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Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/13/2007 8:26:58 PM   
warlimont


Posts: 19
Joined: 3/15/2006
Status: offline 		Fellow Harpooneers,

I just purchased and installed H3 ANW 3.7.0.0, and am going through the tutorials now.

I have had and played the original Harpoon, Harpoon II, Harpoon 97 Classic so I'm
reasonably comfortable with H3's interface.

I have a couple of questions I'm hoping for help with:

1. How far would you suggest I patch it? I have seen the comments to skip any other
3.7 versions and go to 3.8. (I've downloaded the 3.8 patch already).

2. Which version from 3.7 thru 3.8 will give me the best selection of user-made
databases and scenarios?

I always liked Harpoon II even with the fatal bugs, so I'm looking forward to my
H3 experience.

Thanks all.
Post #: 1
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/13/2007 9:40:31 PM   
FransKoenz


Posts: 255
Joined: 6/3/2005
Status: offline 		Why not try out The PlayersDB with ANW 3.8?
All original Harpoon3 scenarios are available and various other interesting scenarios, for Multi-play and play against Computer [AI].


With over 54,000 PlayersDB scenarios downloaded in the last 18 weeks alone, the PlayersDB has proven itself the unequivocal players' favourite.
Harpoon ANW users can get them at:
[U]Complete Harpoon ANW Library [PlayersDB-7.4.7-ANW][/U]
The EU4 Series Battleset is available at:
EU4 Series Battleset
Just unzip the file(s) into your ANW Databases folder normally found at:
C:\Matrix Games\Harpoon 3 Advanced Naval Warfare\Databases
Scenarios can also be loaded individually at:
http://www.GameSquad.com/forums/downloads.php?do=cat&id=118
This scenario requires the latest release of the PlayersDB v7.4.7-ANW
Get it via: HarPlonkHQ, GameSquad, HarpGamer, SimHQ, PlayersDB Depot, Matrix, SubSim, or Frugal's World of Simulation.


This is, of course just a suggestion......

Have fun!
Taitennek.


< Message edited by Taitennek -- 8/13/2007 9:41:22 PM >

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Post #: 2
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/13/2007 9:54:44 PM   
warlimont


Posts: 19
Joined: 3/15/2006
Status: offline 		thnks for your reply.
you mention in your post "The EU4 Series Battleset is available at:
EU4 Series Battleset "

but I didn't see a link.  Is there a separate link for the above EU4 Series?

(in reply to FransKoenz)
Post #: 3
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/14/2007 3:19:30 PM   
FransKoenz


Posts: 255
Joined: 6/3/2005
Status: offline 		EU4 Series Battleset.





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Post #: 4
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/16/2007 12:28:48 AM   
FreekS


Posts: 323
Joined: 5/12/2006
Status: offline 		The Tutorials and all scens can also be played with PlayerDB; a single zip file with all scenarios (>200) and the DB can be downloaded at link below.

Harpoon ANW users can get them at:
Complete Harpoon ANW Library [PlayersDB-7.4.7-ANW]

< Message edited by FreekS -- 8/16/2007 12:35:07 AM >

(in reply to FransKoenz)
Post #: 5
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/16/2007 9:42:41 AM   
Flankerk

 

Posts: 417
Joined: 6/21/2006
Status: offline 		Introductory scenarios are also here :- http://www.harpoonhq.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4618

My understanding is that the players database is not 3.8 compliant either?

< Message edited by Flankerk -- 8/16/2007 9:43:23 AM >

_____________________________



"Alas poor Yorick,I knew him Horatio"

#1 Quote of the Harpoon Community.

(in reply to FreekS)
Post #: 6
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/17/2007 12:30:15 AM   
FreekS


Posts: 323
Joined: 5/12/2006
Status: offline 		sure it is, use it all the time with ANW. Freek

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Post #: 7
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/17/2007 9:48:02 AM   
Flankerk

 

Posts: 417
Joined: 6/21/2006
Status: offline 		The question isn't whether the database just about gets by under 3.8 though, its whether its actually 3.8 compliant. I'd be interested to know how the Players Database implemented any of the Database Compliance requirements without having access to an editor?
I've asked Herman several times to state whether he views PDB as 3.8 compliant and to date he has refused to comment. Many of those "bugs" posted for the Players Database suggest its incompatibility with 3.8. If it is compliant, why not say so?

