Matrix Games Forums

 Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

Questions

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> World in Flames >> Questions Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Questions - 5/19/2009 1:32:49 AM   
Mad Russian


Posts: 13256
Joined: 3/16/2008
From: Texas
Status: offline 		While going through the new Wif rules, which for me includes everything from version 4 to the final version I find "Issues" in them.

For instance, a unit can only attack on the blitz table with armored, mech or an A HQ. Pretty standard except we didn't have HQ's of different flavors.

What I find interesting is that you can't attack a city that is empty with a fleet or air unit in it unless you blitz it?

How can you do that in a port or city?

That doesn't make sense and I'm sure I'm missing something simple.


Good Hunting.

MR

_____________________________

The most expensive thing in the world is free time.

Founder of HSG scenario design group for Combat Mission.
Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm Development Team.
Post #: 1
RE: Questions - 5/19/2009 1:43:12 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

While going through the new Wif rules, which for me includes everything from version 4 to the final version I find "Issues" in them.

For instance, a unit can only attack on the blitz table with armored, mech or an A HQ. Pretty standard except we didn't have HQ's of different flavors.

What I find interesting is that you can't attack a city that is empty with a fleet or air unit in it unless you blitz it?

How can you do that in a port or city?

That doesn't make sense and I'm sure I'm missing something simple.


Good Hunting.

MR

When you have a question on the rules, it would be good to provide a reference to the section. That way someone (not me!) will be able to help 'translate' from the original Australian.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Mad Russian)
Post #: 2
RE: Questions - 5/19/2009 6:15:40 AM   
paulderynck


Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

While going through the new Wif rules, which for me includes everything from version 4 to the final version I find "Issues" in them.

For instance, a unit can only attack on the blitz table with armored, mech or an A HQ. Pretty standard except we didn't have HQ's of different flavors.

What I find interesting is that you can't attack a city that is empty with a fleet or air unit in it unless you blitz it?

How can you do that in a port or city?

That doesn't make sense and I'm sure I'm missing something simple.


Good Hunting.

MR


That refers to advancing after combat into the City by doing breakthrough movement. You can attack an empty hex by paradrop or by invasion, if it is coastal and invadeable for the latter (not all coastal hexes are invadeable). Usually in these cases the hex will have a notional defense factor.


_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to Mad Russian)
Post #: 3
RE: Questions - 5/19/2009 1:19:45 PM   
Mad Russian


Posts: 13256
Joined: 3/16/2008
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

While going through the new Wif rules, which for me includes everything from version 4 to the final version I find "Issues" in them.

For instance, a unit can only attack on the blitz table with armored, mech or an A HQ. Pretty standard except we didn't have HQ's of different flavors.

What I find interesting is that you can't attack a city that is empty with a fleet or air unit in it unless you blitz it?

How can you do that in a port or city?

That doesn't make sense and I'm sure I'm missing something simple.


Good Hunting.

MR

When you have a question on the rules, it would be good to provide a reference to the section. That way someone (not me!) will be able to help 'translate' from the original Australian.


I know, but the rules were at the office and I was hopeful someone would know what I was talking about...in this case I've not made myself clear at all.

I'll get the offending rule today and give reference to it properly.

Good Hunting.

MR


_____________________________

The most expensive thing in the world is free time.

Founder of HSG scenario design group for Combat Mission.
Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm Development Team.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 4
RE: Questions - 5/19/2009 1:49:36 PM   
Joseignacio


Posts: 2449
Joined: 5/8/2009
From: Madrid, Spain
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

While going through the new Wif rules, which for me includes everything from version 4 to the final version I find "Issues" in them.

For instance, a unit can only attack on the blitz table with armored, mech or an A HQ. Pretty standard except we didn't have HQ's of different flavors.

What I find interesting is that you can't attack a city that is empty with a fleet or air unit in it unless you blitz it?

How can you do that in a port or city?

That doesn't make sense and I'm sure I'm missing something simple.


Good Hunting.

MR


Although I am by no means an expert, I believe you:

1- Don't need to attack a city that is empty. If it is empty you would just overrun the planes or ships, and follow the rules about it.

2- Can only call blitz with the units you said, but if it is in city, it's the defender who selects table, not you.

