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Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine

 
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Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/1/2007 11:07:23 AM   
Adraeth


Posts: 400
Joined: 9/24/2007
From: Italy - near Florence
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Despite discussions on previous delay, despite our (the grognards players [really grunting ehh?]), despite our cannibalism on the beautiful AAR made by Ralegh (excellent idea the video)..... Finally we are at the countdown...

so thank you developers and testers who believed in EiANW project.

Just 3 days and i will forge the destiniy of Europe with a Mighty Power (i do not know which one i will pick first )

_____________________________

www.histwar.fr/
---
Periods i like: age of muskets, napoleonics, modern combat.
Post #: 1
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/1/2007 1:23:16 PM   
jamo262


Posts: 82
Joined: 4/21/2003
From: Perth Australia
Status: offline
Now is the waterloo of our discontent made glorious summer!

By this the son of Austerlitz!

(in reply to Adraeth)
Post #: 2
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/1/2007 6:14:25 PM   
cdbeck


Posts: 1374
Joined: 8/16/2005
From: Indiana
Status: offline
I'll be France, come back with a vengeance!

To quote Alan Moore in Swamp Thing,
"I'll shed no tears for those who die unshriven, For they are men, just men. And what are men but Chariots of Wrath, by demons driven?"

There will be blood to pay! Vive la Revolution! Vive l'empereur!

SoM


_____________________________

"Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnoscet!"
(Kill them all. God will know his own.)

-- Arnaud-Armaury, the Albigensian Crusade

(in reply to jamo262)
Post #: 3
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 12:44:26 AM   
sol_invictus


Posts: 1961
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Kentucky
Status: offline
I have not played the boardgame, so maybe I'm completely off the mark here, but I think playing Spain and Turkey will be quite fun. I certainly will not try to tackle France of Britain for my maiden voyage since I don't want to foul up everyone's game and humiliate myself. The only country I absolutely would not want to play is Austria, since it seems that they will be repeatedly thrashed by the French. Prussia might be a bit safer. I guess Russia would be a relatively safe bet for a first game. Oh the choices.

_____________________________

"The fruit of too much liberty is slavery", Cicero

(in reply to cdbeck)
Post #: 4
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 3:03:17 AM   
jamo262


Posts: 82
Joined: 4/21/2003
From: Perth Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald

I have not played the boardgame, so maybe I'm completely off the mark here, but I think playing Spain and Turkey will be quite fun. I certainly will not try to tackle France of Britain for my maiden voyage since I don't want to foul up everyone's game and humiliate myself. The only country I absolutely would not want to play is Austria, since it seems that they will be repeatedly thrashed by the French. Prussia might be a bit safer. I guess Russia would be a relatively safe bet for a first game. Oh the choices.

Let me blather on as my sense of excitment cannot be contained!

I'm my opinion Turkey is fun.

Especially when you pick the right chit and send intruding armies scurrying back to whence they came. The feudal manpower means that- baring disaster- losses can mean nothing as they are recharged automatically each year.

Be sure to garrison Constantinople and a black sea port as a safe haven for your fleet. Sometimes calvary superiority cannot be achieved which is a pity but its always something to aim for. Especially when threatened with an amphibious assault on your capital.

Spain I'm not so sure about. Maybe a guerrilla war is fun but losing fleets is not. They are too hard to rebuild.

Austria is somewhat more resilient than Prussia. It has greater resources, mountains in which to fight and a large hinterland to stall an unconditional peace.

Prussia needs to fight in a combination alliance to survive against Russia or France. Its army is a valuable asset. It has some of the best corp in the game.

Its a great game because when it is time for diplomacy it is all diplomacy. When it is time for war it is all war. And in the end no on wants to see some one get too dominant so when things are going bad there are often allies to help out.

Russia is the second ranked land power. It lurks on the edge of the map-board. I have seen its weight move early against the Turk and Swedes, but often it will support the Prussia and Austria early in the game with its best Corps and for Prussia- a leader.

If France is toppled then all bets are off!

Who is getting to far ahead? Bring them down!

Unfortunately the concept of dominant status is missing from the game. Dominant status functioned to define a set of long term territorial goals for each country. It definitely was an asset to game play as it shaped each players strategic thinking beyond cutting down each tall poppy as it arose. I have, however, no doubt that this game will never die and that in the fullness of time it will be included.




