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Use of Motorcycle Units - 4/14/2002 12:13:26 AM   
Phil

 

Posts: 64
Joined: 12/12/2000
From: New Iberia, LA, USA
Status: offline 		Since eveyone was so helpful with the Infantry gun question I had, I thought I'd ask about another unit I'm curious about.
The Motorcycle unit
How can I effectively use this one? When I've used them in the past, they don't seem to possess much firepower, so I don't attack with them.
About the only thing I've found them good for is loud recon.

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Post #: 1
- 4/14/2002 12:31:33 AM   
Mojo

 

Posts: 915
Joined: 2/6/2002
From: Portland, Oregon USA
Status: offline 		I don't use them much but when I do they scout and do a little long range harassing. Otherwise they just sit around, drink beer, wrench a little, show off their new tats, burn a twisty and ogle each others ol' ladies:D

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Post #: 2
- 4/14/2002 1:22:29 AM   
Goblin


Posts: 5547
Joined: 3/29/2002
From: Erie,Pa. USA
Status: offline 		While Mojo may be correct for an American MC unit, I have found MC's quite useful. In addition to loud recon, they are unmatched in fast reaction to a crucial situation, making them excellent choices for a reserve or reinforcement element. They are also useful for quickly attacking a flank. Anything that you need done real quick, real cheap, they are good for. With the exception of dealing with armor. Then they go for the six pack....;)

Goblin

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Post #: 3
- 4/14/2002 1:39:48 AM   
Mojo

 

Posts: 915
Joined: 2/6/2002
From: Portland, Oregon USA
Status: offline 		Too true Goblin. Speed on defence is imperative. By harassing I meant hit and run tactics against flanks and softish targets like unprotected on board arty which I like to actively hunt.

Other than the Soviets and the Germans does anybody else have mc troops in their OOB? I can't remember in in the US.

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Post #: 4
- 4/14/2002 3:07:34 AM   
Goblin


Posts: 5547
Joined: 3/29/2002
From: Erie,Pa. USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mojo
[B]Too true Goblin. Speed on defence is imperative. By harassing I meant hit and run tactics against flanks and softish targets like unprotected on board arty which I like to actively hunt.

Other than the Soviets and the Germans does anybody else have mc troops in their OOB? I can't remember in in the US. [/B][/QUOTE]

Japan does, a coupla others might. Bicycle infantry and cavalry are nearly as useful for the stated purposes. Italy and Finland have bicycles for sure.

Can you picture 'Easy Company/ 2nd Batt / Hell's Angels'!?:eek:

Goblin

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Post #: 5
- 4/14/2002 3:13:26 AM   
Mojo

 

Posts: 915
Joined: 2/6/2002
From: Portland, Oregon USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Goblin
[B]

Japan does, a coupla others might. Bicycle infantry and cavalry are nearly as useful for the stated purposes. Italy and Finland have bicycles for sure.

Can you picture 'Easy Company/ 2nd Batt / Hell's Angels'!?:eek:

Goblin [/B][/QUOTE]

That's kinda where I was going. Maybe a Stugis goes to the Ardennes?

No Finns on their freakin mopeds tho, we know how tough they are.:D

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Post #: 6
- 4/14/2002 3:17:35 AM   
Goblin


Posts: 5547
Joined: 3/29/2002
From: Erie,Pa. USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mojo
[B]No Finns on their freakin mopeds tho, we know how tough they are.:D [/B][/QUOTE]

Finnish Moped Assault Squads? I LOVE it. Can they mount an MG on one of those?:rolleyes: :p

Goblin

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Post #: 7
- 4/14/2002 10:26:46 AM   
WhiteRook

 

Posts: 276
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: Minneapolis, MN
Status: offline 		[SIZE=3]Hey another great use I have found for them is for getting into rear areas and nailing enemy arty![/SIZE]

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Post #: 8
- 4/14/2002 10:45:27 AM   
Mojo

 

Posts: 915
Joined: 2/6/2002
From: Portland, Oregon USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by WhiteRook
[B][SIZE=3]Hey another great use I have found for them is for getting into rear areas and nailing enemy arty![/SIZE] [/B][/QUOTE]

I love my Jagerscooten:D

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Post #: 9
Phil - 4/14/2002 11:22:36 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		Don't let these other guys sell the motorcylce unit short. It can be very effective if you have the right type.
First there are generally two types the Motorcyle and the Heavy Motorcyle. The regular generaly only have a LMG, these units I have found to be good for Recon, bait and dealing with on board artilary.
They do not do much damage, but they do not cost much and they go very fast. Now this allows to to expore parts of the map quickly. Also ani-tank guns and tanks on oppertunity fire has there to hit affected by the speed of the unit. Well run that cycle around at 11 hexes and whatch it get shot at 12 times and not take any damage. This give you the opportunity to swing in with other units and do real damage. Lastly if you can get a platoon of them through the enemy lines they are great for hunting artillary.
Now the German Hvy Motorcycle on the other hand that is a fine peice of equipment sporting a Kar 98k Rifle, a 7.92 mm MG34 LMG, and Stielhoander. This unit can do all of the above and is devistating to all soft targets and can assult tanks!
Using motorcycles is a bit difficult, I tend not to use them in assualts or defend situations, but in the all other engagements I tend to buy 2-5 platoons of them.

