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4.1 OOB bugs here! - 10/2/2000 4:44:00 AM

Voriax

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Greetings all. As the 4.1 is slowly spreading among gamers I thought to make this topic ready..as you surely find something to comment

Why do I start the topic and not one of the Matrix Guru's? Because I've promised to help them by combining the future oob edits and bugfixes. Sort of a middleman. This means if you want something new to the oob's, You'll have to convince me first! Then I'll convince Paul

So when you report bugs & requests remember couple things: 1) Nothing moves (units, formations & weapons) 2) Units & Formations can be added *if* there is space in the oob file. 3) New weapons *might* be added if you convince me that it is needed and that removing one weapon to get this new one in doesn't mess up things. (Now we don't want another Frozen Hell?) I'll probably comment your suggestions now and then...although I have the new oob's I haven't installed the 4.1 yet. I'm testing WB's new campaign and I want to finish it b4 patching

(It's gonna be great campaign, btw) Thanks Voriax

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- 10/2/2000 5:43:00 AM

Paul Vebber

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Thanks for taking on this task Voriax - we are most appreciative. The grreat thing about SP:WaW is that it has truely been a collabrative between Matrix and a great many or you out there. Here's a salute to you and the many many others who have gone "above and beyond" to support SP:WaW! THat said we relaize that there is much to be done to firm up the formations. weapoons and units should be "there" for the most part. Formations (within the limitations of the OOB format) are teh focus of this next effort!

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- 10/2/2000 5:50:00 AM

troopie

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It doesn't seem possible to add units or Formations to the ANZAC OOB even though it seems there is plenty of room. I tried to add KAR units and formations (for battles in Ethiopia and hypothetical Kenya battles) and they never appeared. The odd thing is, I gave up on ANZAC and tried to add them to India, and they worked fine. Also the Filipinos still seem to be officered by Koreans. I will send you a list of non-Hispanic Filipino names if you wish. troopie ------------------ Pamwe Chete

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Post #: 3

- 10/2/2000 6:10:00 AM

Paul Vebber

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UNfortunately we are stuck with the current name lists for now. When an opportunity to fix them crops up I will let you know. If anyone else wants to "join Voriax's Team" please Email me. Several of you asked, but I can't seem to find your email now...my humblest apologies!

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Post #: 4

- 10/2/2000 7:04:00 AM

Kharan

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-JPz's are unbuyable before '44. Maybe the chance is not working properly? -Wrong pictures: British Stuart VI (a truck) British and Canadian 75mm How Bty (Hurricane) 2 German FJ Airborne squads (SPW-251/23) Finnish OT-133 (Il-4) Finnish OT-130 (Il-4) Finnish M.S.406/410 (Hurricane) Finnish 122 H 38 Bty (P-51D) Nationalist China 122 G 38 Bty (P-51D) Russian Yag-6 (messy) Russian ammo carrier (messy) Russian GAZ-4M-AA (messy) A lot of the still missing pictures could be copied from (or linked to) same units' pictures from other countries. -Some equipment lists go off the screen and there's no way of scrolling (British '45). -The brackets in buying screen could display top armor of planes instead of side armor, to indicate ground attack specialists. -Of the Soviet heavies, IS-2 seems still a bit cheap (142 points). T-34/85 costs 150 points, IS-2(M) 171 points and IS-3 215 points. -Pershing's 90/L53 max penetration of 185 seems exaggarated compared to max penetration 150 of the German 88/L56 gun. I would have guessed the longer 88mm to carry more punch than the 90mm, but I'm no expert. Definitely not that much lower. Awesome job fixing the bugs, btw. I don't have anything left to moan&bitch about anymore!

