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RE: First Impressions? - 6/12/2008 10:43:35 PM

Crimguy
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I did get a CTD on my first outing. Started as CSA and it occurred during the AI's 1st turn as the US. I think I was resizing the window during their move. Running Vista HomePro SP1, 2GB ram.

I'll disregard until I see something more palpable. Vista . . . what was I thinking?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Just FYI, we couldn't duplicate this on our Vista test system at all, the game is solid as a rock. If this happens to you again, please post in the support sub-forum with a DxDiag file. Thanks!

(in reply to Erik Rutins)

Post #: 31

RE: First Impressions? - 6/12/2008 11:18:44 PM

rroberson
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Crimguy

I did get a CTD on my first outing. Started as CSA and it occurred during the AI's 1st turn as the US. I think I was resizing the window during their move. Running Vista HomePro SP1, 2GB ram.

I'll disregard until I see something more palpable. Vista . . . what was I thinking?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Just FYI, we couldn't duplicate this on our Vista test system at all, the game is solid as a rock. If this happens to you again, please post in the support sub-forum with a DxDiag file. Thanks!

Meh I see lots of vista bashing, and frankly it hasnt really caused me much trouble. If you go in and turn everything off...you can kill the resource hog...

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Post #: 32

RE: First Impressions? - 6/12/2008 11:51:19 PM

Crimguy
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I don't bash it, but it hasn't been the greatest for me. Forced upgrade of Office 2000, 5 minute delays by UAC when installing software, and hit or miss performance in games. Overall, it has been more secure and more stable than XP for me.

(in reply to rroberson)

Post #: 33

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 1:15:17 AM

elmo3
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Crimguy

I did get a CTD on my first outing. Started as CSA and it occurred during the AI's 1st turn as the US. I think I was resizing the window during their move. Running Vista HomePro SP1, 2GB ram.

I'll disregard until I see something more palpable. Vista . . . what was I thinking?

I had a crash on turn 1 of the Union AI, but I'm running XP. Did you happen to notice if the Lincoln portrait was missing during the reciting of the Gettysburg address? It was for me. I have been unable to duplicate this one time crash again.

(in reply to Crimguy)

Post #: 34

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 3:33:25 AM

Erik Rutins
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For what it's worth, we haven't seen any issues on Vista on our test systems. It's been running flawlessly for months. However, Vista can be finicky and some Vista hardware drivers (for both graphics and audio) are still bug-filled and unstable. So I can certainly understand why there have been a few Vista issue reports. I would encourage all customers to update to the latest official drivers fairly regularly. If you run into any further issues, please post in our support forum and we'll help you out.

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Post #: 35

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 3:37:53 AM

elmo3
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Yes, sorry for going off topic. My first impression is one of enthusiasm. The game looks more complex than I expected but the 18 video tutorials help clarify a lot of the details.

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Post #: 36

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 5:03:09 AM

tedhealy
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Slightly updated impressions....After struggling a bit with the Union, I started over as the CSA and let the cpu handle my production. This is easily my favorite ACW game now (amonng AACW and several board games). It strikes a good balance between minute details and grand strategy. There's just enough detail to keep you occupied but not so much that my eyes glaze over and turns become a chore. Combat has produced good results so far without any headturning out of whack numbers. Once you understand initiative, the uses of army commanders, and how the reaction phase works, anyone with interest in the ACW should enjoy the game.

Currently I'm in march of 1863 as the CSA. I've stalemated Grant just north of Shiloh and along that line to the east to WV. Unfortunately this was probably at the cost of not being prepared enough in the east. The USA was able to expand from Ft. Monroe into New Bern in late 62. Then in early 63 the AI launched a 2 prong attack into Richmond and into Manassas the same turn thereby dividing my reaction armies in mid Virginia. I probably should have picked to defend one or the other with all my reaction armies but I split them to defend both and won in Richmond but lost in Manassas. I've been able to reinforce the east somewhat and I should hold through 63, but sooner or later I'm going to have to pull troops out of the west or give up defending some coastal areas. I don't think I'll hold too long beyond that, but winning several major engagements in the west was worth it, definite fist pumping moments when you get your first big win. Oh and last but not least, I got screwed in the east too. Just when Lee appeared on the scene and was made army commander, he resigned for 12 months

