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new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/20/2008 8:32:36 AM   
briantopp

 

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From: Toronto
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I've uploaded a new scenario to the games depot - "Fall Blau 1942".

It's a pretty big one covering events on the eastern front from June 29, 1942 to spring 1943. There are more than 1500 units of various types on each side. I'm experimenting with a logistics system that I think works pretty well on its own terms.

Have a look if you're an "easterner" -- feedback welcome.






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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/20/2008 8:39:27 AM   
Silvanski


Posts: 2506
Joined: 1/23/2005
From: Belgium, residing in TX-USA
Status: offline 		I'll surely check it out Brian.
BTW I've still got my "Moscow or Stalingrad" variant of your Operation Blau under development.

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/20/2008 10:20:02 AM   
fulcrum90

 

Posts: 48
Joined: 4/27/2006
From: Madrid, CEE
Status: offline 		Thanks for the scenario, Can someone put the link to download it  please?

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/20/2008 10:31:59 AM   
Silvanski


Posts: 2506
Joined: 1/23/2005
From: Belgium, residing in TX-USA
Status: offline 		That'll be this one but it usually takes a few days for the scenario to appear

http://www.wargamer.com/gamesdepot/

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/20/2008 10:32:42 AM   
Merv0728


Posts: 124
Joined: 6/7/2007
Status: offline 		Which "Games Depot" ?

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/20/2008 2:54:14 PM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Merv0728

Which "Games Depot" ?



the excellent silvanski has the link just above. not sure how long it takes to get a scenario up there. if you'd like it faster bump me your email address and i'll send it across: i'm at briantopp@rogers.com.


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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/20/2008 9:40:07 PM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline 		The scenario is now up on the wargamer.com games depot.

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/21/2008 11:08:40 AM   
Monkeys Brain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: briantopp



I've uploaded a new scenario to the games depot - "Fall Blau 1942".

It's a pretty big one covering events on the eastern front from June 29, 1942 to spring 1943. There are more than 1500 units of various types on each side. I'm experimenting with a logistics system that I think works pretty well on its own terms.

Have a look if you're an "easterner" -- feedback welcome.







Whoa! This can even make me INSTALL TOAW 3

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Post #: 8
RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/21/2008 2:43:17 PM   
Karri

 

Posts: 1137
Joined: 5/24/2006
Status: offline 		Looks interesting.

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/21/2008 4:31:04 PM   
Monkeys Brain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Karri

Looks interesting.


Installed TOAW 3 and patch, scenario looks good even now. Yummy

Looking at Soviet forces makes me go brrrrrr.



Mario

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Post #: 10
RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/21/2008 5:12:24 PM   
Monkeys Brain


Posts: 605
Joined: 10/8/2006
Status: offline 		Anybody played this to finish?
I have played this before long time against PO. and some aborted pbem...

Sadly no AAR's on this superb scenario. (?). Don't know really how much chance Axis player have. Soviet PO can be beaten hehe.(at least in TOAW COW version)

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Post #: 11
RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/21/2008 6:41:41 PM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline 		"Fall Blau 1942" is a brand-new scenario far enough along that I'm looking for a little feedback, just to be a little clearer.

I did one called "Operation Blau", which you might be referring to, awhile ago that deals with roughly the same time period at (if memory serves) 50km-scale.

This scenario is at 5km scale - a much more tactical/operational treatment, new much bigger map, and with some new ideas. Per the notes it can be played against a human opponent or solitaire playing both sides, but not against the PO. all the best bt

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/21/2008 7:08:44 PM   
Monkeys Brain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: briantopp

"Fall Blau 1942" is a brand-new scenario far enough along that I'm looking for a little feedback, just to be a little clearer.

I did one called "Operation Blau", which you might be referring to, awhile ago that deals with roughly the same time period at (if memory serves) 50km-scale.

This scenario is at 5km scale - a much more tactical/operational treatment, new much bigger map, and with some new ideas. Per the notes it can be played against a human opponent or solitaire playing both sides, but not against the PO. all the best bt


Ah, Brian now I see!
I started old game by mistake!

Interesting. There is no Leningrad but there is plenty of Eastern Front on the map

I like it.

Is OOB accurate?

Especially did you considered all changes in OOB that happened?

By memory: 22 inf was converted to luftlande and sent to crete...

Is there GROEDECK brigade for 11th army?
what happened with 22nd panzer and is it included, still didn't checked. But 22nd panzer had some shuffling etc...

Great work BTW!!!


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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/21/2008 9:06:22 PM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline 		thanx mb

The OOB is "reasonably accurate" with a few simplifications and tinkering with placement -- I think. I need to look at the TO&Es again. soviet OOB is a little more "simplified" than the axis especially in the reinforcing armies which clump a year's worth of piecemeal reinforcements into armies to make gameplay a little more straightforward.

I didn't try to follow all the unit and formation changes from june 42 to may 43. that's interesting chrome but doesn't materially change the flow of the game i think.

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 1:58:29 AM   
Monkeys Brain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: briantopp

thanx mb

The OOB is "reasonably accurate" with a few simplifications and tinkering with placement -- I think. I need to look at the TO&Es again. soviet OOB is a little more "simplified" than the axis especially in the reinforcing armies which clump a year's worth of piecemeal reinforcements into armies to make gameplay a little more straightforward.

I didn't try to follow all the unit and formation changes from june 42 to may 43. that's interesting chrome but doesn't materially change the flow of the game i think.


