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For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a problem - 6/8/2009 10:23:54 AM

JudgeDredd

Posts: 8573
Joined: 11/14/2003
From: Scotland
Status: offline

Just recently I wanted to reinstall a game I bought in December 2006. A new version is coming out and from what I recall the original was quite good (after being patched of course).

Anyway, I had some installation issues...I thought I'd post them here for the people who advocate (as I once did) online activations. 5 days and still no software installed. To be completely honest, more than a day without being able to install something you purchased because the company would rather treat you like a pirate than a genuine customer is a day too many. There are probably hundreds (if not thousands) of people playing a pirated copy of this game worldwide...and I, as a legitimate purchaser, cannot. It would be so laughable if it wasn't so sad.

Personally, I'd rather see these companies go down the pan than dance their jig anymore. I'm actually strongly debating whether to continue with my purchase of the British Addon because of this farce...I've been wanting it for so long and I'm already in the series because of CMSF, but I'm seriously debating leaving the online activation scene for good even though I really wanted the British addon (I've already skipped Theatre of War 2 and OOTP10 because of online activation).

It isn't really a long tale...5 days...there are p-lenty of people who have had worse tales of woe, but I'm a fairly impatient man...

Anyway...

03/06/2009 - From Bill Riley
I am currently trying to reinstall software I purchased from you on the 20/12/2006 - Armed Assault.

When I try to start the game, I am asked to "Buy Full Version" or "Activate Licence". When I click Activate Licence, I am taken to a screen where I can Activate New Licence or Reinstall Existing Licence. When I select Reinstall, I enter my Licence Holder name (William Riley) and my Purchase Reference (1-56924F64B65E3C). I then get the message Activation Failed - Activation Code not recognized. Please check that you have entered the details correctly.

I then selected the option Lost your licensing details and entered my email address. I was then sent my Licence Holder name and Purchase Reference...both of which were identical to what I entered.

Can you please sort this out for me. Whilst you are checking the issue can you also please ensure I have activations left.

Regards
W M Riley

quote:

reply 04/06/2008 - From Softwrap
Hi there,

Please click on "Start" then "Run".

Copy the following path into the run box and click on "Ok":

If using Windows Vista - " C:\Users\Public\Documents\Softwrap "

If using Windows XP - " C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\Softwrap "

A window should open with folders, these folder names will look like codes.

I need you to please email me those folder names.

Kind Regards,

Softwrap Support.

04/06/2009 - From Bill Riley
I don't have a Softwrap folder in there. If you are looking for a history from when it was previously installed, I had to rebuild my system some months ago and I haven't had Armed Assault on my computer for the best part of a year

Also, if it's any help, it may be that I am downloading the 1.05 version. I suspect when I purchased the game I downloaded and installed version 1. I was given a link to the 1.05 version by Sprocket in 2008 because my original Sprocket link did not work.

quote:

reply 05/06/2008 - From Softwrap
Hi there,

Please follow the steps in the previous email after you installed ArmA and opened it up for the first time.
The software will automatically create the folders once the software was opened the first time.

Kind Regards,

Softwrap Support

05/06/2009 - From Bill Riley
Did you not understand what I said? Those folders are NOT there! I don't know how many different ways I can say that to make you understand...the folders you want me to take a picture of are not there. I'm honestly not lying to you...the folders aren't in the place you are telling me to look.

quote:

reply 08/06/2008 - From Softwrap
Hi there,

Did you try and look for the folders, after you tryed to run the software first?

Kind Regards

Softwrap Support

08/06/2009 - From Bill Riley
It doesn't matter thank you. I've decided against re-installing the game and have instead decided not to purchase anymore "online activation" games. I'll be informing BI of my reasons.

It's partly down to the support available and partly down to why the hell bother. It's taken me 5 days to get this far and I've still not got the game installed and running. All this hassle for a game I purchased legitimately. The chances are there are hundreds(if not thousands) of people out there that have a pirate copy of this game and are able to install and run it and I, as a legitimate consumer and purchaser of the product, still cannot do so after 5 days of trying.

I won't be jumping through the DRM hoops again.

I'll be letting BI know why I won't be buying their next iteration of the game.

Regards
Bill Riley

Post #: 1

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 11:44:46 AM

Krasny

Posts: 315
Joined: 7/3/2003
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Did you try viewing hidden folders?

