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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 5:50:35 AM   
byron13


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chad Harrison

As for the subs though, this could also help represent the Allies ability to use SigInt to track a specific TF and route subs to it.

I have always thought that subs were way under powered, especially for the Allies.


I'm not looking to hi-jack the thread, but I'm going to throw this out there - this being a topic I am not too familiar with from a historical perspective. No doubt subs could be attached to local operations, whether for screening, pilot rescue, recon, or whatever. My impression of deep patrols hunting merchants was they departed Pearl, opened their orders to maintain secrecy and, generally, no one but HQ knew where they were. But that's not my concern.

My concern is that there are a number of changes in AE that, in combination, may over-stress the Japanese. These are:

1. The new supply system that seeks to require the Japanese to import a historical amount of resources - or seeks to require the Japanese to use its merchant fleet to a historical degree to maintain production in Japan. My guess from what I've read on other threads is that the Japanese are going to have to use a substantial majority of their merchants to maintain the war machine.

2. AE now provides for patrol areas. In WitP, if you manually deployed subs, you either had to move them every turn or else they were easily spotted and avoided. I started letting the computer to do this, and I never really bothered to check the degree to which the computer moved the subs constantly (my guess is it did it a lot because I usually play against the AI, and the AI moved around a lot). Now, with the patrol area function, it is much easier for the player select choke-points, manually place subs where they will do the most damage, and reduce their detection level by using the patrol function.

3. As stated above, radar is improved.

4. The react function seems to me to be too effective.

5. I can't prove it, but I would guess that sub tempo is unrealistically high in the game (tempo has been a problem for all aspects of the game). Certainly subs like Wahoo maintained an incredibly high temp rate - probably about as high as can be maintained by an AE player. But I'm guessing a number of subs were regularly tasked to do something other than hunt Japanese; otherwise the desnsity of subs around Japan is higher than I would have expected. By early '45, the Allies have access to about 300 subs (including S class boats) less any that have been sunk. At least 2/3 of these are probably on station at any one time. At 60 miles a hex, that is pretty dense coverage. Forty miles per hex may help, but that's still a lot of subs with nothing to do but strangle Japan. With the new react function, I see real problems.

Granted AE provides the Japanese player with more ASW assets (though I'm not sure about their effectiveness). But I'll just state the concern - not quite a prediction - that subs will be too powerful a weapon in the hands of the Allies, and Japan may wither ahistorically fast. Through the end of '43, U.S. subs were averaging about 2 - 5 sinkings per month of all kinds. Those averages jump up in the last several months of '44 to around 10 - 15 or so per month (based on a 1947 publication of Japanese Naval and Merchant Shipping Losses During World War II By All Causes). I wonder if someone could run a scenario in mid- to late-43, use the react function, and see what losses are achieved.

However, none of the testers has raised this as an issue, so I hope I am wrong.

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 8:46:02 AM   
EUBanana


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quote:

ORIGINAL: byron13
2. AE now provides for patrol areas. In WitP, if you manually deployed subs, you either had to move them every turn or else they were easily spotted and avoided. I started letting the computer to do this, and I never really bothered to check the degree to which the computer moved the subs constantly (my guess is it did it a lot because I usually play against the AI, and the AI moved around a lot). Now, with the patrol area function, it is much easier for the player select choke-points, manually place subs where they will do the most damage, and reduce their detection level by using the patrol function.


...I don't think reducing micromanagement can be construed as 'helping the Allies'. Thats a good thing, no matter what.

quote:


4. The react function seems to me to be too effective.

5. I can't prove it, but I would guess that sub tempo is unrealistically high in the game


I think as far as submarines are concerned, it is the Japanese whose reaction mechanic bothers me somewhat. The Japanese have those Glen boats, so they can bring their own recon to the party, wherever the party may be, and using the reaction mechanic set up a wolfpack far more effective than one the Allies can create. Or the Germans, for that matter!

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 9:08:21 AM   
JeffroK


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I think as far as submarines are concerned, it is the Japanese whose reaction mechanic bothers me somewhat. The Japanese have those Glen boats, so they can bring their own recon to the party, wherever the party may be, and using the reaction mechanic set up a wolfpack far more effective than one the Allies can create. Or the Germans, for that matter!

I agree, it assumes a level of co-operation which I dont believe the japanese ever achieved.

Plus I believe it is also too strong for the Allied sub fleets, maybe a very limited reaction (1 hex) but thats all.


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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 11:50:17 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: byron13

However, none of the testers has raised this as an issue, so I hope I am wrong.



As always I could be wrong on this but...

Its very possible I am the first tester to actually try it.

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 1:56:35 PM   
Panther Bait


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Until the Allies get closer to Japan or the subs get radar, the react feature shouldn't be too much of a problem because there will not be much air patrol activity in the area. 

Unless the US/UK starts sending PBYs to China, the US will not have good naval search planes on station in the South and East China Seas  or the Philippine Sea (at least once the PI are knocked out).  The Java and Celebes Seas might be more vulnerable until Java/Timor/Northern Oz are occupied/suppressed.

So without patrol planes making contact reports, the subs won't have much to react to, except their own contacts in their own hexes.  In fact, if the subs are set to react to other sub contacts, it makes them vulnerable to ASW TFs sailing a day or two ahead of the transports, especially with crappy torps in the tubes.

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 2:54:21 PM   
EUBanana


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther Bait

Until the Allies get closer to Japan or the subs get radar, the react feature shouldn't be too much of a problem because there will not be much air patrol activity in the area. 

Unless the US/UK starts sending PBYs to China, the US will not have good naval search planes on station in the South and East China Seas  or the Philippine Sea (at least once the PI are knocked out).  The Java and Celebes Seas might be more vulnerable until Java/Timor/Northern Oz are occupied/suppressed.

So without patrol planes making contact reports, the subs won't have much to react to, except their own contacts in their own hexes.  In fact, if the subs are set to react to other sub contacts, it makes them vulnerable to ASW TFs sailing a day or two ahead of the transports, especially with crappy torps in the tubes.


All very true, though I did put PBYs in China in my last WITP game to help direct subs.

