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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> John Tiller's Campaign Series >> Ok you know there's a problem....

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Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/11/2008 5:03:46 AM

V22 Osprey

Posts: 1593
Joined: 4/8/2008
From: Corona, CA
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when an M4A1 platoon takes out a Panzer IVH platoon in 1 shot twice in a row.

I was just playing the Bootcamp 3 in West Front, happy to have the 2 tank platoons since my Major(Commander) and a rifle platoon on hill 121 had spotted the enemy tanks.I move in position and my tanks get wiped out in 1 turn.

If it was a M4 with a 76mm I could understand, but an M4A1 with that crappy little gun.....psh.....

Please tell me this is a bug as I was showing my cousin how to play...and that made me look pretty darn stupid.

< Message edited by V22 Osprey -- 12/11/2008 5:05:39 AM >

Post #: 1

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/11/2008 6:47:26 PM

Arkady

Posts: 1262
Joined: 5/31/2002
From: 27th Penal Battalion
Status: offline

I don't understand why people blame their own poor strategy and tactic mistakes to software bugs

situation description, please :
- distance
- facing
- elevation
- enemy platoon strength

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Post #: 2

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/11/2008 7:23:54 PM

countblue

Posts: 160
Joined: 1/8/2008
From: Vienna,Austria
Status: offline

Bear in mind:
The Mark IV isnt that good a tank in terms of armor, sidehits and hits to the back could be lethal even with an 5cm.

Solution:
I recommend replaying the turn a couple of times and draw a statistic over the different outcomes.
If the statistics show this outcome you had as a "spike" its ok, but if this is regular AKA the "average" its somehow flabbergasting. ;-)

You know the "lucky" hit and all that.

my .02
CB

(in reply to Arkady)

Post #: 3

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/11/2008 9:27:17 PM

e_barkmann

Posts: 1307
Joined: 4/18/2000
From: Adelaide, Australia
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and of course the reverse situation is rarely spoken about as a problem - ie when your tanks overwhelm a superior enemy force - that's always put down to the fighting spirit of your men and your generalship :-)

cheers

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Post #: 4

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/11/2008 11:26:36 PM

V22 Osprey

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From: Corona, CA
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Situation:
1 platoon was 4 hexes away in a village hex.
2nd platoon was 1 hex away in the forest.
As a full-time 2d view player I don't have armor facing on.

(in reply to e_barkmann)

Post #: 5

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/12/2008 2:32:51 PM

GHQ

Posts: 14
Joined: 1/2/2007
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A long way from invincible the MkIV and it doesn't necessarily mean they've it's been destroyed, the wreck represents just put out of action.
That's something the 75mm was quite capable of doing
Many tanks were recoverable and repairable depending on who owned the battlefield in at the end of the encounter.

(in reply to V22 Osprey)

Post #: 6

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/12/2008 4:49:20 PM

PaladinSix

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Joined: 1/7/2006
Status: offline

quote:

Many tanks were recoverable and repairable depending on who owned the battlefield in at the end of the encounter.

And that's an important point which the game engine does not reflect, which makes armor losses particularly frustrating in a campaign game.

Paladinsix

(in reply to GHQ)

Post #: 7

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/16/2008 1:28:38 PM

simovitch

Posts: 5488
Joined: 2/14/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PaladinSix

quote:

Many tanks were recoverable and repairable depending on who owned the battlefield in at the end of the encounter.

And that's an important point which the game engine does not reflect, which makes armor losses particularly frustrating in a campaign game.

Paladinsix

This, and other features (like penalties to the AI forces for losing missions, and manual force selection) can be accomplished if someone with programming experience would just sit down and look at the data structure of the Dynamic Campaign Game. Unfortunately I have niether the time or programming abilities to do such a thing. It took a lot of effort to develop the Creating and Modifying a DCG.pdf document, but no one seems to be doing anything with it.

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simovitch

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Post #: 8

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/16/2008 1:43:15 PM

junk2drive

Posts: 12907
Joined: 6/27/2002
From: Arizona West Coast
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Actually I read your pdf. Thanks for doing it. I'm still pondering what to do and was going to post some questions after trying a couple of things first. I need to finish my current DCG first so that I don't overwrite my save files.

