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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/5/2009 2:01:18 PM

mgarnett

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quote:

Marc that is a superb post - thanks. I really am liking the looks of the new iMac's and Mac Pro's. I can see no price differential between macs and high end PC's now.

I just want something that is simple, safe, inuitive and powerful. I can easily see myself running Adobe on a Mac, Mac versions of MS Office and all the Mac specific video and sound editing programs rather than having to fork out for separate editing and burning programs.

How exactly does bootcamp work then? Do you have to have XP loaded on the Mac? Is this a special XP version? And if it's XP, why isn't the system vulnerable to Windows viruses etc?

Another dumb question, does a Mac run Windows Media files?

Hi Adam,

I have provided a short explanation as to how Parallels and Bootcamp work a couple of posts up.

Cheers

Mark

(in reply to Noypi53)

Post #: 31

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/16/2009 10:25:20 AM

Marc von Martial

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quote:

I have read of guys successfully installing Vista & even Windows 7 but have not done it myself.

I never tried Vista, but Windows 7 works great under Bootcamp and also as a virtual OS setup.

Any version would do, IIRC latest Parallels also supports the 64bit versions.

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Post #: 32

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/16/2009 10:43:56 AM

Marc von Martial

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quote:

ORIGINAL: L�tzow

Around 1991 I owned a i486 for office work and gaming, and a Mac IIfx for Desktop Publishing. The Apple rig was about fourfold in price and due to it's architecture one couldn't easily switch hardware devices, like graphic board or processor, but had to call on service for every intervention. While OS 7 has been more stable than Windows 3, it did not let you interfere with programs as Norton Utilies / PCTools, or simple editing of .ini files. I don't know if or how this has changed, but back to the day the whole philosophy of Apple was, to keep control of their already expensive systems in order to subsequently charge customers for everything an ambitious user could do for himself.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc von Martial

> while a PC user can simply download at youtube

Sorry I do not follow you there?

You can legally download music videos from youtube by using Firefox browser plugin.

Well, well, well. You make assumptions of modern Macs based on your stone age old experience with Macs

1991 is long ago. The whole mainstream desktop world was in its infant shoes back then. Heck I was still using my Amiga in 1991.

As for youtube, well. First off, you need to customize Firefox under Windows to be able to do so. It does not come out of the box what you describe as a point ;)
Safari can also be customized. Greasekit is the magic word (Greasemonkey is the Firefox equivalent). And then again you can just use Firefox as replacement for Safari

And for Youtube videos all you need in Safari is this little bookmarklet:
http://googlesystem.blogspot.com/2008/04/download-youtube-videos-as-mp4-files.html
And you even get the mp4 file with that, not a nasty vlc

So as you see, most "points" people bring up against Macs or Mac Os are purely based on being not up to date or uninformed at all.

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Post #: 33

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/16/2009 9:27:13 PM

GoodGuy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc von Martial

So as you see, most "points" people bring up against Macs or Mac Os are purely based on being not up to date or uninformed at all.

I am not sure about that. A few years ago, I tinkered with Macs at a time when DTP and sound applications, which were meant to be installed on OS 9, just loved to crash on me on the then new OS X, which alledgedly offered downward compatibility. On quite some instances, i had to reset the G-(5?) machine, because the rig froze. OS X was not an option for quite a while, if you depended on a stable and reliable machine for your business or serious hobby.

Same with Mac OS Version 10.6 :
While you can even run PowerPC applications on OSX, using Rosetta - a built-in emulator/dynamic binary translator on OSX for Intel systems, as it translates G3, G4, and AltiVec instructions, you can't run those apps on OSX which had been programmed for the G5 instruction set, specifically.
OS X 10.6 does not support Adobe Creative Suite 3, for example, so owners of CS3 have to spend a Grand and get CS4, in case they want to install the newest OSX.
There is a huge list containing Apps and the few Games for the Mac, (reminds me of the lists floating around when XP had been released), trying to evaluate what would work on 10.6 and what not. There are also quite some video/sound tools which would start on 10.6, but which would not let the user access either some or any of the functions. Quite some Mac media apps insist on intel-based Macs (boxee, etc.) these days.