But, yes. I agree completely. Hence my comment on Glens. The real victor of this rule is definitely not the Allies, but the Japanese, as they can have extremely difficult to interdict naval search aircraft basically anywhere they want. And I think this use of the aircraft, or even the capability of a Glen to spot for a wolfpack of Japanese submarines, its pretty grossly ahistorical.

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 3:06:25 PM   
Sardaukar


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Having max. react range for subs might be very bad, if enemy is running several ASW TFs in area...or even if all subs react to one that happens to come to area.  And it teaches players to escort their ships, especially if high-value.

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 3:41:37 PM   
EUBanana


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

Having max. react range for subs might be very bad, if enemy is running several ASW TFs in area...or even if all subs react to one that happens to come to area.  And it teaches players to escort their ships, especially if high-value.


Assuming subs react to ASW TFs, yes, that could be embarassing.

I don't mind that much. I think the Silent Service has been grossly underestimated in WITP. Submarines should be a major concern. After all in reality the much of the entire Japanese merchant marine was put in the box by submarines, so I'd like to see submarines - of both sides - doing far more damage than they do in vanilla WitP.

...that said I am uneasy about the impact of Glen boats on all this.

I guess we'll have to see. There are a lot more ASW assets in AE as I understand it, so its not like its all in the submariners favour.

< Message edited by EUBanana -- 6/22/2009 3:42:00 PM >


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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/22/2009 8:21:55 PM   
Yamato hugger

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther Bait

Until the Allies get closer to Japan or the subs get radar, the react feature shouldn't be too much of a problem because there will not be much air patrol activity in the area. 



Well I have to disagree, at least in theory, with this. Let me preface this with admitting I have never gotten past mid-Jan 42 so far in testing and to my knowledge have never run up against enemy subs on react.

The allies hung on until late spring 42 at Bataan. As long as there are supplies in Bataan, you can fly PBYs. Manila starts the game with 27 boats and several more in and around the PI at start. From Dec 7 to the end of April 42 the US sank a total of 30 ships (by submarine). 6 in Dec, 7 in Jan, 5 in Feb, 7 in Mar, and 5 in Apr.

Now obviously I would have to run a few tests to see how this would play out with the allies using sub react from the start, but I suspect it will result in a lot more than 30 ships in 5 months.

Also, the Chinese have several ports that would be able to operate PBYs as well.

< Message edited by Yamato hugger -- 6/22/2009 8:23:44 PM >


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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 5:54:36 AM   
byron13


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther Bait

Until the Allies get closer to Japan or the subs get radar, the react feature shouldn't be too much of a problem because there will not be much air patrol activity in the area. 

So without patrol planes making contact reports, the subs won't have much to react to, except their own contacts in their own hexes. 


Why would subs not react to the spotting report of other subs? Why, with a deep picket, would subs deeper in the line not react very effectively to spotting reports of the first layer of subs?

If they would, it may be more effective to leave a solid line of stationary (i.e., not patrolling) subs to spot. It won't matter that the opponent spots and avoids the sub(s) in that first line so long as the sub spots the merchant. Subs two hexes back (whether stationary or patrolling) will react to the report and close on the merchant. Am I missing something? YH's description has subs reacting to reports from subs not carrying spotting a/c. Certainly having Glens would enable you to obtain the same results without a solid line of subs, but the Allies can afford the brute force approach.

Obviously, I don't know whether it works this way or not (if they'd send me a copy of the game, I'd be glad to test it out), but I can just picture a convoy penetrating a line of spotting subs, thinking it's managed to bypass them when, in fact, every sub within six hexes behind the spotters is cranking up to flank speed to intercept and give chase. It could get ugly.

< Message edited by byron13 -- 6/23/2009 6:05:37 AM >


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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 6:54:38 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

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Not to mention the subs on that line as well can be on react and join in. One of the other testers said something about packing 25 subs into the Makassar Strait and having a field day on ships going to Java. "A fair number" to use his words of APs and AKs sunk.

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 10:45:03 AM   
Sardaukar


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Question to YH, what sort of CAP and patrol % you guys use in AE? In WitP, it was very safe to have fighter units for 60% CAP (or even 80) and not get too fatigued. And one could have patrol units with 100% Naval Search without getting fatigued too badly.

But I guess it's quite different in AE, so I am curious, what sort of continuous % one could use and not get unit too fatigued in sustained operation?

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 12:00:38 PM   
Przemcio231


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Qestion about sub patrols when i set the way points the sub will circle around them till fuel runs out right???

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 1:06:26 PM   
Don Bowen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Przemcio231

Qestion about sub patrols when i set the way points the sub will circle around them till fuel runs out right???


For all TFs, including subs, you set patrol zone boundaries (one, two or three). One boundary is a stationary patrol, two and three a moving patrol. The TF will move to the first defined boundary, then cycle between them. One, linger for specified time, move to two, linger for specified time, move to three, linger, move to one, etc.

If react is specified, the TF will leave the patrol zone to chase down detected enemy TFs. Reasonable limits are applied, with small surface TFs not chasing after bigger ones and subs probably not following enemy TFs into restricted waters (depends on TF Commander ratings and random). Subs will probably not react to barge or PT TFs, nor to ASW ones (depends on detection levels).

A TF on patrol will continue to patrol until something forces it off the patrol zone. If it runs short of fuel or ammo, it will return to it's home base, refuel/rearm, and return to the patrol zone. Short of fuel check includes enough fuel to make it home, it does not hang on to the last drop of fuel. If sufficiently damaged, it will return to home port and auto disband. Messages are issues in the ops file when this happens.

READ YOUR OPS FILES!

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 1:35:38 PM   
Durbik


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Nothing would make me happier than reading my AE ops file...

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 1:40:55 PM   
Don Bowen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Durbik

Nothing would make me happier than reading my AE ops file...


When I read mine, my lips get tired.

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 2:22:45 PM   
Panther Bait


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I expect that subs would react to other sub contact reports, but you can only cover as many hexes as you have subs. Planes on naval search would spot a lot more TFs over a much larger swath of ocean.

