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RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/14/2009 8:54:12 PM   
ETF


Posts: 1748
Joined: 9/16/2004
From: Vancouver, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

Green button....green button..

And don't worry, "Japan" does not represent Scandinavians...at least not the sort of Scandinavians I know...



What like . . . the rest of you are not so politically correct, but instead smelly fur-accoutred coastal raiders hell-bent on raping and pillaging your way south?

Hate to feed it, but . . . I find the complaints about a one-sentence acknowledgement on page 322 to be _way_ out of line. I wish there was a word in English for sentiments of insincerely trumped-up hyper-sensitivity; the era of political correctness and ultra-relativism seems to have promoted this temperament excessively and I'm tired of seeing it in my classrooms, let alone a game forum.


I think you know the word sir....as you so nicely PM me. We were pathetic.
Thanks.


_____________________________

My Top Matrix Games 1) CMO MP?? 2) WITP/AE 3) SOW 4) Combat Mission 5) Armor Brigade

Twitter
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(in reply to Anthropoid)
Post #: 121
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 3:36:26 AM   
Jorm


Posts: 545
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Melbourne
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DivePac88


quote:

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

What like . . . the rest of you are not so politically correct, but instead smelly fur-accourted coastal raiders hell-bent on raping and pillaging your way south?


I think you got Scandinavians mixed up with Aussies old son.




now thems be fightin words !!.. hehe

sub in sheepskin coated and pillageing west and we have Kiwi costal raiders

(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 122
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 3:57:08 AM   
DivePac88


Posts: 3119
Joined: 10/9/2008
From: Somewhere in the South Pacific.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorm

now thems be fightin words !!.. hehe

sub in sheepskin coated and pillageing west and we have Kiwi costal raiders


No a Kiwi coastal raider is; a NZ Bloke sunning on Bondi Beach wearing Speedos, and scoping the Aussie Chicks.

_____________________________


When you see the Southern Cross, For the first time
You understand now, Why you came this way

(in reply to Jorm)
Post #: 123
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 4:02:24 AM   
Anthropoid


Posts: 3107
Joined: 2/22/2005
From: Secret Underground Lair
Status: offline 		Sheepskins in the South Pacific? Doesn't that get like real sweaty underneath? . . . Oh yeah, you probably LIKE it that way, eh?

_____________________________

The x-ray is her siren song. My ship cannot resist her long. Nearer to my deadly goal. Until the black hole. Gains control...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkIIlkyZ328&feature=autoplay&list=AL94UKMTqg-9CocLGbd6tpbuQRxyF4FGNr&playnext=3

(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 124
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 12:55:56 PM   
goodwoodrw


Posts: 2661
Joined: 2/14/2005
Status: offline 		I will try again, can some one at Matrix give a cost of this add on. surely with the release a short time off, they must have a good idea of the purchase price. Are we going to have to swear an oath of secrecy before buying the game. not to tell anyone what we paid for it.

_____________________________

Formerly Goodwood


(in reply to Anthropoid)
Post #: 125
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 1:26:54 PM   
Cerix


Posts: 25
Joined: 5/30/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB

Are we going to have to swear an oath of secrecy before buying the game. not to tell anyone what we paid for it.




YES!




(in reply to goodwoodrw)
Post #: 126
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 1:39:41 PM   
Anthropoid


Posts: 3107
Joined: 2/22/2005
From: Secret Underground Lair
Status: offline 		Wasn't there some mention of first born sons?

_____________________________

The x-ray is her siren song. My ship cannot resist her long. Nearer to my deadly goal. Until the black hole. Gains control...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkIIlkyZ328&feature=autoplay&list=AL94UKMTqg-9CocLGbd6tpbuQRxyF4FGNr&playnext=3

(in reply to Cerix)
Post #: 127
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 2:50:05 PM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

Wasn't there some mention of first born sons?



Daughters for me.

(in reply to Anthropoid)
Post #: 128
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 4:15:53 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		BASB,

All we have said officially on pricing so far is that it will be less than WITP, but not much less. Final pricing info will be available the week before release.

Regards,

- Erik

_____________________________

Erik Rutins
CEO, Matrix Games LLC



For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.

(in reply to Don Bowen)
Post #: 129
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 5:15:40 PM   
Knavey

 

Posts: 3052
Joined: 9/12/2002
From: Valrico, Florida
Status: offline 		Take a look at the Land Team Design Notes section. The paragraphs for the US forces look good, but the Commonwealth forces appears to be a mistake and a repeat of the US forces section.

