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All of Europe Alarmed...

 
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All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/14/2009 7:29:48 PM   
dude

 

Posts: 399
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: Fairfax Virginia
Status: offline 		Ok, I'd really like to know what sets all of Europe off.... it seems anytime I get into the lead by even a couple of points all of Europe becomes alarmed... yet if anyone else takes the lead no one notices unless it's a significant lead...

These shots are from my current game and from the same turn. Notice that the rest of Europe doesn't care that Prussia is in the lead by 5 points... but in the next picture when I take the lead by 4 points... they panic! (needless to say that during the next two turns everyone but England and Russia DOW'd me!!!! (and only because I had worked an enforced alliance with both.)





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< Message edited by dude -- 3/14/2009 7:31:45 PM >

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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/14/2009 7:30:39 PM   
dude

 

Posts: 399
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: Fairfax Virginia
Status: offline 		Here's the second shot...
notice they are all alarmed by my gigantic 4 point lead!





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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/14/2009 7:51:45 PM   
dude

 

Posts: 399
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: Fairfax Virginia
Status: offline 		So a couple of turns later I decide to surrender to Spain... we hadn't fought any battles so there would be very few points for him to use in the surrender terms.. he just took Cyrpus. No big loss... but what's annoying is that nobody is alarmed that Spain is now 100 points in the lead...






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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/14/2009 8:25:33 PM   
barbarossa2

 

Posts: 915
Joined: 1/17/2006
Status: offline 		I hate to say this, but this is why I gave up playing games against the computer as anything more than training exercises.

You should do a play by email. No company will ever be able to code for all of the possibilities which will crop up in play.

So, in my opinion, computer game companies owe it to us to give us a reasonable AI to practice on and then they MUST give us the ability to play aginst real human beings within the game.

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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/14/2009 8:28:59 PM   
dude

 

Posts: 399
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: Fairfax Virginia
Status: offline 		Yea but this is minor in my opinion...  The AI should have the same threshold for alarm for everyone… or at least tell me what that there is a different threshold for different countries or human vs AI players…  otherwise I assume all is even and plan accordingly.  If the AI is getting a break somewhere I’d like to know it.


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Post #: 5
RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/14/2009 8:45:48 PM   
Mus

 

Posts: 1759
Joined: 11/13/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dude

Yea but this is minor in my opinion...  The AI should have the same threshold for alarm for everyone… or at least tell me what that there is a different threshold for different countries or human vs AI players…  otherwise I assume all is even and plan accordingly.  If the AI is getting a break somewhere I’d like to know it.



Could also be some randomness to it.

Another factor could be the way you were getting your Glory. If you conquered North Africa and Naples/Sicily or parts of Hungary and were getting your Glory from expansion that could be more alarming than Spain getting its Glory from holding onto core Provinces and winning some defensive engagments.

Hopefully somebody from WCS can chime in in more detail on how the system works.

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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/14/2009 9:05:20 PM   
LuckyJim1006

 

Posts: 35
Joined: 5/5/2008
Status: offline 		The Devs really need to chime in on this one. I personally do not have the time to commit to a PBEM game and so hopefully have bought more than a 'Trainer'

Seeing how Glory is so important to the game I would like an explanation for the above.

Hopefully Mus has hit the nail on the head. After all Brinkmanship should play a part in this time period and you should have to plan your strategy on not upsetting too many people or face the consequences.

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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/14/2009 11:23:03 PM   
dude

 

Posts: 399
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: Fairfax Virginia
Status: offline 		I had not DOW or been at war with any of the major powers yet.  I marched across NA and sat in second place for nearly a year... then wham! everyone hates me with a 4 point lead (which was simply gained because the previouse lead lost a points and I gain about 3 or 4 or turn automaticlly. Meanwhile Spain took Portugal, Sardinia, and had been at war with Austria previously.  I also double checked the treaties and not one of them was under a defense pact... they all DOW'd within two turn just for the heck of it.

