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Most inaccurate war movies - 6/2/2009 9:56:16 AM   
GaryChildress

 

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Status: offline 		Just out of curiosity, what are your picks for the most innacurate war movies? By innacurate it could be innaccurate props, or innaccurate story lines (unless the movie is intentionally about a fictional battle).

Battle of the Bulge has always stuck out with me for some reason. I remember when I was fairly little, seeing The Battle of the Bulge for the first time, and even then knowing that the tanks used in the movie were not German tigers. I know a lot of movies have used innaccurate props but seeing those M47s in Battle of the Bulge sort of sticks out to me.

I would include a category of "Most accurate war movie", however, I can't realy think of many war movies that did a good job in accuracy. Almost all of them seem to have some compromises with props or story. If anyone can name a most accurate war movie I would find that interesting too.

< Message edited by Gary Childress -- 6/3/2009 8:45:25 PM >

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 11:02:47 AM   
Krasny

 

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Status: offline 		Accurate war movies are the exception rather than the rule, because of the twin pressures of saving money by cutting corners and appeasing the censors by minimising the gore.

The first twenty minutes of Saving Private Ryan, and Thin Red Line strike me as being accurate.


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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 11:11:03 AM   
PunkReaper


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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 11:42:03 AM   
SS Hauptsturmfuhrer


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Status: offline 		Blackhawk Down is the most accurate war movie, even down to exact words said and gunbattle situations.  It is tied with Starship Troopers (1997) for the movie I've seen the most times.  Like 4 times each I think.  A Bridge Too Far was another very accurate movie.

Battle of the Bulge was pure cheese start to end like no snow, evil psychotic Germans, fake singing, fake tanks, fake situations etc.  The Longest Day before I stopped watching it was pretty random too showing German fighters strafing the allies on the beaches and the pilots were guffawing as they did it... uhhh hi Mr. Director... there were no German airplanes in Normandy.  Stalingrad (Enemy at the Gates) about the snipers was all dull fiction except for the fact there was a famous Russian sniper in Stalingrad.  The historical situation where an elite German sniper was taken out by the Russian sniper was a lot more interesting than the fictional way the movie did it.  In real life, the famous Russian sniper couldn't find the German so another Russian stuck his head up to provide a target, got shot dead, and so the famous sniper spotted the German and shot him.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 11:49:14 AM   
JudgeDredd


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Status: offline 		Battle of Britain was done to the best of it's ability for it's day...accurate to boot as well, as far as I'm concerned.

As for innacurate, Braveheart!! OMG!

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 12:45:46 PM   
Plodder


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quote:

The Longest Day before I stopped watching it was pretty random too showing German fighters strafing the allies on the beaches and the pilots were guffawing as they did it... uhhh hi Mr. Director... there were no German airplanes in Normandy.


Actually the movie is accurate there,Priller and his wingman in FW190s strafed Sword beach.which is what it shows.


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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 5:22:20 PM   
Sarge


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

Just out of curiosity, what are your picks for the most innacurate war movies? By innacurate it could be innaccurate props, or innaccurate story lines (unless the movie is intentionally about a fictional battle).



Battle of the Bulge ,
hands down the most inaccurate war film of all time that covered historical events.

Equipment, Personalities, Storyline, OOB , Events the list is endless in this train wreck not to mention the famous scene of the German armor advance was put to rest with a single barrel of burning fuel ..........

IIRC the 3rd Army (Patton) was entirely absent in the film ?

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 5:25:05 PM   
GaryChildress

 

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Status: offline 		Haven't seen Blackhawk Down. A Bridge Too Far is probably my favorite war movie of all time because they at least made the effort to use a lot of authentic props or else props doctored to look reasonably close to authentic. Battle of Britian I had forgot about, that was a good one too. Saving Private Ryan was good.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 5:25:43 PM   
Charles2222


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quote:

ORIGINAL: The Plodder

quote:

The Longest Day before I stopped watching it was pretty random too showing German fighters strafing the allies on the beaches and the pilots were guffawing as they did it... uhhh hi Mr. Director... there were no German airplanes in Normandy.


Actually the movie is accurate there,Priller and his wingman in FW190s strafed Sword beach.which is what it shows.


IIRC, they were in ME109's in the movie.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 5:38:59 PM   
Flying Tiger

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles_22


quote:

ORIGINAL: The Plodder

quote:

The Longest Day before I stopped watching it was pretty random too showing German fighters strafing the allies on the beaches and the pilots were guffawing as they did it... uhhh hi Mr. Director... there were no German airplanes in Normandy.


Actually the movie is accurate there,Priller and his wingman in FW190s strafed Sword beach.which is what it shows.


IIRC, they were in ME109's in the movie.