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Post #: 10
- 4/14/2002 11:58:10 AM   
Mojo

 

Posts: 915
Joined: 2/6/2002
From: Portland, Oregon USA
Status: offline 		I do find them to be superior scouts. I've seen scout cars destroyed by a single arty round or burst of MG. If they even manage to hit the mc squad they are only supressed at worst. I was only half kidding about my Jagerscooten.

If I could just figure how to get an FO or sniper to ride pillion they'd be perfect.

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Post #: 11
- 4/14/2002 12:11:09 PM   
WhiteRook

 

Posts: 276
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: Minneapolis, MN
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mojo
I was only half kidding about my Jagerscooten.

Aww come on - I love that term! Gotta write that one down! :D

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Post #: 12
- 4/17/2002 5:13:27 PM   
FNG


Posts: 514
Joined: 1/3/2002
From: Devizes, UK
Status: offline 		If I'm advancing and need to hurry, I find attaching a platoon of MCs to armour formations and using them as dedicated recon really helps keep your tanks alive. They spot better than armoured car/halftrack recon and have way better survivability, as mentioned earlier in the thread. They can also keep ahead of the armour due to their high speed.

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Post #: 13
- 4/17/2002 7:28:46 PM   
panda124c

 

Posts: 1692
Joined: 5/23/2000
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Punch a hole in the front line then stuff a motorcycle platoon into your enemy's rear to get those rearward victory hexes, hunt down trucks, ammo carriers, artillery. On the defence use the Hvy motocycles as a reaction force. They can also be used to get that MG into the 'proper' position untill the foot sloggers arrive.

Basicly you use them as fast cavalry, or dragoons. Back'em up with a few AC and you have a very dangerous force.

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Post #: 14
- 4/18/2002 1:28:49 AM   
ravensclaw

 

Posts: 15
Joined: 4/17/2002
From: uk
Status: offline 		i'm pretty new to the game but won't mc's take huge casualty's from mg fire if caught in the open due to there high speed and low armour:confused:

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Post #: 15
- 4/18/2002 2:26:51 AM   
Capt. Pixel

 

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline 		Yeah, you definitely don't want to be caught in the open with a MC squad. They're not subject to that 'one-shot, one-kill' of a vehicle, but they can wither fast under infantry and MG fire.

I haven't used MC much, but after reading some of the suggested tactics in this thread, I'm gonna have to give it a try. :)

Any votes on 'Best Motorcycle unit of the war"?

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Post #: 16
- 4/18/2002 2:37:56 AM   
ravensclaw

 

Posts: 15
Joined: 4/17/2002
From: uk
Status: offline 		sorry but i have yet to try mc's in any major capacity in any game as of yet

i've only taken them in long campaigns as a useful way to increse the size of your starting force and had them as a roving reserve to guard against infiltraters para's,waiting for those resorce points with which to convert them to a much needed additional armour element or infantry squad:D

however i have to admit this thread has kinda got me thinking that i may hav overlooked a valuable resorce:)

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Post #: 17
- 4/18/2002 3:56:40 AM   
WhiteRook

 

Posts: 276
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: Minneapolis, MN
Status: offline 		Well I vote for the German heavy ones.
Yes MC's can be a great help when used properly, it just takes some time for the learning curve to settle in if ya know what I mean! :D

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Post #: 18
Ravensclaw - 4/18/2002 9:33:06 PM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by ravensclaw
[B]i'm pretty new to the game but won't mc's take huge casualty's from mg fire if caught in the open due to there high speed and low armour:confused: [/B][/QUOTE]

You are correct that MC's will take infantry out in the open damage versus MG's but two things are a factor here. The to-hit % is affected by tehe speed of the unit and MC units can go extreemly fast so they tend not to get hit even out in the open. The second thing is that they carry a lot of smoke and when caught out in the open can disburse a full feild like a tank.

As far as the best MC unit. It either has to be the German Heavy or the Russian Heavy. Both are very good. The Russian is very difficult to destroy, this from personal experience in MC-LV.

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Post #: 19
- 4/20/2002 6:30:56 PM   
Belisarius


Posts: 4041
Joined: 5/26/2001
From: Gothenburg, Sweden
Status: offline 		I love MC units! (as in Motor cycle, not megacampaign *ahem*)

At least the sidecars - fast as a bat out of h*ll, armed with an MG and difficult to hit. They're useful for anything, short of assaulting tanks and bunkers :D :D

Really, I think it's the speed I appreciate the most. Always there to help infantry squads in need, no matter where they are on the map. Always there to scout in advance. Always there to pin those 203 mm Russian SP's...

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Post #: 20
When I first started playing SP........ - 4/23/2002 2:02:40 PM   
gainiac

 

Posts: 84
Joined: 3/20/2002
From: Bronx, NY
Status: offline 		I used Motorcycles to find minefields.........

vvvvvrrrrrrrroooooooooommmmmmmmmmBOOM!!!!

hehehe.......Kamikaze Engineers.......