As a suggestion, I'd like to see a stickied thread where actual 3.8 compliant databases are listed. At present, to the best of my knowledge that is only ANW db, ODB, HUD III when it becomes available and Colonial Wars DB. If there are others then by all means add those to the list.



_____________________________



"Alas poor Yorick,I knew him Horatio"

#1 Quote of the Harpoon Community.

(in reply to FreekS)
Post #: 8
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/17/2007 10:38:49 AM   
Vincenzo_Beretta


Posts: 440
Joined: 3/13/2001
From: Milan, Italy
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Flankerk
I'd be interested to know how the Players Database implemented any of the Database Compliance requirements without having access to an editor?


Maybe there is no need to know that simply because Herman *has* access to an editor, as posted on this very same forum.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=1430341

We've released a new version of the Harpoon3 PlayersDB. Today’s date is 07-04-07, so the new edition is PlayersDB 7.4.7

Why have we done this? Why not just continue to add new platforms to previous PlayersDB editions like we've always done? This release is to accommodate changes implemented in the Harpoon3 ANW game engine that were causing problems for PlayersDB users. Incompatibility issues arose and have now been rectified with this new release and through the use of the Official AGSI Harpoon ANW Database editor.

< Message edited by Vincenzo Beretta -- 8/17/2007 10:50:37 AM >

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Post #: 9
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/17/2007 11:52:23 AM   
Flankerk

 

Posts: 417
Joined: 6/21/2006
Status: offline 		The issue of database compliance isn't about simply adding units through the in game editor. Wholesale changes are required as outlined in the database compliance thread. To do so you require the Reimer Editor as is made available primarily through the AGSI content channel.

Is anyone from the Players Database prepared to clarify whether it is or is not 3.8 compliant? In my experience, using a non compliant database tends to throw up "bugs" that are not in game one's, its a db issue.

_____________________________



"Alas poor Yorick,I knew him Horatio"

#1 Quote of the Harpoon Community.

(in reply to Vincenzo_Beretta)
Post #: 10
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/17/2007 1:54:42 PM   
Vincenzo_Beretta


Posts: 440
Joined: 3/13/2001
From: Milan, Italy
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Flankerk

The issue of database compliance isn't about simply adding units through the in game editor. Wholesale changes are required as outlined in the database compliance thread. To do so you require the Reimer Editor as is made available primarily through the AGSI content channel.

Is anyone from the Players Database prepared to clarify whether it is or is not 3.8 compliant? In my experience, using a non compliant database tends to throw up "bugs" that are not in game one's, its a db issue.


The 'issue' of compliance is solely the purview of the individual editor( s). Wholesale changes are not required unless deemed necessary by the editor. Use of new flags and features made available by ANW are at the discretion of the Editor. Those who choose to ignore them are no less 'compliant' than those who decide to use them. The PlayersDB is as compliant as the ODb and ANWDb (albeit much more functional and reliable than either of the two databases distributed by Matrix).

You wrote:
quote:

ORIGINAL: Flankerk
In my experience, using a non compliant database tends to throw up "bugs" that are not in game one's, its a db issue.


Of course, non-compliant databases like DB2000 "tend to throw up "bugs" that are not in game one's, its a db issue.

The DB editor is available from AGSI: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=1349871
The Reimer Editor is merely another alternative. It is not the only one. The belief that only the Reimer Editor will suffice is the result of inexperience in their function.

According to your "logic", neither the ODb nor the ANWDb would be considered compliant, either, since they produce 60% of the reported bugs.

< Message edited by Vincenzo Beretta -- 8/17/2007 1:57:58 PM >

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Post #: 11
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/17/2007 2:41:25 PM   
Flankerk

 

Posts: 417
Joined: 6/21/2006
Status: offline 		If I can recap, my question was a simple one. Was the Players Database 3.8 compliant?
Thank you for clarifying that it isn't.

Can I suggest that those databases that are compliant to 3.8 be highlighted/stickied or something akin . There are now a number of alternatives that properly comply with 3.8 and several more on the way.

If you ignore the new requirements the game becomes significantly less functional. I would not like to see people assuming that this is due to the game.