Yes, good scenario but monster

Fuel rules are interesting - I hope that they will not be too boring to play, eh. But strategic situation is interesting and there are many holes to cover for Axis and Soviets. Germans will be hard pressed in the North and Soviets in the South.


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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 2:51:22 AM   
Telumar


Posts: 2236
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: niflheim
Status: offline 		Very interesting supply rules. Looks good. Though there is one thing that irritates me: Why have italian and rumanian units 80% proficiency, just as german units?

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 2:57:07 AM   
Monkeys Brain


Posts: 605
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Status: offline 		ups sorry double post

< Message edited by Monkeys Brain -- 2/22/2008 2:58:39 AM >

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 2:58:03 AM   
Monkeys Brain


Posts: 605
Joined: 10/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Monkeys Brain

quote:

ORIGINAL: Telumar

Very interesting supply rules. Looks good. Though there is one thing that irritates me: Why have italian and rumanian units 80% proficiency, just as german units?


Nice catch... Air units as well have really low proficency (german for example, fighter, maybe it was tested that way?).

There is also a gaping hole south east of Velikie Luky for Germans to plug (with what hehe?) and on some other places (one around Sychevka) but some can argue that Soviets has their holes as well.

Some units are divisions and some are regiments etc... well it must be playtested...

Daniel McBride also toyed with this idea but Brian made this first.

Also, there is no ports - maybe better... Airfields are also somewhere scarce and somewhere in big numbers... there is also no ships in black sea etc...

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 3:04:19 AM   
Monkeys Brain


Posts: 605
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Status: offline 		I see that author consulted ZIEMKE.

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 6:53:16 AM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Monkeys Brain

ups sorry double post


that there is a mistake... needs to go on the corrections list. I'm hiding behind the "beta" label. i need to take a closer look at the classes of units -- for example the LW divisions likely need a lower proficiency; it might make sense to assign different proficiencies to the veteran pz divisions over the new ones etc. thanks for the comment

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 6:55:35 AM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Monkeys Brain

quote:

ORIGINAL: Monkeys Brain

quote:

ORIGINAL: Telumar

Very interesting supply rules. Looks good. Though there is one thing that irritates me: Why have italian and rumanian units 80% proficiency, just as german units?


Nice catch... Air units as well have really low proficency (german for example, fighter, maybe it was tested that way?).

There is also a gaping hole south east of Velikie Luky for Germans to plug (with what hehe?) and on some other places (one around Sychevka) but some can argue that Soviets has their holes as well.

Some units are divisions and some are regiments etc... well it must be playtested...

Daniel McBride also toyed with this idea but Brian made this first.

Also, there is no ports - maybe better... Airfields are also somewhere scarce and somewhere in big numbers... there is also no ships in black sea etc...



air units - another mistake needs correcting.

hole south of VL is correct i think. limit on soviets there is their logistics but a problem for axis as well.

ports likely need to go in after i catch up with the details of the soviet black sea fleet and the german/rumanian naval units active on this front. there are also some volga river flotillas that need looking into.


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Post #: 21
RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 6:58:26 AM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline
quote:


Fuel rules are interesting - I hope that they will not be too boring to play, eh. But strategic situation is interesting and there are many holes to cover for Axis and Soviets. Germans will be hard pressed in the North and Soviets in the South.




you have to be a bit of a logistics nut but i find (having played through the opening turns quite a lot and the whole game a couple of times) that they become quite intuitive and easy once the basic rules concepts have been played through. what's nice about having this is toaw is that the movement arrow can be used to count off the movement points -- on paper you have to count them out manually. The tricky part is planning where to send the limited units and then mourning mistakes.

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Post #: 22
RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 11:29:23 AM   
LLv34_Snefens


Posts: 254
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Aarhus, Denmark
Status: offline 		A quick look on the front-line shows an error in the Staraya Russa area. The town was in German hands until 1944.




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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 2/22/2008 5:37:17 PM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
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From: Toronto
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LLv34_Snefens

A quick look on the front-line shows an error in the Staraya Russa area. The town was in German hands until 1944.





another good one thank you

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Post #: 24
RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 3/24/2008 1:27:23 PM   
Rince


Posts: 3
Joined: 10/11/2003
Status: offline 		Hi there, just to make sure I got the house rule on "fuel" right: the eligibility of units to draw fuel is determined by their NATO symbols and NOT by the "special capabilities" found in the Unit Report, right? 

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 3/25/2008 2:36:39 AM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rince

Hi there, just to make sure I got the house rule on "fuel" right: the eligibility of units to draw fuel is determined by their NATO symbols and NOT by the "special capabilities" found in the Unit Report, right? 


Exactly. the fuel rule is layered on top of the whole TOAW systewm. basically, units in axis panzer and motorised divisions require supply, as do armoured and mechanised units in Soviet armies.

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 3/25/2008 2:37:21 AM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: briantopp


quote:

ORIGINAL: LLv34_Snefens

A quick look on the front-line shows an error in the Staraya Russa area. The town was in German hands until 1944.





another good one thank you


This matter was addressed in the revision currently up btw.

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Post #: 27
RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 3/25/2008 2:57:03 AM   
desert


Posts: 827
Joined: 9/14/2006
Status: offline 		You uploaded the new version already?

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RE: new "Fall Blau" scenario - 3/25/2008 3:49:31 AM   
briantopp

 

Posts: 190
Joined: 8/28/2006
From: Toronto
Status: offline 		the correction to the Staraya Russa control issue is corrected in the version that's been up for a few weeks.

best
bt

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Post #: 29
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