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Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3

 
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Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/13/2008 1:56:32 PM   
Mardonius


Posts: 654
Joined: 4/9/2007
From: East Coast
Status: offline 		In the box version of the game, DoWs cost 3 pp. In the Computer game, they
cost 4 pp.

This increase derives from Empires in Harm, but in EiH there were many
means of being able to DoW for only 2 pp with a Casus Belli so it balanced
out. As we have no Casus Belli and reduced DoW in EIANW for the PC, it
would seem prudent to revert to the 3 PP cost as the high cost of entering
wars really slows things down, (particularly if you get rid of the PP for
making free states which had served as a counter weight to some degree.)

Please let me know your thoughts
Post #: 1
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/13/2008 2:42:38 PM   
NeverMan

 

Posts: 1722
Joined: 2/24/2004
Status: offline 		I'm all up for any part of this game reverting to Empires in Arms.

(in reply to Mardonius)
Post #: 2
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/13/2008 3:06:44 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline 		When / If it does, it will be in a different scenario with counters and maps for EiA.


_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to NeverMan)
Post #: 3
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/13/2008 6:31:28 PM   
Murat


Posts: 803
Joined: 9/17/2003
From: South Carolina
Status: offline 		I like the 3 pp loss as well instead of the 4, Mardonius made a good argument.

(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 4
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/15/2008 12:22:47 AM   
delatbabel


Posts: 1252
Joined: 7/30/2006
From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline 		Agree, without the casus belli rules from EiH, the 4 PP DoW makes no sense -- so it should revert to 3.

_____________________________

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Del

(in reply to Murat)
Post #: 5
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/15/2008 3:04:44 PM   
borner


Posts: 1485
Joined: 3/20/2005
From: Houston TX
Status: offline 		the more EiA, the less EiH, the better

(in reply to delatbabel)
Post #: 6
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/16/2008 4:57:40 PM   
timewalker03

 

Posts: 171
Joined: 6/9/2003
From: Omaha, NE
Status: offline 		I am 100% with you Borner. Also it is somewhat disturbing seeing Marshall state "When / If it does, it will be in a different scenario with counters and maps for EiA." That is bothersome seeing that a port to EiA may not be 100% certain in the future. HMMMM!

(in reply to borner)
Post #: 7
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/16/2008 10:36:11 PM   
NeverMan

 

Posts: 1722
Joined: 2/24/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: timewalker03

I am 100% with you Borner. Also it is somewhat disturbing seeing Marshall state "When / If it does, it will be in a different scenario with counters and maps for EiA." That is bothersome seeing that a port to EiA may not be 100% certain in the future. HMMMM!


It's quite more disturbing that we are getting the 1812 campaign AHEAD OF Empires in Arms. How messed up is that?????

It really doesn't matter how much people say on this forum, Matrix continues to hold their strategy: listen to the few who don't complain about the game and ignore the many who just want this game to be good.

< Message edited by NeverMan -- 11/16/2008 10:37:16 PM >

(in reply to timewalker03)
Post #: 8
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/16/2008 10:36:31 PM   
NeverMan

 

Posts: 1722
Joined: 2/24/2004
Status: offline 		duplicate, sorry

(in reply to NeverMan)
Post #: 9
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/17/2008 1:19:27 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: timewalker03

I am 100% with you Borner. Also it is somewhat disturbing seeing Marshall state "When / If it does, it will be in a different scenario with counters and maps for EiA." That is bothersome seeing that a port to EiA may not be 100% certain in the future. HMMMM!


Don't read too much into my "when/if" please! We have not totally discussed the details yet so it's an idea with a few plans around it but I do not have anything official from Matrix yet. There is much to approve. GDW also needs to be involved. I fully intend to add this element but there is a lot of business to discuss yet...



_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to timewalker03)
Post #: 10
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/17/2008 1:21:01 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NeverMan

quote:

ORIGINAL: timewalker03

I am 100% with you Borner. Also it is somewhat disturbing seeing Marshall state "When / If it does, it will be in a different scenario with counters and maps for EiA." That is bothersome seeing that a port to EiA may not be 100% certain in the future. HMMMM!


It's quite more disturbing that we are getting the 1812 campaign AHEAD OF Empires in Arms. How messed up is that?????

It really doesn't matter how much people say on this forum, Matrix continues to hold their strategy: listen to the few who don't complain about the game and ignore the many who just want this game to be good.


#1. You don't have the 1812 scenario yet, do you :-)?
I would never ignore you Neverman LOL!






_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to NeverMan)
Post #: 11
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/17/2008 11:00:10 PM   
NeverMan

 

Posts: 1722
Joined: 2/24/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis


quote:

ORIGINAL: NeverMan

quote:

ORIGINAL: timewalker03

I am 100% with you Borner. Also it is somewhat disturbing seeing Marshall state "When / If it does, it will be in a different scenario with counters and maps for EiA." That is bothersome seeing that a port to EiA may not be 100% certain in the future. HMMMM!