(in reply to sol_invictus)
Post #: 5
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 3:49:51 AM   
Naomi

 

Posts: 654
Joined: 6/21/2005
From: Osaka
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jamo262


Unfortunately the concept of dominant status is missing from the game. Dominant status functioned to define a set of long term territorial goals for each country. It definitely was an asset to game play as it shaped each players strategic thinking beyond cutting down each tall poppy as it arose. I have, however, no doubt that this game will never die and that in the fullness of time it will be included.




Didn't expect it not to be included. What else is missing too?

(in reply to jamo262)
Post #: 6
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 6:36:02 AM   
jnier


Posts: 402
Joined: 2/18/2002
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jamo262
Spain I'm not so sure about. Maybe a guerrilla war is fun but losing fleets is not. They are too hard to rebuild.


Spain is a blast! The trick is to use your fleet as lever, without actually ever committing it to battle. The threat alone, of all those Spanish ships, scares the crap out of both England and France.

(in reply to jamo262)
Post #: 7
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 8:10:41 AM   
yammahoper

 

Posts: 231
Joined: 4/23/2004
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Well, assuming the game plays simular to the table top version;

GB must always stay aware of where all fleets are, especially if they are in striking distance of its homeland with corps ready to go.  GB need only slip up once and Fr, Ru or Sp can land corps.  The forage values in south england and around London are very good, so even severed supply will not have much effect on an army that can land.  It is essential GB garrison all ports, even in Ireland, though it can wait until it gets its first troops to do so (though I never do).  With one corp (and the cav corp), GB can begin to gain some slow conquest of minors, protect his isle and begin to fill the corps.  The money that GB has to offer through trade and the promise of assistance against all things french are her best weapons.  Tu, Pr and Sp are POOR and the $4-9 each eco phase in trade will mean a lot to them (unless Fr is willing to give more).  GB requires solid diplomacy to bring about the defeat of Fr and have a chance to win.  GB should try to bleed the Fr every way it can, and if Fr picks Sp or Tu as an ally, making the Fr give large sums of cash to them to fend off a well funded attack by one of GB allies will serve GB and all of Fr enemies well.

Sp is easiest to play when she picks a side.  The best option to stay nuetral as long as possible is to allow yourself to be bought off, by both Fr and GB is possible by floating up a peace treaty between the two, preferable with twin alliences, thus assuring both sides it shall neither hinder or aid the other, and getting some cash if possible from both.  Just $25 from GB and $15 from Fr will go a long way to fund early conquest of minors.  Sp is always strapped for cash, so do not leave the fleets at sea durring an eco phase, because it will cost $5 per fleet in maintence rather than $1 per fleet if they are in a controlled port.  Be opportunistic.  When Au ends up in war with Tu, ally with one or the other.  Your fleets can deliver corps of your own or the other side quickly much deeper in either nations territory faster than they can march there.  I ofen pick the Au because then I can hammer some extra pp out via fighting turkish fleets (Au has none).  In addition, it is easier to invade Tu than Au.  Either nation will have minors you could use, so negotiate for the Ceeding option in whatever sort of surrender you beat out of them.  Finally, your army is hard and slow to replace, so avoid fights were you are out of cav for support, or one lost battle could wipe out a score of that infantry via cav pursuit.  If GB leaves itself wide open, INVADE.

Fr is the most difficult to play because everyone is after you in one way or another.  You have the biggest and best army.  Use it.  Focus on it.  Fight smart and go for devestating victories that are not brief, but not to drawn out.  The danger is in any length of war that has to many casualties.  The enemy is going to try to drain you as much as possible because you are strong and rich and if they do not, you will overwhelm them.  Stagger your wars with hopefully a few eco phases of peace so you can rebuild.  The real way to knock the Pr out of the game as a threat is to destroy his cav.  Decimate it.  Do not stop fighting the Pr army until the cav is greatly diminished, preferably depleted.  Cav is the most expensive unit in the game and takes a long time to build.  It is also the unit that prevents cav pursuit from destroying infantry after a battle is won (if the game holds true to the original, after losing a battle, one factor lost in the final round must be cav to represent the cav holding the enemy at bay while an orderly retreat is executed.  Cav pursuit is then rolled, and loses come off cav first.  If there is no cav, then 5 militia per unit lost must be removed, OR three infantry/guard).  Fr has many good leaders, so create several armies each under a quality commander.  You can fight on multiple fronts, and when the need comes, those armies via the double move can react in time and space like no other.

