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Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/22/2007 3:34:35 PM   
Skeleton


Posts: 560
Joined: 3/14/2006
Status: offline 		With the exception of Shogun, I know of no wargame-grand strategy game that is set in either ancient Japan or China. These seem like eras ripe for a big, turn based hex game. Does Matrix have any plans for any future projects along those lines? Does anyone know of any possible import games or something very old I have missed? I believe there was a game release within the last year or so that was based on Japan's Shogun time period but it received less then stellar reviews. Any thoughts or suggestions would be more then welcome.

< Message edited by Marcus the leper -- 11/22/2007 3:37:07 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/22/2007 4:53:04 PM   
105mm Howitzer


Posts: 447
Joined: 8/9/2007
From: Montreal, Quebec
Status: offline 		Wasn't there an older game called Seven Kingdoms thet dealt with feudal China? I may be wrong here.

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RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/24/2007 9:50:47 PM   
mikul82

 

Posts: 204
Joined: 3/2/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marcus the leper

With the exception of Shogun, I know of no wargame-grand strategy game that is set in either ancient Japan or China. These seem like eras ripe for a big, turn based hex game. Does Matrix have any plans for any future projects along those lines? Does anyone know of any possible import games or something very old I have missed? I believe there was a game release within the last year or so that was based on Japan's Shogun time period but it received less then stellar reviews. Any thoughts or suggestions would be more then welcome.



All I can think of are the old Koei games that I used to play on a Super Nintendo...

Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Nobunaga's Ambition
Genghis Khan II

Although there was one called "Takeda" that came out several years ago on the PC, it isn't Shogun but it's still kind of fun: http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/takeda

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RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/24/2007 9:52:14 PM   
mikul82

 

Posts: 204
Joined: 3/2/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: 105mm Howitzer

Wasn't there an older game called Seven Kingdoms thet dealt with feudal China? I may be wrong here.


If it's the same game I'm thinking of, Seven Kingdoms was more like Age of Empires with much deeper trade and diplomacy involved. You could play as the Chinese or Japanese I think, but also as the Romans, Celts, and etc, so not striclty Asian at all.

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RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/24/2007 10:54:56 PM   
Hidde

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 5/1/2005
Status: offline 		http://www.ezgame.com/

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RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/24/2007 11:14:54 PM   
Skeleton


Posts: 560
Joined: 3/14/2006
Status: offline 		Thank you for the replies, they are appreciated. Takeda 2 looks a bit like TW Shogun lite, only more of a click fest, is this an incorrect statement? I would much rather have a deep, slow game then an arcade-fast clicky game. Has anyone played Takeda 2? Any thoughts? Is it even remotely historical? Does it have any elements of strategy?

< Message edited by Marcus the leper -- 11/24/2007 11:16:33 PM >

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RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/24/2007 11:30:00 PM   
mikul82

 

Posts: 204
Joined: 3/2/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marcus the leper

Thank you for the replies, they are appreciated. Takeda 2 looks a bit like TW Shogun lite, only more of a click fest, is this an incorrect statement? I would much rather have a deep, slow game then an arcade-fast clicky game. Has anyone played Takeda 2? Any thoughts? Is it even remotely historical? Does it have any elements of strategy?


I played Takeda 1, and it's battles felt like a combination between the Total War games and the Slitherine games. They allowed more direct control than the Sliterine games, but didn't (IIRC) allow the god-like instant click and go anywhere control of the TW games. It's been so long since I've played it that this is the best description I can give :(

Takeda 2 looks like Takeda 1 battles in a 3D engine- they were probably about the same pace as Shogun's although usually on a smaller scale, nothing like a Command and Conquer clickfest though. They should have a demo or two on the ezgames site- I'm not sure if Takeda had one, but the same company made a Roman conquest/battle game that I think used the same combat engine and does have a playable demo.

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RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/24/2007 11:31:50 PM   
mikul82

 

Posts: 204
Joined: 3/2/2007
Status: offline 		One thing though that I do recall is that the Takeda "strategic" game wasn't anything like Shogun's.  It seems like it was completely on rails, sort of like the old "Historical Campaigns" from Medieval 1, in which you really just progressed from battle to battle with some random decisions to make in between (whether to kill a captured enemy general or recruit him, execute captured Princess or marry her, etc). 

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RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/24/2007 11:53:29 PM   
Hentzau


Posts: 161
Joined: 8/31/2004
Status: offline 		Anyone thinking about creating a game like this should go take a look at the Klear Games demo of Reiner Knizia's Samurai. wwwdotkleardotcom/new/games/samurai/index.php That game has asian FLAVOR in spades. Great game too, wish they could have ironed out copyright problems.

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Post #: 9
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/25/2007 8:19:13 AM   
Jeffrey H.


Posts: 3154
Joined: 4/13/2007
From: San Diego, Ca.
Status: offline 		There was an old Yaquinto board game about fuedal Japan. That was pretty neat. I think it was called "Samurai" or some other such unimaginative title.

