Singapore

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

Singapore

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Singapore

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

Singapore - 1/22/2007 6:07:49 PM

Andy_PZ

Posts: 80
Joined: 11/20/2006
Status: offline

From an Allied view can it be defended??? (Is it worth it) I changed the commander from Percival to Haig LOL!!

_____________________________

You can't say that civilization doesn't advance...for in every War they kill you in a new way.

Post #: 1

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 6:10:21 PM

Terminus

Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline

No. The Japanese will eventually take it.

However, the longer you can delay that happening the better for the rest of the war...

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to Andy_PZ)

Post #: 2

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 6:11:39 PM

Andy_PZ

Posts: 80
Joined: 11/20/2006
Status: offline

Thats what I thought...a bit of attrition never hurt anybody! Thanks.

_____________________________

You can't say that civilization doesn't advance...for in every War they kill you in a new way.

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 3

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 6:12:12 PM

Nikademus

Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline

Near end of april 42.

Still holdin.

(not for much longer....but still hold'in)

_____________________________

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 4

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 6:12:56 PM

Terminus

Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline

"Holdin'" it that long isn't healthy. Go to the bathroom!

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to Nikademus)

Post #: 5

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 6:24:07 PM

Ian R

Posts: 3420
Joined: 8/1/2000
From: Cammeraygal Country
Status: offline

The trick is to hold it for long enough that you slow down the Japanese advance so the zero bonus expires before the IJ reaches the DEI.

Then you have a shot at holding out in the DEI, and your LBA might get through the CAP to the KB carriers.

_____________________________

"I am Alfred"

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 6

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 6:33:57 PM

KDonovan

Posts: 1157
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: New Jersey
Status: offline

if your playing against AI, i've heard of players holding out. But reinforcements from India or definetely needed.

Against a human player, its doomed.

_____________________________

(in reply to Andy_PZ)

Post #: 7

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 7:46:17 PM

Rob Brennan UK

Posts: 3685
Joined: 8/24/2002
From: London UK
Status: offline

Getting some oil to singapore really helps as then the local HI will pump out much needed supplies untill the hex is contested. so i try and defend forward then last defence of johore baru before falling back to singers allowing max use of the HI. really can make a huge differance imo.

good luck

_____________________________

sorry for the spelling . English is my main language , I just can't type . and i'm too lazy to edit :)

(in reply to KDonovan)

Post #: 8

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 8:00:16 PM

qgaliana

Posts: 311
Joined: 4/27/2005
Status: offline

Held it (and still holding it) up to 26th of June against AI, just with the Malaya troops.

1) Kicked two crossings in force (4 div+) out with 2-1 shock attack results. Guess I got lucky with the dice, but what the heck. The fact they kept getting 0-1 on the crossing didn't hurt. The Japs haven't tried since January.
2) It helps not to let your troops get forced into any retreats. The accumulated disruption and fatigue will make them useless for defending Singapore. I think the retreats plus Malaria pretty much cooked the Japanese divisions in Malaya.
3) Ship resources with oil. Singapore (at least with stock) doesn't generate much of the former.

I also pulled poor ol' Haig out of near retirement.

Definitely worth holding if you can get decent supply in. Once some P40s and Hurris get in there to secure the AF it just dominates the area. But all bets are off against a human. There were many "I'm screwed if" scenarios that the AI never even tried.

(in reply to Rob Brennan UK)

Post #: 9

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 8:49:51 PM

BigJ62

Posts: 1800
Joined: 12/28/2002
From: Alpharetta, Georgia
Status: offline

Ok human vs human at what price would you be willing to take Singapore in less than one week?

Is it worth taking Singapore this quickly?

_____________________________

Witp-AE
AeAi�AeAi �AeAi�Long live AeAi.

(in reply to qgaliana)

Post #: 10

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 9:11:53 PM

Terminus

Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BigJ62

Ok human vs human at what price would you be willing to take Singapore in less than one week?

Is it worth taking Singapore this quickly?

No. The only upside is big airfields, and Kuching is more than adequate for that.

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to BigJ62)

Post #: 11

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 10:46:02 PM

AHFlattop

Posts: 29
Joined: 1/16/2007
Status: offline

From the Allies perspective, when should the break even point occur? Can Singapore last until February with only oil/supplies runs or should reinforcements also be sent to throw off the Japanese timetable? I just purchased the game over xmas and, in my first game vs the AI, brought in 80,000 supplies from India and Kuala Lumpur and Singapore surrenderred after only 1 day of combat! Its late June 1942 and Manila, Clark Airfield, and Bataan are still hold - even with no supplies coming in!.

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 12

RE: Singapore - 1/22/2007 11:31:56 PM

bradfordkay

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline

The AI rightly puts a lot of emphasis on capturing Malaya and Singapore. There's a lot more in the way of resources in Malaya, and Singapore controls the Malaccan Straits. It's also the perfect base from which to conduct invasions of Sumatra and Java. It doesn't appear to me that the AI cares too much about Luzon. It controls the skies over that area, and the USAFFE troops remaining there can do very little to damage the Japanese war making machine. You can't resupply them and they can't attack the tankers and freigters carrying those all important resources back to Japan.

Now, if you were to base offensive air power at Clark Field or Manila, I'll guarantee that the AI will come down heavy on such an attempt (I know because I tried). The one place where it shows weakness is in allowing the player to keep naval patrol aircraft operating from bases on Luzon.

BTW: I have had Singapore last into Februrary with only supplies/oil/resources being shipped there. How long Singapore lasts basically is determined by how badly the Malayan army is trashed before it withdraws into Fortress Singapore (but this isn't to say that you should not fight for Malaya at all - withdraw too early and the Japanese troops are undamaged as well).

