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I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!!

 
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I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 5:33:11 AM   
Knavey

 

Posts: 3052
Joined: 9/12/2002
From: Valrico, Florida
Status: offline 		YES...the 1 kill in this mission killed one of my aces with 18 kills! And damaged a bunch of my planes to boot! ONE stinkin' bomber! This game is so borked it is not even playable!

Why do we even bother????

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 05/22/42

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Akyab, at 30,29

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 5

Allied aircraft
Blenheim I x 1

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ib Oscar: 1 destroyed, 3 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
Blenheim I: 1 damaged


Aircraft Attacking:
1 x Blenheim I bombing at 1000 feet

< Message edited by Knavey -- 8/15/2007 5:38:36 AM >

_____________________________

x-Nuc twidget
CVN-71
USN 87-93
"Going slow in the fast direction"
Post #: 1
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 5:48:10 AM   
TIMJOT

 

Posts: 1822
Joined: 4/30/2001
Status: offline 		Yes, yes Knavey, Major Takeo Kato the IJAAF first great ace was shot down and killed, by a Blenheim turret gunner Sgt. Jock McLuckie "an appropriate name if I ever heard one". He subsequently damaged and drove off 3 other attackers. The fact that the Blenheim was wave hoping didnt allow for much manuvering by the attackers, I believe.

(in reply to Knavey)
Post #: 2
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 7:37:42 AM   
wild_Willie2


Posts: 2934
Joined: 10/8/2004
From: Arnhem (holland) yes a bridge to far...
Status: offline 		What's the problem... ?

Unarmoured and undergunned fighters going after a (fast)bomber and one gets shot down by a dorsal gunner ?

Murphy's law.....



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In vinum illic est sapientia , in matera illic est vires , in aqua illic es bacteria.

In wine there is wisdom, in beer there is strength, in water there are bacteria.

(in reply to TIMJOT)
Post #: 3
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 8:30:45 AM   
Williamb

 

Posts: 594
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Dayton Ohio
Status: offline 		http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/14/europe/EU-GEN-Italy-WWII-Ace.php

Group finds remains of German WWII ace shot down over Italy
The Associated PressPublished: August 14, 2007


ROME: Italian volunteers located the plane of a German ace shot down during World War II as well as the pilot's remains, including the dog tag and good luck charms he carried into combat, they said Tuesday.

The volunteers found the plane flown by Flight Sgt. Maximilian Volke — a Munich-born pilot credited with shooting down 37 enemy planes — near the site of the German defensive line that witnessed months of bloody battles as the Allies fought to liberate northern Italy.

The dig yielded artifacts including the plane's engine and the pilot's radio microphone, as well as a wallet with money, documents and images of the Virgin Mary and an African elephant.

"He probably carried the images for good luck," Venieri told The Associated Press in a telephone interview. "The positive identification came from the dog tag we found in his pocket."

Volke, a veteran of campaigns in Russia and Africa, was 29 when he took off from a northern Italian air base on Sept. 5, 1944, with three other fighters to intercept a group of nine American B-25 bombers. He was shot down by gunners in one of the U.S. planes, Venieri said, citing witness accounts and the bomber squadron's logs.


< Message edited by William Amos -- 8/15/2007 8:31:32 AM >

_____________________________


(in reply to Knavey)
Post #: 4
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 10:40:03 AM   
TheElf


Posts: 3870
Joined: 5/14/2003
From: Pax River, MD
Status: offline 		don't give up...there is still hope.

_____________________________

IN PERPETUUM SINGULARIS SEDES



(in reply to Knavey)
Post #: 5
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 11:16:47 AM   
pauk


Posts: 4162
Joined: 10/21/2001
From: Zagreb,Croatia
Status: offline

oh, he got you guys, once again!

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Post #: 6
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 12:22:33 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		Aside from the very first poster to respond, methinks.

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to pauk)
Post #: 7
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 12:38:25 PM   
Apollo11


Posts: 24082
Joined: 6/7/2001
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Status: offline 		Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: William Amos

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/14/europe/EU-GEN-Italy-WWII-Ace.php

Group finds remains of German WWII ace shot down over Italy
The Associated PressPublished: August 14, 2007


ROME: Italian volunteers located the plane of a German ace shot down during World War II as well as the pilot's remains, including the dog tag and good luck charms he carried into combat, they said Tuesday.

The volunteers found the plane flown by Flight Sgt. Maximilian Volke — a Munich-born pilot credited with shooting down 37 enemy planes — near the site of the German defensive line that witnessed months of bloody battles as the Allies fought to liberate northern Italy.

The dig yielded artifacts including the plane's engine and the pilot's radio microphone, as well as a wallet with money, documents and images of the Virgin Mary and an African elephant.

"He probably carried the images for good luck," Venieri told The Associated Press in a telephone interview. "The positive identification came from the dog tag we found in his pocket."

