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Lest We Forget

 
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Lest We Forget - 10/10/2000 1:55:00 PM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		In the rush of the last few months with the newest version of Steel Panthers, now known as SPWAW, we sometimes forget how far we have progressed. Let me suggest to those of you who can still get SP, SP2 or SP3 (DOS based) to still run on your computer, that you go back and play a scenario in one of these. Remember (those who go back that far) your initial thrill with SP? It was great for its time. But compare it now with SPWAW and see how far its come. I still do scenario design for SP2 and SP3 and so I am constantly reminded of the progress that has been made. I love this game! Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant
Post #: 1
- 10/10/2000 2:26:00 PM   
Patessi

 

Posts: 6
Joined: 10/4/2000
From: Finland
Status: offline 		You're right. THE GAME has developed maybe more than any other game we've ever seen - as we all know, it was already a great game when it was released in 1995 or so. Thanks to all who've worked for our gaming pleasure and made SPWaW possible!

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Post #: 2
- 10/10/2000 8:41:00 PM   
Tankhead

 

Posts: 1352
Joined: 6/21/2000
From: Yukon Territory Canada
Status: offline 		You got that right Wild Bill. The improvement are like night and day. I still play SPIII with the moderna upgrade. I still got a soft spot for SPIII, and do enjoy playing it once in a while. But then I go back to SPWaW and all I can say is WOW. Tankhead ------------------ Rick Cloutier [email]rcclout@telusplanet.net[/email] Coordinator: Tankhead's SPWAW Resources http://tankhead.home.icq.com

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Tankhead


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Post #: 3
- 10/10/2000 8:53:00 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		I get reminded every day. Currently been revisiting SP-II. Biggest thing i noticed was how much bigger and more complex the lastest scenerios are compared to back then. Some of the 'canned' scenerios provided in SP-II are downright simlistic compared to the ones seen now, even the smaller sized scenerios are far richer in detail and complexity. Cant wait to see this debut in SP:Modern

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Post #: 4
- 10/10/2000 9:05:00 PM   
Leibstandarte

 

Posts: 122
Joined: 6/19/2000
From: Austin, TX USA
Status: offline 		I tried to go back and play SP1 a few weeks ago and really couldn't do it. It was a great game in it's day but it has been so far surpassed by SPWaW as to make it in my opinion unplayable. Tried to continue SP2 because of the modern era but again I keep comparing it to SPWaW and stopped playing. I realize they are two totally different games and both excellent in their own rite but I think I will just wait for SPMW before I play modern battles. Thanks again (and again, etc.) to everybody at Matrix for such a captivating game. I look forward to all your future products! ------------------ Cavalry Trooper (8th US) and Grandson of a Leibstandarte Tanker.

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Cavalry Trooper (8th US) and Grandson of a Leibstandarte Tanker.

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Post #: 5
- 10/10/2000 9:34:00 PM   
Red Baron

 

Posts: 423
Joined: 5/7/2000
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		Hi Bill.. I never forget my roots! I play SP3 almost everyday. It still gives a thrill to play that game against a good and inventive opponet - And those opponets is surly not hard to find at The Blitz www.theblitz.org Make a visit those who dare - Actually i have one SP1 going and two SP2´s. But i most say WAW has come a long way since SP1! ------------------ "SEMPER PARATUS" An Old Hawk Soldier Is Allways Ready!! [This message has been edited by Red Baron (edited October 10, 2000).]

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Post #: 6
- 10/10/2000 11:05:00 PM   
sami heimola

 

Posts: 425
Joined: 5/8/2000
From: kouvola finland
Status: offline
quote:

Originally posted by Wild Bill: In the rush of the last few months with the newest version of Steel Panthers, now known as SPWAW, we sometimes forget how far we have progressed. Let me suggest to those of you who can still get SP, SP2 or SP3 (DOS based) to still run on your computer, that you go back and play a scenario in one of these. Remember (those who go back that far) your initial thrill with SP? It was great for its time. But compare it now with SPWAW and see how far its come. I still do scenario design for SP2 and SP3 and so I am constantly reminded of the progress that has been made. I love this game! Wild Bill
Wild Bill, do you (or others from Matrix and gamers in this forum too ) still play (at least sometimes) SP2WW2 and SPWW2 v.2.2b and 3.0? I still have them all... I don't mean that I play them every day but sometimes for change . Not always SPWAW or SP1-3... Sami

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Post #: 7
- 10/11/2000 12:46:00 AM   
Guderian

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 5/3/2000
From: Poznan, Poland
Status: offline 		Yeah, Raiders did some cool stuff for Spww2... Any chances for you guys taking some time off to do anything for ver 3.0 ?