_____________________________

x-Nuc twidget
CVN-71
USN 87-93
"Going slow in the fast direction"

(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 130
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/15/2009 10:50:47 PM   
tondern


Posts: 38
Joined: 3/26/2004
From: Foggy Bottom, DC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

BASB,

All we have said officially on pricing so far is that it will be less than WITP, but not much less. Final pricing info will be available the week before release.

Regards,

- Erik




Whoa! Get Real. Given the hours it takes to play, price (within the range of WitP or a little more) should NOT be a big deal.

I'm as cheap as most really frugal New Englander 9th generation types ("tight as the bark on a birch tree"), but let's not quibble about price.

Given earlier posts, the standard potato chip/ beer budget (not to mention the single malt crowd) will out run the cost of AE in a few days. We want Matrix to generate some revenue and be inspired to "start" work (wink wink) on WitP II.

Did I give it away that I'm buying AE even if the naval surface combat routine is not - er - (searching for a diplomatic term) yet perfected? Well I am!

Johnny




(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 131
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 12:05:33 AM   
Lifer

 

Posts: 384
Joined: 6/8/2003
From: Caprica
Status: offline 		That's an obvious reference to the notorious Wii

_____________________________

Man does not enter battle to fight, but for victory. He does everything that he can to avoid the first and obtain the second.
Ardant du Picq

(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 132
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 12:19:28 AM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Are you sure I just downloaded it and it looks ok to me ??
quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavey

Take a look at the Land Team Design Notes section. The paragraphs for the US forces look good, but the Commonwealth forces appears to be a mistake and a repeat of the US forces section.


(in reply to Knavey)
Post #: 133
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 6:59:15 AM   
goodwoodrw


Posts: 2661
Joined: 2/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

BASB,

All we have said officially on pricing so far is that it will be less than WITP, but not much less. Final pricing info will be available the week before release.

Regards,

- Erik


Well around $80 Australian, an expensive add on, and if you don't own the original, you have to folk out $A180,
Must be a lot of rich gamers out there!


_____________________________

Formerly Goodwood


(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 134
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 7:17:57 AM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Are you sure I just downloaded it and it looks ok to me ??
quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavey

Take a look at the Land Team Design Notes section. The paragraphs for the US forces look good, but the Commonwealth forces appears to be a mistake and a repeat of the US forces section.




There's definitely repetition. The opening paragraphs for "US Military" and "Commonwealth Forces" are absolutely identical. To the word. A better approach would have been to treat that paragraph as "applicable to all", and use that as the lead-in to the nationality specific sections. The first sentence even suggests as much: "A lot of work was done to fairly assess unit strength and experience across all nationalities." (empasis added). One other comment. The notes refer only to the US and CW forces. Once AE is released and the Land Team has more time available, it would be nice if you could add something for Japan, USSR, & China.

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 135
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 7:36:24 AM   
Anthropoid


Posts: 3107
Joined: 2/22/2005
From: Secret Underground Lair
Status: offline 		My wife and a friend went out to eat at a common chain eatery tonight "Chilis." The friend picked up the tab but I wouldn't doubt that that was about $50 maybe even $60 (two margaritas $16, two salads $14, massive nachos $12, NY Strip $17, taxachusetts ~$7 = $66 plus tip $14 = $80). See, I didn't even really think about just how much that meal cost three folks, and that is by no means any "fancy" place. Had it been the wife and I going to a dinner and movie it wouldve been the same.

The price of one mid-rate "night out" for a middle-aged couple in New England seems pretty modest for a game that will be on my HD for probably years, and yield probably a thousand or more hours of enjoyment.

The price of the original and the expansion for two point three nights out on the town seems no less modest IMO.

Plus, that fricking margarita and steak gave me indigestion and here I am up surfing the web at 2:30 AM! How often will AE do THAT to me!?

_____________________________

The x-ray is her siren song. My ship cannot resist her long. Nearer to my deadly goal. Until the black hole. Gains control...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkIIlkyZ328&feature=autoplay&list=AL94UKMTqg-9CocLGbd6tpbuQRxyF4FGNr&playnext=3

(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 136
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 8:03:11 AM   
DivePac88


Posts: 3119
Joined: 10/9/2008
From: Somewhere in the South Pacific.
Status: offline 		Eighty dollars Aussie is about one hundred dollars New Zealand, and for the amount of time I spend on this game that’s cheap. These operational wargames are not mainstream games, they are specialist games catering to a limited market compared to the mainstream type. Therefore it is only to be expected that they are not cheap, but considering what I used to spend on a comparable broad game, WitP plus AE still workout cost-effective in my book.

