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RE: MWIF Game Interface Design

 
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RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 2:20:56 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline 		The garrison unit you are referring to is one of the odds ducks I threw into the screen shot. Perhaps Patrice (or someone else) can explain it (its from the Mech in Flames countersheet). There is also the SS Russland unit, which can not explain off the top of my head.

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Post #: 1711
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 6:29:30 AM   
michaelbaldur


Posts: 4774
Joined: 4/6/2007
From: denmark
Status: offline 		it´s a unit from mif .... it´s a unit that cw get for free ...when they control athen ....




white cirkels are free units ....
and germany gets more free units in polif



Attachment (1)

< Message edited by michaelbaldur -- 5/31/2009 6:40:26 AM >

_____________________________

the wif rulebook is my bible

I work hard, not smart.

beta tester and Mwif expert

if you have questions or issues with the game, just contact me on Michaelbaldur1@gmail.com

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Post #: 1712
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 9:55:17 AM   
bredsjomagnus

 

Posts: 141
Joined: 10/22/2006
From: Sweden
Status: offline
quote:

Yes , they are great and easily spotted and indentified. No color trouble like in some others games. Only regret is that I would liked the CW with a bit darker blue but I think this could be related to my computer.


I think this blue is better than the board game cards. I´ve always wondered why CW can´t be light brown like in Third Reich. Its much easier to see the text on them. In board wif the black text on that dark blue CW color is a bad idea, IMHO.

(in reply to christo)
Post #: 1713
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 10:45:30 AM   
DavidFaust

 

Posts: 857
Joined: 9/4/2004
From: Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bredsjomagnus

quote:

Yes , they are great and easily spotted and indentified. No color trouble like in some others games. Only regret is that I would liked the CW with a bit darker blue but I think this could be related to my computer.


I think this blue is better than the board game cards. I´ve always wondered why CW can´t be light brown like in Third Reich. Its much easier to see the text on them. In board wif the black text on that dark blue CW color is a bad idea, IMHO.



I agree, that is one of the reasons I dont play the CW

(in reply to bredsjomagnus)
Post #: 1714
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 11:12:11 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bredsjomagnus

quote:

Yes , they are great and easily spotted and indentified. No color trouble like in some others games. Only regret is that I would liked the CW with a bit darker blue but I think this could be related to my computer.


I think this blue is better than the board game cards. I´ve always wondered why CW can´t be light brown like in Third Reich. Its much easier to see the text on them. In board wif the black text on that dark blue CW color is a bad idea, IMHO.

The black text on a dark background annoyed me enormously too - in over-the-board games. CW is just one place where it happened - some of the minor countries had a similar problem.

Light brown is a dangerous color to use since many players have trouble differentiating that color from some of the others in the game.

MWIF puts a severe strain on the color pallette because there are so many nationalities. I also wanted to make division sized units slightly different in color from their larger brethren (the background color of the NATO insert). What I have tried to do is build in information redundancy so understanding units (and other stuff) doesn't depend solely on color. That is one of the reasons all the minor country units contain a 3 letter abbreviation.

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Post #: 1715
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 11:38:02 AM   
christo

 

Posts: 99
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From: adelaide, australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelbaldur

it´s a unit from mif .... it´s a unit that cw get for free ...when they control athen ....




white cirkels are free units ....
and germany gets more free units in polif




that will teach me not to play with an out of date counter sheet

(in reply to michaelbaldur)
Post #: 1716
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 2:50:57 PM   
Mad Russian


Posts: 13256
Joined: 3/16/2008
From: Texas
Status: offline 		What are the chevron and straight line 12 markers for?

Where can I find a copy of the charts?

Thanks in advance.

Good Hunting.

MR


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Post #: 1717
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 3:00:09 PM   
Taxman66


Posts: 1665
Joined: 3/19/2008
From: Columbia, MD. USA
Status: offline 		I believe you are refering to the fort markers.

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Post #: 1718
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 5/31/2009 3:53:11 PM   
michaelbaldur


Posts: 4774
Joined: 4/6/2007
From: denmark
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

What are the chevron and straight line 12 markers for?

Where can I find a copy of the charts?

Thanks in advance.

Good Hunting.