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Post #: 8
- 10/11/2000 12:56:00 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		Like you Sami, and you too, Gud, I have all of them. The only one currently not on my hard drive is the original SP1 and I feel guilty about that . I play them all too, when I can. My primary commitment to Matrix and SPWAW plus some other upcoming projects and my time devoted to Combat Mission, plus normal functions and duties at TGN just about rip 24 hours all to pieces and don't leave enough for some of the other things. So like all of you, I have to set priorities. This and this have to be done. This and this should be done. This and this are what I want to do when the others are done. Fortunately, there are many gifted scenario designers out there.So many of you do so well, that every game should be well covered with new material for play. And with SPCW and SPMW we'll have even more to do. Get a bigger hard drive, guys, you're gonna need it Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 9
- 10/11/2000 3:56:00 AM   
Major Ed

 

Posts: 51
Joined: 9/23/2000
From: Jackson, MS USA
Status: offline 		Bill mentioned going back to pre-SPWAW, what about pre-SP1? What did you play before then and how did you get started playing war games? The first war game I played was Bismark, by Avalon Hill. A friend of mine had it and Battle of the Bulge. We didn't have time that day for me to learn B-o-B, so we played Bismark and I was hooked. The first game I bought was Afrika Korps, again by Avalon Hill. I pushed those counters back and forth over that board so much I had to get replacements. Then came Panzer Blitz (Germany vs. Russia)! This was more like it, platoons and sections, line of sight, indirect artillery and op fire. Not long afterwards came Panzer Leader (Germany vs. Allies). I had a friend in college that bought enough extra boards and counter sets to be able to field a full strength panzer division against a Russian tank corps. You had to be real careful where you rolled the dice. One wrong toss and you spent hours putting counters back where they belonged (along with the arguments - "I killed that Panther 2 turns ago!") or searching under furniture to find them (you would probably find last night's pizza under there also). We also played some large scale games, one was a division/corps level game of the Russian front. Each turn was one week long. I forget the name but I think the games was from SPI. We also played Wacht em Rhine, a battalion (sometimes company) level game in the Ardennes, this was definitely published by SPI. The next game I played a lot was Squad Leader (with Cross of Iron, Crescendo of Doom and G.I. Anvil of Victory add-on modules). I never really got into Advanced Squad Leader since it used new counters and a whole new set of rules and I had so much invested in regular Squad Leader. When SPI published Firefight (1980's and after) I snapped it up. Air Cav is also a good modern era game. I didn't play for several years (no opponents and not enough time) then came Steel Panthers (thank you, thank you, thank you). To the people a SSI and Matrix Games, Paul and Bill - awesome job ya'll!!!!

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Post #: 10
- 10/11/2000 4:29:00 AM   
jsaurman

 

Posts: 129
Joined: 6/28/2000
From: Alexandria, VA
Status: offline 		Bill, I have a weird question, why didn't the Cammo boys call their version Steel Panthers 4 and and the Matrix version end up as Steel Panthers 5? Seems to me that there are a lot of people still out there playing SP 1,2,3 because they don't realize this is the same game. Besides that it would save two keystrokes by typing SP5 instead of SPWAW! I recently tried to play SP1,2,3 again and also tried Panzer General 1, and found them too archaic for me; in addition, PG ran sooo fast that it was no longer playable. I have no regrets, those games don't have the facination they once did when new, and I am glad to move forward into the new Millenium with SPWAW leading the way! JIM

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Post #: 11
- 10/11/2000 4:42:00 AM   
Greg McCarty

 

Posts: 234
Joined: 6/15/2000
From: woodbury,mn,usa
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Wild Bill: [B]In the rush of the last few months with the newest version of Steel Panthers, now known as SPWAW, we sometimes forget how far we have progressed. Yes indeed. I am back with my Russian campaign in progress after absorbing the latest patch. This game is a work of art. We gamers owe Matrix a ton. I'm going to ressurrect an old scenario I did for Novastar and adapt it for SPwaw. I think its a good one, and its the least I can do until I can mail Matrix some money for something. I showed the latest ver of SPwaw to a couple of friends who are uninitiated, and their jaws just went slack. If you like wargames at all, there is currently nothing as complete, relealistic, and as flexible as this one. ------------------ Greg. 37 mill AA... can suddenly ruin your day.

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Greg.

It is better to die on your feet
than to live on your knees.

--Zapata

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 12
- 10/11/2000 5:19:00 AM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		It was 1975 I was stationed at Camp Lejuene NC while waiting in line a the "roach coach" one night a little Pvt in front of me was holding SPI's rule book for "War in Europe" he was not even in my btry but I asked him about it and he took me back to his barracks (squad bays in those days) and out in the hall he had maps all set up and was playing by hisself. I took over the allies and we played everynight (I talked him into getting rooms at motel in town so I could drink beer!) We played that game everychance we could for 2 years!!! Don't remeber his first name? but his last name was Goodwin and I really owe my involvement in wargames to him. Of course starting out on a monster spoiled me for the little beer and pretzel games. I have owned and loved SPI's Camp for North Africa, War in Pacific, Gettysburg, Wach am Rhein, Civil War then I discovered the Commodore-64 and SSI and it was true happieness. No more searching for someone to play, no more needing a gym to set up in, of course had to wait 20-30 minutes for cassette tape of "Knights of the Desert" or "Tigers in the Snow" to load. ------------------ I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a differant direction!

