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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [American Civil War] >> Forge of Freedom: The American Civil War 1861-1865 >> question about demoting

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question about demoting - 5/31/2007 7:05:30 AM

ggm

Posts: 139
Joined: 5/26/2007
Status: offline

I was playing the july 1861 scenario and demoted that horrible 4 star general in charge of the army of the west. he disappearred ( resigned I guess). the problem was that I couldn't promote any other generals to four star. has anyone else seen this effect. Is there something I'm missing?

ggm

Post #: 1

RE: question about demoting - 5/31/2007 7:12:36 AM

Gil R.

Posts: 10821
Joined: 4/1/2005
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What's happening is that you cannot have more 4-stars than the number of armies (or 3-stars/corps, 2-stars/divisions), but when that scenario starts there are already more 4-stars than armies. So, you'd have to demote more 4-stars to be able to make a promotion to that rank.

(in reply to ggm)

Post #: 2

RE: question about demoting - 5/31/2007 7:24:36 AM

ggm

Posts: 139
Joined: 5/26/2007
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I forgot about the two 4 stars in the east. thanks for the quick reply.

ggm

(in reply to ggm)

Post #: 3

RE: question about demoting - 5/31/2007 7:56:27 AM

Erik Rutins

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline

Yes, several generals start out at 4 Star level, reflecting their seniority. You have some people to move out of the way before your favorites can climb the ranks. The Military screen includes a new feature now that lists for you the current and max generals at each rank. If you see more current than max at the start of a scenario for a rank (the only time this is possible is if it's setup that way in the scenario), then you know you've got to demote some to make room.

Alternately, building more army containers will create more 4 Star slots. If you don't want to take the hit with their governor, build an extra army container for them and give them a "token" command. Also, a tip is that the least "expensive" way to demote them is to try demoting them down one rank level if you are thinking they might resign. That way, you get the smallest hit with the governor.

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(in reply to ggm)

Post #: 4

RE: question about demoting - 5/30/2008 1:04:28 AM

Fallshcirmjaeger

Posts: 9
Joined: 5/21/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Alternately, building more army containers will create more 4 Star slots.

Hmmm...this is not what the manual says.

Rule A.10.5 - Promoting and Demoting Generals - pg. 180
"The number of Academy developments that a player has determines the number of each rank of generals a player can support."
~ 5 Stars = 1 if the player has at least 10 Academies, otherwise 0.
~ 4 Stars = # Academies / 4, but at least 1.
~ 3 Stars = # Academies / 2, but at least 2.
~ 2 Stars = # Academies / 1, but at least 4.

This is a bit confusing since in the Standard Campaign the USA begins with three 4 Star generals (Halleck, Butler & Mac) but only 2 academies. Then a fourth 4 Star is promoted on the first turn. According the above chart the USA can only support one 4 Star general, yet, on turn two, they have four. Is this because there are four Army cans on the board?

The same for 3 Star generals. They begin with three (Buell, Hunter & Banks) yet can only "support" one. Odd. This may be because the USA begins with only a single Corps can (Buell)?

Perhaps "support" means something else? Is there another rule regarding this that I have overlooked?

At any rate, if what Erik states is true, then to get more 2, 3 and 4 Star generals all one needs to do is recruit the appropriate cans. If this is the case then I foresee the rapid construction of a barracks or two!

I definitely intend to find out!

~ "Regulators! Mount up and skin out!"

(in reply to Erik Rutins)

Post #: 5

RE: question about demoting - 5/30/2008 2:30:08 AM

Ironclad

Posts: 1924
Joined: 11/22/2006
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That is because the use of academies was changed in a later patch so that now they are solely used for training staffs (this occurs in the two May turns each year) except for their ability to create a 5 star command vacancy when 6 academies are built. This was because it made more sense to match the number of command vacancies to the number of armies, corps and divisions on the board with the exception of the over staffing situation permitted at the start of some scenarios. So a new division creates another 2 star slot, a new corps another 3 star slot and a new army another 4 star slot.

(in reply to Fallshcirmjaeger)

Post #: 6

RE: question about demoting - 5/30/2008 4:33:21 AM

Gil R.

Posts: 10821
Joined: 4/1/2005
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oldSundown,
You've just committed one of the most common rookie errors -- not reading the patch documentation to see how things have changed since the initial release. The good news for you is that the document isn't nearly as long as that manual that you've read twice...

(in reply to Ironclad)

Post #: 7

RE: question about demoting - 5/30/2008 6:42:07 PM

Fallshcirmjaeger

Posts: 9
Joined: 5/21/2008
Status: offline

Please dont lower my Command Rating!

I've read the patch changes, I just have read the manual since then, so the wrong info was in my mind at the time. It's all good and no one got killed.

The end reuslt was that Butler got demoted and then resigned, much to the chagrin of the good people of Massachusetts. These are the tough choices the CiC must make in these challenging times, and lets face it, Gen. Butler was more of a hazard to the troops than the enemy!

~ "On the other hand, you have different fingers."

(in reply to Gil R.)

Post #: 8

RE: question about demoting - 5/30/2008 11:01:02 PM

GShock

Posts: 1245
Joined: 12/9/2007
From: San Francisco, CA - USA
Status: offline

Sundown that depends on Butler's stats which, if randomized, could be good.

This policy with patches listing changes that players often forget to check probably should change. When DEVs publish patches, if the list of changes is too hard to implement in the manual, the patch should come equipped with a new manual that replaces the old one and which carries in its appendix the changelist. This way all players got the same manual.

Another thing to be added, is the automatic opening of the changelog.txt at the end of the installation. Generally, the player will have a look before closing the .txt and that's more than enough to tell him "hey i got a file to check!" when they see something not working as the manual says.

(in reply to Fallshcirmjaeger)

Post #: 9

RE: question about demoting - 5/30/2008 11:38:44 PM

Fallshcirmjaeger

Posts: 9
Joined: 5/21/2008
Status: offline

Since I am still an untested nugget with the game I felt it would be better to play without randomized stats or start dates. A few less things to deal with as I learn the art of command and control. In the future I may randomize those things to add uncertainty and some flavor to the nail biting, but for the present it is a slight relief to at least have some knowledge and expectation of my (and my enemy's) officer's abilities and capabilities.

~ "The truth is what you believe."

(in reply to GShock)

Post #: 10

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