Owners of a ton of OS 9 apps can't run their major programs on OSX, and they depend on the developers of the particular programs to offer crossgrades or create compatibility patches. The latter usually won't happen.
While this partially happened to PC users when they upgraded from Win98 to XP, this kind of missing downward compatibility happened to Mac users at least twice, since OSX had been released in 2001, and Apple keeps adding new functions and (potential) incompatibilities with each major update. Selling OSX 10.6 for 25 bucks may not help there, if you have to upgrade expensive applications like CS3 or similar.

Regarding the price:
Desktop Macs are overpriced. Basically, you do pay extra, for the design, the brand name and maybe even for the reputation, very well.
A custom PC will always be way cheaper than a Mac, but even ready-made stuff from let's say Gateway or Dell will be cheaper. There are quite some Apple products where you either depend on the Apple service center (e.g. to exchange the storage-battery in Iphones) or on overpriced Apple spare parts, whereas - with a PC - you just replace the particular part from a random shop in your area.
The worst Mac I ever saw was the Mac Cube. While the basic idea, to have a passive cooling solution (no fans inside), appeared to be pretty neat, the Cube was terribly underpowered and it had only one or 2 memory slots, so upgrades were pretty limited. It looked good, it was small, but it didn't offer much value for the bucks.
The most recent CPUs and chipsets for PC systems will always be faster and cheaper (if you consider the performance, and the ability to put in hardware upgrades, you get for your money) than Mac systems, unless Apple would switch to what I'd call an "open case" policy for their Macs, giving the Mac user the freedom to put in the hardware HE wants to use.
But in this case, Apple's right to exist (at least as a computer hardware-manufacturer) would diminish, as they could then just restrict themselfs to publish their operating system, which in fact, is more advanced (and powerful), in theory, due to its unix core. This advantage, though, is often undermined by the fact that a new Mac's CPU or video performance is often below the actual tech level of the most recent PCs (which aren't necessarily from the High-End category).

Macs are an interesting option for people who aren't tech-savvy enough or who can't be arsed to run a protected and safe XP environment (eg. disabling services, configuring firewalls, reduce risk of a virus/hacker attack). But since Apples are getting more popular, Mac users will see an increasing number of virus attacks and security exploits.
If you compare the OS X and XP/Windows 7 workflow, OSX has some minor advantages, but if you look at the applications, it's rather just a "religious" question, if you want to use 2-3 mouse buttons and a wheel, or an Apple mouse with one button. I'm using a 5-button mouse, and the workflow on my PC is even faster than on a Mac with OSX, now. Windows 7 may even be more like a mac, as quite some things had been stripped off and simplified.

Stability: It's a myth that macs are more stable. And IF a mac freezes, you really have to reboot it, you can't just kick the task like in XP/Win7 :P (correct me if i am wrong, Marc

).

< Message edited by GoodGuy -- 9/16/2009 10:55:39 PM >

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Post #: 34

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/16/2009 10:11:36 PM

Hertston

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Macs are an interesting and overly expensive option (they have the looks though, I'll give them that). For cheap and totally grief-free home computing I thoroughly recommend Ubuntu Linux on desktop or notebook. The only reason I have a Windows PC at all is gaming.

(in reply to GoodGuy)

Post #: 35

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/16/2009 10:16:24 PM

V22 Osprey

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Well, the only reason is to get a mac is the Apps, you have to admit you can't beat mac when it comes apps.Some of the apps even on my iphone I wish I had on my laptop.

Other than that though, a Mac is just a PC.It's uses the same damn parts, it just has slick looking case and an apple logo on it and different OS.$2200 I get an I Mac with:
3.06 Intel Core 2 Duo(Ok, this isn't a core i7, plus it even isn't a Quad)
4 GB RAM
1 TB storage
GT 130 512MB

I'm getting this straight from the Mac site.Now, with a PC I could easily(I repeat EASILY) put in Liquid cooling, dual GTX 260's, Core i7, and blue ray for the same amount of money or even less if you know where to look.

EDIT:I'm not basing this off alienware, expense wise, they are just as guilty as Mac IMO.(So don't throw Alienware in my face)

< Message edited by V22 Osprey -- 9/16/2009 10:21:19 PM >

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Post #: 36

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/17/2009 10:01:35 AM

Marc von Martial

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Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Bonn, Germany
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quote:

ORIGINAL: GoodGuy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc von Martial

So as you see, most "points" people bring up against Macs or Mac Os are purely based on being not up to date or uninformed at all.