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RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 12:43:40 PM

SS Hauptsturmfuhrer

Posts: 358
Joined: 10/26/2008
Status: offline

Why are there still people who buy DRM and support the evil companies that use it? Whoever puts DRM into software ought to be stripped to their underwear, put in stocks in front of a high school, and have baseball bats, pliers and a blowtorch left next to them for the public to make use of.

DRM is bad.

Don't buy it.

It's just that simple.

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Korsun Pocket

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Post #: 3

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 1:08:28 PM

JudgeDredd

Posts: 8573
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From: Scotland
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Krasny, I am a Software Engineer.

I'm not that fussed. I've just chalked it up with the other issues I seem to have with various methods of DRM....but the more and more I get these online activation/limited activation games, the more I find issues (sometimes my fault...like not remembering to unlicence before uninstall!!).

I'm just done with it. I know this topic keeps cropping up, no moreso than the last couple of weeks, but perhaps there's a reason for that...perhaps they are just making things ridiculously bad for genuine purchasers of software.

I've heard a rumour that EA dropped DRM for Sims 3 - I can't abide the game, but I feel inclined to buy the game just to show them that DRM free will get my money! I could call it a waste of money as I'm not interested in it, but I've already lost �30 on the aforementioned game.

(in reply to SS Hauptsturmfuhrer)

Post #: 4

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 1:38:03 PM

sapper_astro

Posts: 300
Joined: 7/5/2005
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I was actually thinking of doing the same thing Judge, though I was going to hand it off as a present to the kids. You can sell it to me instead

I feel your pain. I have seen these nightmares everywhere, while the pirates and those who use their software, enjoy the fruits. When GTA4 came out, It was on my list to eventually buy. After hearing about the online DRM system they have, it has been canceled, along with the new Total War game, and numerous other games.

Thankfully, Sims 3 is not the first to drop the system. The newest Prince of Persia game also dropped this system. So, there is hope. But only so long as people do not buy games with this system.

(in reply to JudgeDredd)

Post #: 5

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 3:09:41 PM

Phatguy

Posts: 1348
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Buffalo,ny
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Krasny

Did you try viewing hidden folders?

Why the heck should we, the legitimate consumer, have to browse through hidden folders?

(in reply to Krasny)

Post #: 6

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 3:12:32 PM

Phatguy

Posts: 1348
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Buffalo,ny
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Krasny, I am a Software Engineer.

I'm not that fussed. I've just chalked it up with the other issues I seem to have with various methods of DRM....but the more and more I get these online activation/limited activation games, the more I find issues (sometimes my fault...like not remembering to unlicence before uninstall!!).

I'm just done with it. I know this topic keeps cropping up, no moreso than the last couple of weeks, but perhaps there's a reason for that...perhaps they are just making things ridiculously bad for genuine purchasers of software.

I've heard a rumour that EA dropped DRM for Sims 3 - I can't abide the game, but I feel inclined to buy the game just to show them that DRM free will get my money! I could call it a waste of money as I'm not interested in it, but I've already lost �30 on the aforementioned game.

I think you would be better off buying a Matrix game and letting Eric give it to a charity or something. Better bang for your buck.

(in reply to JudgeDredd)

Post #: 7

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 3:31:41 PM

Yogi the Great

Posts: 1948
Joined: 4/10/2007
From: Wisconsin
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sapper_astro

canceled, along with the new Total War game, and numerous other games.

Same here, Empire Total War which would have been a must have game for me (I have the others) instead will have one less customer.

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Post #: 8

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 3:44:04 PM

Perturabo

Posts: 2614
Joined: 11/17/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: apathetic lurker

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Krasny, I am a Software Engineer.

I'm not that fussed. I've just chalked it up with the other issues I seem to have with various methods of DRM....but the more and more I get these online activation/limited activation games, the more I find issues (sometimes my fault...like not remembering to unlicence before uninstall!!).

I'm just done with it. I know this topic keeps cropping up, no moreso than the last couple of weeks, but perhaps there's a reason for that...perhaps they are just making things ridiculously bad for genuine purchasers of software.

I've heard a rumour that EA dropped DRM for Sims 3 - I can't abide the game, but I feel inclined to buy the game just to show them that DRM free will get my money! I could call it a waste of money as I'm not interested in it, but I've already lost �30 on the aforementioned game.