Yes, they were. Obviously a shortage of airworthy FW190's at time of production!!

As for least accurate movie.... i reckon the modern Pearl Harbour has to be close. The original 'Tora, Tora, Tora' was not so bad, but the romantic comedy thing with Ben Afleck was ........ what can i say!!

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 6:01:13 PM   
Sarge


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SS Hauptsturmfuhrer
  The Longest Day before I stopped watching it was pretty random too showing German fighters strafing the allies on the beaches and the pilots were guffawing as they did it... uhhh hi Mr. Director... there were no German airplanes in Normandy. 

JG 2 and JG 26 were both based in France along with the Reich defense gruppen flew over 100+ sorties on D-Day if I’m not mistaken.....


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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 6:01:58 PM   
GaryChildress

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Flying Tiger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles_22


quote:

ORIGINAL: The Plodder

quote:

The Longest Day before I stopped watching it was pretty random too showing German fighters strafing the allies on the beaches and the pilots were guffawing as they did it... uhhh hi Mr. Director... there were no German airplanes in Normandy.


Actually the movie is accurate there,Priller and his wingman in FW190s strafed Sword beach.which is what it shows.


IIRC, they were in ME109's in the movie.


Yes, they were. Obviously a shortage of airworthy FW190's at time of production!!

As for least accurate movie.... i reckon the modern Pearl Harbour has to be close. The original 'Tora, Tora, Tora' was not so bad, but the romantic comedy thing with Ben Afleck was ........ what can i say!!



I would have said PH myself but I have a hard time classifying Pearl Harbor as a "war movie". More like sappy romance movie. It's like classifying Gone With the Wind as a "war movie" based upon the Civil War back drop.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 6:10:51 PM   
Sarge


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles_22


quote:

ORIGINAL: The Plodder

quote:

The Longest Day before I stopped watching it was pretty random too showing German fighters strafing the allies on the beaches and the pilots were guffawing as they did it... uhhh hi Mr. Director... there were no German airplanes in Normandy.


Actually the movie is accurate there,Priller and his wingman in FW190s strafed Sword beach.which is what it shows.


IIRC, they were in ME109's in the movie.


Actually I think they showed BF108 “Taifun‘s” in the film .......

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 6:24:17 PM   
Gil R.


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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 6:41:47 PM   
Perturabo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sarge


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

Just out of curiosity, what are your picks for the most innacurate war movies? By innacurate it could be innaccurate props, or innaccurate story lines (unless the movie is intentionally about a fictional battle).



Battle of the Bulge ,
hands down the most inaccurate war film of all time that covered historical events.

Equipment, Personalities, Storyline, OOB , Events the list is endless in this train wreck not to mention the famous scene of the German armor advance was put to rest with a single barrel of burning fuel ..........

IIRC the 3rd Army (Patton) was entirely absent in the film ?

God, that film was horrible.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 6:42:10 PM   
06 Maestro


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Status: offline 		Too many lame movies to keep track of. There was one doozy-perhaps a British film-I can't recall the name.
It was set in North Africa in the underdog struggle against Rommel. At one point the British generals were talking about their new found intelligence that the secrete German fuel stockpiles were at the Y of Egypt. They could not figure out where there might be a "Y" in Egypt until they realized-it's part of the name!-printed on the map-Shazam! The gist was that while Germany was talking of peace they were secretly stockpiling fuel and ammo in the Egyptian desert-right under the Y on the map.

It has been at least 30 years since I saw that movie-and it was an old one then. Funny how some lone, strange tidbit of a movie can get stuck in the skull. I just might watch that again just for fun-if I could remember what it was called.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 6:53:36 PM   
andym


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Status: offline 		Accurate id say,Cross of Iron and Das Boot.


While a Bridge too far was good,the LAnd rover apc's and Leopards were still too recogniseable.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 6:57:22 PM   
06 Maestro


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress
Battle of the Bulge has always stuck out with me for some reason.


Yep-a total farce. I have not been able to sit through more than a few minutes of that since I was a kid. I would rather watch a 1/2 dozen episodes of Dr. Phill and Opra than to endure watching that film. I don't have that big a problem with the incorrect equipment-understandable-but the rest of it is inexcusable.

Not certain if it was the worst, but its gotta be close.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 9:27:50 PM   
Obsolete


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Status: offline 		Blackhawk Down is the most accurate war movie, even down to exact words said and gunbattle situations.

There were a lot of inaccurate problems I had with this "Hollywood" movie, but it would take threads full to get into them all.  I'll just point out one typical issue then right at the start..

The part where super-duper smart helicopter pilot is able to spot an RPG, and in lightning speed, jerks back the vehicle, and perfectly times the rpg to shoot right threw the open space in the heli, JUST LIKE THAT!