I am not sure about that. A few years ago, I tinkered with Macs at a time when DTP and sound applications, which were meant to be installed on OS 9, just loved to crash on me on the then new OS X, which alledgedly offered downward compatibility. On quite some instances, i had to reset the G-(5?) machine, because the rig froze. OS X was not an option for quite a while, if you depended on a stable and reliable machine for your business or serious hobby.

OSX was a major step, almost like from Windows 95 to Windows 98.
With regards to the new 10.6 and people not getting the cut that has to be done. Well it would be the same as asking for major applications written for Windows 3.1 to work on Windows 7.

quote:

OS X 10.6 does not support Adobe Creative Suite 3, for example, so owners of CS3 have to spend a Grand and get CS4, in case they want to install the newest OSX.

Which is a pitty I agree, however since CS3 is a great package you could either wait for CS5 or simply not use OS 10.6. It is not that you ned 10.6 right now :)
As for the update price from CS3 to CS4, well I paid 500$ for that on Amazon ;)

quote:

There is a huge list containing Apps and the few Games for the Mac, (reminds me of the lists floating around when XP had been released), trying to evaluate what would work on 10.6 and what not. There are also quite some video/sound tools which would start on 10.6, but which would not let the user access either some or any of the functions. Quite some Mac media apps insist on intel-based Macs (boxee, etc.) these days.

And at the same time you get updates for 10.6 compatibility on a daily basis. My apps all work now, and I had minor issues with some plugins / scripts that digged deep into the OS, I did not expect them to work when I upgraded.

quote:

Owners of a ton of OS 9 apps can't run their major programs on OSX, and they depend on the developers of the particular programs to offer crossgrades or create compatibility patches. The latter usually won't happen.
While this partially happened to PC users when they upgraded from Win98 to XP, this kind of missing downward compatibility happened to Mac users at least twice, since OSX had been released in 2001, and Apple keeps adding new functions and (potential) incompatibilities with each major update. Selling OSX 10.6 for 25 bucks may not help there, if you have to upgrade expensive applications like CS3 or similar.

The 10.6 upgrade is not something you have to install. Nobody is forced at gun point here. However if you upgrade the OS works even faster and more stable and ha s few nice additions. Apple had to do the cut to get into 64bit. The time for such a big thing is never right. And incompatibilities with such a step are to be expected.

quote:

Regarding the price:
Desktop Macs are overpriced. Basically, you do pay extra, for the design, the brand name and maybe even for the reputation, very well. A custom PC will always be way cheaper than a Mac, but even ready-made stuff from let's say Gateway or Dell will be cheaper.

I was talking about workstations.

quote:

There are quite some Apple products where you either depend on the Apple service center (e.g. to exchange the storage-battery in Iphones) or on overpriced Apple spare parts, whereas - with a PC - you just replace the particular part from a random shop in your area.

I talked about this earlier already. A Mac is as easy to repair yourself as a PC is. You can get spareparts online and you get instructions online. I did repairs myself several times. For a few bucks on spareparts. Apples service center is just as overpriced as any hardware manufacturers service center, or let's say the BMW or Mercedes direct service, that is where these guys can make some money, if you pay for that extra money it is your own fault

quote:

Macs are an interesting option for people who aren't tech-savvy enough or who can't be arsed to run a protected and safe XP environment (eg. disabling services, configuring firewalls, reduce risk of a virus/hacker attack)

.

I did built my own PCs for almost a decade. I would call myself tech and security savy. The switch to Mac however freed up a lot of time for me that I otherwise had to put into repairing the PC or the OS. In 5 years I never had to reinstall the OS a single time or repair a single part on the MacPro, it simply runs and runs and runs and runs.
It feels like any task, from simply plugin in a guest Laptop into your WIFI to major cleaning up the OS is all way simpler and easier to handle then on any Windows system I used. I'm not religious about Apple or MacOs, but for me it simply is a major time saver.
Not to speak of the huge ammounts of RAM I can put in the machine and actually use it

quote:

But since Apples are getting more popular, Mac users will see an increasing number of virus attacks and security exploits.

