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RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns

 
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RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 8/29/2008 7:54:34 AM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		Starting with the next turn i´ll not longer show EVERY battle in detail.
Only where the battle was and a grand overview of the losses.
For very important fights i´ll go into detail.
I hope George will do the same to reduce the amount of work per turn a bit.

(in reply to seille)
Post #: 121
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 8/29/2008 9:48:04 AM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		Turn 14: March 9, 1942

When viewing the overview screen, I get this tingling feeling in my neck, telling me I might screwed up last turn.




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(in reply to seille)
Post #: 122
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 8/29/2008 11:25:31 AM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		The Northern half of the front shows some progress in Finland, great progress in the Baltic and virtually no progress in the Center. But AG North was still not receiving any additional reinforcements as I was busy rebuilding the Luftwaffe.

Leningrad was vulnerable now, but still a long distance away. The real problem was the massive Red Army Group in the Center, but I didn't feel I was able to push them away. Not until the coming summer offensive at least...




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 123
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 8/29/2008 11:31:28 AM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		In the Ukraine things are different. The Shock armies were now close to my lines and within range of my air and artillery. It was time to set up the trap I planned so I launched some attacks and maneuvered my outflanking forces further into their side. If next turn would give me good weather and Seille would not retreat too far back, I might just be able to pull of a stunt here.

The Romanians boldness last turn however is gonna cost me. They have to retreat headlong towards the Dniepr, pursued by hordes of Russian infantry supported by tanks and dive-bombers. If they cannot hold them off, I'm in trouble.




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 124
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 8/29/2008 4:42:19 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		turn 14 Russia

First we start as usual with the production and the terrible losses my forces took.
Most of them i lost in the south.






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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 125
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 8/29/2008 4:47:29 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		The overview over the situation.
After the success during the winter my forces are now back in reality....
Actually we have only one plus, our center fighters. But the germans are on a good way
to egalize the disadvantage. I need to keep the air superiority there ! This is a must !!
My only chance to do some damage yet and forcing the german player to send most
of his reenforcement to the center. That will take some pressure from the other fronts.
That´s the plan.....




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(in reply to seille)
Post #: 126
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 8/29/2008 4:50:10 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		The center battles in detail.
Overall i destroyed about 100 infantry, 3 artillery and 4 armor.
Lost about 30 infantry and 4 planes.

Not enough damage....




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(in reply to seille)
Post #: 127
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 8/30/2008 4:52:55 PM   
O.O. Howard

 

Posts: 35
Joined: 3/1/2006
Status: offline 		Sielle and George1972,

Every morning, before reading the news of the day, I check to see what happened here first. Yeah, this AAR is most interesting!



_____________________________

Viva Carlotta!

(in reply to seille)
Post #: 128
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/1/2008 11:51:51 AM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		Turn 15 - March 29, 1942

In late March, the sun suddenly makes its appearance and the ground turns firm again. The replay showed a lot of Russian units appearing on the map, especially in the South. I cannot see the strength of most of them, but just their presence on the map is intimidating.

First, my production:




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(in reply to O.O. Howard)
Post #: 129
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/1/2008 1:05:08 PM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		This turn sees the continuation of my offensive, but at great cost. Although the Wehrmacht inflicts a lot of casualties, it doesn't come out of these battles unscathed. Was I a bit premature to start attacking the Red Army on all fronts at this stage? Should I have waited until the Summer Offensive? I'm not sure. At least I inflicted greater losses than I took, which meant the Red Army could only grow at a slow pace.

Seille's forces where still lacking in supporting weaponry, most of all artillery, which meant that his great mass of infantry was not really able to engage dug in enemies. If I had let the pressure off, he might have rebuilt his artillery arm and gone over to a more offensive posture.

This turn also saw the introduction of a new tactic I tried out. Just before Winter came, I got an R&D breakthrough which I spent almost fully on fortifications. Since I didn't have enough to make a useful upgrade, I saved the rest of it. This allowed me to build fortifications in the Center to lessen the impact of Seille's massive air attacks.

The other use I found for fortifications was in support of mobile forces. As can be seen later on in the Ukraine, I have fewer but stronger units, while Seille prefers more numerous but weaker units. This way he can converge on my strong units if they try to punch through his lines and it more or less forces me to either encircle his units and destroy them before they get dangerous (I hardly ever pulled this off in this match) or let the front coalesce into a linear configuration which would degenerate into a slugging match. Obviously, this last option was undesirable from my point of view.

I came up with the idea of having my engineers move with the most vulnerable forward units and create fortifications for those units at their ending positions. Usually the engineers would be mobile enough to withdraw again after building them. The front-line unit would still be susceptible to concentric counter-attack, but since Seille had little or no artillery in the Ukraine, they would have to storm the fortifications. Even if they succeeded, Russian losses would be much higher. In this way I discouraged counter-attacks, while obtaining spring-boards for the continuation of the offensive in the following turn.