Ru.  You are HARD to beat.  You have LOTS of corps, but many are under sized.  Most of your corps do not cav assigned to them so they will need a cav corp in support.  How you decide to build your armys and were you station them will have a ot to do with your success.  You do not NEED any allies, although you cannot afford to anger everyone either, but you can always negotiate from a position of strength.  Everybody will want your aid, but truth is, they have very little to offer.  There are a host of strategies to play the russians, and they have the strength that if one fails, they have time to develop another.  I always liked trying to expand in the med and own part of italy, promising GB that if he will not hinder my growth, he can have sicily and I will take Naples, plus whatever else I can get.  In return I will grow a couple of Russian armies in Italy to go at the Fr with while being able to invade from the north via fleets.  There is a lot to gain with this strategy, as GB will be more than willing to give up the continental minors since GB cannot ever hold them anyway.  The Au and Pr will not like this if they are smart, so beware the ides of march, so to speak.

it is well past my bedtime...

yamma 

< Message edited by yammahoper@yahoo.com -- 12/2/2007 8:12:53 AM >


_____________________________

...nothing is more chaotic than a battle won...

(in reply to jnier)
Post #: 8
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 9:16:59 AM   
timothy_stone

 

Posts: 49
Joined: 5/22/2003
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jnier


quote:

ORIGINAL: jamo262
Spain I'm not so sure about. Maybe a guerrilla war is fun but losing fleets is not. They are too hard to rebuild.


Spain is a blast! The trick is to use your fleet as lever, without actually ever committing it to battle. The threat alone, of all those Spanish ships, scares the crap out of both England and France.


I agree that your fleets are your best bargaining chip, but i differ in the use of it

The Brits are scared of your fleets, so the threat of allying with the FR is a valid one.

Don't imagine that the FR are scared of your fleets (their fleets are already pinned helplessly in port), and FR can trash your nation in a heart-beat. Threatening FR will get you laughed at

SP is an easy bag of p.p.s for france, never forget that.

Use the possibility of allying with FR and lending her your fleets as your bargaining chip to keep FR sweet (e.g. if you attack me, i won't lend you my fleets, but if you leave me alone then at the right time we can jump GB together...) and to keep GB off your back (attack my ships or portugal, and I am FR's ally against you)

(in reply to jnier)
Post #: 9
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 11:53:59 AM   
Adraeth


Posts: 400
Joined: 9/24/2007
From: Italy - near Florence
Status: offline
Well in the boardgame i usually took Russia or Austria and Austria was the Country that allowed me to do my best game ever. I lost to France but only conditional peace, and i annihilated the Turkey (thanksgiving? ) ..... so i think i will start with Austria.

Countdown clock says -2

_____________________________

www.histwar.fr/
---
Periods i like: age of muskets, napoleonics, modern combat.

(in reply to timothy_stone)
Post #: 10
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 6:01:18 PM   
sol_invictus


Posts: 1961
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Kentucky
Status: offline
The thought of playing Austria scares me to no end and Prussia is not much better. I would rather play Turkey or Spain, but this is from someone who has never played the boardgame so my opinion may change. Russia would be my first choice.

_____________________________

"The fruit of too much liberty is slavery", Cicero

(in reply to Adraeth)
Post #: 11
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 9:49:35 PM   
Odysseus

 

Posts: 91
Joined: 11/21/2007
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I'm a big sucker for Russia. Always plays that nation if I can. Of course, I've never really played it that well or succesfully. In fact, I have some pretty spectacular failures behind me...But I don't care - I'm in this for the love of the game and the era more than for my ability to triumph...

(in reply to sol_invictus)
Post #: 12
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/2/2007 10:53:04 PM   
cdbeck


Posts: 1374
Joined: 8/16/2005
From: Indiana
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Odysseus

I'm a big sucker for Russia. Always plays that nation if I can. Of course, I've never really played it that well or succesfully. In fact, I have some pretty spectacular failures behind me...But I don't care - I'm in this for the love of the game and the era more than for my ability to triumph...


LOL, Odysseus! That reminds me of playing the board game version of Diplomacy with all my friends. Whoever got Russia was always like "damn" because they knew they were going to lose, but it was going to take all night and be a long fight!

SoM


_____________________________

"Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnoscet!"
(Kill them all. God will know his own.)

