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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Ship repair question

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Ship repair question - 4/17/2007 8:28:01 PM

toonces

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Hey all,
I tried to find this answer in the manual, but couldn't quite get the answer I'm looking for.

I'm positive you all have answered this before- thank you for your patience and repeating yourself for my benefit!

Playing as the allies, do I need to move a ship to Pearl Harbor/West Coast for repair? Can I use Brisbane? What is the difference between a level 9 and level 10 port for repair purposes?

I've pulled two CV's into Brisbane for repair, and don't seem to be getting much repair done (level 9 port). I believe the closest level 10 is Sydney right down the coast. I need to know if it's worth the sail time to move them, or if I need to pull them completely out of theater.

Post #: 1

RE: Ship repair question - 4/17/2007 8:31:22 PM

toonces

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Follow up question- will moving one or more AR's to any port significantly affect repair? Can these ships provide any benefit in a TF with a heavily damaged ship, ie. can they 'rescue' a ship struggling to make port before sinking?

(in reply to toonces)

Post #: 2

RE: Ship repair question - 4/17/2007 8:40:02 PM

Mike Solli

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Sorry, but I don't play the Allies so I can't give you specifics about the bases. Generally, you want to put your damaged ships in the highest port level you can. Also, up to 4 ARs will help per base. Each AR can help up to 4 ships. ARs only help ships in ports, and some people say they help whether or not the ship is disbanded at the port. I disband the ARs and ships in the port to be sure. ARs will not help ships outside the port, however.

(in reply to toonces)

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/17/2007 9:57:26 PM

Sardaukar

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Capital ships repair slowly, because they have high durability -> slow repair.

For CV, I recommend all following: Size 10 port, repair shipyard (big one, like size 100 or more, 250 is largest) and 4 ARs.

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/17/2007 10:01:27 PM

Sardaukar

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BTW, max number of sys damage you can repair in day is 2, 1 point for port repair and one point for repair shipyard. And then you have been very lucky. ARs and port size affect the possibility of the port repair to happen, shipyard has it's own way to repair.

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Post #: 5

RE: Ship repair question - 4/17/2007 10:20:44 PM

niceguy2005

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As stated, capital ships really need to be moved to size 10 ports with large repair yards (PH, SF, Seattle, LA) to get much repair done quickly. If you just need to take a couple of points of Sys damage from routine operations you can leave them in a size 9 or 10 port and they will eventually repair. I have a BB at a size 9 port with a "minor" repair yard. It has taken of 2 points in 2 months. By contrast a BB in SF has taken of about 20 points of damage.

The ports with smaller repair yards like Sydney, Melbourne, Auckland, Colombo really only repair smaller endurance ships quickly. Even cruisers take a while in those ports.

Ports seem to repair all ships (based on the endurance) each turn. Port repair facilities can only work on 1 ship at a time.

There was a thread a long time ago in which a poster did serious testing on ARs. The conclusion by the tester was that ARs really work best in groups in large ports. Yes, they can help in small ports, but their impact is much lower.

While on the topic of repairs don't forget AD's can help repair destroyers and AS can help subs.

Since you are playing allies, one strategy for repairs is to use your ports in NZ and Canada to repair AK/AP/TK, thus saving better ports for your warships.

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 12:45:14 AM

toonces

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Thanks for the inputs. From what you're saying then, is that even though Sydney is a size 10 port, it's not as 'large' as the mainland ports. Therefore, I'm gonna need to move my capital ships to PH for repairs.

I have Wasp and Hornet in port at Brisbane, one with 40 SYS and the other 46 SYS. I hate to move them across the ocean in this state, but it looks like that's the call. Hornet has had about 5 points SYS damage repaired in the last month at Brisbane which is what prompted me to post.

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 1:13:42 AM

m10bob

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Each yard with repair facilities will give ship repair points..Different mods have added to the number of "repair ports"(thank goodness)..

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 1:15:23 AM

Montbrun

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quote:

ORIGINAL: toonces

Thanks for the inputs.� From what you're saying then, is that even though Sydney is a size 10 port, it's not as 'large' as the mainland ports.� Therefore, I'm gonna need to move my capital ships to PH for repairs.

I have Wasp and Hornet in port at Brisbane, one with 40 SYS and the other 46 SYS.� I hate to move them across the ocean in this state, but it looks like that's the call.� Hornet has had about 5 points SYS damage repaired in the last month at Brisbane which is what prompted me to post.

Move 'em to Sydney, where there is a repair yard.

(in reply to toonces)

Post #: 9

RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 1:31:13 AM

dpazuk

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Along with what has already been suggested, placing a Naval HQ at your repair base wouldn't hurt.