< Message edited by bradfordkay -- 1/22/2007 11:46:11 PM >

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to AHFlattop)

Post #: 13

RE: Singapore - 1/23/2007 12:06:51 AM

String

Posts: 2661
Joined: 10/7/2003
From: Estonia
Status: offline

If you get enough reinforcements down there you can hold it indefinetly against AI.

(in reply to bradfordkay)

Post #: 14

RE: Singapore - 1/23/2007 12:39:40 AM

qgaliana

Posts: 311
Joined: 4/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AHFlattop

From the Allies perspective, when should the break even point occur?��Can Singapore last until February with only oil/supplies runs or should reinforcements also be sent to throw off the Japanese timetable?� I just�purchased the game over xmas and, in my first game vs the AI,�brought in 80,000 supplies from India and Kuala Lumpur and Singapore surrenderred after only 1 day of combat!� Its�late June 1942 and�Manila, Clark Airfield, and�Bataan are still hold - even with no supplies coming in!.�

I'll say it again - do NOT let your forces be forced to retreat. They take brutal levels of fatigue and disruption whenever they are pushed back. I once tried duking it out in Malaya and the survivors, although numerous, were useless in a fight. Singapore collapsed in less than 48 hours. The city has like 50000 troops but most are base forces and engineers. You need almost all the brigades from Malaya in there in good shape to defend it.

At a guess I'd say the AIs problem is that it is scripted to do a frontal assault on Singapore no matter how well defended. And it doesn't seem to be interested in isolating it from Kuching or any other bases in Borneo.

(in reply to AHFlattop)

Post #: 15

RE: Singapore - 1/23/2007 1:26:42 AM

bradfordkay

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline

" And it doesn't seem to be interested in isolating it from Kuching or any other bases in Borneo."

My experience has been otherwise. The AI has always invaded Kuching and usually Brunei before Singapore falls in the few games I have played. It uses Betties and Nells based at Kuching, Khota Bahru and Kuantan to hammer my shipping in the Singapore area. How effective it is at this depends on how aggressive the human allied player wants to be.

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to qgaliana)

Post #: 16

RE: Singapore - 1/23/2007 2:05:11 AM

qgaliana

Posts: 311
Joined: 4/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

" And it doesn't seem to be interested in isolating it from Kuching or any other bases in Borneo."

My experience has been otherwise. The AI has always invaded Kuching and usually Brunei before Singapore falls in the few games I have played. It uses Betties and Nells based at Kuching, Khota Bahru and Kuantan to hammer my shipping in the Singapore area. How effective it is at this depends on how aggressive the human allied player wants to be.

Actually I'm glad to hear that. The AI may be reacting more than I gave it credit for. In my current game it did occupy all of northern Borneo, but hasn't based air there. On the other hand I periodically bomb Kuching (a couple raids every week or so) with heavies from Java. It may just be avoiding the area because of that. Betties and Nells are all in Indochina/Siam, so I still pretty much control the approaches to Singers. We can debate whether this is the correct decision but at least it seems to be modifying its approach in response to the human player.

(in reply to bradfordkay)

Post #: 17

RE: Singapore - 1/23/2007 2:21:02 AM

bradfordkay

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline

Another way to reduce the importance of Kuching is to prevent it from getting enough supplies, if possible. I have also noticed that the AI will withdraw its bombers from there if threatened by heavy bombers. As you mentioned, it does seem to adjust its air camapign to what the player does (but for some reason it doesn't do as well with its amphibious invasions - far too often it will send an invasion TF into the teeth of a large air force).

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to qgaliana)

Post #: 18

RE: Singapore - 1/23/2007 3:53:40 AM

Q-Ball

Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline

Against the AI maybe a better idea is to pull everyone out to Palembang and Java...that will ensure you hold those areas. In fact, against the AI, you should be able to hold everything except Malaya and maybe north Borneo. And by everything I mean the PI, against the AI you can easily supply it with single ship AK's from Pearl. That means you can hold Clark, and if you can do that you can start flying in RAAF Beuforts and torpedo every convoy trying to bring oil and supplies back from the DEI, because they will all sail through that strait.

(in reply to bradfordkay)

Post #: 19

RE: Singapore - 1/23/2007 4:34:42 AM

ctangus

Posts: 2153
Joined: 10/13/2005
From: Boston, Mass.
Status: offline

Vs. the AI I held Singapore until Jan '43 (shortly thereafter I went to PBEM). In PBEM, in 3 games, the earliest I've lost Singapore is March 25th '42. I would have held it a month longer if I hadn't made a big mistake. In a fourth game, I'm commanding Malaya in a team PBEM (currently mid-Jan) and I currently suspect I'll last that long or longer.

IMO the keys to holding Singers as long as possible are:

1. Send in as much supply/oil/resources as you can. In general send the supply from India & the oil/resources from the DEI.

2. Jap LBA at Kuching can dominate the sea lanes around Singapore. Try to hold it as long as possible and then neutralize it with your LBA once it falls.

3. Western Sumatra can be used to base fighters on LRCAP over your convoys from India. Singkep Island can be used to base fighters to LRCAP convoys coming from the DEI. That will deter most unescorted raids, though be prepared to take damage against a raid that comes with Zero escorts.

4. Try to force a fighting withdrawal down the Malaya peninsula. This is probably the toughest bit. You should try to hold at any place that has good forts, in order to gain time, but you don't want to suffer forced retreats, either. If more than 3-4 brigades suffer a forced retreat you'll probably be in trouble. My rule of thumb: I bug out once forts start going down.

(in reply to Q-Ball)

Post #: 20