-- Arnaud-Armaury, the Albigensian Crusade

(in reply to Odysseus)
Post #: 13
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 1:43:24 AM   
yammahoper

 

Posts: 231
Joined: 4/23/2004
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Wow. Your post makes me remember my long love of Total Anihalation...hmm, now I see why I always call it T.A. because I cannot spell it.

Anyway, if I do enjoy this game just as much, then I am really gonna love, in a 'I still fire up T.A. every now and then and put up the best fight I can, with a just better than 50-50 chance of winning" kind of way.

yamma

_____________________________

...nothing is more chaotic than a battle won...

(in reply to cdbeck)
Post #: 14
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 1:57:12 AM   
Irish Guards


Posts: 143
Joined: 8/13/2004
Status: offline
Shall and wee shall see ...
Nation ... Just lookin forward to .. well ya know ... EiA Gaming ..
Every Nation can be very aggressive ..
Take a few months to try em all ..... Oh Dear ..
Ireland ...
IrishDragoonGuards

(in reply to yammahoper)
Post #: 15
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 10:08:37 AM   
Adraeth


Posts: 400
Joined: 9/24/2007
From: Italy - near Florence
Status: offline
Gentlemen, take your positions please... my clock says -1...
 


_____________________________

www.histwar.fr/
---
Periods i like: age of muskets, napoleonics, modern combat.

(in reply to Irish Guards)
Post #: 16
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 10:58:17 AM   
Guenter


Posts: 26
Joined: 7/9/2005
From: Vienna, Austria
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Adraeth Montecuccoli

Well in the boardgame i usually took Russia or Austria and Austria was the Country that allowed me to do my best game ever. I lost to France but only conditional peace, and i annihilated the Turkey (thanksgiving? ) ..... so i think i will start with Austria.

Countdown clock says -2


Austria is cool.
Difficult to play, but very interesting and challenging.
I also like to play Russia or Prussia.

(in reply to Adraeth)
Post #: 17
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 11:35:34 AM   
pasternakski


Posts: 6565
Joined: 6/29/2002
Status: offline
On publication, this game will be vilified, eviscerated, and fricasseed to an extent never before done to wildlife. Be ready. It won't be pretty.

I plan to buy and enjoy this game. I congratulate Marshall and all others involved in its development for picking up a failed project and bringing it to successful fruition. While you are basking in the life-destroying radiation of the "this ain't EiA," "This oughtta be B, not A, and should include C," and "It shouldda been this, not that" nuclear explosion that is about to ensue, I salute you.

Even worse than the immolation of your efforts is that Matrix will likely never again (after suffering through the last gasps of the WiF economic debacle) even consider "porting" a boardgame to computer.

*sigh*

_____________________________

Put my faith in the people
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.

(in reply to Guenter)
Post #: 18
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 2:03:02 PM   
captskillet


Posts: 2493
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From: Louisiana & the 2007 Nat Champ LSU Fightin' Tigers
Status: offline
you think it will exceed the WITP frying that has taken place over the years??????

_____________________________

"Git thar fust with the most men" - Gen. Nathan Bedford Forrest


(in reply to pasternakski)
Post #: 19
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 3:12:28 PM   
timothy_stone

 

Posts: 49
Joined: 5/22/2003
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski

On publication, this game will be vilified, eviscerated, and fricasseed to an extent never before done to wildlife. Be ready. It won't be pretty.

I plan to buy and enjoy this game. I congratulate Marshall and all others involved in its development for picking up a failed project and bringing it to successful fruition. While you are basking in the life-destroying radiation of the "this ain't EiA," "This oughtta be B, not A, and should include C," and "It shouldda been this, not that" nuclear explosion that is about to ensue, I salute you.

Even worse than the immolation of your efforts is that Matrix will likely never again (after suffering through the last gasps of the WiF economic debacle) even consider "porting" a boardgame to computer.

*sigh*


I also plan to buy the game (I still play computer 3rd reich for memory's sake) and the pbem component of EiA will make it SO much more playable than 3R.

I'm also thankful that Matrix and Marshall have worked so long and hard on this.

I'm actually a little put disappointed with the beta-testers for not (apparently) noticing (or not pointing out) some rather large flaws that would (even with my limited programming experience) be relatively easy to adjust (for example, the brits not being able to intercept the neutral spanish fleet carrying an invading french army to London).