I don't consider this a trainer at all... I'm enjoying it quite a bit... just want to understand what makes the AI tick.  Like I said, I go in assuming the AI is under the same rules as I unless the difficulty rating says otherwise (and I'm playing the default difficutly setting).  As far as I was aware there should have been no difference with the Alarm but that's not the way it's looking.

After I surrendered so Spain that dropped me a long way back on the list but still nobody is alarmed by the leader who has an 100+ point lead.  I'm trying to be careful not to get the lead for awhile.  The surrender really worked in my favor.  Spain got next to nothing (Cyrpus), I got 300 exp. for upgrades, and my army was still at full str.

Here's how the others ended up...

Sweden... war lapsed because he couldn't reach me.  Never tried to get access.
France... ditto
Prussia... tried to get an access treaty a few times with Austria but no go... so it also lapsed.
Spain... I surrendered to.

Austria... I'm beating him on my own turf... should have him surrendering soon.
Russia + Britain were allied to me so they could not DOW me.

Now the other fun part was I had just concluded a deal with GB for defense of Turkey in exchange for recognizing some neutrals...  so when they all DOW'd ... Britain went to war with all the ones it could.  Needless to say there are a few less ships out there now. 



< Message edited by dude -- 3/14/2009 11:24:48 PM >

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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/15/2009 4:13:27 AM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		I'm looking forward to the developers' explanation of this.

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Post #: 9
RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/15/2009 4:33:52 AM   
Mus

 

Posts: 1759
Joined: 11/13/2005
Status: offline 		The manual says that the amount of territory held is taken into account along with Glory.  Turkey actually starts the game with Waste, not sure if any other power does, so its pretty big to begin with.  Its also the only other power that starts the game with the ability to declare itself an empire.  Maybe a slight increase in size by taking N Africa and having any Glory lead is sufficient to cross that threshold unless another power is also taking lots of territory.

How is France doing in your game?

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Post #: 10
RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/15/2009 5:14:22 AM   
hgilmer3


Posts: 530
Joined: 12/28/2008
Status: offline 		Maybe they are afraid of you and not the others.

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Post #: 11
RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/15/2009 5:52:55 AM   
dude

 

Posts: 399
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: Fairfax Virginia
Status: offline 		I started with the 1820 Balanced scenerio.  So everyone started fairly small including France.  Spain seemed to have more with most of Italy (Tuscany, Naples, Papacy), Portugal, and Sardinia.  Prussia was next with a lot of central Europe and a chunk of Austria.  France oddly was not doing much at that time.



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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/15/2009 11:30:56 PM   
Franck

 

Posts: 394
Joined: 10/1/2004
Status: offline

I personnaly like this feature! One of the problems with this game is that it's easy to get big and be almost unbeatable. It's still so easy! So even with this feature winning a multiplayer game is so easy.

Anyways, I play against alot of human (PBEM). And I can tell you people do the same :) In our current PBEM wich is 1000 glory wins, I'm suspecting that when someone reach 500-600 he will suddently find it alot harder to have freinds or allies arround :)

I'M just happy because in a PBEM some nations won't win because your ennemy is forced to surrender to another nation first (ie: I was holding half of France + Ile de France and France was forced to surrender to Austria... But not me...) Pushing her just above 1000 glory. While I was sitting at 900 :(   )

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Post #: 13
RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/15/2009 11:39:01 PM   
ericbabe


Posts: 11927
Joined: 3/23/2005
Status: offline 		The AI does get a bonus at higher difficulty levels in avoiding having other AI players becoming alarmed at their rise to power.

The criteria depends on factors related to how close to complete the game is (either time limit or glory race), how many provinces a nation has conquered, nations' relative glory levels, and so forth.  Nations that conquer enough provinces can trigger the alarm at any point in the game, and can trigger it even if they are not in first place glory-wise.


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RE: All of Europe Alarmed... - 3/16/2009 4:04:19 AM   
dude

 

Posts: 399
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: Fairfax Virginia
Status: offline 		Thanks for the response... that's what I was wondering, what would trigger it.

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