Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter
Anyway, I'll change the way captured food is done.  I'll modify it slightly to 1 per 2 captured but allow captured food to be "used up".  So that captured food won't join the economy, it'll instead be more of a pillaging sort of thing where you exhaust the area of whatever it can supply until its gone.

This will also apply to food that is gained through surrendered territory.

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter

Doesn't your national status screen up above say 1/0 for captured?

The only 8/4 I see is for raw materials

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Its only random when there's fractions. So if you had 8 captured food you would get 2 plus a 2/3 chance of getting a third.

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but it didn't destroy them

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but it hadn't made its way to the CP by the time they collapsed?

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Still doesnt explain why i seem to get 2 every time when its supposedly only 1/3 chance per each

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter

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but it didn't destroy them

In the case of the food hexes Germany gets from the Russian surrender they would produce, as they do now, at a 1:1 ratio.  The only difference is that each food hex will be checked to see if it continues to produce at all as control changes.  Those that don't aren't necessarily destroyed, just representing that captured food won't produce at the same rate as when it was part of the home nation.

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but it hadn't made its way to the CP by the time they collapsed?

But the game doesn't take into account the time to ship food.  So food being produced in the Jul-Aug turn will be available in the Jul-Aug turn, even from the Ukraine.

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ORIGINAL: James Ward

I do see the point he is making.
In the game if Russia surrenders, as it historically did, there is no food problem for Germany. Even before Russia surrenders there is rarely a food problem for Germany.
Historically the German were pretty much starved by the blockade. I don't see how you can put pressure on Germany with a blockade even if the game goes exactly as history.

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That seems needlessly more complex that it is now?

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter

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Still doesnt explain why i seem to get 2 every time when its supposedly only 1/3 chance per each

Food is a 1:3, raw materials are a 1:2.  The reason being, I figured farmers and animals leaving the area would make it harder to get food production going than it would be to extract raw materials.

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He's got Germany with 1, and Austria with 1 - so presumably each has a 1/3rd chance?

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ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work

Sardonic your analysis is simplistic and basically wrong......Germany was already starving before 1918 - have a look at the 2nd link I gave above (its a pdf & takes a while to load tho).  German troops were perhaps slowed as much by eating the good food they found in the trenches as by allied actions in the 1918 offensives!!

The NY times archive has a numbe of articles from early 1918 too about the expectations of the Central Powers in regard to Russia, with rushing food to their civilians being one of the foremost concerns.

the allies had also conscripted from farms - but British cereal and crop production went UP in WW1 as they moved away from meat - they imported that from the USA and the Empire.

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ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work




IMO the current 1/3rd system should be fine.

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter

Joel, not to worry, I'm just putting it out there, it can certainly be modified or dropped.

Anyway, as to a further explanation.  The original rules for things like food are pretty simple.  But the discussion here would suggest that the rules in this area can be made better because some problems with the current system do indeed exist.

What those problems are seems to be that Germany's gains in the east and Balkans can completely solve her food problems when historically we know that wasn't the case.  However, we know that that area did produce enough food in peacetime to keep Germans from starving and that food was certainly shipped back home, but not enough.  The area did not produce as much of a surplus as it could have under peacetime conditions.  Thus the 1/3 rule for captured food hexes. 

So the idea in beta4 is that the conquest of food hexes will actually produce more initial food than it does now (1:1), to represent the fact the existing food can be looted but that once the hex is "exhausted" that food hex is out of the war.

Food hexes that are taken not by conquest but due to border changes after a nation's surrender would be different, they would continue to produce but at 1/2 instead of 1/3.

What this would do is allow for a food shortage to be solved through conquest in the short term but not fix the long term problem.

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter

But who would Germany be getting food from with transports in the North Sea?  Norway is the only possible trading partner there.

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter

Well once you're into the Atlantic there's lots of possible countries to trade with.

As for the blockade it was enforced in the North Sea.  As the Brit, I put the main fleet in the North Sea, that's where the DNs go for example.  If I think there's a chance of any surface raiders getting through I keep a BC and 2 cruisers in the Atlantic (need speed).

I think the German player should find it extremely hazardous to place his transports outside of the Baltic if the Entente player is paying attention.  However, opportunities may possibly occur.  If the Brits are forced to reinforce the Eastern Med and the German DNs get a bit lucky there is a chance to release transports and raiders into the Atlantic.

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter

Well once you're into the Atlantic there's lots of possible countries to trade with.

As for the blockade it was enforced in the North Sea. As the Brit, I put the main fleet in the North Sea, that's where the DNs go for example. If I think there's a chance of any surface raiders getting through I keep a BC and 2 cruisers in the Atlantic (need speed).

I think the German player should find it extremely hazardous to place his transports outside of the Baltic if the Entente player is paying attention. However, opportunities may possibly occur. If the Brits are forced to reinforce the Eastern Med and the German DNs get a bit lucky there is a chance to release transports and raiders into the Atlantic.

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If the Germans manage to get transports into the North Atlantic, but the TE still controls the North Sea, would the Germans still get resources via those transports in the North Atlantic even though the North Sea was still under TE control?

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ORIGINAL: FrankHunter

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If the Germans manage to get transports into the North Atlantic, but the TE still controls the North Sea, would the Germans still get resources via those transports in the North Atlantic even though the North Sea was still under TE control?

Yes, the food would still get through although the transports might not be able to return. I know its a simplistic abstraction.