I think you would be better off buying a Matrix game and letting Eric give it to a charity or something. Better bang for your buck.

What he said. It's pretty pointless - why donate money for people who make games directed at some other people just because they stopped doing something wrong.
Also, it's not like they did it because they thing activations are morally wrong, because if they would think that, they wouldn't place them in their games in first place.

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They should ask themselves why people who finish schools burned out due to mobbing aren't receiving high enough compensations to not seek vengeance.

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Post #: 9

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 4:11:44 PM

sapper_astro

Posts: 300
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Fair point.

(in reply to Perturabo)

Post #: 10

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 4:34:41 PM

Qwixt

Posts: 902
Joined: 6/19/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Perturabo

quote:

ORIGINAL: apathetic lurker

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Krasny, I am a Software Engineer.

I'm not that fussed. I've just chalked it up with the other issues I seem to have with various methods of DRM....but the more and more I get these online activation/limited activation games, the more I find issues (sometimes my fault...like not remembering to unlicence before uninstall!!).

I'm just done with it. I know this topic keeps cropping up, no moreso than the last couple of weeks, but perhaps there's a reason for that...perhaps they are just making things ridiculously bad for genuine purchasers of software.

I've heard a rumour that EA dropped DRM for Sims 3 - I can't abide the game, but I feel inclined to buy the game just to show them that DRM free will get my money! I could call it a waste of money as I'm not interested in it, but I've already lost �30 on the aforementioned game.

I think you would be better off buying a Matrix game and letting Eric give it to a charity or something. Better bang for your buck.

What he said. It's pretty pointless - why donate money for people who make games directed at some other people just because they stopped doing something wrong.
Also, it's not like they did it because they thing activations are morally wrong, because if they would think that, they wouldn't place them in their games in first place.

(in reply to Perturabo)

Post #: 11

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 5:40:25 PM

leastonh1

Posts: 879
Joined: 2/12/2005
From: West Yorkshire, England
Status: offline

JD, I feel for you mate. It is incredibly frustrating.

I've lost count how many times I've been in a similar position. I just wrote a long rant about my experiences with DRM and deleted it. It's just not worth the blood pressure increase. Suffice it to say, I've wasted a fair amount of time and money on products that turned out to be more trouble than they were worth, mostly due to hoops I was expected to jump through in order to get said product working. If that's the price of being an honest buyer compared to a pirate who can bypass the DRM with ease in less than 5 minutes, I'll pass. I'm not doing it any more for any software.

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Post #: 12

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 6:22:26 PM

Hard Sarge

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Then add in their product model or development philosophy for the Sims is to release with limited content, then release the rest of the content in expansions. In other products of EA's, I would follow a title and wait for a patch due to all the bugs reported, only to see that they never released one patch after release.

Yea, EA can be very cocky, they do not believe they make any mistakes, everything is perfect

I remember one of there basketball games, 1000 posts about how the AI did not get tired, they replied, all you got to do is adjust the slider, another 1000 posts, that there is no slider for this, they did release a patch, added the slider, and allowed the AI to get tired, instead of all the starters playing 48 minutes a game, they played 46

last game I have bought from them (of course, they also trying to make there games consol only now)

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RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 7:13:43 PM

Jeffrey H.

Posts: 3154
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From: San Diego, Ca.
Status: offline

Well it's pretty clear, if you want to play a title with DRM you should simply join up with the pirates, they win hands down.

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Post #: 14

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 8:32:47 PM

Perturabo

Posts: 2614
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Hate the game, not only the DRM!

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RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/8/2009 9:43:18 PM

gunny

Posts: 995
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Funny, once I hit the 1 year mark for buying a new computer I steer clear of any DRM type game initialization. Transferring is too much of a pain. I'm holding off on TOW2. I had my puter for 6 years now and can't squeez any more out of it. Luckily I don't go back to old games after I play them to death.

Matrix games are no problem, just copy the master file to a DVD and the authentication to a text file on the same CD and reload trouble free.

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Post #: 16

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 10:34:21 AM

Krasny

Posts: 315
Joined: 7/3/2003
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quote:

Why the heck should we, the legitimate consumer, have to browse through hidden folders?

My feelings entirely. I was just offering JD what I thought was helpful and pragmatic advice.