< Message edited by tedhealy -- 6/13/2008 5:04:28 AM >

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Post #: 37

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 5:36:22 AM

PyleDriver
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Ted, OMG, not Lee tell me it's not so...lol...Better tell Davis to just sign the papers now. In 70 games I never seen him take leave. Thats the beauty of this game, their never the same...Learning as the CSA helps you latter to play as the Union, you'll learn their weak spots...Have you read my S&T guide yet? It will help. Yep I wrote it and happy to say I did. Still can't beat Joel, damn...I lost some key battles in our AAR. The final month is coming, it's Joel's turn to post...Stay tuned for this one...

Jon

(in reply to tedhealy)

Post #: 38

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 6:35:56 AM

tedhealy
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Yeah I know I won't last, but I'm hoping to hold out until the election. I actually have a 300 or so PP lead right now. It's going to be a balancing act as I'm going to have to move forces to the east to hold on to Richmond. I think my 2 biggest mistakes early were in the east I did not have enough cav on hand to scout the enemy for weakness and raid and in the west I gave up too much territory without a fight.

Luckily the AI hasn't landed in NOLA yet. I see them shuffling transports and forces near there and Mobile every turn, but no landing. I have 2 small forces and heavy arty there to react so hopefully I can contain any invasion.

Only my first game, but I'm pretty happy with the AI. It hasn't done anything I would question and it's able to organize it's forces for defense and attack.

S&T guide, yeah read it and it's probably the reason I didn't lose at the end of 61

The USA made a huge push down the Mississippi and I had to rush troops to the area to hold the flood and keep them from going all the way to Atlanta. They got down to Shiloh and nearly all of KY and parts of TN including Chatanooga. I then set up mobile reserves with ACs behind the front lines and reacted to and then pushed back USA assaults. In 62 I was able to push them back further retaking up to Humboldt and parts of KY but there's just too many of them in the area now to push any further. At this point I'm preparing for defense and preping Vicksburg with heavy arty.

(in reply to PyleDriver)

Post #: 39

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 6:56:57 AM

PyleDriver
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Ted, sounds like your learning the game well, fun huh...The CSA can replace an AC quickly unlike the Union. 300 pp's up, you may pull this out. The key is what are the Unions pp's are...

Jon

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Post #: 40

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 1:25:29 PM

tgb
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S&T guide?

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Post #: 41

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 2:58:04 PM

Erik Rutins
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S&T = Strategy & Tactics - we released this to the public, but it's also Section 20 in the manual.

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For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

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(in reply to tgb)

Post #: 42

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 3:28:45 PM

terje439
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hmm I am undetermined as to buy it or not, and as such need help, to best give me that help you will probably need some imput about who I am.

1. I really really like FoF (sure it has some things I would like to see changed but still)
2. I enjoyed alot of Mr. Grigsby's games, however I am no longer sure after World at War, so is this GG at his peak (SP-series imo) or at the WaW-stage? Is he once more brilliant?
3. I like control of my forces, how much control do I really get? Yes, I understand that I do not have the same ammount of control as in FoF, but still...
4. How high replay value does the game have?
5. Is the AI somewhat acceptable? (let's accept it, so far no AI has been good enough in any game

)
6. What is the best aspect of the game?
7. What is the worst aspect of the game?
8. Should I buy it? (note #1!!)

I hope some of you will bother to answer these Qs for me.
Thanks!

(in reply to Erik Rutins)

Post #: 43

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 4:09:56 PM

JudgeDredd
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I have Forge of Freedom and it one of my favourites from Matrix. Very in depth and tactical battles...it's got the lot. This is totally different and, imo, shouldn't be compared to FoF. It stands on it's own as a great game. It's lighter than FoF but without being simple (it's definitely not simple!).

I beta tested for 5 or 6 months and all I can say is this....I did not like GG WaW or AWD. I just didn't like the engine or time frame or the way the game played. But I totally enjoyed testing this game, and that's in beta...when you are more looking for issues than enjoyment. The game was a blast...very good fun.

As I said, that statement is coming from a non WaW fan. I'm not a "beta tester fanboi"...truly, the game is a great game.

