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Handicapping - 5/5/2009 3:10:21 AM   
Gneisenau

 

Posts: 22
Joined: 7/17/2004
From: Virginia
Status: offline 		Will MWIF have different settings such as BEGINNER, EXPERIENCED, STUD? Maybe additional BP could be made available to a newbie to WIF like me.
Post #: 1
RE: Handicapping - 5/5/2009 3:55:23 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gneisenau

Will MWIF have different settings such as BEGINNER, EXPERIENCED, STUD? Maybe additional BP could be made available to a newbie to WIF like me.

Not part of my plans. Choosing optional rules has something comparable to that, but that affects the complexity of the game, not the difficulty of the AI Opponent (which is what I think you are asking about).

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Gneisenau)
Post #: 2
RE: Handicapping - 5/5/2009 2:44:36 PM   
Greywolf

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 11/15/2000
Status: offline 		I really really really hope there will be no need for thoses rating... because frankly I have been ashamed by all the computer strategy games AI so far. Lets concentrate on him being the hardest, meanest, sonofabichest bad boy outta here, as I fear that the harder you can compute it, it still wont be enough...

... BTW I would just be happy if it isnt stupid, no need for cleverness, just no silly stupid semi-random moves...

_____________________________

Lt. Col. Ivan 'Greywolf' Kerensky

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 3
RE: Handicapping - 5/5/2009 3:44:00 PM   
Gneisenau

 

Posts: 22
Joined: 7/17/2004
From: Virginia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf

I really really really hope there will be no need for thoses rating... because frankly I have been ashamed by all the computer strategy games AI so far. Lets concentrate on him being the hardest, meanest, sonofabichest bad boy outta here, as I fear that the harder you can compute it, it still wont be enough...

... BTW I would just be happy if it isnt stupid, no need for cleverness, just no silly stupid semi-random moves...


I agree with you Greywolf. I guess what I was really trying to ask was:

1. Can the player somehow edit the BP's or the multiplier which formulates the BP's? This being a way a new guy
could build more units than what was called for in the scenario.

2. Can scenarios be edited?

The AI should be as Greywolf described.

(in reply to Greywolf)
Post #: 4
RE: Handicapping - 5/5/2009 4:05:27 PM   
bo

 

Posts: 4176
Joined: 5/1/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf

I really really really hope there will be no need for thoses rating... because frankly I have been ashamed by all the computer strategy games AI so far. Lets concentrate on him being the hardest, meanest, sonofabichest bad boy outta here, as I fear that the harder you can compute it, it still wont be enough...

... BTW I would just be happy if it isnt stupid, no need for cleverness, just no silly stupid semi-random moves...

AMEN to that Greywolf, the very first thing I do with a new computer game is watch what the AI does because I always play solo [dont want to get mauled by MR] so I would like the AI to beat my pants off until I improve my game. Good modders of an AI can create very good defensive play by the AI and to a lesser extent good offensive moves, but where I see problems start to occur is when a good human player comes across a glitch in the game [not really a program error] that makes the AI very confused [sounds like I am talking about a human huh and starts to make bad errors of judgement [pun] Instead of exploiting it every game because we always want to win dont we? It should be reported to Steve and I am sure he will spank the AI. In Strategic Command the AI is very good almost too good, the AI German wrecks havoc on the Soviets and normally destroys them but when I built a defensive line of forts behind Moscow stretching the whole width of Russia [nowhere big as these maps will be] the AI kept attacking taking terrible losses all up and down the line instead of what any competent human player would do which is attack one point with overpowering forces and breakthrough easily and surround the other Russian forces. We know the AI only reacts and does not comprehend what to do next if it gets stuck in that kind of quagmire. If this is a poor example I apoligize as I am not the brightest light on the xmas tree.

Willy

(in reply to Greywolf)
Post #: 5
RE: Handicapping - 5/5/2009 4:06:54 PM   
lomyrin


Posts: 3741
Joined: 12/21/2005
From: San Diego
Status: offline 		The BP's can be indirectly edited by merely not using a portion of them and not saving the unused ones for a later turn.

Lars

(in reply to Gneisenau)
Post #: 6
RE: Handicapping - 5/5/2009 8:03:07 PM   
michaelbaldur


Posts: 4774
Joined: 4/6/2007
From: denmark
Status: offline 		my idear ....is a simple + 0,25 production multipler ...for easy games ....
                               +0,00 for normal games   
                               and a -0,25 for hard games ....