Pirate Arma2 and send BI the money for the game and letter telling them your reasons for doing so.

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Post #: 17

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 11:42:19 AM

EUBanana

Posts: 4552
Joined: 9/30/2003
From: Little England
Status: offline

Bought Empire Total War from a local game shop, the software key has been stolen apparently so an online phone home with Steam -> no joy.

Some emails later, and they want a photograph of the CD and booklet emailed to them as proof.

I'm a cheapskate so I don't actually have any way to photograph it and email it, beyond cadging a friends phone.

Hassle. Screw Steam in future!

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Post #: 18

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 12:46:27 PM

TulliusDetritus

Posts: 5521
Joined: 4/1/2004
From: The Zone�
Status: offline

quote:

I'm a cheapskate so I don't actually have any way to photograph it and email it, beyond cadging a friends phone.

Eeeeh? All you need is a cheap digital camera (some of your chums / neighbours / co-workers have to have one) or a telephone. Before sending the pic, you have to resize it. The original can be very big: 2 or 3 megas. Use Gimp, "save as" and the pic will be much smaller. And then send the email with the pic attached. No rocket science

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Post #: 19

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 12:57:37 PM

EUBanana

Posts: 4552
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From: Little England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus
Eeeeh? All you need is a cheap digital camera (some of your chums / neighbours / co-workers have to have one) or a telephone.

I don't have cameras in my phones, because never having really had the urge to take a photo of anything I just save me the price of a video game and buy cheap n nasty phones.

Sure, its not an insurmountable problem, but its hassle I can do without, and hassle I do not deserve as a paying customer. Still, I believe in the market and in voting with your wallet - so I'm never buying another Steam activated game again.

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Post #: 20

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 1:27:01 PM

JudgeDredd

Posts: 8573
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From: Scotland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

quote:

I'm a cheapskate so I don't actually have any way to photograph it and email it, beyond cadging a friends phone.

Eeeeh? All you need is a cheap digital camera (some of your chums / neighbours / co-workers have to have one) or a telephone. Before sending the pic, you have to resize it. The original can be very big: 2 or 3 megas. Use Gimp, "save as" and the pic will be much smaller. And then send the email with the pic attached. No rocket science

I think the point is it's pretty bloody ridiculous that legitimate consumers have to do these ridiculous things. The guy bought the game, and the serial has been stolen. Pirate gets to use the game and he has to jump through hoops. That's the point.

I could keep up my dialog with Softwrap and eventually get ArmA working...but I thought "Why bother?" Life is too short. Write it off as a lesson and move on. Very unusually uncharacteristic of me, as I am normally very tenacious when it comes to bad service support/customer service/call it what you will.

However, it really doesn't bother me too much. I'd probably install it and play it for a couple of weeks, only to uninstall it again. The game on release was bug ridden beyond belief. They don't deserve my money period, nevermind just taking into account the pathetic excuse for DRM.

I'm done with the company (Bohemia Interactive) and online activations and limited activations. Others will be added as I come across problems.

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)

Post #: 21

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 1:34:50 PM

TulliusDetritus

Posts: 5521
Joined: 4/1/2004
From: The Zone�
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" I think the point is it's pretty bloody ridiculous that legitimate consumers have to do these ridiculous things"

I know that. But either he wants to try to fix the problem or he doesn't. It is NOT the end of the world. Come on, the real world is full of such kafakesque anecdotes

Ridiculous yes, but all they want is a ridiculous pic.

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RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 1:50:56 PM

JudgeDredd

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From: Scotland
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The reason I answered your post was your retorte to his post was daft. I'm sure he knows (and you probably knew also) that he wasn't wanting help...just sounding off. You probably knew (as I could guess) that he knew where to get a phone from. So either his point was completely lost on you, or your retorte was tongue in cheek to wind him up.

Neither did anyone in this thread suggest it was the end of the world. The first reference to that was you.

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)

Post #: 23

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 2:19:13 PM

LarryP

Posts: 3783
Joined: 5/15/2005
From: Carson City, NV
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yogi the Great

quote:

ORIGINAL: sapper_astro

canceled, along with the new Total War game, and numerous other games.

Same here, Empire Total War which would have been a must have game for me (I have the others) instead will have one less customer.

Me too, and I own the previous entire series.