I tend to agree, however Macs are already popular and still there is not much viruses etc. around.

quote:

If you compare the OS X and XP/Windows 7 workflow, OSX has some minor advantages, but if you look at the applications, it's rather just a "religious" question, if you want to use 2-3 mouse buttons and a wheel, or an Apple mouse with one button. I'm using a 5-button mouse, and the workflow on my PC is even faster than on a Mac with OSX, now. Windows 7 may even be more like a mac, as quite some things had been stripped off and simplified.

You are joking about the mouse buttons right? The Apple Mighty Mouse has more then one button (this one button thing is from the stoneages) and you can use any other mouse you want, with full button support.

I agree on Windows 7, I have it installed under Parallels and I really kind of like what I see. Well, see in terms of the OS, not it's visuals

quote:

Stability: It's a myth that macs are more stable. And IF a mac freezes, you really have to reboot it, you can't just kick the task like in XP/Win7 :P (correct me if i am wrong, Marc ).

I said above that Mac OS is not perfect.
Macs can freeze, yes, I witnessed this 2 times in 5 years powerusing mine. That were freezes were you simply had to pull the plug. However, if you do that nothing breaks

Task kicking? Man this is way easier, reliable and even more stable under MacOS. It is called "Force Quit", if you do it it quits the process even in such a way that you can restart the app without having to reboot the whole OS. You can even kill the "Finder" restart it and continue to use it. Now try to do that with the Windows "Desktop".

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Post #: 37

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/17/2009 10:35:12 AM

L�tzow

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If both platforms are equal in regard to hardware nowadays, one could simply purchase a retail version of Apple's OSX and install it on his PC. There would be no reason to buy a genuine Mac anymore, unless he wants it for the the design factor.

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Post #: 38

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/17/2009 1:59:30 PM

Marc von Martial

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quote:

ORIGINAL: L�tzow

If both platforms are equal in regard to hardware nowadays, one could simply purchase a retail version of Apple's OSX and install it on his PC. There would be no reason to buy a genuine Mac anymore, unless he wants it for the the design factor.

hackintosh

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Post #: 39

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/17/2009 2:54:11 PM

killroyishere

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PC's as always are clearly the game winner when it comes to Mac vs PC. Next comes cost. You can get so much more from a PC than you can a Mac when you breakdown costs of hardware. Stability comes from the software and drivers used to run it so there's no real competition here between the two stabily competition comes from the designers of software complying with the OS of the specific computers. Does Dosbox work on a Mac? Will Macs run PC games without an emulator? PC's are the clear winners hands down. You couldn't give me a Max because if you did I would just sell it and buy lots of new hardware or games for my PC.

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Post #: 40

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/17/2009 6:17:16 PM

Marc von Martial

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quote:

Stability comes from the software and drivers used to run it so there's no real competition here between the two stabily competition comes from the designers of software complying with the OS of the specific computers.

Sorry, I have to object. Stability very well comes also from hardware itself. Prime example RAM.

quote:

Does Dosbox work on a Mac?

There is even a MacOs version of Dosbox.

quote:

Will Macs run PC games without an emulator?

Yes with either Bootcamp or Parallels or any of the other solutions.

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Post #: 41

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/17/2009 9:58:47 PM

Nikademus

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quote:

ORIGINAL: L�tzow

If both platforms are equal in regard to hardware nowadays, one could simply purchase a retail version of Apple's OSX and install it on his PC. There would be no reason to buy a genuine Mac anymore, unless he wants it for the the design factor.

IIRC, Apple does not allow that option.

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Post #: 42

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/18/2009 2:18:47 AM

killroyishere

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quote:

Yes with either Bootcamp or Parallels or any of the other solutions.

Sounds like emulators to me. Because Mac is not a PC and thus must use a secondary programs to operate PC programs.

Plus I've never had stability issues with RAM. All the stability issues I've ever had have been with drivers and either hardware developers not complying or the OS not compatible with the drivers. I've had no hardware issues with PC vs RAM or bios or any other onboard hardware. Besides bad ram would be the same in either computer system. Bad ram is bad ram it has nothing to do with the OS.

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Post #: 43

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/18/2009 3:49:31 PM

noxious

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Hey, use google and check it out : modern Macs can double boot windows, just like a PC does windows/linux.
They are PCs without a legacy BIOS, it's the one and only difference hardware wise with a DOS/Win PC.
Thus why it can run Windows XP and higher natively.

