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RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 7:55:17 PM   
pad152

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

pad, note that aircraft production is 18*(# of engines). A two engine aircraft costs 36 HI for the airframe and an additional 36 HI for the engines.

Also note that the aircraft and engine production is for a month. Divide their totals by 30 to get the average daily production cost.

I also don't believe R&D costs HI. There's been debate about that for years.


It's tough to count apples and oranges if you can't tell the apples from the oranges!

Isn't the number of engines is the same, regardless if they are used for 2 engine aircraft or 1 engine aircraft?

Single engine aircraft is (18 Hi Engine + 18 Hi Airframe) = 36 Hi total

Two engine aircraft is (36 Hi engine + 18 Hi Airframe) = 54 Hi total.

So the Hi Number of 26711/30 = 890 daily and the total Hi produced 1,025 is daily ?

So Japan starts with a surplus of (30750 - 26711) = 4039 Hi per month?

Japan has an extra capacity of 112 (4039/36) single engine aircraft?


Is man power daily or monthly?

The manual does not clearly state which numbers are daily or monthly?

(in reply to Mike Solli)
Post #: 841
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 8:08:56 PM   
Mike Solli


Posts: 15792
Joined: 10/18/2000
From: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
Status: offline 		Here's the explanation from the manual on aircraft production (pg. 232):

For aircraft to be built, there must be Heavy Industry in the pool equal to 18 times the number
of engines required to build each plane; when a plane is built, the appropriate number of Heavy
Industry is consumed. For example, to produce a 2 engine plane, 36 Heavy Industry will be
consumed, while a single engine plane consumes 18 Heavy Industry.

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Post #: 842
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 8:10:04 PM   
Mike Solli


Posts: 15792
Joined: 10/18/2000
From: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
Status: offline 		Manpower is produced daily.  Note that there is no cost.  This is a change from WitP.

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Post #: 843
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 8:12:18 PM   
Mike Solli


Posts: 15792
Joined: 10/18/2000
From: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
Status: offline 		Off the top of my head, aircraft and engines are monthly production and everything else is daily production.

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Post #: 844
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 8:36:27 PM   
pad152

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Here's the explanation from the manual on aircraft production (pg. 232):

For aircraft to be built, there must be Heavy Industry in the pool equal to 18 times the number
of engines required to build each plane; when a plane is built, the appropriate number of Heavy
Industry is consumed. For example, to produce a 2 engine plane, 36 Heavy Industry will be
consumed, while a single engine plane consumes 18 Heavy Industry.


Mike I still can't tell what is the total cost in HI for 2 engine aircraft?

Two engine aircraft is it A or B?

A. (36 Hi engine (2 * 18) + 18 Hi Airframe) = 54 Hi total.

or

B. (36 Hi engine (2 * 18) + 36 Hi Airframe) = 72 Hi total.




(in reply to Mike Solli)
Post #: 845
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 8:38:01 PM   
Xargun

 

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From: Near Columbus, Ohio
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Off the top of my head, aircraft and engines are monthly production and everything else is daily production.


Correct - Engines and Aircraft are produced daily, but the factory size is based on monthly production.

Xargun

(in reply to Mike Solli)
Post #: 846
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 9:01:01 PM   
Mike Solli


Posts: 15792
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quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Here's the explanation from the manual on aircraft production (pg. 232):

For aircraft to be built, there must be Heavy Industry in the pool equal to 18 times the number
of engines required to build each plane; when a plane is built, the appropriate number of Heavy
Industry is consumed. For example, to produce a 2 engine plane, 36 Heavy Industry will be
consumed, while a single engine plane consumes 18 Heavy Industry.


Mike I still can't tell what is the total cost in HI for 2 engine aircraft?

Two engine aircraft is it A or B?

A. (36 Hi engine (2 * 18) + 18 Hi Airframe) = 54 Hi total.

or

B. (36 Hi engine (2 * 18) + 36 Hi Airframe) = 72 Hi total.






Xargun, it's B. It costs 36 HI for the airframe and 36 HI (2*18) for the two engines for a total of 72 HI to produce a 2E plane.