Now packing 25 subs in the Makassar Straights might create some utter havoc, but I would think that 25 reacting 4-ship ASW TFs in the same area might cause some havoc as well, especially in all those shallow water hexes. And if there are 25 subs there, a player would have to be nuts to send ships through anyway. Send them the long way around Sumatra and have a 0% casualty rate, albeit with slower delivery rates. It sounds like an eggs-in-one-basket type situation.

Mike

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RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 5:19:16 PM   
Yamato hugger

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

Question to YH, what sort of CAP and patrol % you guys use in AE? In WitP, it was very safe to have fighter units for 60% CAP (or even 80) and not get too fatigued. And one could have patrol units with 100% Naval Search without getting fatigued too badly.

But I guess it's quite different in AE, so I am curious, what sort of continuous % one could use and not get unit too fatigued in sustained operation?


You can load up to 1/3 more pilots than your maximum number of planes, so I usually operate at 100%. As for CAP percentage, on my carriers I operate between 40% and 60% CAP depending on situation. In WitP if you wanted to fly LRCAP, it had to be at 100%. This is not true in AE. You can set this independently, so the Kaga for example is on 60% CAP (Over herself) and 40% on LRCAP over the invasion force off Fiji. You can also have some pilots training at the same time so in the above, if I had some rookie pilots on the Kaga, I could for example reduce her CAP to 40%, keep the 40% LRCAP, AND have 20% of her pilots training all at the same time.

For bombers you can do even more than that. You could for example have 30% on naval attack, 20% on naval search, 20% on ASW patrol, and 30% training. All these different missions are settable in 10% increments from 0 to 100%.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther Bait

I expect that subs would react to other sub contact reports, but you can only cover as many hexes as you have subs. Planes on naval search would spot a lot more TFs over a much larger swath of ocean.

Now packing 25 subs in the Makassar Straights might create some utter havoc, but I would think that 25 reacting 4-ship ASW TFs in the same area might cause some havoc as well, especially in all those shallow water hexes. And if there are 25 subs there, a player would have to be nuts to send ships through anyway. Send them the long way around Sumatra and have a 0% casualty rate, albeit with slower delivery rates. It sounds like an eggs-in-one-basket type situation.

Mike


I have yet to see an ASW force react to a sub, and I have had several instances now where a sub was positively identified within a hex or 2 of one of my ASW forces with a react set to 6. Also, I have never seen one of my subs react to an ASW force. Now personally I think that ASW should react to subs more often than subs reacting to other TFs. Personal opinion. But I happened across this too late to fix before release.

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RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 6/23/2009 5:49:36 PM   
HistoryGuy


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An interesting gamut of reactions to the Japanese air attack on Pearl Harbor. It appears most vessels opened fire fairly quickly with ready guns (predesignated weapons that were manned and ammunitioned) while more guns joined in once GQ sounded. Because they were in port for repairs, etc. some weapons were partially disassembled or lacked ammunition. That said, losing only eight planes does seem a bit low, even considering that a portion of the 29 total losses were attributable to USAAF fighters.

USS CALIFORNIA AAR:

0750 Sounded General Quarters and manned all battle stations, started setting Condition ZED.
0803 Commenced firing with M.G.s 1 & 2 (Ready Guns) on Torpedo Planes.
0805 Two torpedoes struck port side, frame 100, making a hole about 40' long, extending from the first seam below the armor belt to the bilge keel.
0810 Opened fire with 5" A.A. Guns #2 (Ready Gun) and #4 on Dive Bombers.
0820 A torpedo struck port side, frame 47, making an irregular hole covering an area about 27' X 32', the top of which is some 6' below the bottom of the armor belt.
0825 Opened fire on dive bombers with 5" A.A. and fwd. machine guns, and continued intermittent fire until end of attacks about 0915.
0840 Ship shaken by four (4) near bomb hits and splintered considerably by fragments.
0900 One (1) bomb (possibly a 15" A.P. projectile with tail vanes) struck abreast of Casemate #1, frame 59, penetrated to the second deck where it exploded in A-611, rupturing the forward and after bulkheads of the compartment, and the overhead into compartment A-705. The armored hatch leading into the Machine Shop was also badly sprung and could not be closed. A serious fire started about 0905 below main deck as a result.

USS NEVADA AAR:
Enemy air attack first observed at 0801. General quarters sounded immediately. Two machine guns forward and two aft were already on continuous watch. The 5" antiaircraft battery was partially manned for routine daily 0800 battery and fire control check.
At 0802 machine guns opened fire on enemy torpedo planes approaching in port beam. One plane was brought down by machine gun fire and crashed about 100 yards off Nevada's port quarter. One plane dropped a torpedo which struck the Nevada on the port bow.
At 0803 (about) 5" A.A. battery opened fire, local control, as guns were manned, and without waiting for control to be manned. These guns fired at torpedo planes, low altitude and high altitude bombers. Fire from these guns as well a .50 caliber machine guns, was almost continuous until 0820 when the attack slackened somewhat.
One torpedo plane was destroyed by .50 caliber machine gun fire about 0802 and fell about 100 yards on the Nevada's port quarter. The plane had not dropped its torpedo. A considerable number of persons saw this plane destroyed.
During the periods mention above, at a time undetermined, but probably about 0803, the port 5" broadside battery opened fire on low flying torpedo planes; Members of the Nevada crew state that this battery scored a direct hit on one of these planes, the shell probably striking the torpedo, resulting in the disintegration of the plane in midair.
Firing was intermittent until 0830 when a heavy bombing attack was made. Before getting underway at 0840, the forward machine guns are believed to have brought down three enemy torpedo planes that were strafing. These planes were said to have been hit within 200 yards of the ship.
Both A.A. batteries opened continuous fire on enemy planes until 0908. At this time the attack slackened.
About 0915 the 5" A.A. battery opened fire intermittently on enemy planes to the eastward. These planes, as far as is known, made no direct attack on Nevada.