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Post #: 10
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/25/2007 8:21:10 AM   
wesy


Posts: 224
Joined: 2/10/2002
From: Berkeley, CA
Status: offline 		If you're not limited to computer games. You can check these games out:

Ran or Samurai at gmtgames.com


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Post #: 11
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/25/2007 9:30:29 AM   
Hidde

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 5/1/2005
Status: offline 		I have Takeda I and II. Had a lot of fun with the first one. Yes, it was a linear campaign but it was something different and atmospheric. In Takeda II you can do more but not as much as you might first think.
You arrange marriages for your family members, appoint generals and governors and march armies around a strategic map. I had high hopes at first but soon found that it was pretty shallow.
One thing I think is noteworthy is that on the strategic map there is no provinces. Armies must march along roads when in forests or mountains and every army have an area around that when overlapping another army area results in battle. Supply lines are drawn back to a specific city for each army. I believe this is nice ideas that could be further developed.
If I remember correctly one can set the speed in tactical battles to ones liking. There are lots of starting formations in tactical battles and you have time to move your forces around a bit before actual battle begins. Then it's mostly a brawl. I'm not an expert but maybe not very unlike how it was in reality.
Takeda II had promise but I had more fun with the first one.

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Post #: 12
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 11/25/2007 4:53:20 PM   
Skeleton


Posts: 560
Joined: 3/14/2006
Status: offline 		Thank you for the information Hidde and all for responses, it is very much appreciated. I think I will pass on Takeda 2, as it appears to be a bit to linear without enough variation in both combat and campaign. This really seems to be an era sorely lacking and I would love to see Matrix work with someone to develop a game that has their trademark depth and realism. Maybe now with a WW1 game, several ACW games out and Napoleonics finally getting their due, there might be hope. Wesy, I was aware of both boardgames and very interested. But, as long retired, recently again interested boardgamer, how compatiable are both titles for solitaire play? I cannot bear the idea of attempting yet again to get a group going only to find no one has the time to make a commitment.

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Post #: 13
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 3/25/2009 3:44:13 PM   
Anguille


Posts: 637
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Hyper-cruiser "Phantom"
Status: offline 		I am fairly surprised to see the comment here. I have bought Takeda 2 three months ago and think that this one of the finest game of the genre...no clickfest at all. In the last 2 months i have lost every campaign against the AI. There are indeed no provinces per se, they are like in Slitherines games (Spartan etc). Unfortunately the game is not available anymore because Takeda 3 has been released...while Takeda 3 has a lot of improvement, i still prefer the artwork in Takeda 2. Anyway take a look at Takeda 3...

Cheers

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Post #: 14
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 3/25/2009 4:39:19 PM   
SireChaos

 

Posts: 710
Joined: 8/14/2006
From: Frankfurt, Germany
Status: offline 		A remake of Shogun: Total War would be great - or a Total War set in the Three Kingdoms period.

For that matter, a Gates of Troy conversion or even a Forge of Freedom conversion for either scenario would also be a great thing.

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Post #: 15
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 3/25/2009 6:19:24 PM   
Anguille


Posts: 637
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Hyper-cruiser "Phantom"
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SireChaos

Total War set in the Three Kingdoms period.


Check Sango 2 (also by Magitech) as it covers exactly this period. It was released last year. You should try the demo.


Takeda 3 is pretty much a sequel to Shogun even though the graphics aren't so much better. One of my fav aspect is that each castle is the reproduction of the original one (i think more than 30 different castles).

Cheers

< Message edited by Anguille -- 3/25/2009 6:20:53 PM >

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Post #: 16
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 3/26/2009 2:16:17 AM   
ccxx

 

Posts: 10
Joined: 6/5/2007
Status: offline 		There is indeed some great asia wargames.For example "Tenka Touitsu" . That game is from a boardgame publish aoroud 80's,and in last 20 years ,it spawn 5 or 6 generations computer game.
Very like WITP in Sengoku period
And it's boardgame version nearly publish by MMP last year(Sadly , some accidcents stop that....)


< Message edited by ccxx -- 3/26/2009 2:17:40 AM >

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Post #: 17
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 3/26/2009 2:28:36 AM   
ccxx

 

Posts: 10
Joined: 6/5/2007
Status: offline 		It's boardgame version:

http://www.boardgamegeeks.com/boardgame/6744

http://www.boardgamegeeks.com/boardgame/27967

Beware ,it's computer version is much more complicate

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Post #: 18
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 3/28/2009 4:09:34 PM   
panzers

 

Posts: 635
Joined: 5/19/2006
From: Detroit Mi, USA
Status: offline 		those were great games. I wish they would Come out with modern versions of those games.
There is also a surprising, albeit simpler, napoleonic game call Le'empurer. Of couse the SNES'a PTO and PTOII

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Post #: 19
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 3/28/2009 7:27:43 PM   
Grymme

 

Posts: 1821
Joined: 12/16/2007
Status: offline 		http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2073797

Mod in process for AT. Sounds great when it will be finished.

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Post #: 20
RE: Suggestions for Asian Historical Wargames - 3/28/2009 7:33:03 PM   
Peter Fisla


Posts: 2503
Joined: 10/5/2001
From: Canada
Status: offline 		Fire In the Sky...Japanese boardgame about WW2 pacific war published by MMP

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/14083


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Post #: 21
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