Control of units? Not a great deal. You can move your troops from state to state, joining armies and separating them. The key in the game is leadership and assigning leaders. It's absolutely paramount you get this right to get initiative to be able to go on the offensive. You can strategically move units all over the map if you have enough strategic movement in the regions.
Replayability - I'd say pretty high with the options. Random leader ratings? 4 levels of difficulty?
As for the AI, it appeared to me more than capable...always keeping me on my toes.
Best aspect of the game....for me - initiative. It's important and not given to you on a plate. It's been implimented very well
Worst aspect of the game...for me - the lack of tactical battles (one of my loves from FoF)

Should you buy it? I'm not going to say...but I can only say this

I was not a fan of World at War engine - you were
I am a big fan of FoF - so are you

I'd buy it...sup to you?

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 44

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 7:40:09 PM

aztez
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I'am a longterm Witp player and just curious about this game.

How does this compare to the monumental game againts Witp? I know it is a diffrent era etc, etc.
So, it is kind of hard compare these releases.

At the moment I'am waiting for AE edition but just maybe I will buy this product too.

Thank you in advance.

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 7:56:34 PM

Crimguy
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Just having played a bit, I think you might actually have the ability to complete a PBEM in less than 3 years with WBTS.

We're all waiting for AE

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Post #: 46

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 8:14:06 PM

PyleDriver
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Once you get the hang of the game, Union turns take a little over an hour and CSA about 40 mins. So alot depends in PBEM when you opponent sends his turn back. I've had games finish in less than 30 days...

Jon

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Post #: 47

RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 8:57:50 PM

nelmsm1
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The differences between this and WiTP are quite numerous but the most obvious one is that there is a lot less micromanagement with WBTS. Not to say it's a simple game but the complexities are on totally different levels. With one month turns the WTBS games will fly by, especially as you find yourself "doing just one more turn" so you can see what happens. I'm doing a WiTP PBEM of just the first three months of the Southern Campaign and we've been at it for 6 months or better. I did a PBEM of the Civil War up to about September of 1864 in about 3 weeks.

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 10:07:18 PM

therockyfroggy
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Replayability - I'd say pretty high with the options. Random leader ratings? 4 levels of difficulty?

If the game is so focused on leaders and their initiative...than the random leader ratings will be huge with replayability.....after getting used to the game I can see doing random ratings most of the time.

< Message edited by therockyfroggy -- 6/13/2008 10:21:06 PM >

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/13/2008 10:26:18 PM

terje439
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Worst aspect of the game...for me - the lack of tactical battles (one of my loves from FoF)

Thx for a quick reply. This part made the decision easy for me thou

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/14/2008 8:47:19 AM

brisd
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Well I am still in July 1861 with the Union vs. CSA computer. I haven't read the manual thoroughly (like most wargamers) but watched all the tutorials, the 1st turn one was the MOST helpful by far. Took me awhile to get the hang of attaching and detaching units, and I have more than once left clicked when I meant to right click, send troops and leaders to the wrong places. I like the scale, tactical battles would be simply too much IMO. I have American Civil War released by Matrix last year and after a few weeks of playing it found it a waste of time and money. I have never been disappointed by any of Gary's games, from Computer Bismarck(!) to War in Russia to Pacific War to WITP, this seems to be my next time burner

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/14/2008 9:36:52 AM

JudgeDredd
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quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Worst aspect of the game...for me - the lack of tactical battles (one of my loves from FoF)

Thx for a quick reply. This part made the decision easy for me thou

Np.

What I did omit to saying though is although that is the worst aspect of the game, I should've been clear in stating that it was only the worst part of the game because I couldn't think of anything else to say and I was keeping in mind the fact that you like FoF and so I was looking at what you (as I) might find to be the worst feature.

The game does not suffer from not having tactical battles. It's its own take on the ACW and it's a very good, well implemented, refreshing take on the war.

That said, if you want tactical battles in your game, then yes...you would be disappointed if you bought it. But I thought about tactical battles and the lack of when I first started looking at it and there was plenty more to do...I didn't miss them.

It's a nice change from the in-depth management system of FoF.

There is most definitely space on my drive for both.