It's quite more disturbing that we are getting the 1812 campaign AHEAD OF Empires in Arms. How messed up is that?????

It really doesn't matter how much people say on this forum, Matrix continues to hold their strategy: listen to the few who don't complain about the game and ignore the many who just want this game to be good.


#1. You don't have the 1812 scenario yet, do you :-)?
I would never ignore you Neverman LOL!







I apologize if I misunderstood you saying earlier that the 1812 was coming soon.

(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 12
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/18/2008 12:38:31 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline 		No apologies here. It actually might come quicker than the classic scenario just because of the business issues involved.

_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to NeverMan)
Post #: 13
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/18/2008 1:08:02 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

GDW also needs to be involved.


Do you mean ADG and Harry Rowland? It would be nice to see some comments and insights here from those guys occassionally. After all, if Harry himself says such and such change or enhancement is a good improvement to the original game, or not, then that would carry a lot of weight in the development of this officially licensed computer version.

(in reply to Mardonius)
Post #: 14
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/18/2008 11:10:34 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline 		ADG, Correct! Arrrrg! When Worlds Collide LOL!
I agree.


_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 15
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/19/2008 12:32:42 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		Not the Worlds Collide Theory!

quote:

George: Ah, you have no idea of the magnitude of this thing. If she [Susan] is allowed to infiltrate this world, then George Costanza as you know him, ceases to exist! You see, right now, I have Relationship George, but there is also Independent George. That's the George you know, the George you grew up with -- Movie George, Coffee Shop George, Liar George, Bawdy George!
Jerry: I love that George.
George: Me too! And he's dying, Jerry! If Relationship George walks through this door, he will kill Independent George! A George, divided against itself, cannot stand!*

(in reply to Mardonius)
Post #: 16
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/19/2008 12:52:43 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline 		LOL!


_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 17
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/19/2008 1:36:21 PM   
iamspamus

 

Posts: 433
Joined: 11/16/2006
From: Cambridge, UK
Status: offline 		I'd like both. EIH 5.0 and EIA...
Jason

quote:

ORIGINAL: borner

the more EiA, the less EiH, the better


(in reply to borner)
Post #: 18
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/20/2008 9:56:36 AM   
delatbabel


Posts: 1252
Joined: 7/30/2006
From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline 		I actually quite like the casus belli rules from EiH.  They allowed some DoWs to only be 2 PPs.  However without them, a DoW needs to go back to the EiA method of 3 PPs.  It would be nice if casus belli could be implemented as an optional rule though.

_____________________________

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Del

(in reply to iamspamus)
Post #: 19
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/20/2008 12:35:06 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline 		Is 3 the number?
I can change this easily for 1.06


_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to delatbabel)
Post #: 20
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/20/2008 12:54:42 PM   
Mardonius


Posts: 654
Joined: 4/9/2007
From: East Coast
Status: offline 		I reckon 3 should be the number. If you include an option for Casus Belli rules later then it could go to -4 or -2 with a Casus Belli. This is probably a good idea. But until then, 3 should be the number.

(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 21
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/20/2008 2:41:49 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline 		"3" shall be the count! Not 2, nor 4 BUT "3" shall be the count!

Actually we could still implement a Casus Belli and charge 1 or 2.

IMO, I always thought that a Casus Belli should exist for called allies. My reasoning was they were upholding their end of the allied agreement.




_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to Mardonius)
Post #: 22
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/20/2008 8:07:43 PM   
iamspamus

 

Posts: 433
Joined: 11/16/2006
From: Cambridge, UK
Status: offline 		Concur...but we can't have any connection to EIH, now...

Is that an African or a European Swallow?
Jason


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

"3" shall be the count! Not 2, nor 4 BUT "3" shall be the count!

Actually we could still implement a Casus Belli and charge 1 or 2.

IMO, I always thought that a Casus Belli should exist for called allies. My reasoning was they were upholding their end of the allied agreement.





(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 23
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/21/2008 12:31:04 AM   
Mardonius


Posts: 654
Joined: 4/9/2007
From: East Coast
Status: offline 		That concept makes sense to me... Just the "Just War" parameters should be discussed before hand, as there are multiple convolutions...


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

"3" shall be the count! Not 2, nor 4 BUT "3" shall be the count!

Actually we could still implement a Casus Belli and charge 1 or 2.

IMO, I always thought that a Casus Belli should exist for called allies. My reasoning was they were upholding their end of the allied agreement.





(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 24
RE: Reduced PP for DOW on Major Powers from 4 to 3 - 11/21/2008 11:52:46 AM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5630
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline 		This has been changed in 1.06 (Just the 4pp moved to 3pp).


_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to Mardonius)
Post #: 25
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