one problem causes trouble

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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Steel Panthers World At War & Mega Campaigns >> one problem causes trouble

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one problem causes trouble - 7/5/2007 1:16:00 PM

koju

Posts: 13
Joined: 1/22/2003
From: Finland
Status: offline

I am using v. 8.403 and have done some my own scenarios and put those together as campaign. In gameplay against AI between turns 5-20 one of my units gets supressed without any reason. This usually happens when at least one enemy unit is visible for that unit. No shots or sumthing happened supression just suddenly rises over 80.

Is this some kind of bug in 8.403?

Post #: 1

RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/5/2007 3:18:39 PM

vahauser

Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline

People have known about this phenomenon for a long time. Nobody knows for sure why it happens.

My personal theory is that this occurs to units that have low morale and that are not close to other friendly units.

If you have mines in the game, then there is also a bug associated with mines that suppresses units when another unit is destroyed by a mine.

My suggestion is to keep units that have low morale within visual sighting distance of each other.

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Post #: 2

RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/5/2007 3:33:27 PM

FlashfyreSP

Posts: 1193
Joined: 7/6/2002
From: Combat Information Center
Status: offline

It's called "combat friction". There are any number of reasons why this happens to a unit, and it was purposely built into the game. Random suppression increases, particularly to units that are low in Morale, are Out of Contact with higher HQ, or have witnessed the destruction of a friendly unit.

I once had a Troop Commander unit (the B0 tank of a British Cruiser squadron) in a Core Force develop 99 Suppression between the Deploy phase and Turn 1, resulting in its retreating off the map, in two successive batles. The unit was high Average in EXP and MOR, had no damage, did not "see" any enemy units, was not fired on or barraged, did not see any friendlies destroyed, or suffer any other event that could logically have explained the sudden increase in Suppression, but there it was, running hell-bent for the Retreat flag.

So it's not a "bug", more of a "design feature".

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Post #: 3

RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/5/2007 10:07:33 PM

koju

Posts: 13
Joined: 1/22/2003
From: Finland
Status: offline

No no no.

In core force this suppression >80 happens to same unit ONLY and unit is platoon leader
Same freaking random supression >80 thing happens once per mission to D0 unit again and again still I start campaign over and purchase same units again. No difference.
Unit isnt low morale unit, Finns never been.
When it happens there has always been at least two friendly units next to it.

Only solution I have now is to purchase one D0 unit and leave it to backline.

< Message edited by koju -- 7/5/2007 10:18:06 PM >

(in reply to FlashfyreSP)

Post #: 4

RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/6/2007 1:57:50 AM

FlashfyreSP

Posts: 1193
Joined: 7/6/2002
From: Combat Information Center
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: koju

No no no.

In core force this suppression >80 happens to same unit ONLY and unit is platoon leader
Same freaking random supression >80 thing happens once per mission to D0 unit again and again still I start campaign over and purchase same units again. No difference.
Unit isnt low morale unit, Finns never been.
When it happens there has always been at least two friendly units next to it.

Only solution I have now is to purchase one D0 unit and leave it to backline.

Read the first line of my post above: there are MANY reasons why this would occur in real life; most of them are abstract concepts, not something that can be quantified as a number or statistic. Low morale is only one of those possible factors, and may NOT be what is at work in this, or in my own, case.

Whatever is causing it, it will eventually go away. That unit will have some changes to its ratings, and likely one of them is the cuplrit. Once it changes, the Supression bug will disappear. It did for my unit, once it was rallied and engaged in some combat to gain experience.

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RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/6/2007 11:43:09 AM

koju

Posts: 13
Joined: 1/22/2003
From: Finland
Status: offline

It seems that nobody in here is experiencing same as me. And couple of replys simply tell me that those are not believing what I say or do not understand what I am saying.

Help I don't anymore want but I try to say this clearly to you. I have been playing this game since first versions arrived and I really nowadays can't see what I have done wrong after updates and mods. So I propably have seen how normally supression works.

It's allways D0 unit, units morale and experience both are >70. Every time Battalion Commander is 2 Hexes away and two friendly other (infantry) are 1 hexes away. There is no shots against D0 and noticed now even once there wasnt any enemy units in line of sight. D0 can be sniper, infantry or tank same happens, boosting units values do not do any difference. So... D0 is only unit in my scenarios wich suppression rises suddenly once per scenario without any reason over 80.

I am sorry if you don't believe me, I have been intersted if somebody has been experiencing same and how to solve this strange behaviour.

< Message edited by koju -- 7/6/2007 11:44:57 AM >

(in reply to FlashfyreSP)

Post #: 6

RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/6/2007 3:45:24 PM

FlashfyreSP

Posts: 1193
Joined: 7/6/2002
From: Combat Information Center
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I never said I didn't believe you...I even had the same thing happen to one of MY units, as I stated in my posts above.

What I AM saying is that it's nothing you did wrong in your design, and there is nothing you can do to fix it, except let the situation work itself out. It is a design feature of the game, something that the newer design has to make the combat model more realistic than the older versions of the game.

I am sorry that you aren't listening to what is being said...

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Post #: 7

RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/6/2007 6:24:16 PM

vahauser

Posts: 1644
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Texas
Status: offline

koju,

If you have mines in your game, then there is a known bug involving mines. If one of your vehicles is destroyed by a minefield, then there is a possibility that one of your units (usually in formations B, C, D, or E) will sustain very high supression no matter where on the map it is. This is not the design feature described by FlashFyre. This is a bug. There is no solution to this bug. You just have to live with it.

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Post #: 8

RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/6/2007 7:25:16 PM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline

why not redo the scenario and re buy the unit in question??

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Post #: 9

RE: one problem causes trouble - 7/7/2007 10:13:16 AM

Rimrunner

Posts: 12
Joined: 7/6/2007
Status: offline

Because the bug is still there.

You can buy and rebuy whatever, at some point,
usually early in the game, and in my experience,
usually a unit or units in B or C groups, will
abruptly rout. Often more than one.
Auto-rally helps but doesn't solve it.

My solution is the same as Koju's (above): use B and C for something like transport lorries
and keep them away from the sharp end.

You can imagine, before I learned better, when these are scout tanks hunting enemy
artillery behind the lines, safely behind a forest or a hill, and when they rout they run
for the enemy front line - where the big tanks are

(in reply to Alby)

Post #: 10