Ummmmmm...... O_o..  ?  Is that Rambo again?



This is Holywood's explanation as to why an American soldier fell off the heli and basically crippled himself.  The fact is, the heli in real-life was in no such situation, and the soldier simply stepped out to grab onto the rope and instead mis-stepped and fell.  There was no action during that time, just a simple standard procedure.  Not even a simple bullet had flown yet, and no one was even expecting one to yet at that point.

Yes, it was a simple accident, but definitely was embarrasing for the forces, so Holywood decided to TWIST the story once again to make it more heroic.

I refuse to get into any more issues on BlackHawkD... let's just say that movie was a let-down for me since I had did some study on the scenario long before HOLLYWOOD decided to bring this to the silver screen for a fast buck.




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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 9:38:43 PM   
Sarge


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Obsolete

Blackhawk Down is the most accurate war movie, even down to exact words said and gunbattle situations.

There were a lot of inaccurate problems I had with this "Hollywood" movie, but it would take threads full to get into them all.  I'll just point out one typical issue then right at the start..

The part where super-duper smart helicopter pilot is able to spot an RPG, and in lightning speed, jerks back the vehicle, and perfectly times the rpg to shoot right threw the open space in the heli, JUST LIKE THAT!

Ummmmmm...... O_o..  ?  Is that Rambo again?



This is Holywood's explanation as to why an American soldier fell off the heli and basically crippled himself.  The fact is, the heli in real-life was in no such situation, and the soldier simply stepped out to grab onto the rope and instead mis-stepped and fell.  There was no action during that time, just a simple standard procedure.  Not even a simple bullet had flown yet, and no one was even expecting one to yet at that point.

Yes, it was a simple accident, but definitely was embarrasing for the forces, so Holywood decided to TWIST the story once again to make it more heroic.

I refuse to get into any more issues on BlackHawkD... let's just say that movie was a let-down for me since I had did some study on the scenario long before HOLLYWOOD decided to bring this to the silver screen for a fast buck.








LOL,

I hardly think they changed the story line simply to cover-up what you perceive as an embarrassment ……

I seen four individuals get medicals in jump school alone, can’t image how you would think during such a operation a misstep would cause Delta and the Rangers embarrassments .


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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 10:32:30 PM   
06 Maestro


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sarge


I hardly think they changed the story line simply to cover-up what you perceive as an embarrassment ……

I seen four individuals get medicals in jump school alone, can’t image how you would think during such a operation a misstep would cause Delta and the Rangers embarrassments .



I know a Ranger who got a Medical after 9 years of service-repelling from a chopper. When you train hard things can and do go wrong-sometimes resulting in fatalities.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/2/2009 11:33:25 PM   
JagdFlanker


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Status: offline 		windtalkers was pretty unbearable to watch. cage looked like an idiot running around firing his thompson with 1 arm

a great movie often overlooked is Stalingrad - not amazing, but really good. the attack of sov T-34s trying to overrun the dug in german squad with 1 AT gun in the middle of the movie was really intense. even though they were using T-34/85s which didn't go into production until a year later, at least they were using T-34s

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/3/2009 1:09:59 AM   
IronDuke_slith

 

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U571 was the worst.

Ingenious American submariners steal Enigma, at one fell swoop writing British efforts (which included some fallen Sailors/real heroes if memory serves) right out of the war.

Someone should have been shot for that.

It was very difficult to get past the tanks in the Bulge movie, I agree with those posters citing that.

Ryan and Bridge too far always seemed the most authentic looking to me. Thin red line looked alright until all them philosophers walked on dressed as American military personnel. It got a bit surreal to me at that point.

Cross of Iron was very nicely done once you were past the stereotypes. Loved Das Boot. Downfall was a more modern classic, but superbly staged.

There is a Korean movie called Brothers if memory serves I have floating about on DVD with some energetic action scenes that deserves honourable mention in dispatches.

Although melodramatic, the longest day was also pretty sharp at times.

I'd also mention Where Eagles Dare simply because I never get tired of watching it.

Regards,
IronDuke



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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/3/2009 1:14:55 AM   
SS Hauptsturmfuhrer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Obsolete

Blackhawk Down is the most accurate war movie, even down to exact words said and gunbattle situations.

There were a lot of inaccurate problems I had with this "Hollywood" movie, but it would take threads full to get into them all.  I'll just point out one typical issue then right at the start..

The part where super-duper smart helicopter pilot is able to spot an RPG, and in lightning speed, jerks back the vehicle, and perfectly times the rpg to shoot right threw the open space in the heli, JUST LIKE THAT!