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 4:09:17 AM

wdolson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: toonces

Thanks for the inputs. From what you're saying then, is that even though Sydney is a size 10 port, it's not as 'large' as the mainland ports. Therefore, I'm gonna need to move my capital ships to PH for repairs.

I have Wasp and Hornet in port at Brisbane, one with 40 SYS and the other 46 SYS. I hate to move them across the ocean in this state, but it looks like that's the call. Hornet has had about 5 points SYS damage repaired in the last month at Brisbane which is what prompted me to post.

The issue there is not the size of the port, but the size of the repair shipyard. For a repair shipyard to remove 1 point of damage, the repair yard must have enough repair points stored up to euqal that ships durability. After the repair, that number of repair points will be subtracted from the port's repair point pool. If unused, a port's repair points will accumulate, but max out at 4X the size of the ship repair yard.

The Allies have many small ship repair yards at start: Melbourne, Sydney, Aukland, Calcutta, Columbo, Bombay, Karachi (or Aden if playing the extended map), Soerabaja, Manila, Singapore, Hong Kong, Victoria, Vancouver, and Prince Rupert. These ports can repair smaller, low durability ships and some can even repair Cruisers, but the only ports that can repair capital ships effectively are Pearl Harbor and the West Coast of the US ports.

If your ships have flotation damage, keep them in port until that is patched up, a small repair yard can fix flotation damage on anything. ARs, port size, and having a naval headquarters in the port will also help speed up this process. To fix the Sys damage, you're going to need a large ship repair port.

The biggest is San Francisco. Portland and San Diego are a little whimpy compared to Pearl, LA and Seattle, but all are decent repair ports. When a lot of my ships are upgrading at once, such as in April 1942, all the posts on the West Coast end up full.

Because there are two repair mechanisms: organic repair and shipyard repair, a capital ship will probably repair on its own eventually through organic repair if you leave it in a big port long enough, but ship yard repair is much faster.

If a big ship gets banged up, just expect to have to send them to the West Coast for repairs. It is one of the few disadvantages of being the Allies. Repair is a long ways from the action for big ships.

Bill

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 4:24:42 AM

tsimmonds

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quote:

The issue there is not the size of the port, but the size of the repair shipyard. For a repair shipyard to remove 1 point of damage, the repair yard must have enough repair points stored up to euqal that ships durability. After the repair, that number of repair points will be subtracted from the port's repair point pool. If unused, a port's repair points will accumulate, but max out at 4X the size of the ship repair yard.

This is almost but not exactly right. First, the organic repair procedure is checked for each damaged ship. Then, any ship that removed a point of damage through the organic procedure is eligible to attempt to remove another point with the repair yard. Repair points (if available) are spent, and a die roll determines whether a second point of damage is removed.

So the size of the port is in fact a critical issue, in that it determines the likelihood of removing through organic repair procedure the point of damage that makes a ship eligible for repairing a second point through the repair yard roll.

Weird.

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 4:35:15 AM

wdolson

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Didn't know that. So if a repair yard is used, the ship will repair two points that turn? Maybe this is why it can take forever to repair the last point of damage because it will only be repaired by organic repair?

That is very weird. No wonder the ship repair routine is so wonky.

Bill

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 10:42:20 PM

Halsey

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Max additions for ship repairs in ports.

One Naval HQ will add +1 per 100 support pts it has.
Four AR's.
One AD.
One AS.

Anything else is waste.

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/18/2007 10:57:07 PM

niceguy2005

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson
The issue there is not the size of the port, but the size of the repair shipyard. For a repair shipyard to remove 1 point of damage, the repair yard must have enough repair points stored up to euqal that ships durability. After the repair, that number of repair points will be subtracted from the port's repair point pool. If unused, a port's repair points will accumulate, but max out at 4X the size of the ship repair yard.

So implied in this statement is the idea that it may be impossible for some smaller repair yards to actually contribute to some large endurance ships, as they may never accumulate enough repair points.

quote:

The Allies have many small ship repair yards at start: Melbourne, Sydney, Aukland, Calcutta, Columbo, Bombay, Karachi (or Aden if playing the extended map), Soerabaja, Manila, Singapore, Hong Kong, Victoria, Vancouver, and Prince Rupert.

This may vary from Mod to mod. I believe in stock Calcutta (landlocked), Portland (landlocked), Vancouver and Prince Rupert do not have repair yards. Chadpur and Diamnod Harbor do though.

One parting thought, it is very important to understand how the repair yards work. Since any ship in theory can be eligible to use repair points (and thus draw down the pool available) it is important if trying to repair a capital ship fast, like a CV, that you not have a lot of other damaged ships in port with it. They will also use the yard and draw down the pool of points available.