Volke, a veteran of campaigns in Russia and Africa, was 29 when he took off from a northern Italian air base on Sept. 5, 1944, with three other fighters to intercept a group of nine American B-25 bombers. He was shot down by gunners in one of the U.S. planes, Venieri said, citing witness accounts and the bomber squadron's logs.



Anything can happen (old Slavic proverb: "Even blind chick sometimes finds corn")...


Leo "Apollo11"

_____________________________



Prior Preparation & Planning Prevents Pathetically Poor Performance!

A & B: WitW, WitE, WbtS, GGWaW, GGWaW2-AWD, HttR, CotA, BftB, CF
P: UV, WitP, WitP-AE

(in reply to Williamb)
Post #: 8
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 12:51:32 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		That's Slavic? Didn't know that...

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to Apollo11)
Post #: 9
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 2:07:30 PM   
Apollo11


Posts: 24082
Joined: 6/7/2001
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Status: offline 		Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

That's Slavic? Didn't know that...


You use it as well?

If yes then it's international...


Leo "Apollo11"

_____________________________



Prior Preparation & Planning Prevents Pathetically Poor Performance!

A & B: WitW, WitE, WbtS, GGWaW, GGWaW2-AWD, HttR, CotA, BftB, CF
P: UV, WitP, WitP-AE

(in reply to Terminus)
Post #: 10
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 2:13:01 PM   
m10bob


Posts: 8622
Joined: 11/3/2002
From: Dismal Seepage Indiana
Status: offline 		A law of applied combat science: Bullets are not discriminatory. If you are there, when it is there, you are somewhat diminished. No matter if the plane had a single machine gun, or ten, it is the single almighty bullet in your space which is the determining factor.
Nothing more.


I kinda like the "corn thing" though.


_____________________________




(in reply to Terminus)
Post #: 11
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 2:42:31 PM   
tabpub


Posts: 1019
Joined: 8/10/2003
From: The Greater Chicagoland Area
Status: offline
quote:

Anything can happen (old Slavic proverb: "Even blind chick sometimes finds corn")...


Hehe....

Over here, it's:

"Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in awhile......" or...
"Even a blind pig finds a corncob once in awhile...." or.... well, you get it...

_____________________________

Sing to the tune of "Man on the Flying Trapeze"
..Oh! We fly o'er the treetops with inches to spare,
There's smoke in the cockpit and gray in my hair.
The tracers look fine as a strafin' we go.
But, brother, we're TOO God damn low...

(in reply to Apollo11)
Post #: 12
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 2:54:29 PM   
herwin

 

Posts: 6059
Joined: 5/28/2004
From: Sunderland, UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: m10bob

A law of applied combat science: Bullets are not discriminatory. If you are there, when it is there, you are somewhat diminished. No matter if the plane had a single machine gun, or ten, it is the single almighty bullet in your space which is the determining factor.
Nothing more.


I kinda like the "corn thing" though.



"I'm not worried about the bullet that has my name on it; it's the ones with 'to whom it may concern' that scare me."

_____________________________

Harry Erwin
"For a number to make sense in the game, someone has to calibrate it and program code. There are too many significant numbers that behave non-linearly to expect that. It's just a game. Enjoy it." herwin@btinternet.com

(in reply to m10bob)
Post #: 13
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 3:34:07 PM   
whippleofd

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 12/23/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk



oh, he got you guys, once again!


Ayup. He's good at it. Keeps 'em far enough apart that the old "rant" isn't remembered. This Nuc is good. Brings a tear to my eye everytime with the way it carrys it off.

Whipple

_____________________________

MMCS(SW/AW) 1981-2001
1981 RTC, SD
81-82 NPS, Orlando
82-85 NPTU, Idaho Falls
85-90 USS Truxtun (CGN-35)
90-93 USS George Washington (CVN-73)
93-96 NFAS Orlando
96-01 Navsea-08/Naval Reactors

(in reply to pauk)
Post #: 14
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 4:02:58 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Apollo11

Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

That's Slavic? Didn't know that...


You use it as well?

If yes then it's international...


Leo "Apollo11"


Yup! "Even a blind hen can sometimes find corn"...

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to Apollo11)
Post #: 15
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 4:18:53 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		I'm used to it.

I grew up with him.

I still remember the time that he pain-stakingly opened every Oreo in the cookie jar, and added a little Tabasco for seasoning; then waited with anticipation as I unwittingly selected one... 

Lucky for him, Dad wasn't the one to try the Oreos first...

-F-

_____________________________

"It is obvious that you have greatly over-estimated my regard for your opinion." - Me


(in reply to whippleofd)
Post #: 16
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 4:21:50 PM   
pauk


Posts: 4162
Joined: 10/21/2001
From: Zagreb,Croatia
Status: offline


_____________________________


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Post #: 17
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 5:57:03 PM   
Big B

 

Posts: 4870
Joined: 6/1/2005
From: Old Los Angeles pre-1960
Status: offline 		I have to agree...I forgot what he was doing (again) until reading further down...