USS PENNSYLVANIA AAR

First Call to colors had been sounded, when about 0757, explosions were heard on the end of Ford Island abreast drydock No. 1. When second explosion took place, it was realized that an air raid was in progress. Men started proceeding to their stations and "Air Defense" was sounded. Shortly after, general quarters was sounded. Condition "YOKE" was set as soon as stations were manned. In many cases men knocked off locks of ammunition ready boxes and ready stowages, not waiting for keys. 0802 - Attack by torpedo planes came in from West and South, attacking Oglala and Helena and battleships across the channel. Number of planes not recorded, estimate 12 or 15.

0802 to 0805 (Exact time not known). Pennsylvania commenced firing at enemy planes, – reported as first ship opening fire by personnel on board. All anti-aircraft batteries were rapidly brought into action. After release of torpedoes three planes came in low from the port beam, strafing Pennsylvania, – strafing attack not effective. During the torpedo attack, one enemy plane was observed to burst into flames about 2,000 yards on the starboard bow.

Dive bombing attacks, torpedo attack on Pearl Harbor and dive bombing attacks on Hickam Field continued.

Sometime between 8 and 8:30 a.m. the Nevada was observed to be getting underway and reached a point about on the Pennsylvania's starboard quarter, distant about 600 yards when a dive bombing attack was observed to approaching the Pennsylvania on the port bow, 10 or 15 planes coming in succession, low altitude. This was between 0830 and 0900. This attack apparently was directed at the Pennsylvania and the two destroyers in dock. These attacking planes were taken under heavy fire. Just before reaching Pennsylvania, about two-thirds appeared to swerve to the left, a number of them dropping bombs at the Nevada, with some misses ahead, some misses astern, and at least one hit apparently in the vicinity of the bridge. The Nevada was observed to stop.

At the same time, other planes of this attack passed to port and over the Pennsylvania and dropped bombs which fell in the water beyond the caisson. Except probably for machine gun bullets it is believed that the Pennsylvania was not hit during this attack.

One of the dive bombers dropped a bomb on the Shaw in the floating drydock, setting it on fire.

The Nevada was observed to slowly swing around, head to port and broadside to the channel, later drifting across the harbor, on fire forward.

During the period 0830 to 0915 - HIGH BOMBING ATTACK.

About 5 high bombing attacks were observed to pass over the Pennsylvania, one from the port bow, one from ahead and one from ahead passing to starboard, two from astern. These attacks were in "V" formation generally with from 4 to 6 planes in each formation, usually five. Formations maintained straight course and I estimate were at an altitude of 10,000 to 12,000 feet.

The first attack coming in from ahead and passing to starboard is believed to have bombed the battleships across the channel.

The second attack coming in slightly on the port bow dropped bombs on the ships in the drydock, one heavy bomb hit the destroyer Downes in the dock ahead of the Pennsylvania, one hit the dock approximately abreast frame 20 starboard of the Pennsylvania and one hit the boat deck of the Pennsylvania a few feet abaft 5"/25 gun No. 7, passing through the boat deck and detonating in the casemate of 5"/51 gun No. 9. The fifth bomb is believed to have struck the water outside the dock.

The third high bombing attack from ahead, appeared to drop bombs shortly after passing overhead on battleships across the channel.

The bomb hits on the Pennsylvania and Downes occurred at 0906.

All high bombing attacks were fired on by all batteries. 5" bursts appeared to have been accurate, but later it was estimated that fuze settings were too short and that the bombing formation was not being reached, perhaps by several thousand feet.

USS TENNESSEE AAR:

On Sunday, December 7, 1941, the U.S.S. Tennessee was moored starboard side to interrupted quay Fox 6, Pearl Harbor, Oahu, T.H., with two wire hausers and seven manila lines. The U.S.S. West Virginia was moored alongside to port with one wire hauser and seven manila lines. Boiler #1 was steaming for auxiliary purposes. Various units of the U.S. Pacific Fleet and various yard craft were present in the Harbor. Commander-in-Chief, U.S. Pacific Fleet was the Senior Officer Present. Commander Battle Force in the U.S.S.California was the Senior Officer Present Afloat. This ship was the Flagship of Commander Battleship Division Two. The U.S.S. Maryland was moored to quay Fox 5 and the U.S.S. Arizona (inboard) and the U.S.S. Vestal (outboard) were moored to quay Fox 7, these quays being about seventy-five feet ahead and astern respectively of the U.S.S. Tennessee. At about 0755, planes, observed to be Japanese by their markings, were seen dropping bombs on Ford Island. This ship went to general quarters and started setting condition Zed. Immediately, after the bombing of Ford Island, planes began torpedoing and bombing the battleships and other ships in the Harbor. This ship opened fire with 5" 25 caliber, 3" .50 caliber, and .50 caliber machine guns about five minutes after the first attack. Orders for sortie were received but later cancelled for battleships. This ship was ready to get underway with both plants and 6 boilers about 0930. Shortly after the attack began the Oklahoma, West Virginia, and California received torpedo hits. The Oklahoma listed over and in about 10 minutes capsized. The West Virginia listed heavily but was righted by counter flooding. The California listed. The Arizona received several large bomb hits at least one of which apparently penetrated the magazines. There was a large explosion forward. The foremast fell forward and burning powder, oil, and debris was thrown on the quarterdeck of the Tennessee. The Arizona settled rapidly by the bow. The Nevada got underway but was struck by bombs and torpedoes and grounded in the channel. Large fires were raging around the Arizona and West Virginia. The Arizona was moored to quays about seventy-five feet astern of the Tennessee and the West Virginia was moored to the Tennessee. The burning powder, oil, and debris from the Arizona explosion plus the intense heat from the fires started fires in the stern and port quarter of this ship. These fires and the subsequent wetting caused considerable damage to the wardroom and officers' quarters in this vicinity. The fires were brought under control about 1030. The Captain returned aboard about 1000 and resumed command. During the engagement the Tennessee received two bomb hits, one on turret III and one on the center gun of turret II. The hit on turret III wrecked the high catapult and penetrated the roof of the turret. The bomb broke into large pieces but did not explode. The explosive charge spilled into the turret and burned. Fragments of the bomb strongly indicate that it was a converted 15" armor piercing shell and weighed about 1500 to 2000 pounds. The training gear and rammers were damaged. The range finder was completely wrecked. Several casualties occurred as a result of this hit. Casualties will be listed separately. The hit on turret II split the hoop of the center gun, rendering it inoperative. Fragments from this hit caused casualties on the machine gun stations. The active fighting was over by about 1000 although small numbers of planes were observed and fired at through the day, no more bombs or torpedoes were observed.

