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newbee question - what to produce as CSA ?

 
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newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 10/31/2008 1:26:01 PM   
spruce

 

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Honestly,

what should you be producing when playing CSAA - what does make sense and what not ?

artillery - you need some artillery, but I was guessing if you should invest in production upgrade in GA, VA, AL early war ? Or not ?
heavy artillery - somebody says they get bonuses in fortresses - what kind of bonus ?
cruisers - gunboats - ironclads - I think gunboats might be handy to keep the rivers open ? What do you guys think ?
supply - early game this seems stupid to build in surpluss - but in 1863 and 1864 you'll find out that supplies are in short supply
industry - I think there's a good philosophy about upgrading them - but I' m not sure what to do,

please give your opinon
Post #: 1
RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 10/31/2008 2:18:39 PM   
herwin

 

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From: Sunderland, UK
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quote:

ORIGINAL: spruce

Honestly,

what should you be producing when playing CSAA - what does make sense and what not ?

artillery - you need some artillery, but I was guessing if you should invest in production upgrade in GA, VA, AL early war ? Or not ?
heavy artillery - somebody says they get bonuses in fortresses - what kind of bonus ?
cruisers - gunboats - ironclads - I think gunboats might be handy to keep the rivers open ? What do you guys think ?
supply - early game this seems stupid to build in surpluss - but in 1863 and 1864 you'll find out that supplies are in short supply
industry - I think there's a good philosophy about upgrading them - but I' m not sure what to do,

please give your opinon


heavy artillery--the Union uses heavy artillery to block riverine ports; the Confederacy uses it to defend rivers. I buy a few guns as the Union; I like to have about 20 as the Confederacy.
cruisers--only Union. I buy about 20 to allow me to chase raiders and blockade ports.
gunboats--both sides to protect riverine transports and engage heavy artillery.
ironclads--mostly Union to take on heavy artillery.
supply--I like to build factories on both sides to increase the availability of supply later on. Usually 3-4 for the Confederacy and perhaps 5 or more for the Union.
artillery--brittle. I build it to work with infantry and cavalry in combined arms. YMMV.



_____________________________

Harry Erwin
"For a number to make sense in the game, someone has to calibrate it and program code. There are too many significant numbers that behave non-linearly to expect that. It's just a game. Enjoy it." herwin@btinternet.com

(in reply to spruce)
Post #: 2
RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 10/31/2008 7:35:57 PM   
silber

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin


quote:

ORIGINAL: spruce

Honestly,

what should you be producing when playing CSAA - what does make sense and what not ?

artillery - you need some artillery, but I was guessing if you should invest in production upgrade in GA, VA, AL early war ? Or not ?
heavy artillery - somebody says they get bonuses in fortresses - what kind of bonus ?
cruisers - gunboats - ironclads - I think gunboats might be handy to keep the rivers open ? What do you guys think ?
supply - early game this seems stupid to build in surpluss - but in 1863 and 1864 you'll find out that supplies are in short supply
industry - I think there's a good philosophy about upgrading them - but I' m not sure what to do,

please give your opinon


heavy artillery--the Union uses heavy artillery to block riverine ports; the Confederacy uses it to defend rivers. I buy a few guns as the Union; I like to have about 20 as the Confederacy.
cruisers--only Union. I buy about 20 to allow me to chase raiders and blockade ports.
gunboats--both sides to protect riverine transports and engage heavy artillery.
ironclads--mostly Union to take on heavy artillery.
supply--I like to build factories on both sides to increase the availability of supply later on. Usually 3-4 for the Confederacy and perhaps 5 or more for the Union.
artillery--brittle. I build it to work with infantry and cavalry in combined arms. YMMV.



My thoughts (for the CSA):
Heavy artillery -- don't build them in Richmond. I found that every time one was built, the next turn the union gunboats destroyed it. Build them elsewhere, and then bring them in, under a leader, in a group.
Gunboats -- build just a couple on each major river to block invasions. They aren't worth using against union artillery.
Ironclads -- build one or two in each front. They are good at harrasing blockaders, but are too costly otherwise.
Supply -- build factories. Spread them out, and keep them in the deep South but away from the coast.
Artillery -- I try to build enough artillery to have a 3-1 ratio of infantry to artillery.

(in reply to herwin)
Post #: 3
RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 10/31/2008 11:10:33 PM   
GShock


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The best solution for both sides is to build the right units and use them in the right places.

CSA is at disadvantage with artillery but can capture the USA guns much more easily if USA routs. There are also very few places where CSA can build arty and besides, the main concern of CSA is manpower and that derives from supply production, associated to local manpower and costs depending on PP situation. There can't be a strict rule or suggestion on production, all depends on the situation and this also implies the USA situation (check usa post draft turns where u may expect less surging reinforcements to their lines).

Remember that hvy arty makes its best when stationary and in fort, especially when coupled with a good arty leader these guns do catastrophic damage and if damaged they come back without losing their experience.

