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remember the original wargame construction set

 
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remember the original wargame construction set - 6/21/2009 9:36:24 PM   
gunny

 

Posts: 995
Joined: 3/1/2003
Status: offline 		Long before modding was even conceived SSI put out the WGCS back in the apple II tandy IBM x86 days.

One could select a sprite, could be a unit, a man, a space future warrior, artillery, tank. Next define its strength, defence and attack attributes. Movement points. Ranged attack. If it was artillery it could fire a ranged attack.

Next you select the map and create movement costs. Some maps were red martian landscapes or green jungles. Done, then you would play the wargame scenario you just created in less than 5 minutes.

I just thought it would be interesting to see this recreated in this day and age with todays graphics, detailed maps. Sprites replaced by 3d objects, hi res and sound effects. But the 5 minute construction still the theme of the game.

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RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/21/2009 10:16:59 PM   
pasternakski


Posts: 6565
Joined: 6/29/2002
Status: offline 		I loved it. For about five minutes.

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Post #: 2
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/21/2009 10:57:22 PM   
E

 

Posts: 1247
Joined: 9/20/2007
Status: offline 		I was completely let down when it never came out for the Apple. Then I saw it only allowed Roger Damon-styled wargames and felt much better. I eventually got it when I swapped to PC's and kicked myself for ever wanting it in the first place. (not only could you only do Roger Damon styled games, it and everything else looked horrible on PC).

I even booted it up a few months ago. It still looks terrible. *grin*

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Post #: 3
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/22/2009 12:09:03 AM   
Greybriar


Posts: 1148
Joined: 2/9/2007
Status: offline 		I never played the first Wargame Construction Set, but I played its successors Wargame Construction Set II: TANKS! and Wargame Construction Set III: Age of Rifles 1846-1905 a LOT! I would love to see a sequel to either or both of the last two.

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Post #: 4
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/22/2009 3:16:25 AM   
bartholimew

 

Posts: 86
Joined: 2/23/2004
From: Swastika Ontario Seriously I am
Status: offline 		hah I remember this. Did not seem implemented well. But agree would be interesting to reinvent. Never played tanks - was it better? Played AOR and that was not what I would call a war game construction set.

http://www.answers.com/topic/wargame-construction-set

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Post #: 5
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/22/2009 3:27:28 AM   
Greybriar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bartholimew

....Never played tanks - was it better? Played AOR and that was not what I would call a war game construction set....


Since I didn't play the original WGS, it would be unfair of me to claim either was better. But I certainly enjoyed playing the last two games in the series.

Note I wrote "games" instead of "construction sets." If there was an editor included with either of them, I never used it.


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RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/22/2009 5:14:29 AM   
SS Hauptsturmfuhrer


Posts: 358
Joined: 10/26/2008
Status: offline 		Sounds like a cool idea.  You could cook up some funky hotseat games doing that.

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RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/22/2009 5:35:13 AM   
sabre1


Posts: 1928
Joined: 8/15/2001
From: CA
Status: offline 		+1 for Greybriar!

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Post #: 8
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/22/2009 7:26:34 AM   
Veldor


Posts: 1531
Joined: 12/29/2002
From: King's Landing
Status: offline 		SSI "borrowed" the idea from EA. Adventure Construction Set & Racing Destruction/Construction Set were two of my all-time favorite games. When SSI made Wargame Construction Set a year later so was it. The later sets II & III all lacked the same sparks and never saw quite the same fanfare and the whole concept seemed to have died off forever after.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adventure_Construction_Set

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racing_Destruction_Set

Not quite the same thing but I'm also reminded of "Mail Order Monsters" which also came out that same year and was a bit of a "Monster Construction Set".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mail_Order_Monsters

That game in turn reminds me of Archon & Archon II

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archon
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archon_II

Which in turn reminds me of....

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RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 12:25:07 AM   
Brigz


Posts: 1162
Joined: 1/20/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bartholimew

hah I remember this. Did not seem implemented well. But agree would be interesting to reinvent. Never played tanks - was it better? Played AOR and that was not what I would call a war game construction set.


Tanks! was a very fun game to play. I still crank it up occasionally because the battles can be fast and addictive. It's about as close as you can get to a computer version of AH's PanzerBlitz/PanzerLeader games. Runs on WinXP with the help of Dosbox. Here's a link to a good website for those interested where you can download the game, DosBox and lots of scenarios:
http://www.fprado.com/armorsite/tanks.htm

< Message edited by Dave Briggs -- 6/23/2009 12:27:01 AM >

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RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 12:56:56 AM   
scriibe

 

Posts: 12
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline 		I had the original WCS and AOR (which I still play using DOSBox). The original had its moments, but may have been a little too ambitious for its day. As for AOR, it is still my all-time favorite computer wargame and if it were ever redone, I would jump on it immediately. I am curious about Tanks and if available (for a reasonable price) I would probably give it a shot. Battles of Napoleon also had a similar construction set, although I always found the Command in Control aspects of the game confusing ("Where are my orders?").