USS WEST VIRGINIA AAR:

The Senior Surviving Officer was at the time of the engagement the Executive Officer. I was in my cabin just commencing to dress, when at 0755 the word was passed "Away Fire and Rescue Party". This was followed about thirty seconds later by "General Quarters"; at the same time, 0755, the marine orderly rushed into the cabin and announced "the Japanese are attacking us". Also, just at this time two heavy shocks on the hull of the West Virginia were felt. It seemed as if these shocks were somewhere forward on the port side.

By this time I had reached the Quarterdeck, and the ship was beginning to list rapidly to port. I proceeded along the starboard side until just forward of Number Three Turret, when there was a third heavy shock felt to port. The planes on top of Turret Three caught on fire, and there were flames all around the Turret Top. The quarterdeck sentry informed me that the Captain had already gone to he bridge, so I remained aft to assist in extinguishing the fire around Turret Three and on the quarterdeck. There was another heavy explosion at this time, that threw me flat on the deck. During all this time the ship was continuing to list to port, and at that time of this latest shock, I should estimate that the list was about 20° or 25° (this is purely an estimate). I called to the sound power telephone watch to tell Central to counterflood, but do not know whether or not this word got through.

Immediately following this latest explosion, I saw a flash of flame about fifteen feet high somewhere forward on the Arizona and had just gotten to my feet again when there was a terrific flash of flame from the Arizona, this second flash being higher than the foretop. Burning debris of sizes from a fraction of an inch up to five inches in diameter rained on the quarterdeck of the West Virginia.

During all of the above the ship's batteries continued firing, and shortly after the Arizona explosion, the list on the West Virginia stopped and she gradually started right herself. Meanwhile, efforts to push overboard the burning embers on the quarterdeck and to extinguish the fire on top of Turret Three and in the planes was continued. There was another heavy shock, distinguishable from the shock of the ship's own guns firing, and it was reported that a large fire had broken out amidships. I went in to the deck-house and found the repair parties already working against a fire, but without much success, as the fire increased by leaps and bounds. At this time, a Telephone Talker said "Central Station says Abandon Ship". As it was evident the fire fighting party had no chance to extinguish the fire, they were ordered to leave the ship. The fire had by then, from all appearances, from aft, isolated the after and forward parts of the ship. I went out on the port side of the quartered, and seeing on boats on that side went over to the starboard side. By this time the stern of the Tennessee was burning, and a wall of flame was advancing toward the West Virginia and the Tennessee from oil on the water from the Arizona. I looked around and saw no one else aft on deck and then I dove overboard and swam to the Tennessee.

USS HELENA AAR:

Planes were observed over Ford Island at about 0757. These were recognized as Japanese planes when at an altitude of about 4000 feet. The Officer of the Deck as promptly notified by C.A. FLOOD, S.M.1c, on watch on the signal bridge. This man has had recent duty on the Asiatic Station, and identified the character of the planes immediately. Ensign W.W. Jones, U.S.N., Officer of the Deck, without delay, turned on the general alarm and passed word over the general announcing system, "Japanese planes bombing Ford Island, Man all battle stations, break out service ammunition". (This time is fairly accurately fixed by the signalman in charge of watch, C.A. Flood, who was standing by the "Prep" signal for 0800 colors. It is confirmed by the Engineering log and also by H.F. Korloch, C.T.C., U.S.N., who had just relieved as gangway Security Watch; also by Ensign J.J. Armstrong, U.S.N.R., and Ensign W.W. Jones, U.S.N., who were in the process of relieving as O.O.D.). Helena guns were in action about 0801.
One torpedo observed to be fired by a torpedo plane flying low over the southern tip of Ford Island was fired at the Helena at a range of about 500 yards. This torpedo was fired about one minute after general quarters had been sounded, and about one and one-half minutes after the Japanese planes were sighted over Ford Island. Our crew were running for their general quarters stations. This accounted for a large loss of personnel by flash burns from the explosion and from concussion in passageways. No guns were yet in action and therefore no opposition to the Japanese plane. The torpedo struck with a violent explosion on the starboard side at approximately frame 75 about 18 feet below the water line.
About four near misses from bombs received from which there were a few fatal casualties and many minor injuries to personnel.
One strafing attack from which little damage was received. This was due to the very early period of the engagement in which the attack occurred. This attack was delivered just prior to the torpedo hit noted above, and was about the time general quarters were being sounded (0757), and for this reason the men had not reached their exposed machine gun stations on the top side.
Ammunition was expended approximately as follows: Five inch 375 rounds; 1.1"/75 3000 rounds; .50 caliber 5000 rounds.

