in there too once I try it.

(in reply to John 3rd)
Post #: 11
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 4:59:00 AM   
TOMLABEL


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I'm currently playing the Big B mod with Andrew's extended map.

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Post #: 12
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 5:12:59 AM   
bilbow


Posts: 741
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From: Concord NH
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I've been playing stock since the beginning using Subchaser's map as my only mod. Recently started a game of CHS Nik-mod with Drex. It's early yet, but I'm very impressed with it. I really like AB's extended map.

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Post #: 13
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 8:34:24 AM   
Mike Wood


Posts: 2095
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Oakland, California
Status: offline
Hello...

Still play WIP, SPWaW and Neverwinter Nights, between "Carrier Force" programming sessions.

CHS is pretty good.

The map for Northern Australia is different, maybe better, don't know. There are changes in China, maybe better, don't know. The changes on the west coast of USA are ok. The map for Malay is not so good. Joel put a lot of work into determining the road net for the area and prefer his. A number of bases had airfields and or ports reduced, which confuses computer opponent, who expecting to use a base for staging or headquarters suddenly finds the ships it sends there for storage cannot disband or the airfield is too small to use for domination of the area. And, of course there are many bases that the computer opponent does not know exist; not on any of the lists, so it will pretty much ignore them except for air attacks.

Rather like the changes in aircraft speed/maneuver, but object to the reduction of bombs carried by Allied bombers, which was done without increasing the ranges for those bombers or reducing the maximum bomb load value, which actually makes the bomber simulation less realistic, not more.

A number of ships were added, many of which are quite neat. Hope that some one eventually does a comprehensive set of all ships all drawn to the same scale and in the same artistic style. But, until some one does, cannot play the CHS mod. Could overlook most everything else.

Have not looked at Nick's mod. It is probably filled with data he tried to get into the official data set, but could not convince the fellow in charge of that data set (not sure who that was, but who ever it was allowed reduction of penetration for bombs from the UV data set, which caused Japanese cruisers to become impenetrable to 500 pound GP bombs). Nick is a pretty smart fellow with an excellent gaming mind, so his mod is most likely pretty good.

Have been playing the unpublished "Michael Wood Mod", based on the official data set, with elements of CHS added, as well as own modifications (added the B-17 radioman’s gun, for instance, missing in all data sets that have seen).

Really, you can only play the game once. After that, you know too much to play again. The artificial intelligence becomes too predictable. So, recommend playing the standard scenarios which you find interesting, one time each and then start playing mods or if you can tolerate them, other humans.

Do not recommend starting over, if you find you have made some errors and call it a "learning experience". The computer opponent lacks that ability and that is its greatest weakness. Have never heard anyone call the computer opponent stupid the first time they played. They wait until they have starting over 15 times. As the computer opponent cannot have a "learning experience", you will probably have more fun, if you just play all the way through and accept errors like real war commanders did.

Your humble programmer's thoughts.

Have Fun…

Michael Wood


quote:

ORIGINAL: Beren

What mod do you prefer?

1.- Nik mod
2.- CHS
3.- CHS + nik variant
4.- Others?(sorry i don´t know more, Big B maybe?)




< Message edited by Mike Wood -- 1/17/2007 10:22:59 AM >

(in reply to argaur)
Post #: 14
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 9:56:45 AM   
John 3rd


Posts: 17178
Joined: 9/8/2005
From: La Salle, Colorado
Status: offline
Mike,
Thanks for jumping in with your perspective!
John

(in reply to Mike Wood)
Post #: 15
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 10:23:56 AM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline
"A number of bases had airfields and or ports reduced, which confuses computer opponent, who expecting to use a base for staging or headquarters suddenly finds the ships it sends there for storage cannot disband or the airfield is too small to use for domination of the area."

Mike, would it be possible to let the CHS guys know which bases need to be adjusted for AI play? I don't know if they'd be willing to do it, but a CHS-AI mod would be nice. I'm sorry to say, but the Australian racetrack railsystem sure turned me off to the original map.