(in reply to simovitch)

Post #: 9

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/16/2008 9:18:58 PM

umbro

Posts: 54
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: V22 Osprey
when an M4A1 platoon takes out a Panzer IVH platoon in 1 shot twice in a row.

1. The PzIVH platoons in this scenario have only 1 vehicle in them. The M4A1 platoon has 3 tanks in it.
2. The first shot at 4 hexes is 3(SPs) @ 14 (atkstr at 4 hexes vs. Hard) : 7 (MkIV def str) [assuming no terrain)
The attacker has a 38% chance of inflicting at least one SP loss and therefore destroying the platoon.
3. The second shot is 3 @ 18 : 7 and has a similar chance of inflicting one SP loss (~39%)

Thus the chance of two shots taking out two PzIVHs in two different platoons is ~15% Lucky, but hardly extra-ordinary.

umbro

(in reply to V22 Osprey)

Post #: 10

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/16/2008 11:21:00 PM

V22 Osprey

Posts: 1593
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From: Corona, CA
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''The PzIVH platoons in this scenario have only 1 vehicle in them.''
-umbro

Oh, duh.That explains it.My bad.

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Post #: 11

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/17/2008 8:17:22 PM

Arkady

Posts: 1262
Joined: 5/31/2002
From: 27th Penal Battalion
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: simovitch

quote:

ORIGINAL: PaladinSix

quote:

Many tanks were recoverable and repairable depending on who owned the battlefield in at the end of the encounter.

And that's an important point which the game engine does not reflect, which makes armor losses particularly frustrating in a campaign game.

Paladinsix

This, and other features (like penalties to the AI forces for losing missions, and manual force selection) can be accomplished if someone with programming experience would just sit down and look at the data structure of the Dynamic Campaign Game. Unfortunately I have niether the time or programming abilities to do such a thing. It took a lot of effort to develop the Creating and Modifying a DCG.pdf document, but no one seems to be doing anything with it.

I have the skills but I do not have the time

I've idea and few notes about "Campaign Track", something similar to Steel Panther's Megacampaign or campaign games in HPS Napoleonic Wars with strategic decisions, repairs and reinforcements etc.
Unfortunately no time to do it now, I want finish my CS Army mod first before I start anything new. My current time plan is 3 month at least to finish the mod.

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Post #: 12

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/17/2008 9:54:58 PM

Warhorse

Posts: 5712
Joined: 5/12/2000
From: Birdsboro, PA, USA
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Richard, I've read your PDF front to rear many, many times, and am constantly tinkering with it, just not enough time to post here on what I'm doing! I have a DCG with my K'talian mod going, and one with a WW1 mod going in WF, as well as a few others. Your work was definitely not for nothing guy, I really appreciate what you did, I always play DCG's more than anything else, they are fascinating!!

Mike

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Meine Ehre hei�t Treue
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Post #: 13

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/18/2008 1:29:37 AM

Borst50

Posts: 261
Joined: 4/1/2008
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I have to side with Mike on this one....I for another, definetely appreciate what you have done. If it wasnt for you and your advice, I dont think I could have figured out how to manipulate OOB's that i am able to now.

Three cheers, Rich....you earned it!

Tom

(in reply to Warhorse)

Post #: 14

RE: Ok you know there's a problem.... - 12/23/2008 11:57:43 AM

auHobbes37

Posts: 30
Joined: 5/6/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: simovitch

quote:

ORIGINAL: PaladinSix

quote:

Many tanks were recoverable and repairable depending on who owned the battlefield in at the end of the encounter.

And that's an important point which the game engine does not reflect, which makes armor losses particularly frustrating in a campaign game.

Paladinsix

This, and other features (like penalties to the AI forces for losing missions, and manual force selection) can be accomplished if someone with programming experience would just sit down and look at the data structure of the Dynamic Campaign Game. Unfortunately I have niether the time or programming abilities to do such a thing. It took a lot of effort to develop the Creating and Modifying a DCG.pdf document, but no one seems to be doing anything with it.

Well the game is on its way to my house... my 4 year old "bought" JTCS for my birthday. One of the reasons I am finally upgrading from the old TS WF/EF/RS is to get your DCG.pdf. It was s elling

(in reply to simovitch)

Post #: 15