MR



http://pagesperso-orange.fr/froon/WiF/counters/index.htm

_____________________________

the wif rulebook is my bible

I work hard, not smart.

beta tester and Mwif expert

if you have questions or issues with the game, just contact me on Michaelbaldur1@gmail.com

(in reply to Mad Russian)
Post #: 1719
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/1/2009 6:34:10 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf
But the Vichy sub is not that much different from FF ones, they could use the blue strip to look like other vichy naval unit. Except you can do that because of the way the counters are made if I am right ?


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
I would like all the Vichy French units to have the solid coloring like the submarines and the land units. That would make them appear the same as any other countries units. It is only the bitmaps that prevent that.


Why not make the SUBs (& TRS & AMPH) the same as the other naval units counters, with the 2 strips instead of all solid color ?

(in reply to Greywolf)
Post #: 1720
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/1/2009 9:20:16 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
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From: Honolulu, Hawaii
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf
But the Vichy sub is not that much different from FF ones, they could use the blue strip to look like other vichy naval unit. Except you can do that because of the way the counters are made if I am right ?


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
I would like all the Vichy French units to have the solid coloring like the submarines and the land units. That would make them appear the same as any other countries units. It is only the bitmaps that prevent that.


Why not make the SUBs (& TRS & AMPH) the same as the other naval units counters, with the 2 strips instead of all solid color ?

I could do that - I thought about it for at least 3 seconds once upon a time. Though that makes all the naval units match, it makes them completely different from the land units. And making the land units striped to match the naval units really doesn't appeal to me.

Other opinions? [I can make these changes in under 5 minutes.]

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Perfection is an elusive goal.

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Post #: 1721
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/1/2009 10:16:23 PM   
peskpesk


Posts: 2347
Joined: 7/17/2003
From: Stockholm, Sweden
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets


quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf
But the Vichy sub is not that much different from FF ones, they could use the blue strip to look like other vichy naval unit. Except you can do that because of the way the counters are made if I am right ?


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
I would like all the Vichy French units to have the solid coloring like the submarines and the land units. That would make them appear the same as any other countries units. It is only the bitmaps that prevent that.


Why not make the SUBs (& TRS & AMPH) the same as the other naval units counters, with the 2 strips instead of all solid color ?

I could do that - I thought about it for at least 3 seconds once upon a time. Though that makes all the naval units match, it makes them completely different from the land units. And making the land units striped to match the naval units really doesn't appeal to me.

Other opinions? [I can make these changes in under 5 minutes.]


Steve, if it’s a quick fix, can show us a image of how the modified units would look?

< Message edited by peskpesk -- 6/1/2009 10:22:42 PM >

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Post #: 1722
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/2/2009 7:57:30 AM   
Greywolf

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 11/15/2000
Status: offline 		I agree that stripped land unit wouldn't look too good ( or at least confusing ). But I think that showing all the naval unit with the stripes could be nice as it will help identificate them faster ( plain = land, stripped = naval, boxed = air )....

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Post #: 1723
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/2/2009 8:03:42 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf

I agree that stripped land unit wouldn't look too good ( or at least confusing ). But I think that showing all the naval unit with the stripes could be nice as it will help identificate them faster ( plain = land, stripped = naval, boxed = air )....

All right, I'll try to do a post of that tomorrow.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Greywolf)
Post #: 1724
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 6:43:30 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline 		I have reworked the initiative form. The version from CWIF showed the impulse number and other values but the context/importance of those values was difficult to nuderstand unless you were very familiar with WIF.

I've added the Initiative and Impulse Tracks, similar to the what appears in the paper version (WIF FE). I've also thrown in some of the notes that are on those charts.

The screen shot on the left was taken at the start of Barbarossa, where the scenario setup instructions have dictated which side has the initiative. The player hs no decision to make and just clicks on the OK button to end the phase.

The screen shot on the right is from a later turn in the Global War scenario. The Axis has won the initiative die roll but since the Initiative track is at 0, the Allies can decide whether to ask for a reroll or not. That is why the screen background is green - the US player needs to decide. He makes his choice by clicking on either the Reroll or No Reroll button. I tried to display the die roll for each side (they should appear just above the Reroll & No Reroll buttons), but for some reasons they aren't showing up. I am also thinking about adding the Move First decision to this form since you will want to have most of this information at your fingertips when making that decision.




Attachment (1)

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Perfection is an elusive goal.