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Post #: 847
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 9:35:27 PM   
Mynok


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That's why they call it HI: Headachicus Instantanius.

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(in reply to Mike Solli)
Post #: 848
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 10:36:15 PM   
pad152

 

Posts: 2871
Joined: 4/23/2000
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli


quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Here's the explanation from the manual on aircraft production (pg. 232):

For aircraft to be built, there must be Heavy Industry in the pool equal to 18 times the number
of engines required to build each plane; when a plane is built, the appropriate number of Heavy
Industry is consumed. For example, to produce a 2 engine plane, 36 Heavy Industry will be
consumed, while a single engine plane consumes 18 Heavy Industry.


Mike I still can't tell what is the total cost in HI for 2 engine aircraft?

Two engine aircraft is it A or B?

A. (36 Hi engine (2 * 18) + 18 Hi Airframe) = 54 Hi total.

or

B. (36 Hi engine (2 * 18) + 36 Hi Airframe) = 72 Hi total.






Xargun, it's B. It costs 36 HI for the airframe and 36 HI (2*18) for the two engines for a total of 72 HI to produce a 2E plane.



So if your aircraft production is 380 airframes, there is no way to figure out the cost in Hi because, you can't tell how many are single engine, two engine or four engine!

What I'm trying to do is the figure out the cost of production (ship yards, aircraft, engines, armaments, etc.).

Is there anyway to tell if production exceeds the total amount of Hi for the month?




(in reply to Mike Solli)
Post #: 849
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 10:48:00 PM   
Mike Solli


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152
Is there anyway to tell if production exceeds the total amount of Hi for the month?


Yup, keep track of your HI pool each day and see if it increases or decreases.

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Post #: 850
RE: Japan Production - 8/24/2009 11:58:26 PM   
pad152

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli


quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152
Is there anyway to tell if production exceeds the total amount of Hi for the month?


Yup, keep track of your HI pool each day and see if it increases or decreases.


I don't understand, HI pool is the amount of produced by heavy industry, why would it go up/down by increasing aircraft production?

Doesn't the amount remain constant? (Resources + Fuel = Hi), why would that change if producing 5 aircraft or 50?



(in reply to Mike Solli)
Post #: 851
RE: Japan Production - 8/25/2009 2:47:17 AM   
erstad

 

Posts: 1944
Joined: 8/3/2004
From: Midwest USA
Status: offline 		Mebbe I missed it, but no-one pointed out the biggest boo-boo.

1025 is not your starting HI production, it is your starting stockpile.

7180 is the starting HI production.  (which produces 14360 HI points/turn)


(in reply to pad152)
Post #: 852
RE: Japan Production - 8/25/2009 7:18:13 AM   
ussdefiant

 

Posts: 60
Joined: 6/18/2009
Status: offline 		A minor problem for the Japanese in Scenario 2:

The Tony goes and starts production in 42/11, but their engines don't start getting made until 43/02.

(in reply to erstad)
Post #: 853
RE: Japan Production - 8/25/2009 9:33:24 AM   
steveh11Matrix


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Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline 		Hmmm. Do the Japanese store the airframes, or do they just not produce the Tony until the engines are available?

(How many P-51A got converted from Allison engines to Merlins? Just asking... )

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Post #: 854
RE: Japan Production - 8/25/2009 5:04:07 PM   
Xargun

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: steveh11Matrix

Hmmm. Do the Japanese store the airframes, or do they just not produce the Tony until the engines are available?

(How many P-51A got converted from Allison engines to Merlins? Just asking... )


I don't believe the airframe will be built without engines. So no engines available, then no aircraft will be built. Whole Aircraft and Engines can be stored, but not just airframes.

Xargun

(in reply to steveh11Matrix)
Post #: 855
RE: Japan Production - 8/25/2009 6:24:10 PM   
Mike Solli


Posts: 15792
Joined: 10/18/2000
From: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
Status: offline 		Xargun is correct.