Of course, this tactic requires a lot of PP, and I think I easily spent over 60 PP building fortifications in this match, which could have been used elsewhere. But since I had a production disadvantage, preserving my strength while exacting the highest possible toll on the enemy seemed like a smart move.

The following shot shows the location of newly built fortifications.




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< Message edited by george1972 -- 9/1/2008 1:10:03 PM >

(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 130
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/1/2008 1:45:54 PM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		In the North, all eyes are fixed on Leningrad. In the Center, the stalemate continues, each of us picking of a single unit or so per turn...




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 131
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/1/2008 2:05:35 PM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		In the South, Seille has retreated in front of AG South but is moving towards Dnepropetrovsk in force and I'm running out of units in that sector.

Some attacks were successful, but I also took the liberty of taking Kharkov again (2nd time already), but that attack cost me more casualties than the Russians. But still, less production for Russia is a good thing, right?




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Post #: 132
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/2/2008 5:02:59 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		Russian turn 15

The production:






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< Message edited by seille -- 9/2/2008 5:07:36 PM >

(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 133
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/2/2008 5:15:44 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		The overall situation:

Leningrad is very critical.
The center is stable yet (we have the air superiority)
and the south is mixed.




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(in reply to seille)
Post #: 134
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/2/2008 5:18:04 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		The Leningrad and Center battle reports:




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(in reply to seille)
Post #: 135
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/2/2008 6:13:27 PM   
Manus von Olie


Posts: 70
Joined: 1/2/2008
From: Amsterdam, the Netherlands
Status: offline
quote:

I came up with the idea of having my engineers move with the most vulnerable forward units and create fortifications for those units at their ending positions. Usually the engineers would be mobile enough to withdraw again after building them. The front-line unit would still be susceptible to concentric counter-attack. ... In this way I discouraged counter-attacks, while obtaining spring-boards for the continuation of the offensive in the following turn.

This is also a standard defensive tactic key point: building a fortification right away 'under' vulnerable spearheads!

< Message edited by Manus von Olie -- 9/2/2008 6:23:39 PM >

_____________________________

He! Ho! Let's go! (The Ramones)

(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 136
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/3/2008 8:13:23 AM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		Turn 16 - April 18, 1942

After last turn I thought I had most areas under control, but the losses overview for this turn look catastrophic. My leading edge is melting away as fast as snow melts in the sun. The hit to my air force is the biggest one since the "Winter Mistake".

At the start of my turn my situation looked as follows:


  • The Finns were pretty battered by the latest attacks and would soon have to retreat (again).
  • AG North had not taken a hit since the end of winter and was in pretty good shape. But it had also not gotten any reinforcements since the winter.
  • AG Center just lost its air cover. Offensive operations here were out of the questions until the summer.
  • AG South took a beating to one of its units on its left flank. Looking at the opposition, a stalemate is developing here.
  • AG Romania is being cut to pieces on the Dniepr. Major reinforcements are being sent that way.


The screenshot shows my production, kills and losses...




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(in reply to Manus von Olie)
Post #: 137
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/3/2008 9:40:05 AM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		In the North I suddenly see an opening. Leningrad itself is not heavily defended, so I attempt to take the city with Finnish forces which to my surprise succeeds. AG North closes the gap with the remainder of the Leningrad Front troops and it turns out it still is stronger than its enemy.

However... was Leningrad a trap for my forces or a genuine mistake? Nevertheless, even if I lose Leningrad the next turn, Seille needs at least 2 turns to rebuild it. That means his production takes a hit of at least 10 000 PP in the coming turns. I should be able to benefit from that.




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 138
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/3/2008 10:12:59 AM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		The Southern half of the front sees a lot of action. AG South throws back its opponent's left flank with heavy losses, while withdrawing its own left flank. The Romanians withdraw behind the Dniepr and start receiving large amounts of reinforcements.

The situation here is tense. If Seille would push aggressively towards Kiev with his Shock Armies and transfer his big Fighter group from the Center to Kursk to support it, I think he could outmaneuver AG South or at least deal out some heavy damage before the German bonus turns start. This was my biggest worry at the time.

On the other hand, I find these "mobile battles" the most fun to play, so I was thoroughly enjoying myself at this point in the game




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 139
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/3/2008 10:51:54 AM   
Vic


Posts: 8262
Joined: 5/17/2004
Status: offline 		Guys,

you should really consider sending in this AAR to the Wargamer.com

epic stuff. (and i have a feeling it aint finished yet)

kind regards,
Vic

(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 140
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/3/2008 2:58:28 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		I´m not interested in rewriting it myself Vic. It is too much work.
As it is now i need up to two hours for preparing a single turn.
If a guy from wargamer.com wants to rewrite and make a package from
for posting it there as a article i have no problems with, but i won´t do it myself.

And yes, that AAR is far away from beeing finished. The REAL action will start soon
(at least from my view). Many many turns to go and most of them very bloody.... 

(in reply to Vic)
Post #: 141
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/3/2008 3:07:20 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		Russian turn 16

A very important turn for my russians.
With the fall of Leningrad a real desaster hit us. And the russian command thought
it was pretty safe after the preventive attacks to the finnish forces close to Leningrad.
Unfortunately we hit only the spearhead not the main forces behind....