There is a priority routine for ship repair that the game follows but no one I know of understands it. Best thing if you want a fast repair is put the CV in SF with no other damaged ships.

< Message edited by niceguy2005 -- 4/18/2007 10:58:56 PM >

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/19/2007 9:38:13 AM

Sardaukar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Halsey

One Naval HQ will add +1 per 100 support pts it has.

That's why it's so good to evacuate 360 support point Asiatic Fleet from Philippines to Australia, for example ! Not sure if it adds +3 or +4 to port size, but it's nice anyway !!

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/19/2007 9:45:05 AM

Sardaukar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005

So implied in this statement is the idea that it may be impossible for some smaller repair yards to actually contribute to some large endurance ships, as they may never accumulate enough repair points.

That's correct, AFAIK. If repair yard size x 4 is not equal or larger than ship's durability, it cannot repair that ship.

Someone did some testing with different repairs and IIRC, he stated that repair yards seem to repair independently from port repairs. That is, you still seem to have chance of shipyard repair after you fail port repair check.
I thought differently first, until I discovered that repair yards can somehow repair ships in docked TFs !! TF ships docked never repair (except with intrinsic repair capability for heavy damage) in port that does not have repair shipyard. I found that out when watching my CS convoys loading in SF etc.

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"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von B�lov, 1870-

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/19/2007 2:19:27 PM

ny59giants

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It was my understanding that the repair routine for those ports with a shipyard is to start with those ships with a lower ship ID number from the data base (usually CV's 1st, then BB's, CA's, etc.). Thus, the larger capital ships get first chance at the supply of repair points before the less durable ships get a chance. Is this correct??

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/19/2007 6:09:09 PM

AmiralLaurent

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As everything in WITP is done in database order, it seems logical that repair shipyards will work the same.

That said it is still a good idea to have big repair shipyards reserved to big ships. Example: you have a 80 shipyard trying to repair a 90 durability ship.

If the ship is alone, strating from the 2nd day the shipyard will have enough points to repair the ship. If there are other smaller ships in the shipyard, they may use the points after the CV had faield to repair or had not found enough shipyard points to do so.

Interesting remark about ships in docked TF being repaired by repair shipyards. It may explain what I saw last turn. I had a ship with SYS 1 sailing off Malaya but next turn it was docked in Singapore (still in its TF) with SYS 0. Normally no damage under SYS 5 can be repaired except if the ship is disbanded into a port.

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/20/2007 12:25:49 AM

tabpub

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quote:

Interesting remark about ships in docked TF being repaired by repair shipyards. It may explain what I saw last turn. I had a ship with SYS 1 sailing off Malaya but next turn it was docked in Singapore (still in its TF) with SYS 0. Normally no damage under SYS 5 can be repaired except if the ship is disbanded into a port.

AL,

Yep. Been over this one before; I think it's a programming hole.
Ship in TF makes "repair roll", program says "wait, you're in a TF, no repair under 5", but then the repair yard presence is noticed by the program; "Oh, you repaired a point, now for the shipyard repair roll", which is then done even though it's in a TF.

You notice it the most with DD and Liberty's as they have low DUR and make their repair rolls fairly easily.

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/20/2007 9:34:23 AM

Sardaukar

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It really helps keeping CS Convoys in shape, so I don't mind. Like one shuttling from SF to Pearl Harbor etc. when both places have repair shipyard.

< Message edited by Sardaukar -- 4/20/2007 9:35:56 AM >

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RE: Ship repair question - 4/20/2007 1:25:18 PM

Charles2222

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tabpub

quote:

Interesting remark about ships in docked TF being repaired by repair shipyards. It may explain what I saw last turn. I had a ship with SYS 1 sailing off Malaya but next turn it was docked in Singapore (still in its TF) with SYS 0. Normally no damage under SYS 5 can be repaired except if the ship is disbanded into a port.

AL,

Yep. Been over this one before; I think it's a programming hole.
Ship in TF makes "repair roll", program says "wait, you're in a TF, no repair under 5", but then the repair yard presence is noticed by the program; "Oh, you repaired a point, now for the shipyard repair roll", which is then done even though it's in a TF.

You notice it the most with DD and Liberty's as they have low DUR and make their repair rolls fairly easily.

I don't think it's anything unrealistic, despite what the rules state. A 5 level may be too high, but I would suppose a TF at the port hex could have some people sent out by some boat, maybe an AR or one of the many non-represented boats in the game, to fix the grease fire damage to a fryer or what not.

(in reply to tabpub)

Post #: 22