If authors have no intention of updating their databases, thats up to them I agree. However it is disingenuous to release a 3.8 compatible database that isn't at all compliant.

_____________________________



"Alas poor Yorick,I knew him Horatio"

#1 Quote of the Harpoon Community.

(in reply to Vincenzo_Beretta)
Post #: 12
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/17/2007 4:30:29 PM   
BurntFingers

 

Posts: 155
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Flankerk

Introductory scenarios are also here :- http://www.harpoonhq.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4618

My understanding is that the players database is not 3.8 compliant either?


Speaking as a reletive newcomer who owns ANW but never bought an earlier version of Harpoon 3;-

- VCDH is quite correct. The Reimer database is NOT necessary to make database changes. In fact, just browsing a database with the standard editor (the request form is on this website) reveals much about a database.

My advice to ANW players;-

Try different databases/scenarios. Some work better than others, but they all (for the moment) have ANW faults/bugs or as I call them, "quirks".

Some of us can live that. Others are more fussy.

(in reply to Flankerk)
Post #: 13
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/17/2007 11:07:31 PM   
Vincenzo_Beretta


Posts: 440
Joined: 3/13/2001
From: Milan, Italy
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Flankerk
If I can recap, my question was a simple one. Was the Players Database 3.8 compliant?
Thank you for clarifying that it isn't.


And where I did do that? What I actually "clarified" is that your standards for "non-compliance" (if applied to all the DBs out there) would make very few of them "compliant" - even some of those you mark as "compliant". This contradiction happens, as I explained, because actually it is your line of reasoning to be flawed, not the DBs themselves.

I think that your intent is good, but you should really *read* what other people post before answering.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Flankerk
If you ignore the new requirements the game becomes significantly less functional. I would not like to see people assuming that this is due to the game.


The game already has A LOT of problems, I agree. Here is a good list: http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42076
...and of course we are all waiting for the day when they will be fixed by the dev. team.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Flankerk
If authors have no intention of updating their databases, thats up to them I agree. However it is disingenuous to release a 3.8 compatible database that isn't at all compliant.


No it's not. Just because AGSI claims that some things work does not mean that anything actually "works". Take for example the claim that UnRep works.

"Underway Replenishment including refueling"
http://www.harpoon5.com/wiki/main/index.php?title=H3ANW:373#Other_Enhancements.2FAdjustments

Anyone foolhardy enough to try and implement that 'feature' would now be singing the blues.
http://tinyurl.com/yo558v


So, in principle, I agree with VCDH:

quote:


There are two ways to look at this. From a scenario or DB perspective. A 3.8 Compliant DB means that the DB author has taken all steps necessary to get the most out of the new features that are available in v3.8 (UnRep, etc).


- or to avoid them when deemed necessary.

However, this is different from just arbitrarily decide what "rocks" and what "doesn't" - only creating the opportunity for strawmen as a byproduct. Thus, this is why I disagree with Flanks' approach


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Post #: 14
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/18/2007 6:41:53 AM   
Flankerk

 

Posts: 417
Joined: 6/21/2006
Status: offline 		I asked whether the Players Database was 3.8 compliant and receive a lengthy posting on the meaning of the word compliance. 

The link to the database compliance thread is above. If it would be easier to break down that thread into which parts of the  work the players database has done perhaps that could be used as an example?

I agree in principle that this could be done to an extent using the simplified editor, but implementing the seeker changes isn't feasible in my honest opinion. Were those changes done?

_____________________________



"Alas poor Yorick,I knew him Horatio"

#1 Quote of the Harpoon Community.

(in reply to Vincenzo_Beretta)
Post #: 15
RE: Harpoon 3 ANW suggestions?? - 8/18/2007 7:48:26 AM   
TonyE


Posts: 1551
Joined: 5/23/2006
From: MN, USA
Status: offline 		Flanker, why does it matter if PDB is compliant?  As we've all seen, the AGSI backed databases may be compliant but they sure don't work as they should.  So if PDB is compliant and works how it should (and has game bug workarounds added a couple times per week lately), what's the point?

After reading the wiki page as you suggest, it seems to me PDB is compliant, thanks for the reference



_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to Flankerk)
Post #: 16
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