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fair winds,
Brad

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Post #: 16
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 11:07:31 AM   
Mike Wood


Posts: 2095
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Oakland, California
Status: offline
Hello...

Do not know what the road/railroad status in northern Australia was, in 1941. Joel did original rearch in that area, but approved of those road changes in D. Bowen's map, when I talked with him about it. Those specific road changes do not effect computer opponent's artificial intelligence. It would just send ships to resupply the northern bases, if needed. It knows about those bases.

As far as, "...which bases need to be adjusted for AI play...", go, when get time, will look up that data, if CHS folks request. Spread out all over the place. Will take time to gather, when time available.

Bye...

Michael Wood

quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

"A number of bases had airfields and or ports reduced, which confuses computer opponent, who expecting to use a base for staging or headquarters suddenly finds the ships it sends there for storage cannot disband or the airfield is too small to use for domination of the area."

Mike, would it be possible to let the CHS guys know which bases need to be adjusted for AI play? I don't know if they'd be willing to do it, but a CHS-AI mod would be nice. I'm sorry to say, but the Australian racetrack railsystem sure turned me off to the original map.



< Message edited by Mike Wood -- 1/17/2007 8:56:52 PM >

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 17
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 3:22:07 PM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline
CHS Experimental (scen160).

Plannning to mod standard CHS with BigB mod aircraft gun accuracy ratings too to check how that works.

(in reply to Mike Wood)
Post #: 18
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 6:38:05 PM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Wood

Hello...

Still play WIP, SPWaW and Neverwinter Nights, between "Carrier Force" programming sessions.

CHS is pretty good.

(snip)
A number of ships were added, many of which are quite neat. Hope that some one eventually does a comprehensive set of all ships all drawn to the same scale and in the same artistic style. But, until some one does, cannot play the CHS mod. Could overlook most everything else.
(snip)

Your humble programmer's thoughts.

Have Fun…

Michael Wood



Just in case anyone missed it.

100% agree - but have no artistic talent. Lots of people have done some excellent work with ship art but a complete, to-scale, same style set is still only a dream. Volunteers cheerfully accepted...

(in reply to Mike Wood)
Post #: 19
RE: Mod Query - 1/17/2007 7:04:45 PM   
Big B

 

Posts: 4870
Joined: 6/1/2005
From: Old Los Angeles pre-1960
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Wood

Hello...

Still play WIP, SPWaW and Neverwinter Nights, between "Carrier Force" programming sessions.

CHS is pretty good.

(snip)
A number of ships were added, many of which are quite neat. Hope that some one eventually does a comprehensive set of all ships all drawn to the same scale and in the same artistic style. But, until some one does, cannot play the CHS mod. Could overlook most everything else.
(snip)

Your humble programmer's thoughts.

Have Fun…

Michael Wood



Just in case anyone missed it.

100% agree - but have no artistic talent. Lots of people have done some excellent work with ship art but a complete, to-scale, same style set is still only a dream. Volunteers cheerfully accepted...


Maybe several of us could get together and make a combined effort, thinking out loud...

(in reply to Don Bowen)
Post #: 20
RE: Mod Query - 1/18/2007 2:43:45 PM   
tanjman


Posts: 717
Joined: 1/26/2002
From: Griffin, GA
Status: offline
IMO it would look better if the plane tops were all at the same scale also.

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Post #: 21
RE: Mod Query - 8/14/2007 11:48:46 PM   
el cid again

 

Posts: 16922
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Wood

Hello...

Still play WIP, SPWaW and Neverwinter Nights, between "Carrier Force" programming sessions.

CHS is pretty good.