I personally tend to build supplies and factories mostly and only once every 2 or 3 turns build occasional artillery. The CSA is a bait and trap job and if you are successful the USA gives you the arty you need...figuring it's more important to build supplies that help recruit more militias than having arty but being outnumbered 3 to 1 by the union soldiers. It's important to have supplies in winter especially, so build guns preferrably in warm seasons so the production slots are available when winter comes.


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(in reply to silber)
Post #: 4
RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/1/2008 6:15:49 PM   
spruce

 

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Gshock, did you say that you can capture Union artillery - that's new to me - how do you see this in the game ?

-------------------------

to all,

Perhaps I should rephrase my thread info and write a few dilemma's for you to answer in your own opinion - when playing CSA.

Diliemma 1 - do you build gunboats to keep the Mississippi open for as long as possible - or do you see gunboats as a sinkhole and invest the production points elsewhere? A closed Mississippi costs you big time - troops can not pass - disruption in transportation network. Remember some states (AR) allow gun boat production and do not allow artillery production - is a gunboat a better investment at the longer term.

Dillemma 2 - do you build factories in VA, GA and AL early game to build more artillery later game - in other words a big investments will yield a higer return on investment later game,

Dillema 3 - in my game the Union advanced on Memphis - do you want to keep the lines open to Nashville where militia are spawned? In my last game I took some risk at opposing and delaying the Union there and I got 4 to 6 extra militia from it. Militia that later would be converted to infantry. It seems the Union AI has set its mind on Memphis and Vicksburg - which makes sense to me. Do you take the risk to draw militia from parts of Kentucky and Tenessee and let the Union come closer to Memphis and Vicksburg ?

Dillema 4 - do you repair infantry - or do you merge them ?

Let me give me answers =

1. I like to build a fairly big gunboat fleet (I had a fleet of 4). When the units gain experience and are commanded by a crack CSA naval commander - they can keep the Mississippi open between Vicksburg and New Orleans.

2. I invest heavely early game in factory production - especially in these states that will build additional artillery later game. Also for repairs - they are much needed.

3. Like I stated I took some risks and had a big corps and 2 divisions in South KY and East TN to profit from Nashville - which I only lost fairly late in the game,

4. I have no idea at all - I do not merge them because it feels "not-economical" - anyhow late game the CSA gets a pile of infantry and a lack of supplies. So I feel I'm on the wrong side here,

please give your opions, please

(in reply to GShock)
Post #: 5
RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/1/2008 7:46:42 PM   
herwin

 

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I merge if I can since it costs less in both supply and population that way.

_____________________________

Harry Erwin
"For a number to make sense in the game, someone has to calibrate it and program code. There are too many significant numbers that behave non-linearly to expect that. It's just a game. Enjoy it." herwin@btinternet.com

(in reply to spruce)
Post #: 6
RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/1/2008 9:56:42 PM   
Bo Rearguard


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On Dilemma One, I usually build a Rebel ironclad or two in New Orleans and then I'll send one of them upstream with a decent admiral. It seems to give the Union gunboats pause even if they substantially outnumber me.

_____________________________

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(in reply to herwin)
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RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/1/2008 10:14:13 PM   
Treefrog


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On CSA ironclads, one of my very crafty opponents (I won't disclose him name in case he wants to do this to YOU) built 2 each at both Memphis and New Orleans, then massed them at Memphis. We had quite the riverine battle there with Union gunboats and shore heavy artillery (in Arkansas) fighting Confederate ironclads and shore heavy artillery (at one point he had 9 in Memphis under Pemberton). The river ran red for months. We had lots of fun; a real memorable vignette in the game.

I haven't played the CSA yet, but see a value in building heavy artillery and/or gunboats to keep the river crossing between railroad regions open at Selma, Alabama. I assume the CSA can build them at Mobile (seems to me in the war they actually built an the CSS Hunley there, then moved it to Virginia).

Speaking of Selma, I assume the lack of a bridge there reflects a change in the gauge of the railroad track at that point. Does anybody know?

_____________________________

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RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/1/2008 10:45:20 PM   
Bo Rearguard


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Treefrog Speaking of Selma, I assume the lack of a bridge there reflects a change in the gauge of the railroad track at that point. Does anybody know?


Historically, there was a big gap in the railroad line between Selma and Montgomery, Alabama which was served instead by steamboat. Is that what you are thinking of?



_____________________________

"They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist ...." Union General John Sedgwick, 1864

(in reply to Treefrog)
Post #: 9
RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/2/2008 11:46:01 AM   
GShock


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From: San Francisco, CA - USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: spruce

Gshock, did you say that you can capture Union artillery - that's new to me - how do you see this in the game ?


