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Are Video Games Expressions of Free Speech?

 
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Are Video Games Expressions of Free Speech? - 5/8/2002 3:12:49 AM   
Bernie


Posts: 1779
Joined: 3/15/2002
From: Depot HQ - Virginia
Status: offline 		A recent article in Salon.com has me concerned. A Federal judge has ruled that video games are not forms of free speech and are not protected by the first ammendment. You can read the text of the article here: http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/2002/05/06/games_as_speech/index.html?x

What I'd like to do is hear your thoughts on this article and this subject.

In my personal opinion, both as a game player and as a game author, computer games should definately have protection under the first ammendment. Regardless of the content, no matter what machine they may be played on, computer games are expressions of the authors views and opinions. Remember, the quality or "correctness" of those views has no bearing on any argument either for or against protection, anymore than the quality or correctness of a written article or verbal speech determines if it is covered by the first ammendment. The first ammendment protects all topics, even those we may find repugnant or distasteful. What's [B][I]your[/I][/B] opinion?

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What, me worry?
Post #: 1
- 5/8/2002 3:43:59 AM   
Goblin


Posts: 5547
Joined: 3/29/2002
From: Erie,Pa. USA
Status: offline 		They ABSOLUTELY should be protected under the F.A. That judge is obviously a moron. Sorry, but I have strong feelings on this. He is an idiot. That ruling means they could ban this game because they find the swastika offensive, or the fact that there are 'kills' in the game distasteful!

Goblin- A Goblin says "Take him off the bench!":mad: :mad: :mad:

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Post #: 2
- 5/8/2002 3:48:09 AM   
Goblin


Posts: 5547
Joined: 3/29/2002
From: Erie,Pa. USA
Status: offline 		Oooooo, I'm steamin' mad!:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Goblin- A Goblin says hang the hangin' judge:mad: :mad:

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Post #: 3
- 5/8/2002 8:10:23 AM   
Orzel Bialy


Posts: 2664
Joined: 4/4/2002
From: Wisconsin USA
Status: offline 		Welcome to the world of Political Correctness Gone Haywire!!!

Instead of prosecuting criminals our justice system will waste time trying to decide what law-abiding people should be able to do with their free-time. Makes sense....NOT :rolleyes:

Somewhere down the line this moron judge must figure that games like this will become the breeding ground of a warrior cult that might try to overthrow the government! Yep, see that happening...don't you? :D

Anyway, it's ridiculous that any such ruling was even considered, let alone made. It's like music on the radio...If you don't like something, change the station! I'm not a rap fan...but I don't expect it to be banned because I find of some of it's material unpleasant.

And as for the effects on kids...if parents would act like friggin parents and get involved and take reponsibility, then things wouldn't be so friggin' out of whack. But no, it's easier just to demand everyone else to stop what they're doing. :mad: :mad: :mad:
NEWSFLASH!!! Hey all you people out there, teach wrong and right, real from fantasy at home and you won't have to worry about what junior does.

OK, now that I've blown off steam...and please note that this game didn't make me go out and smash things "Judge Dope"....I'm going back to doing what I like best on my PC. Blow up computer generated icons! :D

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Post #: 4
- 5/8/2002 9:52:10 AM   
WhiteRook

 

Posts: 276
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: Minneapolis, MN
Status: offline 		Yes Gentlemen, this is the kind of people that the general public puts in places of power every day across this great country.
As for PC in all its forms, stick it where the sun never shines! :mad: Nothing steams me more than all that PC crap! :mad:
Its the bleeding heart dumbassed backwards morons that are doing their very best to strip us of our constitional rights. What you read, watch, play, ect. etc.. :eek:
Sorry its strong language I know and I do my best not to swear on the boards but Bernie this is just the kind of crap that gets crack pot milita groups going!
Guess I should climb down from the soap box and shut up before I offend someone! :rolleyes:
Rook

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Post #: 5
- 5/8/2002 10:11:30 AM   
tracer


Posts: 1865
Joined: 11/22/2000
From: New Smyrna Beach, FL USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by WhiteRook
[B]
Its the bleeding heart dumbassed backwards morons that are doing their very best to strip us of our constitional rights. What you read, watch, play, ect. etc.. :eek: [/B][/QUOTE]

Actually, its the folks at the opposite extreme from the 'bleeding hearts' in this case. I wish both extremes would simply take shots at each other and leave the majority in the middle alone :p