If not one of the beta testers actually know EiA, then it's not surprising that got overlooked. But to any player with even average EiA experience, that sticks out as a very large problem.

Small things like 'we can't have the kingdom of italy' are unfortunate for those who know and love the game, but not a big deal

changes that make a nation hugely harder to win with (without a corresponding adjustment in the VP-to-win total) are a big deal.

(in reply to pasternakski)
Post #: 20
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 3:30:23 PM   
Monadman


Posts: 2085
Joined: 12/6/2005
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: timothy_stone


quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski

On publication, this game will be vilified, eviscerated, and fricasseed to an extent never before done to wildlife. Be ready. It won't be pretty.

I plan to buy and enjoy this game. I congratulate Marshall and all others involved in its development for picking up a failed project and bringing it to successful fruition. While you are basking in the life-destroying radiation of the "this ain't EiA," "This oughtta be B, not A, and should include C," and "It shouldda been this, not that" nuclear explosion that is about to ensue, I salute you.

Even worse than the immolation of your efforts is that Matrix will likely never again (after suffering through the last gasps of the WiF economic debacle) even consider "porting" a boardgame to computer.

*sigh*


I also plan to buy the game (I still play computer 3rd reich for memory's sake) and the pbem component of EiA will make it SO much more playable than 3R.

I'm also thankful that Matrix and Marshall have worked so long and hard on this.

I'm actually a little put disappointed with the beta-testers for not (apparently) noticing (or not pointing out) some rather large flaws that would (even with my limited programming experience) be relatively easy to adjust (for example, the brits not being able to intercept the neutral spanish fleet carrying an invading french army to London).

If not one of the beta testers actually know EiA, then it's not surprising that got overlooked. But to any player with even average EiA experience, that sticks out as a very large problem.

Small things like 'we can't have the kingdom of italy' are unfortunate for those who know and love the game, but not a big deal

changes that make a nation hugely harder to win with (without a corresponding adjustment in the VP-to-win total) are a big deal.



Careful with your speculations. We knew the score but there was only one man in charge of coding this and short of beating him to a pulp to get it and several hundred other things done, a lot was changed to bring it to where it is today.

Richard


_____________________________


(in reply to timothy_stone)
Post #: 21
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/3/2007 4:15:29 PM   
timothy_stone

 

Posts: 49
Joined: 5/22/2003
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Monadman


quote:

ORIGINAL: timothy_stone


quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski

On publication, this game will be vilified, eviscerated, and fricasseed to an extent never before done to wildlife. Be ready. It won't be pretty.

I plan to buy and enjoy this game. I congratulate Marshall and all others involved in its development for picking up a failed project and bringing it to successful fruition. While you are basking in the life-destroying radiation of the "this ain't EiA," "This oughtta be B, not A, and should include C," and "It shouldda been this, not that" nuclear explosion that is about to ensue, I salute you.

Even worse than the immolation of your efforts is that Matrix will likely never again (after suffering through the last gasps of the WiF economic debacle) even consider "porting" a boardgame to computer.

*sigh*


I also plan to buy the game (I still play computer 3rd reich for memory's sake) and the pbem component of EiA will make it SO much more playable than 3R.

I'm also thankful that Matrix and Marshall have worked so long and hard on this.

I'm actually a little put disappointed with the beta-testers for not (apparently) noticing (or not pointing out) some rather large flaws that would (even with my limited programming experience) be relatively easy to adjust (for example, the brits not being able to intercept the neutral spanish fleet carrying an invading french army to London).

If not one of the beta testers actually know EiA, then it's not surprising that got overlooked. But to any player with even average EiA experience, that sticks out as a very large problem.

Small things like 'we can't have the kingdom of italy' are unfortunate for those who know and love the game, but not a big deal

changes that make a nation hugely harder to win with (without a corresponding adjustment in the VP-to-win total) are a big deal.



Careful with your speculations. We knew the score but there was only one man in charge of coding this and short of beating him to a pulp to get it and several hundred other things done, a lot was changed to bring it to where it is today.

Richard



We all appreciate what Marshall has been able to do, and the fact that there are many subtleties to the game that are difficult to code. We're overjoyed to have the game at last (at all).

We also appreciate the way he has been so responsive to the requests of the community by putting in things like max tactical ratings and the new poly combo's that have been put in.

And yet, it is still my opinion that some items on the to-do list need to take higher priorities than others because they influence the game greatly.