Simple: When u see the casualty window, you'll see a (cap) by the number of units in the screen. CSA has an advantage with capturing USA arty.


quote:

Diliemma 1 - do you build gunboats to keep the Mississippi open for as long as possible - or do you see gunboats as a sinkhole and invest the production points elsewhere? A closed Mississippi costs you big time - troops can not pass - disruption in transportation network. Remember some states (AR) allow gun boat production and do not allow artillery production - is a gunboat a better investment at the longer term.


There is no pre-set rule. You might succeed with a strategy or fail just for a quirk of fate with a bad roll here or there (i.e. a dmg rather than destroyed unit, a wounded rather than killed leader, a unit suffering from attrition in a place or another). Too many variables to build a specific rule. The general rule is to adapt to the situation and, with production, this implies producing in advance, large advance what you presume you'll need. The gunboats can NOT keep the mississipi river open. USA will go for the 2 forts by the river mouth as primary target and when one of these is lost and garrisoned with a heavy arty the whole mississipi will be blockaded and ironclads will start pushing towards New Orleans.

Conversely, the USA will also attack from the confluent but in this case each and every heavy arty you place from paducah to vicksburg can sink the USA gunboats. Both defensive strategies must be in place and in both cases the CSA gunboats play their role. It is important to note that if a gunboat is damaged, either at memphis or at new orleans it will be useful again in both support roles.


quote:

Dillemma 2 - do you build factories in VA, GA and AL early game to build more artillery later game - in other words a big investments will yield a higer return on investment later game,


Obviously yes but the point is that a factory means a whole set of supplies lost from production for an entire year. You should balance this loss by building factories in places u foresee u won't lose anytime soon but also...do not build factories all together or you'll run short of supplies. U might have to pause building to repair damaged units but there's no way to keep up in defense without a good number of factories. It's a must, but it's also a must to build factories with moderation.


quote:

Dillema 3 - in my game the Union advanced on Memphis - do you want to keep the lines open to Nashville where militia are spawned?
In my last game I took some risk at opposing and delaying the Union there and I got 4 to 6 extra militia from it. Militia that later would be converted to infantry. It seems the Union AI has set its mind on Memphis and Vicksburg - which makes sense to me. Do you take the risk to draw militia from parts of Kentucky and Tenessee and let the Union come closer to Memphis and Vicksburg ?


Of course, but dont forget perhaps Nashville didnt fall yet because of initiative problems. Maybe the AI has more forces elsewhere committed, you could even surprise it with an attack from Nashville itself. Let the Union come and stretch their lines. Raid their backs and steal more supplies...the more you delay them the better it is but you must protect cities as priority even if it means losing some key territories with rail and roads. Prepare for the bloody assaults and fortify the towns.


quote:

Dillema 4 - do you repair infantry - or do you merge them ?


Depending on the manpower available and presence in area of a good ITR leader there may be occasional choices to keep both infantry and repair them but generally, its better to merge them because it saves manpower and production points; critical for CSA.

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(in reply to spruce)
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RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/2/2008 3:45:03 PM   
John Neal

 

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When using sub-commanders I don't build nearly as many field artillery as otherwise. When using sub-commanders, if you don't have artillery sub-commanders commanding, they frequently get captured if required to retreat. Don't waste supply and personnel on a bunch of artillery that can't be commanded.

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Post #: 11
RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/2/2008 3:54:39 PM   
John Neal

 

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I like to build factories in Richmond and Petersburg. Those should the last places to fall, and you'll need the supply they produce in the late game as the rest of the south falls under Union control.

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RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/2/2008 4:58:14 PM   
Bo Rearguard


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I usually build factories in Charlotte and Fayetteville, NC and Columbia, SC. Those take a long time for the Union to take unless you're really overlooked coastal defence. Atlanta is generally a good spot too.

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"They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist ...." Union General John Sedgwick, 1864

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RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/2/2008 6:58:57 PM   
GShock


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Atlanta is definitely a good spot because of the foundries so with factory u also increase gun output.

However...CSA can't be strong everywhere. All it takes for USA is to attack somewhere and find out it's heavily defended and by wild guess next turn a swift amphibious assault will take away NC/SC towns. I don't consider them safe enough to build a factory there. Such an attack may come anytime and if you defend there you're weak everywhere else...that is, on the frontline borders of KY/VA...but that's my opinion of course.


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RE: newbee question - what to produce as CSA ? - 11/8/2008 5:03:53 AM   
Texican

 

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Well, I tried a different strategy recently and bought a few ironclads (6 for the east and 4 for the Mississippi river). The ones on the Mississippi did okay, but I never concentrated them enough.

The ones on the east coast formed a single battlegroup (5 ships at first, then 6) and owned. They won some fights, got 2 or 3 stars experience, then never looked back. Ran them up and down the Atlantic seaboard, toasting transports.

Never defeated the Union Navy completely, of course, but was able to make sorties without real worry about being completely destroyed.

(in reply to spruce)
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