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I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!

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Post #: 13
- 10/11/2000 5:39:00 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		Major Ed, you've been around as long as I have it seems. My experiences in Wargaming began as a kid back (Waaaaaay back) in the the 40s. With my Dad off to World War II, I was caught up in the fervor of those times. Later at about the age of 10, I taught myself to play chess, then converted the classic pieces to small plastic soldiers just to have a modern day "battle." My first introduction to board gaming, like you, came with Midway and AK, around 1965, both of which, again like you, I played till I wore them out. I even took a cardboard packing crate for a fridge, cut it open, spread it out, and made a huge AK map that covered the living room floor with counters the size of kitchen tiles Panzerblitz, Jutland,Panzer Leader,D-Day, War in Europe, games from GDW, SPI, Battlefront, AH, and many others. And then came SL and I was in gaming Nirvana. Here was "my" game! I went so far in the late 70s as to form the first Wild Bill's Raiders group. No E-Mail then, all snail mail. We designed a pretty good pacific variant for SL, so good it was posted in the old Wargamer magazine. Well, AH did not like that very much and put the quietus on it real quick. In the early 80s I was a participant in a bitter divorce and I stepped away from gaming for five years. Sold over 300 classic board games and about 100 issues of the General from their earliest editions onward for $300. I'll always regret that move! In 1988 I came back, and started with computers, an old Atari machine and the Microprose and SSI games. My favorite was Wargame Construction Set, did over 100 scenarios in that one. Then came "TANKS," and I was on my way. David Landrey saw my early efforts and asked me to do some discs for him. I did over 200 scenarios in that game. Finally, in 1975 David Landrey got me on the beta team for SP. I'll never forget starting the game, the graphics, the rush! And from there to here, through 11 different games and beta test teams and nearly now 1000 scenarios and campaigns. Its been a long road, bumpy sometimes and I'm not quite sure where it will take me. I've gotten my wish, my long term wish with SP in this game, SPWAW. I now hope, at 63, to see even more detailed, finely tuned wargames in what remains of my life. As one British author so well put it, "...The best is yet to be, the last of life, for which the first was made." Wild Bill =============== ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 14
- 10/11/2000 5:41:00 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		That would be a question the SPWW2 folks would have to answer, Jim.. Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 15
- 10/11/2000 5:43:00 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		Lots of good memories, guys. We are all a special group, no doubt about that Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 16
- 10/11/2000 10:47:00 AM   
Randy

 

Posts: 1172
Joined: 8/22/2000
From: Torrance, Calif. USA
Status: offline 		Wild Bill, as you once said the difference in the games is like kindergarden to college. I brought out my SP1 the other day and the graphics looked so bland, and the game play is good but compared to SPW@W it doesn't come close. Does any one remember the Mattel Intelivision "Tanks"/Armor Battles (or something like that)? How about Perfect General? At the time I thought this was the ultimate in computer war games. Times have changed. Thanks again Team Matrix Semper Fi Randy

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Semper Fi
Randy

The United States Marines: America's 911 Force-The Tip of the Spear

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Post #: 17
- 10/11/2000 11:56:00 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		It has been a great experience and has lengthened the life of SP for some years to come. Thanks, Randy! Welcome to SP college! Semper Fi! Wild Bill ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 18
- 10/15/2000 10:41:00 AM   
Jerry

 

Posts: 8
Joined: 10/7/2000
Status: offline 		The improvement is really great from SP1 to SPWAW, but the change from Typhoon of Steel to SP1 seemed a little more evolutionary. But I don't know for sure because I'm still trying to get SPWAW to work on my new Pentium-100 computer.

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Post #: 19
- 10/15/2000 8:32:00 PM   
troopie

 

Posts: 996
Joined: 4/8/2000
From: Directly above the centre of the Earth.
Status: offline 		Like most of you I have all the SP games. SP one is the only one not still on my hard drive. I have two installs of SP2, one standard (with the African bravado) and one with odd and unusual MOBs like the French Foreign Legion. I have Moderna and SPww2v3. But I play SP-Moderna mostly for the OOBs not available anywhere else and SPWW2v3 mostly for WW1 (Which reminds me, got to get over to Alsace.) I found it almost impossible to play SP1 after SPWW2 came out, so deleted it. troopie ------------------ Pamwe Chete

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Pamwe Chete

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Post #: 20
- 10/16/2000 12:11:00 AM   
Drex

 

Posts: 2524
Joined: 9/13/2000
From: Chico,california
Status: offline 		I go back to the days of board games myself learning the hard way not to play with the window open! Then came the computer and SPI and all the great civil war games. Now the only games I play are Cm, PacWar and SPWAW and it's tough dividing up my time between them. But SPWAW is a masterpiece and I find myself playing it more than the others especially since it keeps getting better and better.

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quote:

Col Saito: "Don't speak to me of rules! This is war! It is not a game of cricket!"

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 21
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