Marshall (not being an EiA grognard) can't be expected to spot subtleties like that.

Since it has such a *massive* affect on the GB player (and since there is already a check-for-corps-onboard routine coded into the interception routines) the effect vs effort ratio of this *particular* instance was high enough that were I a beta tester I would have stressed the need for change very strongly immediately upon seeing it, and continued to stress it until it got addressed. I wish it had been, but it won't stop me from buying the game... : )

Other items (like the minors whose movement stays at 3 even though french) just have so much less of an effect that of course they can be left to later (we hope there will be a later)

If we weren't all so green-eyed jealous of the fact that the beta-testers were chosen instead of us, there would be more cheers for them, no doubt... ;)

(in reply to Monadman)
Post #: 22
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/5/2007 3:51:14 AM   
demonterico


Posts: 292
Joined: 10/16/2002
From: Seattle WA
Status: offline
I love Spain.  My 15mm Spanish army is my favorite, and oh that beautiful big navy. Second largest navy in the game.  Remember it was the British Navy that won the Napoleonic Wars.  (See quote below)  After Oct. 21, 1805 everything the French did was just an exercise in futility.  Throughout history gaining control of the sea has been a prerequisite to gaining the victory in war.  But the Spanish fleet does have an Achilles Heel.  Above Jamo262 said it was too hard to rebuild, but thats not quite right, its impossible to rebuild.



_____________________________

The world has never seen a more impressive demonstration of the influence of sea power upon history. Those far distant, storm-beaten ships, upon which the Grand Army never looked, stood between it and the dominion of the world. -- Alfred Thayer Mahan

(in reply to timothy_stone)
Post #: 23
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/5/2007 4:17:44 AM   
JavaJoe


Posts: 546
Joined: 9/12/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: timothy_stone


quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski

On publication, this game will be vilified, eviscerated, and fricasseed to an extent never before done to wildlife. Be ready. It won't be pretty.

I plan to buy and enjoy this game. I congratulate Marshall and all others involved in its development for picking up a failed project and bringing it to successful fruition. While you are basking in the life-destroying radiation of the "this ain't EiA," "This oughtta be B, not A, and should include C," and "It shouldda been this, not that" nuclear explosion that is about to ensue, I salute you.

Even worse than the immolation of your efforts is that Matrix will likely never again (after suffering through the last gasps of the WiF economic debacle) even consider "porting" a boardgame to computer.

*sigh*


I also plan to buy the game (I still play computer 3rd reich for memory's sake) and the pbem component of EiA will make it SO much more playable than 3R.

I'm also thankful that Matrix and Marshall have worked so long and hard on this.

I'm actually a little put disappointed with the beta-testers for not (apparently) noticing (or not pointing out) some rather large flaws that would (even with my limited programming experience) be relatively easy to adjust (for example, the brits not being able to intercept the neutral spanish fleet carrying an invading french army to London).

If not one of the beta testers actually know EiA, then it's not surprising that got overlooked. But to any player with even average EiA experience, that sticks out as a very large problem.

Small things like 'we can't have the kingdom of italy' are unfortunate for those who know and love the game, but not a big deal

changes that make a nation hugely harder to win with (without a corresponding adjustment in the VP-to-win total) are a big deal.



I am a beta tester and an avid EiA player. I've played this particular version of EiANW for quite some time....years? :) Played EiA for too many years.

Please don't speculate on what the beta testers "overlooked".



_____________________________

Vice President Jersey Association Of Gamers
JerseyGamers.com

(in reply to timothy_stone)
Post #: 24
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/5/2007 4:28:35 AM   
Murat


Posts: 803
Joined: 9/17/2003
From: South Carolina
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JavaJoe

I am a beta tester and an avid EiA player. I've played this particular version of EiANW for quite some time....years? :) Played EiA for too many years.

Please don't speculate on what the beta testers "overlooked".


Do you agree that fixing the attacking a neutral transporter should be fixed at the same time as allowing fleets to be loaned?

(in reply to JavaJoe)
Post #: 25
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/5/2007 4:45:14 AM   
Thresh

 

Posts: 393
Joined: 12/25/2006
From: KCMO
Status: offline
Being a playtester for several other games, I will attest to one thing:

Playtesters are human, and make mistakes. They can and will miss things. It's part of the territory. Otherwise there would be no such thing as patches or second editions etc etc

That said, speculating on game imbalances before actually playing it is pretty....well, lame.