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Post #: 856
RE: Japan Production - 8/25/2009 6:59:32 PM   
pad152

 

Posts: 2871
Joined: 4/23/2000
Status: offline 		Request: Change the color (red?) for factories that are turned off

Example: I turned off production of the E13A1 Jake but, the Air and Engine Production screen still shows I'm building 27 of them!

(in reply to Mike Solli)
Post #: 857
RE: Japan Production - 8/25/2009 7:18:57 PM   
pad152

 

Posts: 2871
Joined: 4/23/2000
Status: offline 		Request: Bring back the engine totals

The player now has manualy count the number of factories that are producing a specific engine type, to know how many engines of each type are being build.

Bring this back from WITP.





Attachment (1)

(in reply to pad152)
Post #: 858
RE: Japan Production - 8/26/2009 2:49:41 PM   
Xargun

 

Posts: 3690
Joined: 2/14/2004
From: Near Columbus, Ohio
Status: offline 		Any of the Devs care to answer this question I posted in the War Room here ?

Thanks

Xargun

(in reply to pad152)
Post #: 859
RE: Japan Production - 8/26/2009 3:38:59 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		In the manual there is a nice table that lists all of the bases along with critical the information about island size and terrain type. This is important for planning because in-game you can only see this information for bases you already own, not for enemy bases.

Luganville is missing from the table!

(in reply to Xargun)
Post #: 860
RE: Japan Production - 8/27/2009 4:07:42 AM   
erstad

 

Posts: 1944
Joined: 8/3/2004
From: Midwest USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152

Request: Bring back the engine totals

The player now has manualy count the number of factories that are producing a specific engine type, to know how many engines of each type are being build.

Bring this back from WITP.


This info is on the aircraft/Engine Production pool screen.

A handy tip is to sort on the engine column, you can see the engines and the planes using that engine next to each other.

(in reply to pad152)
Post #: 861
RE: AE Map, Base, Economic Issues - 8/28/2009 7:28:47 PM   
Pascal_slith


Posts: 1651
Joined: 8/20/2003
From: back in Commiefornia
Status: offline 		Sorry if this has already been brought up, but just got my AE edition and have perusing the map and bases.

As I mentioned in earlier forums on WitP, there is far too much fuel available in many bases at the start of the game (and there is not enough in PH). I still have an old .doc file I did for WitP with the proposed corrected amounts. The PH amount, for example, is based on the testimony in the Congressional hearings on Pearl Harbor (available on-line). The rest is available from the Pacific Fleet combat command summaries. Nimitz often mentioned that his biggest worry was fuel, and often complained of the lack of fuel in major ports (including the Australian ones; Sydney, e.g., is indicated as having only 5000 tons of bunker fuel a couple months into the war).

Also, as defined in the past, many islands with a port level of 1 should be a port level of 0 at the start (e.g. many French islands, the US Channel Islands, etc.), unless the game assumes a simple, small pier to be a port of level 1. Most islands did not have anything. Offloading was simply done over the side or 'beached'.

I'll post the details soon.



< Message edited by Pascal -- 8/28/2009 7:30:27 PM >

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Post #: 862
RE: AE Map, Base, Economic Issues - 8/28/2009 8:39:20 PM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline 		I don't know if this has ben mentioned yet, but shouldn't Howland Island have a level one airstrip? There was the airstrip that Amelia Earhart planned to use, was it so overgrown already by war start as to be a level zero? 

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Post #: 863
RE: AE Map, Base, Economic Issues - 8/28/2009 10:50:47 PM   
Pascal_slith


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

I don't know if this has ben mentioned yet, but shouldn't Howland Island have a level one airstrip? There was the airstrip that Amelia Earhart planned to use, was it so overgrown already by war start as to be a level zero? 


The best sources on the development (both pre-war and during the war) is the official Naval Administration history called "Building the Navy's Bases in World War II" (2 volumes) and Gordon Rottman's "World War II Pacific Island Guide".