I was running a (raw) developer version of MacOS X on a standard PC 12 frikkin' years ago, it always ran on PCs, will run on standard PC if you know what you're doing (not supported by Apple)

So instead of trying to find fault with Macs, do yourself a favour and try to learn a few things or two.
Parallels is a virtualization system, just like what is used by the 64 bit versino of Windows to run 32 bit program, not emulate them.
Bootcamp is a boot manager, like LILO, or the Windows boot menu.

I don't own a modern Mac at the moment, only a Toshiba laptop running Vista 64
No fanboi of Apple at all, quite the contrary, but at least that doesn't taint my judgement.
Sheesh !!

< Message edited by noxious -- 9/18/2009 3:53:25 PM >

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/18/2009 4:05:42 PM

Nikademus

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I'm not a fan of Parallels as it caused a number of glitzes on the Macbook we were using. It also took a huge preformance hit when trying to use Adobe software for Windows. Bootcamp is neat....and free, and there's no preformance hit since your only operating one OS at a time. Mostly trouble free. Like anything....not perfect though..... A bootcamp attempt on GF's new Imac caused the primary hard drive volumes to corrupt and could not be fixed using the Mac tools available. Had to reformat the entire drive and reinstall OS-X. That did not make the GF unit happy and she has currently forbidden any immediate attempts to reinstall XP on the Imac. On the laptop though...never had a problem though if you want to install SP3 for XP you have to ensure you have the latest version of Bootcamp otherwise you'll get an error msg that there's not enough memory or some such for the install to continue.

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Post #: 45

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/21/2009 9:25:13 AM

Marc von Martial

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quote:

ORIGINAL: killroyishere

quote:

Yes with either Bootcamp or Parallels or any of the other solutions.

Sounds like emulators to me. Because Mac is not a PC and thus must use a secondary programs to operate PC programs.

Not an emulator at all. Simply a tool to access your Windows XP (which is installed and works on the Mac, just like on a PC) directly without the need to actually shut down your running MacOS. So basically you are running two OS at the same time. If you want without even noticing it.

If you want, but it is not the primary use of Parallels, you can install almost any OS in a virtual hardrive too. So you can either use it as boot manager or virtualizer.

quote:

Plus I've never had stability issues with RAM. All the stability issues I've ever had have been with drivers and either hardware developers not complying or the OS not compatible with the drivers. I've had no hardware issues with PC vs RAM or bios or any other onboard hardware.

Just because you did not have them does not mean they do not exist and my point that hardware causes also stability issues would not be valid

Be thankfull, there might be the day hardware problems hit you.

quote:

Besides bad ram would be the same in either computer system. Bad ram is bad ram it has nothing to do with the OS.

Right, but where did I say it is not happening on Macs (or other plattforms)?

< Message edited by Marc von Martial -- 9/21/2009 9:29:49 AM >

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/21/2009 12:24:06 PM

GoodGuy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nikademus

quote:

ORIGINAL: L�tzow

If both platforms are equal in regard to hardware nowadays, one could simply purchase a retail version of Apple's OSX and install it on his PC. There would be no reason to buy a genuine Mac anymore, unless he wants it for the the design factor.

IIRC, Apple does not allow that option.

What's the name of the Stick manufactured by a Swiss company? You just need a Mac OS and you're ready to go.
For quite a while the Stick only worked on certain PC mainboards erm hmm some manufacturer starting with "E" .. Epox? Elitegroup?
The Stick totally emulates a Mac, with the performance of a recent Mac (or even better), with the sugar (that you can use most recent PC hardware and upgrade the CPU) on top. !

I forgot the name of the stick.

Whatsoever, Apple was pretty quiet when being asked by magazines what they think about that genuine stick. If I'm not mistaken, Swiss and German laws don't follow EULA rules that restrict users to install an OS on a certain hardware/brand, so it's totally legal here. Apple said "no comment".

< Message edited by GoodGuy -- 9/21/2009 1:18:13 PM >

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Post #: 47

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/21/2009 1:13:52 PM

GoodGuy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc von Martial

quote:

Stability comes from the software and drivers used to run it so there's no real competition here between the two stabily competition comes from the designers of software complying with the OS of the specific computers.