_____________________________


When you see the Southern Cross, For the first time
You understand now, Why you came this way

(in reply to ETF)
Post #: 137
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 8:17:21 AM   
goodwoodrw


Posts: 2661
Joined: 2/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DivePac88

Eighty dollars Aussie is about one hundred dollars New Zealand, and for the amount of time I spend on this game that’s cheap. These operational wargames are not mainstream games, they are specialist games catering to a limited market compared to the mainstream type. Therefore it is only to be expected that they are not cheap, but considering what I used to spend on a comparable broad game, WitP plus AE still workout cost-effective in my book.


Divepac88,
My guestomate may be wrong, my calculation is based on Erik's post. WITP at the moment $A97 so less than but much less than is around $A80 hopefully I'm wrong. paying more for an add than most new wargames.

Anthropoid
If you go to a decent restaurant here in Oz 150 bucks for two is reasonable fare our local bush Mex rest $30/50 per head, but its unfair to compare apples with wargames
Ron

_____________________________

Formerly Goodwood


(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 138
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 1:39:27 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB
Well around $80 Australian, an expensive add on, and if you don't own the original, you have to folk out $A180,
Must be a lot of rich gamers out there!


It's not really an add-on though. It's a separate game that requires the first one to play because we don't want customers jumping into AE without any previous experience with a "monster" wargame like this. The amount of time and effort that went into AE actually exceeds the original development of WITP by my count.


_____________________________

Erik Rutins
CEO, Matrix Games LLC



For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.

(in reply to goodwoodrw)
Post #: 139
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 1:57:45 PM   
rjopel

 

Posts: 614
Joined: 12/19/2007
From: Charlottesville, VA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

\snip/

Plus, that fricking margarita and steak gave me indigestion and here I am up surfing the web at 2:30 AM! How often will AE do THAT to me!?


Let's see reasons AE will give you indigestion.

1. You lost all 8 battleships at Pearl.
2. The Enterprise and Lexington ran into the KB on the way back to Pearl from Wake.
3. Your invasion plans went horibly wrong.
4. ...

(in reply to Anthropoid)
Post #: 140
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 2:28:34 PM   
Curty

 

Posts: 269
Joined: 11/25/2005
From: Barnard Castle,Durham County,UK
Status: offline 		Checks wallet....has wallet shot

_____________________________


(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 141
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 3:12:29 PM   
Flying Tiger

 

Posts: 496
Joined: 3/11/2008
From: ummmm... i HATE that question!
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

Sheepskins in the South Pacific? Doesn't that get like real sweaty underneath? . . . Oh yeah, you probably LIKE it that way, eh?


DivePac comes from Otago. It is FREEZING down there!! Plus he is a kiwi, and we all know how kiwi's feel about sheep!!

(in reply to Anthropoid)
Post #: 142
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 3:33:31 PM   
DivePac88


Posts: 3119
Joined: 10/9/2008
From: Somewhere in the South Pacific.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Flying Tiger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

Sheepskins in the South Pacific? Doesn't that get like real sweaty underneath? . . . Oh yeah, you probably LIKE it that way, eh?


DivePac comes from Otago. It is FREEZING down there!! Plus he is a kiwi, and we all know how kiwi's feel about sheep!!


Yep... we really love our sheep.

_____________________________


When you see the Southern Cross, For the first time
You understand now, Why you came this way

(in reply to Flying Tiger)
Post #: 143
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 5:30:02 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Price is a thorney issue.  Given the amount of time and resources Matrix devoted to the game - even considering that so much time was donated - and the relatively small market for a game of this complexity, the price has to be fairly stout to justify the investment.  Yet, the economy stinks right now and many of us have to get appropriations okayed by our comptrollers (IE, spouses).  Of course, I have a work-issued credit card, and I AM the boss, so I can always run the purchase through my business and "give myself the game as a well-earned bonus."

Or...I can continue to observe strictly my vow of celibacy....

(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 144
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 6:05:56 PM   
Knavey

 

Posts: 3052
Joined: 9/12/2002
From: Valrico, Florida
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Are you sure I just downloaded it and it looks ok to me ??
quote:

ORIGINAL: Knavey

Take a look at the Land Team Design Notes section. The paragraphs for the US forces look good, but the Commonwealth forces appears to be a mistake and a repeat of the US forces section.