(in reply to Yogi the Great)

Post #: 24

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 2:23:50 PM

TulliusDetritus

Posts: 5521
Joined: 4/1/2004
From: The Zone�
Status: offline

And the reason I answer your last comment is that you shouldn't be looking for an excuse to get offended, he he he

This is a public forum, so what I write is not your bloody problem (as long as I don't offend anybody: and I don't). Use the green button and voil�. No rocket science either

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Post #: 25

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 2:39:05 PM

Perturabo

Posts: 2614
Joined: 11/17/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: EUBanana

Bought Empire Total War from a local game shop, the software key has been stolen apparently so an online phone home with Steam -> no joy.

Some emails later, and they want a photograph of the CD and booklet emailed to them as proof.

I'm a cheapskate so I don't actually have any way to photograph it and email it, beyond cadging a friends phone.

Hassle. Screw Steam in future!

Wouldn't returning game to the store be more logical than phoning the tech-help? After all it's the store who is responsible for the state of the package?

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Post #: 26

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 2:47:53 PM

sapper_astro

Posts: 300
Joined: 7/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Perturabo

quote:

ORIGINAL: EUBanana

Bought Empire Total War from a local game shop, the software key has been stolen apparently so an online phone home with Steam -> no joy.

Some emails later, and they want a photograph of the CD and booklet emailed to them as proof.

I'm a cheapskate so I don't actually have any way to photograph it and email it, beyond cadging a friends phone.

Hassle. Screw Steam in future!

Wouldn't returning game to the store be more logical than phoning the tech-help? After all it's the store who is responsible for the state of the package?

Certainly worth a try. They will probably think up some excuse, but nothing ventured, nothing gained. God I hope this online crap goes down the toilet soon, pardon the pun.

(in reply to Perturabo)

Post #: 27

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 2:50:57 PM

mack2

Posts: 243
Joined: 6/29/2007
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Luckily DRM is on the wane almost everywhere at least in consumer level products. The huge backlash over Starforce, games like Bioshock having massive issues with online activations and the general idea of most people who have DRM problems to simply return something that doesn't work and never bother again, and some positive reinforcement like the huge sales of DRM-free games like Sins of a Solar Empire have meant most companies aren't bothering anymore. It's too much hassle, causes hype backlash and tech support issues that they can't afford. That isn't going into the music side of things either.

Apart from the fact piracy has never been proven to save more money from people who buy a game instead of pirating.

quote:

Sure, its not an insurmountable problem, but its hassle I can do without, and hassle I do not deserve as a paying customer. Still, I believe in the market and in voting with your wallet - so I'm never buying another Steam activated game again.

You can get the exact same issue with any game which uses keys, even if they don't use steam. Especially when it has a multiplayer system (because cd-keys are the basis to control the online mp "landscape"). It might not have been a "steam" or "stolen key" issue anyway, could be as simple as a misprinted key.

Is it _that_ hard to take a picture? Most companies don't ask for anything more. You report a stolen key, they get the key from you, a picture of the disk, and send a new one key by email, or contact steam to get the game added to your account. Wait maybe a week to play a game.

Of course, depending on any statutory rights in your area, you could have just taken the game back to the store, told them it didn't work and get a replacement.

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)

Post #: 28

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 2:53:07 PM

LarryP

Posts: 3783
Joined: 5/15/2005
From: Carson City, NV
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sapper_astro

God I hope this online crap goes down the toilet soon, pardon the pun.

Perfect pun for me! I have passed on many games I wanted, all because of Securom and such. I won't finance that garbage.

(in reply to sapper_astro)

Post #: 29

RE: For anyone who thinks online activations aren't a p... - 6/9/2009 3:08:47 PM

EUBanana

Posts: 4552
Joined: 9/30/2003
From: Little England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mack2
Is it _that_ hard to take a picture?

Thats not really the point, is it. But yeah, if you don't have a camera it is slightly more of an issue than a trivial snap-and-email.

quote:

Of course, depending on any statutory rights in your area, you could have just taken the game back to the store, told them it didn't work and get a replacement.

Didn't keep the receipt, like a numpty. I don't buy that many games, I wasn't expecting DRM issues. I am as sweet and innocent as the driven snow - and the only companies I bought from really are Paradox (who have zero protection), Matrix (who are very helpful) and Blizzard (who make subscribing easy for all those listless addicts out there).

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Post #: 30