Seriously.......they make for an EXCELLENT recon force.....

Marty

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Post #: 21
Re: When I first started playing SP........ - 4/24/2002 1:18:31 AM   
panda124c

 

Posts: 1692
Joined: 5/23/2000
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline 		One problem I see with MC Companies is their lack of any support weapons. The MG units just don't make it, easy to spot, easy to kill. I have found an interesting fix to this problem, replace the MG platoon with a SdKfz 221 platoon, very good fire control, armour, excellent speed (can keep up with the MCs). Also try charging ATGs, and mortars with the MC's, get right next to them and 'empty the magazine' works wonders on these units.

Those British 2lb'er just fold up under this type of attack. :D

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Post #: 22
- 4/24/2002 1:37:40 AM   
Larry Holt

 

Posts: 1969
Joined: 3/31/2000
From: Atlanta, GA 30068
Status: offline 		Historically, in the GE Heer at least, MC units were used to break though an enemy line to allow Armored Cars to get into the enemy rear area for deeper recon. ACs were expected to operate individually (I shudder at the thought of sending one of anything into harms way) or in pairs for up to several days at a time.

In the game I find them useful in a combined arms role with tanks and infantry to eliminate enemy ATGs:

You start with tanks and inf dismounted. You move them forward a few hexes at a time. Mount up the inf and then dismount them to look around every few hexes if needed. The point is to not drive you tanks blindly into a close assault. When ATGs shoot at your tanks, the tanks can't see them to fire back usually. Dismount inf to observe. Move tanks alternately to get the ATGs to keep shooting to disclose their location. Once located and out of shots, the MC units can zoom up to finish them off. A smart opponent will place defending infantry and MGs around the ATGs to defend them from this. If the MCs take this kind of fire, keep moving you tanks up with inf until the enemy units are spotted then shoot at them with tanks.

In this manner the tanks take out enemy heavy weapons that can stop your infantry and the MCs take out ATGs that can stop your tanks.

Combined arms is fun.

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Post #: 23
- 4/24/2002 6:34:00 PM   
robot


Posts: 1438
Joined: 5/9/2000
From: Covington Ky USA
Status: offline 		I use mc in all situations. They are my constabulary. This is mobile calvary to the uninformed or mounted police force however used. I back them up with 221 and 231 plus a sp force squad mech. They are brought in on breakthrus on defense. and a high speed rear area reaction force. Also for wide scale map recon. Evan when hit or surpressed are back in action in 1 or 2 turns. Very elite force. Not too hard to get out of tough situations and with the back up force able to hold there own most of the time. At least till i can bring other troops into play. If you couple this high speed force with paras, there is hell to pay in the backfield.

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Post #: 24
MC's - 4/26/2002 4:11:22 PM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Greetings I always use MC sqds as part of my core force in long campaigns currently I have a platoon of them (Italian) They stay in reserve till after I make the breakthrough and then run into the enemy rear area wiping out mortars and capturing the back VH while the remainder of my force mops up. They only carry rifles and grenades so I don't let them get into firefights with organized enemy units unless one of my mixed platoons is there to support them (I have 3xmixed platoons of 4x13/40 and 4xincursori sqds) What i really like about them is if they get into trouble they retreat a real long way. Just make sure they don't breakdown. If 1 out of 10 MC breaks the whole sqd stops to have a smoke and beer bash while the broke biker gets out his wrenchs. Even worse is they will not change facing while one is down (**** that weed)

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Post #: 25
re: Motorcycles - 5/2/2002 3:35:05 PM   
Stahlhelm

 

Posts: 16
Joined: 1/22/2002
From: Australia
Status: offline 		Motorcyles used to be one of my favourite German units.
Great for racing ahead and grabbing Victory Hexes early in a game or just setting up forward ambushes.
unfortunately the current version seems to treat MC's as if they are vehicles so they cannot enter a building hex.
But this is a unit of guys on bikes, they don't fight from them, they use them as transport.
If cavalry and bicycle units can enter buildings whay not MCs?

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Post #: 26
Re: re: Motorcycles - 5/2/2002 8:53:54 PM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Stahlhelm
[B]Motorcyles used to be one of my favourite German units.
Great for racing ahead and grabbing Victory Hexes early in a game or just setting up forward ambushes.
unfortunately the current version seems to treat MC's as if they are vehicles so they cannot enter a building hex.
But this is a unit of guys on bikes, they don't fight from them, they use them as transport.
If cavalry and bicycle units can enter buildings whay not MCs? [/B][/QUOTE]

If I recall right, original SP I ver. 1.0 or 1.01 had a bug that let motorcycle squads drive through buildings, demolishing them :D .
It gave me an impression of gang of "Hell's Angels" driving through bar front door with their Harleys and demolishing the place :) .
I'm not sure if they should get into buildings in SPWaW, since those bikes are bit hard to stash inside a building...unless it's their "clubhouse" :D

Cheers,

M.S.

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Post #: 27
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