(in reply to terje439)

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/14/2008 8:44:13 PM

Grouchy
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Ok..my impressions.
The UI is kind of typical for GG, same with the amount of clicking involved. Can't say i like the current unit diplay & ordering system, it doesn't feel intuitive and it's making a complex game even more complex for poor me

The map.....compared to AGEOD's American Civil War the map is rather eeeeuh... grey.
Also scrolling is really slow for me on my Vista system and experienced 3 CTD's.

Combat/battle is rather generetic...missed the feedback during the battles and i have no idea why my troops win or lose.

Learning curve is steep, most of the time that is a good sign. I'm currently still trying to crack the movement & leader system. The gameplay is certainly there but it's certainly 'hard work' for me until now.

< Message edited by Grouchy -- 6/14/2008 8:46:20 PM >

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/14/2008 9:22:30 PM

Bo Rearguard
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I'm liking what I see so far. Some of the game mechanics are familiar from GG's World at War so that helps ease the newness a bit. Oddly, as an American Civil War game it looks a lot more complex in many regards than WaW.

I find the leader's mortality numbers interesting. I see the relatively young Stonewall Jackson has a four while the much older Admiral Farrugut has a one. They must reflect some of these leader's propensity to get themselves in caught the line of fire as well as their age and health.

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/15/2008 12:08:09 AM

Grotius
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My first impression is very positive too. I'm pretty addicted! At first I was a bit overwhelmed, even though I played the heck out of GGWAW and its sequel. The new leadership system in GGWBTS can be a bit overwhelming at first, but I think I "get" it now. You want some leaders to train units; some to build forts; some to serve as theater or army commanders; some to command cavalry, some for infantry, some for navy; etc. The filters in the leadership screen help one figure all that out. There's no research or tech screen here, but that's OK with me given this setting.

I liked FoF and AGEOD's ACW too, and it's interesting to see how the three games all have different strengths. FoF models governors, tactical battles, and research; AGEOD has a neat leadership system and an elegant interface; GGWBTS seems to have the deepest leadership system, and while it uses month-long turns, it still seems plenty detailed. It's been a great year for Civil War fans!

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/15/2008 12:12:35 AM

Titanwarrior89
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Yes its a great year for those of us who are students of the war and a good game.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

My first impression is very positive too. I'm pretty addicted! At first I was a bit overwhelmed, even though I played the heck out of GGWAW and its sequel. The new leadership system in GGWBTS can be a bit overwhelming at first, but I think I "get" it now. You want some leaders to train units; some to build forts; some to serve as theater or army commanders; some to command cavalry, some for infantry, some for navy; etc. The filters in the leadership screen help one figure all that out. There's no research or tech screen here, but that's OK with me given this setting.

I liked FoF and AGEOD's ACW too, and it's interesting to see how the three games all have different strengths. FoF models governors, tactical battles, and research; AGEOD has a neat leadership system and an elegant interface; GGWBTS seems to have the deepest leadership system, and while it uses month-long turns, it still seems plenty detailed. It's been a great year for Civil War fans!

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/15/2008 12:23:53 AM

oldspec4
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Titanwarrior89

Yes its a great year for those of us who are students of the war and a good game.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

Titanwarrior,

See you are from Arkansas. I walked the Wilson's Creek, Pea Ridge, and Prairie Grove battlefields a couple of months ago. Pretty much had each to myself for a day each. I was pleasantly surprised by Prairie Grove. State of Arkansas has done oustanding job there.

(in reply to Titanwarrior89)

Post #: 57

RE: First Impressions? - 6/15/2008 12:28:11 AM

aztez
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Thanks to all who replied to my question.

Just downloaded this game so I will be playing this one sooner than later.

(in reply to oldspec4)

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RE: First Impressions? - 6/15/2008 6:13:27 AM

dthornburg
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Well, just got done getting wiped by the computer in normal mode as the Union. I finally secured MO and most of the border states by '63 but I could not find a way to slow down the CSA production. They were raking in 160+ in production every turn regardless of anything I did with my navy. I guess I will have re-read the manual/tutorial. One thing that I wish was a way to abstract or CPU control the supply aspect. I dislike managing supply. I know that probably runs counter to die-hard turn-based players but I find it an annoyance.

< Message edited by dthornburg -- 6/15/2008 6:20:09 AM >

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Post #: 59