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Post #: 1725
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 7:52:15 AM   
Greywolf

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 11/15/2000
Status: offline 		Hum, no RAW on hand but I think you dont know if your opponent want to go first or not when choosing to reroll. Also, the fact you win/loss initiative with a reroll can alter your choice of going first/last so you can adjust the initiative track for next turn. Especially in the 0 area I think. But it could help speed up PBEM.

The sandy texture of the american box make the white writing a bit hard to read. and the OK button and text under it are not centered but slighty to the left. The text that explain the impulse track could benefit to be included into the impulse track box, right now I thought it was explaining the choice you had with the button above him.

Are the white button greyed out or highlighted ? I think that they are greyed out but that dont look that evident as their text label insn't altered like it should be.

And to end with a real nitpicking note: why are the Axis on top of the initiative ladder and Allies on bottom ? isn't Allies before Axis in alphabet ;)

Kudos on your job :)

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Post #: 1726
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 9:50:23 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf

Hum, no RAW on hand but I think you dont know if your opponent want to go first or not when choosing to reroll. Also, the fact you win/loss initiative with a reroll can alter your choice of going first/last so you can adjust the initiative track for next turn. Especially in the 0 area I think. But it could help speed up PBEM.

The sandy texture of the american box make the white writing a bit hard to read. and the OK button and text under it are not centered but slighty to the left. The text that explain the impulse track could benefit to be included into the impulse track box, right now I thought it was explaining the choice you had with the button above him.

Are the white button greyed out or highlighted ? I think that they are greyed out but that dont look that evident as their text label insn't altered like it should be.

And to end with a real nitpicking note: why are the Axis on top of the initiative ladder and Allies on bottom ? isn't Allies before Axis in alphabet ;)

Kudos on your job :)

I have special tweezers for nits and then I burned them using a magnifying glass under the Hawaiian sun.

Many small improvements can really make things much better. Thanks for the feedback.

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Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

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Post #: 1727
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 11:52:42 AM   
Caquineur


Posts: 96
Joined: 4/21/2009
From: Aix en Provence, France, Europe
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
(from text in image) ...These modifiers are +1 when playing Fascist Tide or Day of Infamy...


Instead of "These modifiers are +1", it might be clearer to read "These modifiers are -1 and 0" (obvious for veteran players, not so for beginners like me)

Instead of "Fascist Tide or Day of Infamy", it might be more precise to say "a 1 or 2-map game" - If I'm not mistaken, players may pass in the 2 5-turn scenarios (Barbarossa and Guadalcanal).

Just my one cent and one cent more.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 1728
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 3:27:13 PM   
sajbalk


Posts: 264
Joined: 7/11/2005
From: Davenport, Iowa
Status: offline 		A couple of things: you need to know which side won the initiative last turn because in the currenct turn, last turn's intiative loser wins intiative in the event of ties. So, this information should be displayed somewhere.

For passing to end the turn early -- should read "-1"

Finally, you must choose to re-roll before you know whether the intiative winning side wishes to go first or allow the other side to go first.

Initiatve = higher modified initiative number.
Must choose re-roll or not if you lose.
Then iniative winner chooses to go first or second.
If a tie, the side without initiative wins the initiative.
Remember, initiative is not the same as going first.



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Iowa, USA

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Post #: 1729
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 5:50:41 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Caquineur

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
(from text in image) ...These modifiers are +1 when playing Fascist Tide or Day of Infamy...


Instead of "These modifiers are +1", it might be clearer to read "These modifiers are -1 and 0" (obvious for veteran players, not so for beginners like me)

Instead of "Fascist Tide or Day of Infamy", it might be more precise to say "a 1 or 2-map game" - If I'm not mistaken, players may pass in the 2 5-turn scenarios (Barbarossa and Guadalcanal).

Just my one cent and one cent more.

Yes. Thanks.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

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Post #: 1730
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 6:00:31 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sajbalk

A couple of things: you need to know which side won the initiative last turn because in the currenct turn, last turn's intiative loser wins intiative in the event of ties. So, this information should be displayed somewhere.

For passing to end the turn early -- should read "-1"

Finally, you must choose to re-roll before you know whether the intiative winning side wishes to go first or allow the other side to go first.

Initiatve = higher modified initiative number.
Must choose re-roll or not if you lose.
Then iniative winner chooses to go first or second.
If a tie, the side without initiative wins the initiative.
Remember, initiative is not the same as going first.