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- 10/2/2000 9:30:00 AM

Paul Vebber

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Yes we will have a formation update available in a month or so...getting them sorted out is quite a job :confused: The difference is an attempt to account for the variety of non-HVAP projectiles available to the Pershing and the fact that many wouold be used in hypothetical "war goes long" or US vs USSR battles. THe sources I have list 110 @ 30 degrees at 500m for an 88L56 while the 90L53 ammo ranged from 120 @ 30 at 500m, to over 130 @30 at 500m, this is an equivalent (using /cos^1.4) 135 @ 500 compared to 153 (using 125) reducing to "0" range brings those up to ~ 150 and 180 I could have done early and late 90mmM3 guns - that may be something the OOB clean up crew may want to do... IS 2 takes a big points hit because it only has 10 AP rounds and a significantly less well sloped front hull than the later models (represented by the 2m. The 2m's improved front slope makes it much more survivable, but still is hampered by its small ammo load.

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Post #: 6

- 10/2/2000 9:30:00 AM

SAMWolf

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In the Lighting Strikes in Norway Scenario, the ammo dumps icons have becomne SPW's. This was not occurring in the 4.0 Version.

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Post #: 7

- 10/2/2000 9:32:00 AM

Redleg

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Here's a couple for the list: 1. Pre-war Philipines still have PzIVs and Schwimmen panzers. 2. Japanese 150mm off-board howitzer has a range of 30 hexes.

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Post #: 8

- 10/2/2000 11:22:00 AM

Wild Bill

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Please don't tell me this, SamWolf! Please. I've been down this road too many times. It's been broken, fixed, broken. ARGH! Okay, I'll take a look at it. I do hope it has not been messed up again. If so, I'll post a remedy. Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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Post #: 9

- 10/2/2000 12:43:00 PM

Wild Bill

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Sam, I was going to send a copy of a file you'll need to correct Lightning Strikes, but your e-mail address does not appear. If you will write me, I'll send it to you. Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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Post #: 10

- 10/2/2000 12:55:00 PM

Wild Bill

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Sorry, Sam. I guess I can't help you with Norway scenario. I don't don't have one of the older versions of the Norway OOB which supports the scenario. Hopefully someone on the team still has it and I can get a copy added into the scenario so you can play it. I know this must be confusing, but what you need is an oob file that has the ammo canister listed. Evidently it was removed in the last builds of the oobs so that is why you are not getting the right unit. Soon as we get it squared away, I'll post a note telling you and put the proper oob in a spot where you can find it. I apologize for the inconvenience. Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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Post #: 11

- 10/2/2000 4:58:00 PM

hnh3_sp

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May or may not be an OOB bug, but aircraft MGs (.50 cal MG at least) make an explosion sound rather than the strafing MG sound.

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Post #: 12

- 10/2/2000 7:12:00 PM

Paul Vebber

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The Norway bug is my fault - wrong template used...it will get fixed!

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Post #: 13

- 10/2/2000 7:14:00 PM

craig77

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Not sure if this goes here....Is it possible for you guys to double the amount of units available to around 500. Also it would be great to have some additional unit classes. Such as... Heavy Inf Gun Bicycle Platoon HQ Mounted Platoon HQ Mounted Squad Motorcycle Platoon HQ Engineer Platoon HQ and at least 2 more engineer squads (German army had two different types...Regt pioneer squads had 1x HQ sqd, 3x squad with LMG and 3x Squad with no LMG. The Divisional Pioneers had 1x HQ Squad and 3x pioneer squads. Each of these divisional pioneers squads had different equipment). Similar situation with the Mounted troops. German's had mounted platoons with at the Division level and some with the Recon BN. They were very different. This does not include the units of the Cavalry Division which was also different. Also need a motorcycle prime mover class, often the Light Grenade launchers and the Medium MG of the Bicycle units road on motorcycles and dismounted when needed. As far as the Infantry guns are concerned, It would be great if you could make a couple howitzer clone classes and call them Light and Heavy Inf gun. That was indirect fire would be possible. Throw in a couple more generic Infantry while you are at it. Also many of these squads had 15 men. Craig

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Post #: 14

- 10/2/2000 7:37:00 PM

Voriax

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Gee, a good start

A number of people will be doing a bit more major changes to some oob's...so I'll most likely use the magical cut & paste to put all remarks that appear here in a one (small?) list and check them only after the larger rewrites are done. Paul: Do I get freebies later on?