I cannot see which rule makes you need to attack air or sea units with land ones, instead of overrunning them, but even if you needed to fight, then I don't remember any rule that states it needs to be in a blitz, which would be most bizarre because it's not the attacker the one who selects the modality in a city.

< Message edited by Joseignacio -- 5/19/2009 1:50:17 PM >

(in reply to Mad Russian)
Post #: 5
RE: Questions - 5/19/2009 2:22:57 PM   
csharpmao

 

Posts: 83
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline 		Maybe he's thinking this :

If you dow netherland, and the opponent place his unit in Amsterdam.
You cannot advance your units to Rotterdam because of ZoC.
If you attack Amsterdam and win, you can go in Amsterdam.
But you cannot attack Rotterdam even if there is some planes/ship until the next impulse (or with a breakthrough).

In fact, you can go further if you attack and win than if there is no unit in an hex.

(in reply to Joseignacio)
Post #: 6
RE: Questions - 5/19/2009 2:36:22 PM   
Greywolf

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 11/15/2000
Status: offline 		Yep, the best defense is the empty hex. As far as I know it is a trick in the book of a lot of wargame since more than 30 years, WiF not excepting... In WiF one of the best defense for the belgian is to let the Capital empty so it can be attacked and taken, of course if the german have para that is another story.

And we do have HQ of different flavor : HQ-INF and HQ-ARM...

_____________________________

Lt. Col. Ivan 'Greywolf' Kerensky

(in reply to csharpmao)
Post #: 7
RE: Questions - 5/19/2009 6:02:48 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

While going through the new Wif rules, which for me includes everything from version 4 to the final version I find "Issues" in them.

For instance, a unit can only attack on the blitz table with armored, mech or an A HQ. Pretty standard except we didn't have HQ's of different flavors.

What I find interesting is that you can't attack a city that is empty with a fleet or air unit in it unless you blitz it?

How can you do that in a port or city?

I'm not sure I understand what you mean fully, but if you wonder what mechanism allows your troops to enter an enemy city port where there are no enemy land units, but where there are air or naval units, then the answer is : Overrun.

An overrun is when you enter an enemy hex where there are enemy units. If they are naval or air units, they simply have to leave, or can be destroyed depending on the circumstances. If they are land units, you need to be overwhelming in combat power, and this is not allowed in certain types of terrains, such as cities.

(in reply to Mad Russian)
Post #: 8
RE: Questions - 5/20/2009 10:22:46 AM   
Joseignacio


Posts: 2449
Joined: 5/8/2009
From: Madrid, Spain
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: csharpmao

Maybe he's thinking this :

If you dow netherland, and the opponent place his unit in Amsterdam.
You cannot advance your units to Rotterdam because of ZoC.
If you attack Amsterdam and win, you can go in Amsterdam.
But you cannot attack Rotterdam even if there is some planes/ship until the next impulse (or with a breakthrough).

In fact, you can go further if you attack and win than if there is no unit in an hex.



Well, i cannot see the map right now, but I will take that the situation is like you said. Also, I'll assume we are writing about an impulse different than the following after the DoW, because in this case there would be no ZoC (or is it optional?).

Anyway, in this case, the reason for not being able to enter Rotterdam would be the ZoC, no the possible planes/ships and they could be overrun normally the following impulse if the city keeps on being undefended by land units.

(in reply to csharpmao)
Post #: 9
RE: Questions - 5/20/2009 12:27:28 PM   
Greywolf

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 11/15/2000
Status: offline 		Yes, it is optionnal Jose. And from what I read not a lot of people play with Surprised ZoC because the effect can be far too strong.

_____________________________

Lt. Col. Ivan 'Greywolf' Kerensky

(in reply to Joseignacio)
Post #: 10
RE: Questions - 5/20/2009 1:37:32 PM   
Joseignacio


Posts: 2449
Joined: 5/8/2009
From: Madrid, Spain
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf

Yes, it is optionnal Jose. And from what I read not a lot of people play with Surprised ZoC because the effect can be far too strong.


We always do. And as for what I saw in several dozen games, it would be ok not to have that optional rule in Western europe, but my firends and us would never have a chance to defeat Russia with the german production and initial forces if the "surprised ZoC" rule was not in effect, making the first strike devastating for the russian forces that need to be close to the border.