I'll add the information about who wins ties. Thanks.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

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Post #: 1731
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 11:49:40 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sajbalk

A couple of things: you need to know which side won the initiative last turn because in the currenct turn, last turn's intiative loser wins intiative in the event of ties. So, this information should be displayed somewhere.

For passing to end the turn early -- should read "-1"

Finally, you must choose to re-roll before you know whether the intiative winning side wishes to go first or allow the other side to go first.

Initiatve = higher modified initiative number.
Must choose re-roll or not if you lose.
Then iniative winner chooses to go first or second.
If a tie, the side without initiative wins the initiative.
Remember, initiative is not the same as going first.



All good points.

(in reply to sajbalk)
Post #: 1732
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/5/2009 11:50:09 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

I have reworked the initiative form. The version from CWIF showed the impulse number and other values but the context/importance of those values was difficult to nuderstand unless you were very familiar with WIF.

These are HUGE improvements over the old ones !!!

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 1733
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/6/2009 1:30:19 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline 		A revised version based on yesterday's forum feedback. Since this screen shot was taken I have widened the space for showing the die rolls, so the 7 no longer drops down to the next line.




Attachment (1)

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Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

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Post #: 1734
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/6/2009 2:33:42 AM   
christo

 

Posts: 99
Joined: 11/24/2005
From: adelaide, australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Caquineur

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
(from text in image) ...These modifiers are +1 when playing Fascist Tide or Day of Infamy...


Instead of "These modifiers are +1", it might be clearer to read "These modifiers are -1 and 0" (obvious for veteran players, not so for beginners like me)

Instead of "Fascist Tide or Day of Infamy", it might be more precise to say "a 1 or 2-map game" - If I'm not mistaken, players may pass in the 2 5-turn scenarios (Barbarossa and Guadalcanal).

Just my one cent and one cent more.


Terms such as 1 or 2 map game will be somewhat redundant given the unified global scale. Could well be confusing to those who have not played WIFFE

(in reply to Caquineur)
Post #: 1735
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/7/2009 11:42:18 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greywolf

I agree that stripped land unit wouldn't look too good ( or at least confusing ). But I think that showing all the naval unit with the stripes could be nice as it will help identificate them faster ( plain = land, stripped = naval, boxed = air )....

All right, I'll try to do a post of that tomorrow.

It took me awhile to get around to this. Here are Vichy French units with the naval units all done with similar striping. I'll eventually get around to removing the thin edging of darker blue/lavender around the air and naval units as they appear on the map. The Flyouts show the units the way I would like them to appear.



EDIT: By the way, Italy conquered France in this game.

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 1736
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/8/2009 2:24:12 AM   
felixghost


Posts: 19
Joined: 6/30/2004
Status: offline 		Looks excellent!

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 1737
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/8/2009 8:49:44 AM   
Greywolf

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 11/15/2000
Status: offline 		+1, nice and crisp :)

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Post #: 1738
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/8/2009 9:02:53 AM   
Caquineur


Posts: 96
Joined: 4/21/2009
From: Aix en Provence, France, Europe
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: christo
quote:

ORIGINAL: Caquineur
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
(from text in image) ...These modifiers are +1 when playing Fascist Tide or Day of Infamy...

...Instead of "Fascist Tide or Day of Infamy", it might be more precise to say "a 1 or 2-map game" - If I'm not mistaken, players may pass in the 2 5-turn scenarios (Barbarossa and Guadalcanal).
...

Terms such as 1 or 2 map game will be somewhat redundant given the unified global scale. Could well be confusing to those who have not played WIFFE


Quite true, I hadn't thought of that - fortunately Steve did and instead of "a 1 or 2-map game" as I suggested, used a less confusing phrase (see post 1734). Thanks for noticing that.

< Message edited by Caquineur -- 6/8/2009 1:48:04 PM >

(in reply to christo)
Post #: 1739
RE: MWIF Game Interface Design - 6/8/2009 9:51:41 AM   
Neilster


Posts: 2890
Joined: 10/27/2003
From: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
Status: offline 		Jeez I hate Vichy France. "Let's fight the guys who are trying to defeat the evil regime that occupies our country"

Sorry? Run that by me again...

Cheers, Neilster

(in reply to Caquineur)
Post #: 1740
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