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Jim NSB

(in reply to Bernie)
Post #: 6
- 5/8/2002 11:03:09 AM   
troopie

 

Posts: 996
Joined: 4/8/2000
From: Directly above the centre of the Earth.
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by tracer
[B]

Actually, its the folks at the opposite extreme from the 'bleeding hearts' in this case. I wish both extremes would simply take shots at each other and leave the majority in the middle alone :p [/B][/QUOTE]


Keg!

troopie

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Pamwe Chete

(in reply to Bernie)
Post #: 7
- 5/8/2002 11:08:25 AM   
WhiteRook

 

Posts: 276
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: Minneapolis, MN
Status: offline 		Sorry "bleeding hearts" was a poor choice of wording I know, tend to do that when I get worked up! ;)
The other reason is I am in Minnesota and we have an Over Abundance of them here! :eek: :D

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Post #: 8
- 5/8/2002 11:21:12 AM   
Akmatov

 

Posts: 495
Joined: 7/26/2000
From: Tucson, AZ, USA
Status: offline 		Actually White Rook, people across the country are NOT putting Federal judges into positions of power, the President does this with the 'advise & consent' of the Senate.

This is why once we elect these guys, we have to watch them and yell at them frequently and fire them as needed.

We let these guys slide FAR to much. Many are probably fairly decent humans being, but if not one is watch it is also human to cut corners and slid things by.

BTB - Warrior Cult! Cool. SPWAW and especially the modern versions of CL and CA will prepare us to sieze power in combat with the pitifully funded armed forces - a doubt it!

BTB2 - speaking of pitiful funding, last weekend I saw a B2 fly over my house at only a few hundred feet! Way cool!!!!! I got to see one of the 21 we bothered to buy. These things take off from CONUS, fly to Afaghanistan, drop more tons of bombs than a couple of squadrons of WW2 heavy bombers and fly home - all without landing. And do it with the radar signiture of a plump dove. Yeah, just 21 of these should do us just fine. After all most of the B-52s are still under 45 years old. Sorry for the rant, but it is a very impressive sight to see something like that banking in the air.

(in reply to Bernie)
Post #: 9
- 5/8/2002 5:29:53 PM   
Belisarius


Posts: 4041
Joined: 5/26/2001
From: Gothenburg, Sweden
Status: offline 		Whenever I see these things happening, I'm reminded why I'm soooo happy to liver over here!

Thing is ofcourse that whatever stupid things the judges/MPAA/PETA/Senate/President/Enron/etc etc decides over there affects, in the end, us over here as well. :mad:


Which, ofcourse, also is the reason why the United States gave up their (sic!) right to merely look to their "own interests" long ago, if unvoluntarily. That is a luxury you do not have. Since it is the world's biggest market every decision, domestic as international, affects all markets and in the end, the indivduals.

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Got StuG?

(in reply to Bernie)
Post #: 10
I shake my head - 5/8/2002 8:26:48 PM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		When ever I read articles like this. I live in America "The Land of the Free" Where the freedom of speach is suppose to be protected, a place where my ancestors fled to to avoid persecution for their beliefs. Yet I look around and what do I see, the same type of persecution going on that caused my ancestors to flee to this country in the first place.
I have [COLOR=crimson]NEVER[/COLOR] understood why other people feel that it is neccessary to "protect" me from hearing, seeing, or reading other peoples beliefs. I am an educated person and can make my own decisions.
And yet we have Wallmart protecting me from offensive music (they have a company policy that prohibits the sale of music that does not pass thier censure ratings and they are the #1 retailer for music sales any musical artist that does not agree to the companies censurship looses 20% of their gross sales), we have Blockbuster protecting me from offensive videos (they have a similar policy they will not rent any video that has an x-rating and will edit other videos that they think is to graphic or sexual), we have our own government that just recently created a secret police and passed laws that allow them to install phone taps and read our e-mail, perform search and seizure without probable cause.

This article is just the first step in political activist groups to force their beliefs and ideas on other people. And like most unethical legislation it will be overturned and struck down by wiser and more intelligent judges. But this does not prevent these groups from petitioning private corporations into making company policies that effect the rest of the world.

I do not remember where it came from, but this quote will allways stick with me "For evil to win, all that has to happen is for good men to do nothing!"

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"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Bernie)
Post #: 11
- 5/9/2002 12:10:23 AM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		Ahhh free speech one of my favs.