He is a master at his craft!
quote:

ORIGINAL: Whipple

quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk



oh, he got you guys, once again!


Ayup. He's good at it. Keeps 'em far enough apart that the old "rant" isn't remembered. This Nuc is good. Brings a tear to my eye everytime with the way it carrys it off.

Whipple


(in reply to whippleofd)
Post #: 18
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 6:51:15 PM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline 		Oh ye of short memories. I was going to google for information on that particular combat, except that my PBEM turn arrived just as I was reading Knavey's opening post of this thread. I knew that someone else would find the information while I was playing my turn...

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to Big B)
Post #: 19
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/15/2007 8:20:38 PM   
RevRick


Posts: 2617
Joined: 9/16/2000
From: Thomasville, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Apollo11

Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: William Amos

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/14/europe/EU-GEN-Italy-WWII-Ace.php

Group finds remains of German WWII ace shot down over Italy
The Associated PressPublished: August 14, 2007


ROME: Italian volunteers located the plane of a German ace shot down during World War II as well as the pilot's remains, including the dog tag and good luck charms he carried into combat, they said Tuesday.

The volunteers found the plane flown by Flight Sgt. Maximilian Volke — a Munich-born pilot credited with shooting down 37 enemy planes — near the site of the German defensive line that witnessed months of bloody battles as the Allies fought to liberate northern Italy.

The dig yielded artifacts including the plane's engine and the pilot's radio microphone, as well as a wallet with money, documents and images of the Virgin Mary and an African elephant.

"He probably carried the images for good luck," Venieri told The Associated Press in a telephone interview. "The positive identification came from the dog tag we found in his pocket."

Volke, a veteran of campaigns in Russia and Africa, was 29 when he took off from a northern Italian air base on Sept. 5, 1944, with three other fighters to intercept a group of nine American B-25 bombers. He was shot down by gunners in one of the U.S. planes, Venieri said, citing witness accounts and the bomber squadron's logs.



Anything can happen (old Slavic proverb: "Even blind chick sometimes finds corn")...


Leo "Apollo11"

Naw.. there's a Southern variant of that. "Even a blind hog finds an acorn once in a while!"

_____________________________

"Action springs not from thought, but from a readiness for responsibility.” ― Dietrich Bonhoeffer

(in reply to Apollo11)
Post #: 20
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/16/2007 3:03:28 AM   
BrucePowers


Posts: 12094
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

I'm used to it.

I grew up with him.

I still remember the time that he pain-stakingly opened every Oreo in the cookie jar, and added a little Tabasco for seasoning; then waited with anticipation as I unwittingly selected one... 

Lucky for him, Dad wasn't the one to try the Oreos first...

-F-



(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 21
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/16/2007 3:03:37 AM   
Knavey

 

Posts: 3052
Joined: 9/12/2002
From: Valrico, Florida
Status: offline 		Aw shucks...you guys are too kind...well, everyone except my brother (Feinder).  Need to find something HIGH on the Scoville scale.  As kids, Tabasco was hot...as someone who spent some time in Lousiana, Tabasco is good on dessert!  Meals and practical jokes call for something stronger.  Of course, don't green peppers mess you up Feinder?  I think they rate about a 1 on the scale.

Ok,

Bloody Shambles...again.  Just now wrapping up the second volume and that is where this little battle came from.  The story is about what TIMJOT said.  The Blen was actually hugging the waves which sort of eliminated an attack from below.  Couple that with good gunnery, and luck, and a guardian angel or 3, the Blen managed to get back to its airfield without being hit.  Unfortunately, it had to belly land since it had hydraulic issues which had left a wheel dangling.  The repair was to bounce the wheel off the wavetops, and knock it back into place.  After that, they couldn't put it down and had to belly land. 

The Japanese pilot was a top ace, and intel was so good (or perhaps Japanese radio security was so bad) that the British identified him from the radio traffic and actually sent a congratulatory telegram (I almost wrote email ) to the bomber crew naming the Japanese pilot.

Good job on the knowlege out there, and by the way...stuff like this make our WitP game seem not so unrealistic after all!



< Message edited by Knavey -- 8/16/2007 3:14:09 AM >

_____________________________

x-Nuc twidget
CVN-71
USN 87-93
"Going slow in the fast direction"

(in reply to RevRick)
Post #: 22
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/16/2007 3:12:22 AM   
Knavey

 

Posts: 3052
Joined: 9/12/2002
From: Valrico, Florida
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

Oh ye of short memories. I was going to google for information on that particular combat, except that my PBEM turn arrived just as I was reading Knavey's opening post of this thread. I knew that someone else would find the information while I was playing my turn...