Thresh

That said,
quote:

ORIGINAL: JavaJoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: timothy_stone


quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski

On publication, this game will be vilified, eviscerated, and fricasseed to an extent never before done to wildlife. Be ready. It won't be pretty.

I plan to buy and enjoy this game. I congratulate Marshall and all others involved in its development for picking up a failed project and bringing it to successful fruition. While you are basking in the life-destroying radiation of the "this ain't EiA," "This oughtta be B, not A, and should include C," and "It shouldda been this, not that" nuclear explosion that is about to ensue, I salute you.

Even worse than the immolation of your efforts is that Matrix will likely never again (after suffering through the last gasps of the WiF economic debacle) even consider "porting" a boardgame to computer.

*sigh*


I also plan to buy the game (I still play computer 3rd reich for memory's sake) and the pbem component of EiA will make it SO much more playable than 3R.

I'm also thankful that Matrix and Marshall have worked so long and hard on this.

I'm actually a little put disappointed with the beta-testers for not (apparently) noticing (or not pointing out) some rather large flaws that would (even with my limited programming experience) be relatively easy to adjust (for example, the brits not being able to intercept the neutral spanish fleet carrying an invading french army to London).

If not one of the beta testers actually know EiA, then it's not surprising that got overlooked. But to any player with even average EiA experience, that sticks out as a very large problem.

Small things like 'we can't have the kingdom of italy' are unfortunate for those who know and love the game, but not a big deal

changes that make a nation hugely harder to win with (without a corresponding adjustment in the VP-to-win total) are a big deal.



I am a beta tester and an avid EiA player. I've played this particular version of EiANW for quite some time....years? :) Played EiA for too many years.

Please don't speculate on what the beta testers "overlooked".




(in reply to JavaJoe)
Post #: 26
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/5/2007 6:32:00 AM   
Odysseus

 

Posts: 91
Joined: 11/21/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Son_of_Montfort


quote:

ORIGINAL: Odysseus

I'm a big sucker for Russia. Always plays that nation if I can. Of course, I've never really played it that well or succesfully. In fact, I have some pretty spectacular failures behind me...But I don't care - I'm in this for the love of the game and the era more than for my ability to triumph...


LOL, Odysseus! That reminds me of playing the board game version of Diplomacy with all my friends. Whoever got Russia was always like "damn" because they knew they were going to lose, but it was going to take all night and be a long fight!

SoM



Well, as an example, I believe I might be the only player of Russia in EiA history that succeeded in being at war with ALL the other MPs AT ONCE! I'm particularly proud of that one, though I can't really take credit for it - the first DoW was from the player of Spain . He was a Swedish nationalist and declared before the game even had started that he'd automatically, on principle, DoW anyone who DoWed Sweden - regardless of what nation he played and regardless of the situation on the board. As Russia, I did, because, lo and behold, that's a pretty standard scenario. IIRC some months later, I had joined Austria, Prussia and England vs France and Turkey. They wooped us good. Austria and Prussia got conditional surrenders and where forced into war with Russia - not that they were unwilling after just having lost a war... And then England simply jumped on the bandwagon to get a piece of the cake.

*sigh* those were the days....

(in reply to cdbeck)
Post #: 27
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/5/2007 7:14:10 AM   
timothy_stone

 

Posts: 49
Joined: 5/22/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Thresh

Being a playtester for several other games, I will attest to one thing:

Playtesters are human, and make mistakes. They can and will miss things. It's part of the territory. Otherwise there would be no such thing as patches or second editions etc etc

That said, speculating on game imbalances before actually playing it is pretty....well, lame.

Thresh



Except for the fact that I *have* played the game, just not on the computer interface.
And *because* I have played the game, I Know that the french (or anyone else) getting a free ride to London is unbalancing.

I can understand this without having to actually see the gui and make the moves with my mouse -- the fact that i make them with my mouse or with a cardboard chit does not make it any more or less a very raw deal for Britain.

GB could try to stay at permanent war with FR/SP/RU/TU to avoid armies smiling and waving as they go by the british ships on neutral fleets... but that also upsets the balance.

Not to mention that any one of the above except for turkey could surrender to GB, then carry the french to London, and after the french force GB to surrender carry the russians (then au, pr...)to london (ad nausea). it will never end for GB since there will always be someone at enforced peace with him who can carry his enemies directly to london.