_____________________________

the wif rulebook is my bible

I work hard, not smart.

beta tester and Mwif expert

if you have questions or issues with the game, just contact me on Michaelbaldur1@gmail.com

(in reply to lomyrin)
Post #: 7
RE: Handicapping - 5/6/2009 12:12:35 AM   
Mad Russian


Posts: 13256
Joined: 3/16/2008
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Maybe we could write up about a dozen scripts for the AI. Then at various points the AI would check to see what the situation is and adjust to the script that meets the most points in the situation report. (Sit Rep)

This is what an actual commander does. The longer the game is around the more scripts could be written for the AI to implement. Some of them could cover the same situation with a variable number as to which script the AI would choose to follow.

The AI would follow that script until the next check point 4-6 months down the road.

For instance:

Axis AI Sept. 1939 - Poland is unconquered.
A) Germany attacks Poland. 90 % chance this happens.
B) Germany attacks France and the Low Countries. 10% chance this happens.

Axis AI April 1940 - Poland is conquered but France has not been.
A) Germany attacks the Low Countries and France. 65% chance of that happening.
B) Germany attacks the Soviet Union. 15% chance of that happening.
B) Germany attacks only the Low Countries. 5% chance of that happening.
C) Germany attacks only France. 5% chance of that happening.
D) German attacks the Low Countries and when they are conquered then France. 10% chance of that happening.

That sort of thing.

Now Steve may already have something like that in place. After all men named Steve are of above average intelligence.....

For those playing against our group you may want to take note of some of those options listed......

EVERY strategy will work sometimes!!! Timing is everything.

Good Hunting.

MR





_____________________________

The most expensive thing in the world is free time.

Founder of HSG scenario design group for Combat Mission.
Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm Development Team.

(in reply to michaelbaldur)
Post #: 8
RE: Handicapping - 5/6/2009 12:22:16 AM   
Mad Russian


Posts: 13256
Joined: 3/16/2008
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bo

AMEN to that Greywolf, the very first thing I do with a new computer game is watch what the AI does because I always play solo [dont want to get mauled by MR] so I would like the AI to beat my pants off until I improve my game.

Willy


Don't be too in awe of the old breed Willy. The "old grizzlies" can get mauled by the young lions too!

One of the best ways to learn is to play an experienced gamer and discuss the game with him as you go. Play the AI a couple of times to orient yourself. READ EVERYTHING IN PRINT, once the AAR's start to come out, and then climb in your tank/ship/plane and prepare to do battle.

The gamers that will win this game are those that make the fewest STRATEGIC mistakes. That has nothing to do with age or, at times, even ability. A die roll can change everything. The gamers that can adjust the quickest to changing situations, and take advantage of them, has an advantage. That could very well be a lesser experienced gamer. Let an experienced gamer get caught in a Midway carrier battle and see if the Japanese aren't soon on the ropes by a new gamer....he will be, in a New York minute.

Whether, or not, he can adjust to that would be the question.

For those that have never played WiF before, IMO, your first games should be as the Allies. That puts you in very historical shoes. The Allies had to learn a new game too and they made lot's of mistakes. But time is on your side. Even more importantly, so is attrition.

Good Hunting.

MR


< Message edited by Mad Russian -- 5/6/2009 12:26:09 AM >

_____________________________

The most expensive thing in the world is free time.

Founder of HSG scenario design group for Combat Mission.
Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm Development Team.

(in reply to bo)
Post #: 9
RE: Handicapping - 5/6/2009 4:43:15 PM   
coregames


Posts: 470
Joined: 8/12/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gneisenau

Will MWIF have different settings such as BEGINNER, EXPERIENCED, STUD? Maybe additional BP could be made available to a newbie to WIF like me.

WiFFE has a kind of handicapping, if you allow bidding for the major powers in play. Stronger players can assume they will do better than expected, and therefore bid to control more objectives than the baseline. The total of all the bids will always equal the number of objectives available (exception being the U.S. aligning C.A. and Brazil, which raises their bid by one). This means if one side's bids are high, the others will automatically be low. I've seen the Axis total bid be 4, due to Italy having a bid of -8 (The US and CW players both bid very high). So if the options available don't offer enough of a balancing tool, the bidding process can make up the difference.

_____________________________

"The creative combination lays bare the presumption of a lie." -- Lasker

Keith Henderson

(in reply to Gneisenau)
Post #: 10
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