(in reply to Greywolf)
Post #: 11
RE: Questions - 5/20/2009 11:30:03 PM   
Taxman66


Posts: 1665
Joined: 3/19/2008
From: Columbia, MD. USA
Status: offline 		There's too much incentive for Germany to avoid attacking the Netherlands as is, playing with the Surprise ZoC rule just adds to it. 

_____________________________

"Part of the $10 million I spent on gambling, part on booze and part on women. The rest I spent foolishly." - George Raft

(in reply to Joseignacio)
Post #: 12
RE: Questions - 5/21/2009 7:51:48 AM   
Joseignacio


Posts: 2449
Joined: 5/8/2009
From: Madrid, Spain
Status: offline 		Yes, that's why I would understand in that case it wasn't used; but in Russia, with the initial display + production i think it would be too much unbalance if the german didn't have that advantage.

(in reply to Taxman66)
Post #: 13
A question about Milch Cows - 5/21/2009 2:59:00 PM   
macgregor


Posts: 990
Joined: 2/10/2004
Status: offline 		The example in the RaW(what exactly does that stand for anyway?) describes a Walther sub being allowed to return to base at a Milch Cow. So in addition to having a reorg point, they also can act as an at-sea base for subs? The example given describes a very dangerous situation for allied convoys indeed.

(in reply to Joseignacio)
Post #: 14
RE: A question about Milch Cows - 5/21/2009 3:12:35 PM   
Mike Parker

 

Posts: 583
Joined: 12/30/2008
From: Houston TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor

The example in the RaW(what exactly does that stand for anyway?)...


Rules As Written

Essentially the rules for the board game as opposed to RAC Rules As Coded for MWIF.

(in reply to macgregor)
Post #: 15
RE: A question about Milch Cows - 5/21/2009 4:56:48 PM   
macgregor


Posts: 990
Joined: 2/10/2004
Status: offline 		Thanks Mike.

(in reply to Mike Parker)
Post #: 16
RE: A question about Milch Cows - 5/21/2009 5:13:02 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: macgregor

The example in the RaW(what exactly does that stand for anyway?) describes a Walther sub being allowed to return to base at a Milch Cow. So in addition to having a reorg point, they also can act as an at-sea base for subs? The example given describes a very dangerous situation for allied convoys indeed.

Yes.

They have one big drawback though. When a ship or SUB is docked at the Milchcow SUB, it loses its ability to not get involved in combats. It is treated as a surface naval units, so if the enemy finds it, it can harm it without the Milchcow SUBbeing able to dive underwater. Worse, any damage suffered by the Milchcow SUB is also suffered by the ship of SUB docked here.

Also, they don't have a reorg point. It is that ships docked here during the end of turn phase are reorganized for free.

Also, they must be in sea box section 0. None other.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to macgregor)
Post #: 17
RE: A question about Milch Cows - 5/21/2009 5:14:19 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline 		Also, Walther SUBs are not the only ones to be able to dock at Milchcow SUBs. All subs, as well as any ship, can too. The ship can't be loaded though.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 18
RE: A question about Milch Cows - 5/22/2009 4:18:21 PM   
macgregor


Posts: 990
Joined: 2/10/2004
Status: offline 		Thank you very much Froonp!

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 19
RE: A question about Milch Cows - 5/25/2009 5:58:33 PM   
Mike Parker

 

Posts: 583
Joined: 12/30/2008
From: Houston TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Also, Walther SUBs are not the only ones to be able to dock at Milchcow SUBs. All subs, as well as any ship, can too. The ship can't be loaded though.





Its odd that a ship can dock with a milchcow. I wouldn't think they would carry enough nor the proper sorts of material to resupply a surface group. But I suppose fresh food and diesel is enough to consider a surface group 'resupplied' don't know the the German torpedos for the U-boats were the same as the ones carried on their surface units.

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 20
RE: A question about Milch Cows - 5/25/2009 6:33:50 PM   
micheljq


Posts: 791
Joined: 3/31/2008
From: Quebec
Status: offline 		I think the U-Boots sunk a lot of merchant ships using their gun, when they could, to save their torpedoes.

(in reply to Mike Parker)
Post #: 21
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> World in Flames >> Questions Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

2.703