Hopefully, there will be a patch, but until then any game i play in will have to have a house rule about the fleet situation to give britain *any* chance of winning, because once GB starts winning, it's very easy for the rest of the world to force her into a series of surrenders, something that is much much harder to do in the original game.



< Message edited by timothy_stone -- 12/5/2007 7:30:41 AM >

(in reply to Thresh)
Post #: 28
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/5/2007 8:19:51 AM   
Monadman


Posts: 2085
Joined: 12/6/2005
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: timothy_stone

Hopefully, there will be a patch, but until then any game i play in will have to have a house rule about the fleet situation to give britain *any* chance of winning, because once GB starts winning, it's very easy for the rest of the world to force her into a series of surrenders, something that is much much harder to do in the original game.



Actually, the way it was coded, the program would have booted any loaned corps off the island unless Britain had given the borrowing major power access (there is no forcible access in EiANW). That would mean that the borrower would need to con their ally (Britain) into believing that they needed access while at the same time that borrower was also allied to Britain’s enemy with full access to their territory as well (which Britain could clearly detect). So your house rule will have to come equipped with a few players less accustomed to the rules in order for you to come close to pulling the above scenario off (even the AI is not that dumb).

Anyway, we already have a fix in that will allow major powers to attack neutral or allied fleets transporting an enemy corps. It will be a deviation (not following EiA 6.3.1.2 to the letter) but players will be allowed to either intercept (if a standing order is given), or initiate an attack during their naval turn, if there is an enemy corps onboard.

Richard


_____________________________


(in reply to timothy_stone)
Post #: 29
RE: Soon the Sun of Austerlitz will shine - 12/5/2007 8:49:03 AM   
timothy_stone

 

Posts: 49
Joined: 5/22/2003
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Monadman


quote:

ORIGINAL: timothy_stone

Hopefully, there will be a patch, but until then any game i play in will have to have a house rule about the fleet situation to give britain *any* chance of winning, because once GB starts winning, it's very easy for the rest of the world to force her into a series of surrenders, something that is much much harder to do in the original game.



Actually, the way it was coded, the program would have booted any loaned corps off the island unless Britain had given the borrowing major power access (there is no forcible access in EiANW). That would mean that the borrower would need to con their ally (Britain) into believing that they needed access while at the same time that borrower was also allied to Britain’s enemy with full access to their territory as well (which Britain could clearly detect). So your house rule will have to come equipped with a few players less accustomed to the rules in order for you to come close to pulling the above scenario off (even the AI is not that dumb).

Anyway, we already have a fix in that will allow major powers to attack neutral or allied fleets transporting an enemy corps. It will be a deviation (not following EiA 6.3.1.2 to the letter) but players will be allowed to either intercept (if a standing order is given), or initiate an attack during their naval turn, if there is an enemy corps onboard.

Richard



Exellent (on the fleet patch issue). Thank you all very much.

On the corps comment, please let me check if you and I are talking about the same thing.

I am talking about SP (neutral) ships carrying FR (at war with GB) corps to London.
The corps are moving in the SP turn, but they are FR in identity, so are not forcibly accessing, but have access rights normally because they are at war with GB.

Are you saying they *still* would not be allowed to land? Interesting.

what you are saying seems to be in conflict with what previous posters have said (about how loaned corps work, though no one has explicitly talked about invasions)-

the borrowed corps (fr, for example) are at war with GB, and thus can attack GB troops - that has been explicitly stated previously.

Does the fact that they are moving in SP's turn really keep them limited to only moving into lands that *SP* can move into?

i.e. do they act half-french (who they can attack) and half-Spanish (where they can move)?

SO if FR/SP are allied, FR is at war with AU, SP is not ---
FR and SP want to combine move (so FR loans some corps to SP).
in the SP turn, those FR corps could attack AU troops that are in FR lands (since SP can move there)
but NOT attack Au troops in AU land (since SP has no access to Au land)?

Only if the above is true (which is an interesting twist from what i expected) or there is special coding for invasions would the fr be held back from a free ride to London.

If it is true, it is quirky (half sp/fr corps), but I'd much rather have quirky corps on loan than free-invasions-for-everyone.

cheers (and thank you, beta-testers for your patience with me, and for your hard work)
(lucky $%&*$#$%&*&^%$#s....) : )

p.s. how many hours now?

(in reply to Monadman)
Post #: 30
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