Ok its time to get reeeeeally wacky (best way to illustrate something is bend it till it breaks).

Ok free speech is what" freedom to say anything you like?

Ok would you permit a software company to design a game that stuffed holocaust denial down your throat, while playing a quest style game? It would be easy to design a game to do that.

How about the next evolution in first person shooters. Cross genre games. Duke Nukem meets Lara Croft.
Ever wanted to have Duke Nukem interrogate Lara? How about beat her up. Hmmmm why not just have Duke use his gun on her. No I dont mean that gun, I mean the one that is for fun (any soldier will know what I mean).

We already have games that demonstrate that some bodies have more blood in them than I was told was supposed to be there at any rate. And the gore seems to be what everyone wants.

So while my Duke Nukem notion might seem incredibly idiotic, well, I am not going to think for a second you couldn't sell a game that allowed one pixel person to rape another.

Do we need "protection" from this.

Well ask yourself. Would you allow it in your home?

Would you be concerned if your son's/daughter's friend had it?.
Would you be concerned if your son's/daughter's friend's dad/mom didn't care what your opinion was in his home.?
Would you be concerned if you couldn't tell where that material was in the first place.?

My son has more Lego than software for a reason. I won't buy him toys that require he play act agression. I also buy him a lot of books. My son will grow up to be an educated creative lad.
When he is old enough to buy his own stuff, he will be able to make his own mind up about what is ok.

I am not into censorship myself. Just quality control. I won't let him play shooter games or wrestling games period. I don't care to worry about what you will let your kids indulge. Your kids are your kids.

As for adults, hey you can watch whateeeeeeeever you wan't. I am willing to assume you are educated enough to tell the difference.

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I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to Bernie)
Post #: 12
- 5/9/2002 12:24:13 AM   
Capt Chris

 

Posts: 200
Joined: 2/4/2002
From: Rochester, NY
Status: offline 		I don't need no stinking censors! Let me filter my own content damnit. These people are a bunch of A-holes! Who has the right to tell me what I can do? I love playing video games, [B]especially[/B] the violent ones. I'm not hurting anyone.

[B]What would they rather have me do in my spare time?[/B]

Maybe I could study politics instead so I could become president and the have sex with my intern ( BILLY BOY).

Maybe they would rather I studied accounting so I could swindle millions of dollars from hardworking investors (ENRON).

If these judges are bored and don't have anything productive to do besides make sh** up, I can help them find something.

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Capt Chris

"Badges? We don't need no stinking badges!"

(in reply to Bernie)
Post #: 13
- 5/9/2002 2:56:57 AM   
TheZel66

 

Posts: 210
Joined: 4/6/2001
From: Phila, PA
Status: offline 		why is everyone gettting so upset about all this. there have been crackpot judges out there trying to sensor everything including computer games since day one... they never go anywhere.. thats the great thing about our government. Its inertia is its greatest asset. Nothing ever gets done...

Relax, dont worry, have some beer and play SPWAW...

About phone tapping-- they've been doing this for years. Who cares - unless you've doing something you shouldn't. in which case, i'm glad they're listening..
:p :p :p

(in reply to Bernie)
Post #: 14
- 5/9/2002 4:55:27 AM   
WhiteRook

 

Posts: 276
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: Minneapolis, MN
Status: offline 		Well you know the old saying, utilmate power - utilmately corrupts! Some people get into positions of "judgement" :rolleyes: and it goes to their heads!
Yes I know the pres puts federal judges in place, I was making a broad-based statement. i.e. utilmately we put every offical in power by how we vote if you know what I mean! ;)
No I personaly do not think that fascist skinhead groups should be allowed to exsist in this country. But by the same token I beleive that Jesus Christ is my personal lord and savior. And the constitutional amendment's allow me to have this belief.
Parents must take more time and decide what their children may play do or see on a day to day basis. Its our job as parents!
It also protects our right to voice our opinions and grips in places like this board! :cool:
There is always going to be a "big brother" aspect to the goverment in one form or another. What I cherish is the right to publicly voice my views on it! :D

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Post #: 15
Correctness - 5/9/2002 9:18:25 AM   
BruceAZ


Posts: 608
Joined: 10/9/2000
From: California
Status: offline 		I agree completely. As a SPWAW Campaign designer, I think any work done under this forum, or any forum, would be protected by the 1st Amendment. I am surprised that it is not!

Bruce
Semper Fi:cool:

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Post #: 16
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