Info to google is getting slimmer and slimmer...you guys are too good. Only a date and a kill number to go on this time! Not too shabby there.

Have to stop doing the ships...too easy. Found a couple more tidbits from the book that will show up in my Trivia series.

Off to finish the last chapter of Bloody Shambles Vol 2. It's actually pretty depressing. Mostly about the guys that did not manage to escape after the last of their planes were gone. Lots of guys ending up trying to escape capture but not being able to.

_____________________________

x-Nuc twidget
CVN-71
USN 87-93
"Going slow in the fast direction"

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 23
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/16/2007 5:25:13 AM   
ctangus


Posts: 2153
Joined: 10/13/2005
From: Boston, Mass.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Whipple

quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk

oh, he got you guys, once again!


Ayup. He's good at it. Keeps 'em far enough apart that the old "rant" isn't remembered. This Nuc is good. Brings a tear to my eye everytime with the way it carrys it off.

Whipple


Oh - I don't know about that. I've seen enough now that any time I see a thread started by Knavey I immediately think he's trying to pull someone's leg. I always find the threads entertaining and often educational, though.

For example - I never thought of doing such a thing to an Oreo cookie. Grand idea...

(in reply to whippleofd)
Post #: 24
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/16/2007 5:44:18 AM   
Knavey

 

Posts: 3052
Joined: 9/12/2002
From: Valrico, Florida
Status: offline 		Scrape off the filling and replace with toothpaste for some pretty funny results also.

_____________________________

x-Nuc twidget
CVN-71
USN 87-93
"Going slow in the fast direction"

(in reply to ctangus)
Post #: 25
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/16/2007 12:48:53 PM   
USSAmerica


Posts: 18715
Joined: 10/28/2002
From: Graham, NC, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavey

Scrape off the filling and replace with toothpaste for some pretty funny results also.



I had someone try to pull that one with me while I was deployed to the Med and IO. Received a big ziploc bag full of Oreos, out of their original packaging, and as soon as I opened the ziploc, I could smell the mint of the toothpaste.

I was actually pissed at the waste of perfectly good Oreos.

_____________________________

Mike

"Good times will set you free" - Jimmy Buffett

"They need more rum punch" - Me


Artwork by The Amazing Dixie

(in reply to Knavey)
Post #: 26
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/16/2007 5:20:23 PM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3611
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: USS America


quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavey

Scrape off the filling and replace with toothpaste for some pretty funny results also.



I had someone try to pull that one with me while I was deployed to the Med and IO. Received a big ziploc bag full of Oreos, out of their original packaging, and as soon as I opened the ziploc, I could smell the mint of the toothpaste.

I was actually pissed at the waste of perfectly good Oreos.


I can always depend on these smartaleck Witp players to have me in stitches!

_____________________________

After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

(in reply to USSAmerica)
Post #: 27
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/16/2007 7:26:44 PM   
Coach Z

 

Posts: 576
Joined: 7/31/2007
From: New York
Status: offline 		While I was stationed at Fort Lewis for Officer Trainning a Special Forces Lt from the next barracks/bivouc over gave us a bunch of OREOS...filled with Sour cream!!

_____________________________

ZUCK

(in reply to ilovestrategy)
Post #: 28
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/17/2007 5:11:35 PM   
Joe D.


Posts: 4004
Joined: 8/31/2005
From: Stratford, Connecticut
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavey
YES...the 1 kill in this mission killed one of my aces with 18 kills! And damaged a bunch of my planes to boot! ONE stinkin' bomber! This game is so borked it is not even playable!

Why do we even bother??? ...


Well, at least your imperial ace got it from another aircraft. Look what historically happened to the Red Baron, who probably bought it from an Aussie gunner on the ground w/one lucky shot to the ace's chest; but the Brits wouldn't hear of it, and gave the kill to one of their own airman.


_____________________________

Stratford, Connecticut, U.S.A.

"The Angel of Okinawa"

Home of the Chance-Vought Corsair, F4U
The best fighter-bomber of World War II

(in reply to Knavey)
Post #: 29
RE: I am FINISHED...ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! - 8/17/2007 5:22:47 PM   
Mistmatz

 

Posts: 1399
Joined: 10/16/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavey
YES...the 1 kill in this mission killed one of my aces with 18 kills! And damaged a bunch of my planes to boot! ONE stinkin' bomber! This game is so borked it is not even playable!

Why do we even bother??? ...


Well, at least your imperial ace got it from another aircraft. Look what historically happened to the Red Baron, who probably bought it from an Aussie gunner on the ground w/one lucky shot to the ace's chest; but the Brits wouldn't hear of it, and gave the kill to one of their own airman.




Do you have a source for that Joe D.?

(in reply to Joe D.)
Post #: 30
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