Btw I pinched your title idea. Kharan: While I may not be able to do anything to those messy images I try to remember fix the wrong ones, IF the picture exists already. Missing pics are more problematic as non-copyrighted pictures would be needed. Redleg: I think those German units in Phil OOB are meant to be 'scenario specials' only. We gotta decide where to put them...like the train cars in Norwegian OOB. hnh_3sp: Hmm...in the last game I played they sounded fine..what aircraft did you use? If you played a scenario, which one? Voriax ------------------ OOB-Wan Kenobi

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Post #: 15

- 10/2/2000 7:49:00 PM

Charles22

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Hmmm. I must say this latest version has left me the most baffled, though perhaps that's easily remedied. V4.2????? I see the SPWAW News, and it says V4.2. Was this a real quick patch over V4.1? If so, if would understand, because I've had a couple of problems, though probably the same cause, with V4.1, that I've yet to experience with the other versions, though I probably will do some more experimentation down the line. The first problem, is the first time I went into picking a campaign force, while picking the last support unit, the entire computer locked up. I thought perhaps I had another window up, so I gave it another go. I toyed around picking two or three different campaign forces and it didn't reoccur. The second problem is that the FIRST time I replied no to an OP fire prompt (and when you're playing Ruskie with visibility of four against the Finns, you tend to reply, yes) the game locked up (just the game, not the entire computer). That time I definitely didn't have another window up. I haven't played it again since. -------- Oh, I now see we have a V4.3. Phew! Is there any hope the new version will alleviate my problem? The only thing I've different to my computer since the last time I played V4.0, was that I installed Pacific War, but I DID NOT do any of the memory fixes that were mentioned for it, I ran it straight out of Windows 98 SE shortcut. [This message has been edited by Charles22 (edited October 02, 2000).]

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Post #: 16

- 10/2/2000 9:06:00 PM

SAMWolf

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quote:

Originally posted by Wild Bill: Please don't tell me this, SamWolf! Please. I've been down this road too many times. It's been broken, fixed, broken. ARGH! Okay, I'll take a look at it. I do hope it has not been messed up again. If so, I'll post a remedy. Wild Bill

I wasn't complaining, just giving you heads up. I still have the OOB with the corrected data available at home. If you want I can send it to you this evening.

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Post #: 17

- 10/2/2000 10:39:00 PM

Redleg

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Some more OOB problems. Soviet Guards infantry 1943 are messed up. Both leg and motorized. Both companies and platoons. No infantry assigned to these units.

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Post #: 18

- 10/2/2000 11:06:00 PM

Tom Proudfoot

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German rifle companies have ski squads in place of one of the old units (don't remember what they used to be, unfortunately). When you purchase the company, you get three Ski Squads in place of three of the rifle squads. Tom

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Post #: 19

- 10/2/2000 11:20:00 PM

Paul Vebber

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I had fixed that Tom, Somehow the last set of OObs I sent got corrupted and a bunch of old fixed bugs came back...That was supposed to be a ski unit Company - just ignore it for now and use the "other" Rifle company... It will get fixed... [This message has been edited by Paul Vebber (edited October 02, 2000).]

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Post #: 20

- 10/2/2000 11:41:00 PM

Paul Vebber

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This is a classic example of how "being too accurate" causes problems. Someone (may have been me but I don't remeber doing it)apparantly saw that the RPG AT grenade was in the 43 Guards unit and changed the date to reflect when that gear was avaialble and did not back fill the early Guards unit to fill in "the gap" form the begining of 43 to October that that left. One of your biggest challanges, Voriax, is to temper the desire folks have to make dates as exact as possible which doesn't always work because the end dates have to end at the end of a year - not month- because of how the oob data is coded. As you and others work on OObs remember that you often have to make compromises of a couple months here or there to get the "Seamless" OOB's. Blindly entering dates (and I know if I did not do this one I likely made same mistake elsewhere..;( )that may be "right" may end up doing more harm than good!