The map for Northern Australia is different, maybe better, don't know. There are changes in China, maybe better, don't know. The changes on the west coast of USA are ok. The map for Malay is not so good. Joel put a lot of work into determining the road net for the area and prefer his. A number of bases had airfields and or ports reduced, which confuses computer opponent, who expecting to use a base for staging or headquarters suddenly finds the ships it sends there for storage cannot disband or the airfield is too small to use for domination of the area. And, of course there are many bases that the computer opponent does not know exist; not on any of the lists, so it will pretty much ignore them except for air attacks.


This seems not to be the whole story. I added locations in Burma at Forum request - more than I wanted to - and they certainly do affect the AI when it comes to things like retreats. And added bases also certainly contribute to the micro-economy of an area - AI shamelessly uses resources (or whatever) they produce. The stock map is more of a skeliton than a complete map - and one person privately wrote he felt countries like Thailand were grossly misrepresented in terms of their bases - distorting their importance economically and operationally (again something we deliberately changed in RHS). The Malaya area is very hard to do on this scale and it is further complicated because the Eastern line was torn up (to provide rail for the Burma-Siam RR) - so do you show it as rail line - or not?

One should remember that CHS and RHS were mainly intended for PBEM with human opponents, so AI's ability to cope is less an issue than it is with stock - which must be AI capable given most players do that. I just tried my first AI oriented mod - and I found it can be "programmed" to a great extent by how you set things - locations in particular - but also units.
If we could know which slots were hard coded to do what, we could do a better job - but in general CHS and RHS use stock slots for locations and units - so most of it will work as intended.

(in reply to Mike Wood)
Post #: 22
RE: Mod Query - 8/14/2007 11:53:52 PM   
el cid again

 

Posts: 16922
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Big B

quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Wood

Hello...

Still play WIP, SPWaW and Neverwinter Nights, between "Carrier Force" programming sessions.

CHS is pretty good.

(snip)
A number of ships were added, many of which are quite neat. Hope that some one eventually does a comprehensive set of all ships all drawn to the same scale and in the same artistic style. But, until some one does, cannot play the CHS mod. Could overlook most everything else.
(snip)

Your humble programmer's thoughts.

Have Fun…

Michael Wood



Just in case anyone missed it.

100% agree - but have no artistic talent. Lots of people have done some excellent work with ship art but a complete, to-scale, same style set is still only a dream. Volunteers cheerfully accepted...


Maybe several of us could get together and make a combined effort, thinking out loud...


A standard set of ship art is more or less in use by CHS and RHS - as proposed by Mike if I remember right - although it is still being revised to get certain things better. The standard art apparently has definitions including things like facing, size, etc. Each mod apparently needs a separate package - although in principle it might be possible to do a common set - it would be hard to get all the pointers to agree between mods. But one thing I recommended - and Cobra adopted - was that we revert to the stock standard as far as possible - where slot number = pointer number. If we go far enough down that road we might end up with a common set of art for all.

(in reply to Big B)
Post #: 23
RE: Mod Query - 8/15/2007 12:01:46 AM   
Terminus


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And a properly scaled art pack for stock (both sides) has been out for months. Maybe if you cared about other's people's work than your own, you'd have noticed.

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Post #: 24
RE: Mod Query - 8/15/2007 2:42:04 PM   
kokubokan25


Posts: 1252
Joined: 7/19/2004
From: Iliaca, Spain
Status: offline
WITM Mod!

Well, serious now, my favorite mod is CHS with AB Map.

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Post #: 25
RE: Mod Query - 8/17/2007 11:09:16 PM   
VSWG


Posts: 3432
Joined: 5/31/2006
From: Germany
Status: offline
CHS + Nik

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Post #: 26
RE: Mod Query - 8/18/2007 1:38:57 AM   
ny59giants


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Ditto....CHS + Nik's 

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Post #: 27
RE: Mod Query - 8/18/2007 2:16:56 AM   
bobogoboom


Posts: 3799
Joined: 2/13/2006
From: Dallas
Status: offline
CHS standard.
Haven't tried chs+nik mod will try that one next.

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Post #: 28
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