USS CURTISS AAR

0750 General Quarters. Ship being straffed by fighter planes. Bomb hits observed on patrol plane hangar at the Naval Air Station and at Hickam Field. The Utah, Raleigh and Richmond were attacked with torpedoes. The Utah capsized.
0803 Curtiss commenced firing .50 cal. machine guns.
0805 Commenced firing 5" battery in local control. All guns ordered to "fire individually on any target making on offensive approach." All 5" and .50 cal. guns were firing continuously. Lighted off boilers number 1, 2 and 4.
0808 Ordered engine room "Underway emergency".
0825 Curtiss attacked by bombers. Bombers under heavy fire.
0827 Cut in boilers number 1, 2, and 4.
0835 Tested main engines. Engineering Department ready for getting underway.
0836 Sighted submarine periscope on starboard quarter, distance 700 yards. 5" guns ordered to "Fire on Submarine". #3 gun fired one shot over and two just short and directly at periscope. #2 gun opened fire.
0840 Submarine surfaced showing conning tower and section of bow. Submarine observed to fire one torpedo up North Channel toward destroyer. Conning tower hit twice by 5" shells from gun #3.
0842 Ordered "Cease firing on submarine".
0843 Monaghan (DD354) dropped two depth charges on submarine. Air bubbles and slick appeared.
0905 One of three planes pulling out of dive over Ford Island was hit by Curtiss, set afire, crashed into starboard side against #1 crane. Plane disintegrated, gas tank exploded and the plane burned on the boat deck. Crew of #3 gun was forced to abandon gun temporarily.
0912 Group of planes under heavy fire attacked Curtiss. During attack, one bomb hit stern mooring buoy, one fell short, one over, and one hit ship on starboard side of boat deck. The latter passed through the carpenter shop, radio repair shop, entered the hanger and detonated at the Main deck Level. The bomb destroyed bulkheads, decks, equipment and fixtures within a radius of 30 feet from point of detonation, and started numerous fires which destroyed equipment in hangar, upper handling room of #4 gun, battery ship, movie booth, and radio transmitter room. All fatalities occurred as a result of this detonation or from fires resulting from this hit. In this attack one plane was shot down about 1000 yards on the port bow, and one disintegrated from a hit 500 yards on port beam and one plane was shot down on port beam landing in the water off Pan American dock. These planes were later recovered. Another was reported to have crashed in the cane fields astern and one forward of the ship.
0927 After engine room out of commission and evacuated due to smoke, broken steam lines and water from overhead.
0928 Fired forward guns at planes passing high over head from bow to stern.
0936 First Lieutenant reported fires under control.

USS DOWNES
The attacking planes were sighted coming in out of the clouds at about 0755 by several men on deck including the Chief Petty Officer with the day's duty. The C.P.O. with day's duty immediately had general quarters sounded and notified the duty officer, Lieutenant (jg) J.D. Parker, U.S. Navy. The crew proceeded to their stations quickly, set condition Afirm, except where prevented from so doing by the temporary ventilation ducts forward, checked closure of sea valves, and began intensive efforts to prepare the ship for fighting. The machine guns were quickly prepared for firing and work was begun on assembling the breech plugs of the 5" battery. Ammunition details broke out ammunition for both the machine guns and the 5"/38 caliber. As there was no belted .50 caliber on board, two magazines of this ammunition were obtained from the Cassin in order that fire might be opened as soon as possible. Yard power was lost at 0810 which necessitated passing much of the 5" ammunition up by hand. Ammunition passers worked in total darkness until flashlights could be obtained, and as a result no tracer ammunition was located for the machine guns. Men not occupied, which included men of the engineers force and most of the 5" gun crews, were turned to belting machine gun ammunition. The speed with which this operation was carried out was most gratifying. The machine guns were firing within 15 minutes of the start of the attack. The 5" guns crews were retained in the ammunition supply and belting details until their guns could be made ready to fire.
After loss of yard power at 0810, several men of the engineers force under Chief Machinist's Mate JOHNSTON and Chief Electrician's Mate RAIDY succeeded in starting the emergency diesel generator. As the ship was in drydock, it was necessary to connect a hose to the fire main to supply circulating water to the diesel. This was done by the light of the battle lanterns. At 0823, the power and light load was taken by the emergency diesel generator. Switches were thrown to supply power to the ammunition hoists. The hoist for gun No. 2 was used thereafter in bringing up ammunition.
During the first hour the Downes was untouched. The first attacks were made by torpedo planes against the battleships. These were followed a few minutes later by horizontal bombing attacks on the battleships. During these attacks the Downes opened fire with machine guns, but the range was too great for effectiveness and fire was stopped. The horizontal bombers attacked in groups of about five planes each, at an altitude of about 9,000 to 12,0000 feet.
With the loss of yard power, no power was available for the operation of the 5" battery or director. However, as soon as gun No. 3 could be made ready (about 0845), it was loaded by hand and fired. This was a test shot to see how the ship would stand the shock of firing while drydocked. The test successful, Ensign Robinson, who had been in charge of the forward machine guns, took charge of gun No. 3 and stood by to open fire in local control. Ensign Stewart had been sent to control the after machine guns. Ensign Sebbo took control of the forward machine guns. Ensign Comly was in charge of the ammunition details. Lieutenant (jg) Parker directed operations from the bridge.
At about 0850, there was a lull of some six minutes. Lieutenant (jg) Parker was asked at this time if the Downes was ready for the dock to be flooded. After a quick check, he replied in the affirmative. Shortly thereafter, dive bombers attacked the ship. Three dive bombers came from the Southeast in a steep dive. They were immediately taken under fire by the forward and after machine gunners. Attempt was being made to get 5" gun No. 3 on the horizontal bombers attacking the battleships. Almost simultaneously with the first bomb hit, this gun got off one shot at the horizontal bombers. At 0827 the dive bombers dropped an incendiary bomb, which hit in the drydock between the Cassin and Downes about abreast of gun No. 4. Two men were killed outright. Fire enveloped the after part of the ship instantaneously. The diesel fuel oil tank was ruptured and set afire, and the emergency diesel generator stopped. The ship was now without power or lights. Flames spread very rapidly covering the after deck house and gun shelters. The heat was intense. The incendiary material used was described as a yellowish-green liquid. Fire hoses were quickly manned by the repair party and gun crews aft and water turned on the flames. The initial flow of water was inadequate; after this had been corrected, it was found that water was ineffective, spreading rather than reducing the fire.
It was soon evident that the fire was out of control. The engineroom was abandoned at 0912. Lieutenant (jg) Parker ordered the abandonment of the after part of the ship, however the flames were already driving the men off the ship. Orders were given to flood the after magazines, but it is not known whether this was accomplished or not. A few seconds later, at about 0920, the situation then being hopeless, Lieutenant (jg) Parker gave orders for all hands to abandon ship. Shortly after orders had been given to abandon ship another incendiary bomb hit between the Cassin and Downes abreast the bridge structure setting the quarterdeck and the forward part of the Downes afire. Lieutenant (jg) Parker attempted to make a personal check to see that all men were off the ship but was prevented from doing so by the flames, and was forced to leave himself. The flames, fed by diesel and fuel oil as well as the painted surfaces of the ship, and fanned by the wind, swept diagonally across the ship, setting it on fire from bow to stern.