Ummmmmm...... O_o..  ?  Is that Rambo again?



This is Holywood's explanation as to why an American soldier fell off the heli and basically crippled himself.  The fact is, the heli in real-life was in no such situation, and the soldier simply stepped out to grab onto the rope and instead mis-stepped and fell.  There was no action during that time, just a simple standard procedure.  Not even a simple bullet had flown yet, and no one was even expecting one to yet at that point.

Yes, it was a simple accident, but definitely was embarrasing for the forces, so Holywood decided to TWIST the story once again to make it more heroic.

I refuse to get into any more issues on BlackHawkD... let's just say that movie was a let-down for me since I had did some study on the scenario long before HOLLYWOOD decided to bring this to the silver screen for a fast buck.


I can't remember that scene in the movie but I do remember it in the book. And yes the ranger did miss the rope for no reason other than having pre-battle jitters and moving too fast. Poop on whoever decided to add in the silly embellishment.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/3/2009 1:18:51 AM   
Perturabo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sarge

I hardly think they changed the story line simply to cover-up what you perceive as an embarrassment ……

I seen four individuals get medicals in jump school alone, can’t image how you would think during such a operation a misstep would cause Delta and the Rangers embarrassments .

It would be an embarrassment by a Hollywood "logic". Stepping out from a helicopter and falling would be too "uncool" for Hollywood. Also, it wouldn't be dramatic enough for them.


quote:

ORIGINAL: IronDuke

There is a Korean movie called Brothers if memory serves I have floating about on DVD with some energetic action scenes that deserves honourable mention in dispatches.

Brotherhood of War. I don't know if it's accurate, but it overflows with Pure Awesomeness.

BTW.
I would call Starship Troopers the most inaccurate war movie ever. KILL!!!!!!!!!!

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/3/2009 1:21:24 AM   
gunny

 

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Status: offline 		I hate to diss the Duke but the Green Berets was pretty cheezy. The terrain was local. The extras during the night attack were caucasians in VC cooly hats and it goes on from there. Not sure of the earliest vietnam show that was good, although Go Tell the Spartans 10 years later was up to the task

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/3/2009 1:30:37 AM   
Obsolete


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Status: offline 		If we are talking about the  worst war-movies ever made, I don't think we could possibly come to agreement.  But if we mean worst movies in the last decade or so, then maybe.

I'm sure if anyone who was around during the siege of Troy, and then could watch the movie TROY... we'd be hearing non-stop how rediculous everything was.  You get the point...

But I think IronDuke's nomination of U571 as the worst war-movie ever made seems to be hard to beat.  That one got just about everything about every detail wrong (except who was axis and who was allies), but gets it just right when it comes to U-boat captain stereotypes.  I don't know what more there is to say about that abomination.  It wouldn't bother me so much if it was just another HOLLYWOOD film, but this one tried to pawn itself off as an AUTHENTIC story instead of a fictionalized event.  Sadly, there are people who are inexperienced enough to believe it.




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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/3/2009 1:33:10 AM   
gunny

 

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Status: offline 		Oh here's a good one. El Alemaine when the British M113's dropped their ramps and the Tommies ran out A'la perfect 1980 mechanized assault syle dressed in their pot helmets with enfields and knee socks.

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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/3/2009 1:38:25 AM   
sapper_astro

 

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Status: offline 		U571, Battle of the Bulge, Pearl Harbour...

Something that cracks me up to this day; Kelly's Heroes, that was basically a comedy film, actually tried harder to get things more accurate (especially in props/etc) than some of these "serious" warfilms. The Tigers were t34's underneath, but at least they gave it a shot by trying to make the cover look realistic. Pulled it off to a fair degree.

Blackhawk down wasn't too bad, until night fell and suddenly the super troopers emerged. That made me sit up and laugh my head off. Good old Eric Bana.


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RE: Most innacurate war movies - 6/3/2009 1:45:29 AM   
sapper_astro

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gunny

Oh here's a good one. El Alemaine when the British M113's dropped their ramps and the Tommies ran out A'la perfect 1980 mechanized assault syle dressed in their pot helmets with enfields and knee socks.


Damn, that's a laugh. I will have to check that one out.

There was another movie, with John Belushi in it. He is in the Desert in his Grant/Lee tank, and he teams up with a Pommie, and Aussie and a few others. Haven't seen it for a while, but at least they got the tank right. I cannot remember the name for it now.

Along the same lines, this time a Michael Caine movie, again I cannot remember the name. He is a LRDG operative (Long Range Desert Group) and they set off south through the Western Desert. Again, my memory is hazy on it, but they did a good job with the props/equipment in this one.

Anyone remember the names for these two?

Wild Geese is not a bad film.

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