I agree that it would be interesting seeing the game remade using contemporary computing power. I would also like to see it so flexible that a simple battle could be created in minutes, while grognards would be able to tinker to their hearts content.

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Post #: 11
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 3:29:29 AM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		While I enjoyed them all, I also have to say my favorites were II (Tanks) and III (Age of Rifles).

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Post #: 12
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 6:12:19 AM   
Veldor


Posts: 1531
Joined: 12/29/2002
From: King's Landing
Status: offline 		The difference for me was Age of Rifles was a better game, but from what I remember you could play it a whole lot more as a game as well. Whereas with the very first one it was a true construction set. All it had were a few samples made with the tool and basically you had to otherwise entertain yourself making your own (Same with the other 2 construction sets that year). From memory the first game was the only one well received (as a construction set) though obviously AoR was the best selling/best known from a gaming perspective.

Of course that concept would never fly today. From that angle many a Matrix Game is also a construction set. Advanced Tactics comes to mind. But we expect a fully developed and functional game in addition...

Actually AT reminds me more of the real versatility of the first set whereas later ones seemed more limiting and regimented to what they provided already (more like modding).

Of course my memory is also a bit faulty but AT seemed to scratch a similar itch for me.

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Post #: 13
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 1:08:15 PM   
RedArgo


Posts: 524
Joined: 8/2/2004
From: Illinois
Status: offline 		In case you are interested, there is a company that just released Archon Classic for the I-Phone and says it will be out later in the year for PC. I don't have an I-Phone, but I would like to get it as a PC game.

I remember playing Mail Order Monsters a lot. Mostly because the 1541 disk drive on my Commodore 64 was so slow.

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Post #: 14
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 2:12:04 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		Advanced Tactics is definitely our "Wargame Construction Set", I would agree with that. While there are a number of games in our catalog that have fantastic scenario creation tools, Advanced Tactics is the most "open ended" with people able to create battles of just about any kind, any period, any scale.

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Post #: 15
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 3:12:38 PM   
JudgeDredd


Posts: 8573
Joined: 11/14/2003
From: Scotland
Status: offline 		Yeah...with factions called Hindu Lights and Ariel Angels

Sorry... I just didn't get on with it. Too little immersion

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Post #: 16
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 5:25:57 PM   
Jeffrey H.


Posts: 3154
Joined: 4/13/2007
From: San Diego, Ca.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Yeah...with factions called Hindu Lights and Ariel Angels

Sorry... I just didn't get on with it. Too little immersion



Eriks point is that AT can be used to create games with any sort of names you like.

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RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 5:43:41 PM   
Vic


Posts: 8262
Joined: 5/17/2004
Status: offline 		The thing is... the more versatile you make your engine the more impossible it becomes to provide a good AI to go with it.

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Post #: 18
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 6:30:10 PM   
Hertston


Posts: 3564
Joined: 8/17/2002
From: Cornwall, UK
Status: offline 		Well, it was better than UMS.  Just not much.. 

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Post #: 19
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 6:37:31 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		UMS, ouch, I had some bad experiences with that one.

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Post #: 20
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 8:25:05 PM   
JudgeDredd


Posts: 8573
Joined: 11/14/2003
From: Scotland
Status: offline 		I did know what Eriks point was. My point was it was too much work to make immersive.

Ok, "too much work" is a bit harsh, but I don't expect to work when I want to play a game...I simply want to load and, erm, play.

But hey - people love it. I got rid of it faster than I bought it.

Edited for spelling as usual!

< Message edited by JudgeDredd -- 6/23/2009 10:41:26 PM >

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Post #: 21
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/23/2009 9:08:23 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		Judge,

Hey, it's a subjective thing. Personally, I love AT and still play it.

Regards,

- Erik

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For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

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Post #: 22
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/24/2009 3:16:04 AM   
madgamer2

 

Posts: 1235
Joined: 11/24/2004
Status: offline 		I find this term "Immersion" each of us seems to define it a bit different so perhaps we should open a thread to allow each to present there version of what the heck it means.
What ever it is there is more to it than "I want to be there" kind of statement. So lets here so of the deffinitions of what it means.

Madgamer

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Post #: 23
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/24/2009 3:17:25 AM   
madgamer2

 

Posts: 1235
Joined: 11/24/2004
Status: offline 		A-M-E-N!!!!!!!!!!

Madgamer

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Post #: 24
RE: remember the original wargame construction set - 6/24/2009 4:13:17 AM   
Greybriar


Posts: 1148
Joined: 2/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hertston

Well, it was better than UMS.  Just not much.. 


I never played UMS: The Universal Military Simulator. Surely it wasn't any worse than UMS II, was it? (By the way, I posted the link to an eBay auction because of the images of the retail game box and its contents and not to advocate anyone buying it--for $69.99 U.S.)

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