And this is not the only problem. In the south (especially Kharkov area) we run
out of troops while the germans not only have Kharkov in their hands again they look much (MUCH)
stronger than our troops there. If our plan to cut them off fails we´ll have a hard time to stop their
run to Stalingrad during the summer (bonus) turns.

The center is actually the only stable front...but how long?

Our production:




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(in reply to seille)
Post #: 142
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/3/2008 3:08:48 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		Situation and battles in the north and center:




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(in reply to seille)
Post #: 143
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/3/2008 3:15:51 PM   
seille

 

Posts: 2134
Joined: 6/19/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		The south:
This is really critical. We had to send so many reenforcement to
stabilize Leningrad and the center that we had not enough left for
the south. We´ll have to change this soon or the germans will crush this front.
We simply hope to keep our few stronger units there (siberians mostly) in good shape
as long as possible. If not the front will collapse.
Unfortunately the damn germans have the full air superiority in the south.

Even with a production advantage i can´t have both, strong ground troops and a mighty
air force.....






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< Message edited by seille -- 9/3/2008 3:19:35 PM >

(in reply to seille)
Post #: 144
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/4/2008 7:14:46 PM   
Westheim

 

Posts: 570
Joined: 7/9/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		I agree with Vic - best PT AAR ever! Keep it up, guys. Considering there are "over 60 turns", you could easily be busy until christmas with it.

_____________________________

Don't be scared - I'm almost sure that I just want to play!

(in reply to seille)
Post #: 145
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/7/2008 1:04:39 PM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		Turn 17 - May 8, 1942

The combat reports don't look too good. We suffer great losses to our units, mostly to the Finnish Army. Seille's annihilating air strike North of Vitebsk wipes out 2 good units in a single turn. The good news is, that his air force is still in the Center and hasn't moved North or South and that I get an R&D breakthrough. Now... where do I invest it?

Most of the reinforcements are sent to AG North, including 80 Rifle, 7 Fighter and 3 Artillery. The rest go to AG South and the Romanian AG. Despite the pressure the Romanians are under, I cannot really give them priority.




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< Message edited by george1972 -- 9/7/2008 1:06:03 PM >

(in reply to Westheim)
Post #: 146
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/7/2008 1:46:44 PM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		After the loss of Leningrad, the Finns are out of the war. Their forces are reduced to 20% of their strength and barely capable of defending Finland itself. Luckily for them, AG North is now in position to threaten Leningrad from the West, which will take the Russian attention off the Finns.

I launch a series of attacks mostly aimed at securing good positions for the Summer and trying to take out as much heavy equipment (especially artillery) as possible. The ground attacks are relatively successful but the air attack takes a lot of casualties in Fighters, despite a 2 : 1 advantage. It seems as though the Luftwaffe has lost its edge.

Nevertheless, I do manage to take out a big chunk of artillery and get my strong ground units into position. I estimate Leningrad should fall (again) in about 2 - 3 turns.




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 147
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/7/2008 2:00:22 PM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		In the Ukraine, the situation is serious. From the North there is pressure from a strong Russian army group which includes the Shock Armies. From the South the Stalingrad Front is pushing the Romanians across the Dniepr. I hold Kharkov and the Russian lines towards the East are very thin, but I cannot be everywhere at once.

The Luftwaffe is thrown against the Northern threat, while part of AG South attacks South towards Dnepropetrovsk to relieve pressure on the Romanians. These attacks are relatively painless, but the pressure from the North seems to mount.

The bigger Russian unit count worries me. They can more easily perform concentric attacks or try to swarm my units and cut them off from supply. I have been thinking about splitting up some units, but the readiness hit they take would make them too vulnerable at this moment. I have no quiet "rear area" where I could perform this reorganization.

Despite these worries, I intend to hold the Northern line by using Kharkov and the fortifications West of it as a "pivot". My air force and artillery can strike at units that dare to come close to these lines. And, by now I know Seille a bit better, and his playing style is to execute well-planned and well-supported attacks. Entering into a mobile melee is something he has avoided so far, probably because his units consist mostly of infantry. So the threat of him infiltrating my lines is not very likely at this moment.

Some attacks from this turn:




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 148
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/7/2008 2:33:46 PM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		The situation in the North is shown in the following screenshot. AG North looks to be a in good position, while AG Center remains dug in behind the Berezina river.

The R&D breakthrough I decide not to use right now, instead I will attempt to produce some more and try to get to Fighter III...




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 149
RE: George vs. Seille - A Russia 1941 AAR over 60 turns - 9/7/2008 2:35:58 PM   
george1972

 

Posts: 366
Joined: 6/19/2008
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline 		The Southern overview. On the Crimean front, everything has come to a standstill. Dnepropetrovsk is abandoned despite some successful attacks in that direction. Kharkov seems secure but the pressure on AG South is still strong.




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(in reply to george1972)
Post #: 150
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