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Post #: 21

- 10/2/2000 11:57:00 PM

Steel Thunder

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Hi All! Charles said: "The first problem, is the first time I went into picking a campaign force, while picking the last support unit, the entire computer locked up. I thought perhaps I had another window up, so I gave it another go. I toyed around picking two or three different campaign forces and it didn't reoccur." I have the same bug when I try a long campaign playing Germany in 6/41. I bought my core units and then my support group. I bought so many units that the unit list extends to the second page. Then I press 'next'-button to move to the second page and try to delete one of my support units. Then the game freeze. I had to press Ctrl+Alt+Del and choose 'end task'. This bug happened every time when I try to delete support unit. When this happened I had installed 4.1 patch and 4.2 patch over my old 4.0 installation. Then I uninstall my old 4.0 installation and re-install 4.0 and 4.1 and 4.2 patches. However it didn't help, the bug remains. Steel Thunder

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Post #: 22

- 10/3/2000 12:32:00 AM

Tom Proudfoot

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Was this a brand-new campaign or a continuation of a campaign from before 4.1? Tom

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Post #: 23

- 10/3/2000 12:33:00 AM

Charles22

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Steel Thunder: You meany!!! I read all through that post thinking you had the solution. Yes, my units go into a 2nd page, but then they alays have with the prior versions. Yes, I do believe I was deleting the last support unit when it happened. The later campaigns I was messing with, probably didn't involve my ever trying to delete the last support unit and that's why they worked. While that does point out something to avoid, my larger op fire issue is at hand. Tom: All my campaigns were new to V4.1. I've yet to go further in the campaign in 4.1 to see what the 2nd battle would do (I was stymied a bit by the first battle locking up on my responding in the negative to op fire). I have another campaign battle going which today or tommorrow I'll do a deliberate denial on op fire and see what happens. [This message has been edited by Charles22 (edited October 02, 2000).]

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Post #: 24

- 10/3/2000 12:52:00 AM

hnh3_sp

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Voriax: After more testing (in campaigns and battles) it appears that all aircraft MGs use the wrong sound. I guess this isn't an OOB problem.

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Post #: 25

- 10/3/2000 12:56:00 AM

Redleg

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Soviet M/C Company 1943 - the last platoon of this company is a single squad of 30 men instead of 3 squads of 10 men.

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Post #: 26

- 10/3/2000 1:06:00 AM

Redleg

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I think the mg/cannon situation is a wide-spread phenom - I've seen it several times in different oobs. Unfortunately, I didn't write them down. I'll watch some more for this.

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Post #: 27

- 10/3/2000 1:07:00 AM

Wild Bill

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A note to Sam and others. The Norway problem has been temporarilly resolved. Mike Amos fixed the oob. I have attached into the scenario depot download file for the scenario. The corrected oob will eventually be available to everyone but if you need it in the meantime, you can simply

download the scenario from the Game Depot. It has the corrected file. Or you can write me and I will send it to you if you have not yet played the scenario and want to do so. Thanks Paul and Mike. And thanks for offering to send it, Sam. I appreciate very much your calling my attention to this. Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games [This message has been edited by Wild Bill (edited October 02, 2000).]

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Post #: 28

- 10/3/2000 4:17:00 AM

Redleg

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France - Foreign Legion not available prior to 1939.

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Post #: 29

- 10/3/2000 5:45:00 AM

KGzim

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Hello; 90/L52 APCBC 805m/s Pen 120mm@30deg@457m HVAP 1021m/s could do 221mm@30deg@457m The HVAP round for the 90mm was very rare 88/L56 APCBC 773m/s Pen 110mm@30deg@500m APCR 930m/s could do 155mm@30deg@500m KG Zim

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