Here is the link for Building the Navy's bases: http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/Building_Bases/index.html



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Post #: 864
RE: Japan Production - 8/29/2009 1:50:41 AM   
pad152

 

Posts: 2871
Joined: 4/23/2000
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quote:

ORIGINAL: erstad


quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152

Request: Bring back the engine totals

The player now has manualy count the number of factories that are producing a specific engine type, to know how many engines of each type are being build.

Bring this back from WITP.


This info is on the aircraft/Engine Production pool screen.

A handy tip is to sort on the engine column, you can see the engines and the planes using that engine next to each other.



No it's not the same thing, you don't see the monthly totals! Bring back the table that shows the totals of engines produced and engines needed.





(in reply to erstad)
Post #: 865
RE: Japan Production - 8/29/2009 7:29:20 AM   
erstad

 

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From: Midwest USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152

No it's not the same thing, you don't see the monthly totals! Bring back the table that shows the totals of engines produced and engines needed.



The rate column is the (estimated) monthly total.






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< Message edited by erstad -- 8/29/2009 7:30:10 AM >

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Post #: 866
RE: AE Map, Base, Economic Issues - 8/29/2009 9:27:59 AM   
bradfordkay

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Pascal


quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

I don't know if this has ben mentioned yet, but shouldn't Howland Island have a level one airstrip? There was the airstrip that Amelia Earhart planned to use, was it so overgrown already by war start as to be a level zero? 


The best sources on the development (both pre-war and during the war) is the official Naval Administration history called "Building the Navy's Bases in World War II" (2 volumes) and Gordon Rottman's "World War II Pacific Island Guide".

Here is the link for Building the Navy's bases: http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/Building_Bases/index.html




I checked the link that you posted and could not find any reference to Howland Island.

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Post #: 867
RE: AE Map, Base, Economic Issues - 9/1/2009 2:16:08 AM   
Pascal_slith


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay


quote:

ORIGINAL: Pascal


quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

I don't know if this has ben mentioned yet, but shouldn't Howland Island have a level one airstrip? There was the airstrip that Amelia Earhart planned to use, was it so overgrown already by war start as to be a level zero? 


The best sources on the development (both pre-war and during the war) is the official Naval Administration history called "Building the Navy's Bases in World War II" (2 volumes) and Gordon Rottman's "World War II Pacific Island Guide".

Here is the link for Building the Navy's bases: http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/Building_Bases/index.html




I checked the link that you posted and could not find any reference to Howland Island.


Howland was occupied on 11 August 1943. No one there beforehand.

Check this link (often an excellent source if you can at least get the "limited view" version of a book):

http://books.google.com/books?id=ChyilRml0hcC&printsec=frontcover&dq=intitle:guide+inauthor:rottman&lr=&as_drrb_is=q&as_minm_is=0&as_miny_is=&as_maxm_is=0&as_maxy_is=&as_brr=0#v=onepage&q=&f=false

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Post #: 868
RE: AE Map, Base, Economic Issues - 9/1/2009 5:38:34 AM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
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Status: offline 		Since I don't have a copy of that book, and the link provided did not mention Howland Island in the pages available for viewing, I still haven't seen anything that tells me anything either way about this question.

You say that Howland Island was occupied on 11 August 1943 and that noone was there before that. Okay, fine... did Earhart intend to just land on a deserted beach and hope that she wouldn't crash? This doesn't make much sense for a otherwise fairly carefully planned "round the world" flight. Was it all just a well publicized suicide? If there was no airstrip there why was it chosen to be her refueling point?


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Post #: 869
RE: AE Map, Base, Economic Issues - 9/1/2009 5:53:04 AM   
Pascal_slith


Posts: 1651
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Status: offline 		Don't know much about Earhart.

If you want to find the references in the limited preview to Howland Island, just type "Howland" in the search box when you're on the page. This book does not talk about Earhart and I don't have my complete copy handy.

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Post #: 870
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