US Military
A lot of work was done to fairly assess unit strength and experience across all nationalities.
‘Fifty’ was set as the norm for the highest experience level an LCU could achieve, without being
in combat. Exceptions were made for elite units. Weapons performance was better aligned
(example: All .50 caliber machine guns now have the same ceiling). Even individual rifles were
rated and their value rolled into the ‘squad’ firepower rating. One of the biggest changes was
counting medium and heavy caliber machine guns as separate devices.

Commonwealth Forces
A lot of work was done to fairly assess unit strength and experience across all nationalities.
‘Fifty’ was set as the norm for the highest experience level an LCU could achieve, without
being in combat. Exceptions were made for elite units or especially well trained units. Weapons
performance was better aligned (ex: All rifle caliber machine guns now have the same ceiling).
Even individual rifles were rated, and their value rolled into the ‘squad’ firepower rating. One
of the biggest changes was counting medium and heavy caliber machine guns as separate
devices.


Opening quotes from the manual. Both are the same with the exception of talking about the .50 cal machine gun.

_____________________________

x-Nuc twidget
CVN-71
USN 87-93
"Going slow in the fast direction"

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 145
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 6:32:17 PM   
Flying Tiger

 

Posts: 496
Joined: 3/11/2008
From: ummmm... i HATE that question!
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DivePac88


quote:

ORIGINAL: Flying Tiger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

Sheepskins in the South Pacific? Doesn't that get like real sweaty underneath? . . . Oh yeah, you probably LIKE it that way, eh?


DivePac comes from Otago. It is FREEZING down there!! Plus he is a kiwi, and we all know how kiwi's feel about sheep!!


Yep... we really love our sheep.


Go to sleep mate!! Its about 3am over there!!!

(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 146
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 9:04:04 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Knavey you are correct its a bit of lazy writing probably by me - the next para is unique though

(in reply to Flying Tiger)
Post #: 147
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/16/2009 9:59:11 PM   
tondern


Posts: 38
Joined: 3/26/2004
From: Foggy Bottom, DC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Price is a thorney issue.  Given the amount of time and resources Matrix devoted to the game - even considering that so much time was donated - and the relatively small market for a game of this complexity, the price has to be fairly stout to justify the investment.  Yet, the economy stinks right now and many of us have to get appropriations okayed by our comptrollers (IE, spouses).  Of course, I have a work-issued credit card, and I AM the boss, so I can always run the purchase through my business and "give myself the game as a well-earned bonus."

Or...I can continue to observe strictly my vow of celibacy....


Divepac, Anthropoid, et.al. AGREED. Whatever we pay for AE it's cheap relative to our time, or a night out at the movies, etc.

And Canoerebel, of course you've earned it. (BTW beautiful canoeing in SE TN. As I'm chicken, I prefer floating down the Hiawassee with a six-pack in tow. The Ocoee is for adventurers.)

Now can we just get Matrix into profit-maximizing mode? I'd BUY an advance, preliminary, in-need-of-editing, etc., copy of the manual.

As long as I hide it from she-who-must-be-obeyed.

Yours,
Johnny

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 148
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/17/2009 1:25:51 AM   
mariandavid

 

Posts: 297
Joined: 5/22/2008
Status: offline 		An earlier post raised questions on some of the levels experience could be taken to without combat, and listed in the manual extracts that have been published. I am assuming that these levels (such as the 50 for British/Indian and the 65 for US Marines) refer to units that start on the map. As far as the British are concerned that would be valid - units forming/created/initially present in 1941 are (with a couple of exceptions) 'average'. However I am again assuming that some of the units that appear as reinforcements - notable examples are the 7th Australian, 5th Indian and 70th British - would initiate with much, much higher experience and morale levels.

(in reply to tondern)
Post #: 149
RE: War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition Manual Preview - 6/17/2009 6:52:39 AM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mariandavid

An earlier post raised questions on some of the levels experience could be taken to without combat, and listed in the manual extracts that have been published. I am assuming that these levels (such as the 50 for British/Indian and the 65 for US Marines) refer to units that start on the map. As far as the British are concerned that would be valid - units forming/created/initially present in 1941 are (with a couple of exceptions) 'average'. However I am again assuming that some of the units that appear as reinforcements - notable examples are the 7th Australian, 5th Indian and 70th British - would initiate with much, much higher experience and morale levels.


I'd expect so too. And it'll be very easy to edit, if necessary too.


_____________________________

"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von Bülov, 1870-


(in reply to mariandavid)
Post #: 150
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