Most of the men escaped over the brow which was located on the 02 deck just forward of the chart house but some men, finding themselves trapped aft, were forced to escape over the sides into the drydock. As the last survivors were leaving the ship a bomb, believed to be a small high explosive one, struck the bridge completely destroying the director platform, bridge, and chart house.
having released their bombs, the Japanese then made a strafing attack on personnel on the dock, but none were injured. Upon completion of these strafing attacks, some of the Downes men proceeded to the windward side of the dock to man yard fire hoses, others assisted in removing the wounded to the hospital or first aid stations, while several others, including two gunner's mates proceeded to the Marine Barracks to assist in giving out arms and ammunition. Two of the latter obtained guns and ammunition and returned to take up stations where they might fire on attacking planes.
Soon after the ship was abandoned, a terrific explosion occurred amidships, at torpedo tube number 3. After the fire had been extinguished it was discovered that the warheads in tube 3 had blown up leaving a large hole in the side and main deck in the vicinity of the tube mount and demolishing the number 2 stack. Fragments of the tube mount were found on the bow of the U.S.S. Pennsylvania.

USS Ontario AAR

At the time the attack occurred, this vessel's allowance of small arms (12 Springfield rifles and 6 .45 cal. colt automatic pistols) were served out and the ammunition from the Abandon Ship Locker was broken out and issued. Members of the deck force were given all rifles and opened fire on all low flying enemy planes. No hits were observed. Ammunition for the pistols was borrowed from the U.S.S. Sicard.
The ship's one (1) Lewis machine gun was mounted and as soon as ammunition for it could be borrowed from the U.S.S. Sicard (inboard of this vessel), pans were filled and fire was opened on low flying enemy planes.
As this vessel has no steel helmets, none having been sent to Samoa, from whence this vessel has recently arrived, all personnel not actually engaged in firing upon enemy aircraft were ordered to take shelter as numerous bomb and shrapnel fragments were falling all about.
All fire hoses were lead out and the ship was placed in material readiness for battle.



(in reply to Jim D Burns)
Post #: 499
RE: If you gotta go... - 6/23/2009 5:58:50 PM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger


You can load up to 1/3 more pilots than your maximum number of planes, so I usually operate at 100%. As for CAP percentage, on my carriers I operate between 40% and 60% CAP depending on situation. In WitP if you wanted to fly LRCAP, it had to be at 100%. This is not true in AE. You can set this independently, so the Kaga for example is on 60% CAP (Over herself) and 40% on LRCAP over the invasion force off Fiji. You can also have some pilots training at the same time so in the above, if I had some rookie pilots on the Kaga, I could for example reduce her CAP to 40%, keep the 40% LRCAP, AND have 20% of her pilots training all at the same time.

For bombers you can do even more than that. You could for example have 30% on naval attack, 20% on naval search, 20% on ASW patrol, and 30% training. All these different missions are settable in 10% increments from 0 to 100%.


I have yet to see an ASW force react to a sub, and I have had several instances now where a sub was positively identified within a hex or 2 of one of my ASW forces with a react set to 6. Also, I have never seen one of my subs react to an ASW force. Now personally I think that ASW should react to subs more often than subs reacting to other TFs. Personal opinion. But I happened across this too late to fix before release.


Great news about those settings, pity that ASW TFs don't seem to react tho.


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Post #: 500
RE: If you gotta go... - 6/24/2009 6:04:33 AM   
byron13


Posts: 1589
Joined: 7/27/2001
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

If it runs short of fuel or ammo, it will return to it's home base, refuel/rearm, and return to the patrol zone.



(I haven't kept up on the naval thread) You mean it acts kinda sorta like a CS convoy where the TF will automatically go home, refuel/rearm, and then return to its patrol zone? If so, kewl!


quote:



You can set this independently, so the Kaga for example is on 60% CAP (Over herself) and 40% on LRCAP over the invasion force off Fiji. You can also have some pilots training at the same time so in the above, if I had some rookie pilots on the Kaga, I could for example reduce her CAP to 40%, keep the 40% LRCAP, AND have 20% of her pilots training all at the same time.

For bombers you can do even more than that. You could for example have 30% on naval attack, 20% on naval search, 20% on ASW patrol, and 30% training. All these different missions are settable in 10% increments from 0 to 100%.


Totally kewl !

RE the sub thing, one dampener I failed to mention is the sub will have to pass its leadership check to react. No one knows the algorithm probably. What's it primarily based on? Aggressiveness? So not every sub nearby will react. Well, I'll be interested to see if this is a problem.

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Post #: 501
Enterprise hit! - 6/27/2009 8:47:49 PM   
Yamato hugger

 

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He came in with the Enterprise and Lex trying to get to the New Caledonia landing force. The Hiryu/Soryu (hex 1) launched strikes and hit the Enterprise. The CVL group (hex 2) was under weather and didnt participate although the combat report says that some of their CAP was dirverted. Counterstrike on Hiryu hit nothing. The Lex launched an afternoon raid at a BB force (hex 3) getting 1 1000 SAP bomb on the Mutsu. She currently has 1 sys damage on her that could have been from moving. Suffice it to say Mutsu wasnt impressed.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Noumea at 108,162

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 120 NM, estimated altitude 32,050 feet.
Estimated time to target is 45 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 14
B5N2 Kate x 13
D3A1 Val x 25



Allied aircraft
F2A-3 Buffalo x 3
F4F-3A Wildcat x 11


Japanese aircraft losses
B5N2 Kate: 4 destroyed, 3 damaged
D3A1 Val: 1 destroyed, 6 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
F4F-3A Wildcat: 1 destroyed

Allied Ships
CV Enterprise, Bomb hits 2, on fire
CA Salt Lake City
CA Northampton



Aircraft Attacking:
16 x D3A1 Val diving from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb
4 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo
8 x D3A1 Val diving from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb
1 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo

CAP engaged:
VF-2 with F2A-3 Buffalo (0 airborne, 2 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 30000 and 33200.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 43 minutes
VF-6 with F4F-3A Wildcat (3 airborne, 8 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 32000 and 33000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 33 minutes
4 planes vectored on to bombers



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Belep Islands at 106,157

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 15 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 28



Allied aircraft
F2A-3 Buffalo x 3
F4F-3A Wildcat x 11
SBD-2 Dauntless x 34
SBD-3 Dauntless x 26
TBD-1 Devastator x 11


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
SBD-2 Dauntless: 3 destroyed, 10 damaged
SBD-3 Dauntless: 2 destroyed, 11 damaged
TBD-1 Devastator: 1 destroyed, 7 damaged

Japanese Ships
CV Hiryu
BB Kirishima
CA Nachi
CV Soryu
CA Chikuma



Aircraft Attacking:
12 x SBD-3 Dauntless diving from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
10 x SBD-2 Dauntless diving from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
10 x TBD-1 Devastator bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 2 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
13 x SBD-3 Dauntless diving from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
16 x SBD-2 Dauntless diving from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb

CAP engaged:
Zuiho-1 with A6M2 Zero (3 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(7 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 4 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 32150
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 24 minutes
4 planes vectored on to bombers
Soryu-1 with A6M2 Zero (3 airborne, 7 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 32810 , scrambling fighters between 17000 and 32000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 13 minutes
Hiryu-1 with A6M2 Zero (0 airborne, 8 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 3 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 32810 , scrambling fighters between 8000 and 9000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 13 minutes
7 planes vectored on to bombers


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< Message edited by Yamato hugger -- 6/27/2009 8:50:17 PM >


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Post #: 502
RE: Enterprise hit! - 6/27/2009 9:51:55 PM   
Fishbed

 

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Hell, that was quite an anti-climatic fight... Does weather have an impact on the efficiency of dive-bombing and torpedo-bombing? Can we believe the "severe storm" and "heavy rain" factors played a large role into foiling the strikes on both ends? Does it explain why the combat report has the bombers attacking in droves instead of smaller groups?

Thanks in advance :)


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Post #: 503
RE: Enterprise hit! - 6/28/2009 4:47:51 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

Posts: 5475
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Allied carriers withdrawing toward New Zealand. They launched an ineffective am strike against a CL squadron bringing landing troops to Norfolk Island for no effect. If thats the best he can muster after 1 strike vs 2 carriers, he will be hard pressed to survive the attack by 8 that is closing in from the north and north east. Normally I shy away from bringing my carriers in so close to a major base, but he hasnt had time to reinforce it.




Morning Air attack on TF, near Norfolk Island at 113,170

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid spotted at 47 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 18 minutes


Allied aircraft
F2A-3 Buffalo x 2
SBD-2 Dauntless x 6
SBD-3 Dauntless x 7
TBD-1 Devastator x 8


Allied aircraft losses
SBD-2 Dauntless: 2 damaged
SBD-3 Dauntless: 3 damaged
TBD-1 Devastator: 5 damaged

Japanese Ships
CL Natori
CL Kuma



Aircraft Attacking:
7 x SBD-3 Dauntless diving from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
6 x SBD-2 Dauntless diving from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
8 x TBD-1 Devastator launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 22in Mk 13 Torpedo

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< Message edited by Yamato hugger -- 6/28/2009 4:48:04 AM >


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Post #: 504
RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 6/28/2009 4:53:02 AM   
Chad Harrison


Posts: 1395
Joined: 4/2/2003
From: Boise, ID - USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HistoryGuy

An interesting gamut of reactions to the Japanese air attack on Pearl Harbor. It appears most vessels opened fire fairly quickly with ready guns (predesignated weapons that were manned and ammunitioned) while more guns joined in once GQ sounded. Because they were in port for repairs, etc. some weapons were partially disassembled or lacked ammunition. That said, losing only eight planes does seem a bit low, even considering that a portion of the 29 total losses were attributable to USAAF fighters.

. . .



HistoryGuy, I just wanted to thank you for all of your very informative posts. I know the AE team has been especially grateful for your help, but the rest of us appreciate it too!

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Post #: 505
Enterprise is hit! - 6/28/2009 4:56:16 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

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The situation at Canton Island:




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Post #: 506
RE: Enterprise is hit! - 6/28/2009 5:02:07 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

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Malaya. He did a full Sir Robin and left these 3 bases undefended, so I took them with para assaults and railed 4 divisions plus support on down. They are now marching overland on Singapore.




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Post #: 507
RE: Enterprise is hit! - 6/28/2009 5:07:10 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

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Panzer Armee Burma begins its move to Rangoon. These are tankers of the 1st and 2nd armored divisions from Manchuria. The RTA (Royal Thai Army) is heading in the back door towards Mandalay.




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Post #: 508
RE: Enterprise is hit! - 6/28/2009 5:11:27 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

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Southern PI. There are no allied ground units left on this map.




The only troops he has left in the PI are at Bataan. I have the 16th and the 48th just moved in this turn. The 33rd and 38th (and a whole lot of arty) will be joining then soon.

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< Message edited by Yamato hugger -- 6/28/2009 5:12:57 AM >


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Post #: 509
RE: Enterprise is hit! - 6/28/2009 5:18:30 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

Posts: 5475
Joined: 10/5/2004
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Aleutians: Last game I landed a regiment here and it was met soon after by a SCTF built around the Colorado, so this time I landed with 1 airfield company and a sub flotilla patrols the waters. I sank an AG north of Adak a few turns ago, so I suspect he has troops on Kiska. I had planned to take the base and then transfer control to Japanese Defense Command and put a Mavis squadron in, but it wont let me change control of the base so it will take a few turns to transfer some recon planes up.

Edit: Cancel that. Just figured out how to do it. If you change command of the ground unit, you can then change command of the base, so there is now a Mavis squadron stationed here. One of the ones that "cant leave Japan"




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< Message edited by Yamato hugger -- 6/28/2009 5:22:55 AM >


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