Sorry, I have to object. Stability very well comes also from hardware itself. Prime example RAM.

Ram? You either have quality RAM strips, or cheap "no-name" RAM with faulty SPDs or address ranges. If the mainboard and its chipset is well designed - this goes for Mac boards and PC boards alike, RAM shouldn't have any stability issues.
Didn't you just state that Macs use more similar hardware or even PC hardware than some people think?

If so, you end up with the very same RAM that's being used in PCs, with most (if not all) desktop Macs. You should then also mention that Macs act allergic when they are fed with certain PC-RAM strips, forcing the users to look for Mac certified strips, so your "prime" example may indicate that Macs can be quite picky with some PC hardware, no?

With the exception of ASUS PC mainboards (which tend to dislike no-name RAM), I didn't come across picky PC boards, yet.

Unstable RAM is either a result of faulty RAM (mostly faulty SPD units on the memory-strip) or a result of the bad design of a controller chipset. While recent PCs still offer some downward compatibility even down (or back - if you will) to the DOS era, the hardware employed these days is really powerful. Astounding transfer rates exclusively seen in Apple's SCSI systems for years had been matched by SATA systems quite some time ago.

Stability stands or falls with the quality of the OS and its architecture, and with the quality of the application written for a particular OS. If the hardware strictly complies with international specs, it shouldn't produce any instability these days. It's usually the software (OS or App) that fails or that creates instabilities.
Instabilities are often assumed to be caused by hardware, but - especially with PCs- they mainly use to be caused by the inability (or unwillingness) of software developers to cater for many different hardware mixes. On top of that some hardware manufacturers provide badly programmed drivers or their hardware design causes conflicts with other hardware not included/present during driver testing.

Confusing? Well, but that's how I think things work these days.

Performance or a performance advantage comes from hardware. This could be seen in RISC CPUs when they were compared to PC CPUs, back then. Software (and OS) performance can be enhanced and optimized too, but only within the specs boundaries of the employed hardware.

That brings up a question in my mind: Can you upgrade Mac Pros?
(CPU, soundcards)?

I wonder, can Macs use DDR3 RAM? Afaik, Mac Pro's accept DDR2 RAM since 2008, at least.

< Message edited by GoodGuy -- 9/21/2009 2:05:58 PM >

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---
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8th of August, 2006

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Post #: 48

RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/21/2009 8:22:58 PM

Marc von Martial

Posts: 10875
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From: Bonn, Germany
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quote:

ORIGINAL: GoodGuy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc von Martial

quote:

Stability comes from the software and drivers used to run it so there's no real competition here between the two stabily competition comes from the designers of software complying with the OS of the specific computers.

Sorry, I have to object. Stability very well comes also from hardware itself. Prime example RAM.

Ram? You either have quality RAM strips, or cheap "no-name" RAM with faulty SPDs or address ranges. If the mainboard and its chipset is well designed - this goes for Mac boards and PC boards alike, RAM shouldn't have any stability issues.
Didn't you just state that Macs use more similar hardware or even PC hardware than some people think?

I really wonder where people read that I said this can not happen with Macs?
Yes mostly it is RAM that is faulty or overheating that causes such stability issues. Proper in order RAM should not of course. Sorry if I was not specific anough in my short sentence

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/21/2009 8:33:12 PM

Marc von Martial

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GoodGuy

That brings up a question in my mind: Can you upgrade Mac Pros?
(CPU, soundcards)?

I wonder, can Macs use DDR3 RAM? Afaik, Mac Pro's accept DDR2 RAM since 2008, at least.

You can upgrade CPUs, it is not official but it is well documented in the "secret" Apple Maintenance book

. You can upgrade video cards.
I'm not sure about an "upgrade" for the soundcard, but I rarely upgraded a sound card on a PC either.

The new "March 2009" Mac Pro's use DDR3 RAM, my Macbook Pro does either. The older models, as my Mac Pro use DDR2 RAM.

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/23/2009 4:36:36 PM

Nikademus

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how difficult is an Imac to take apart?

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/23/2009 5:10:06 PM

killroyishere

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Here's some million dollar questions. Can the MAC run 4800x resolutions? Can you build a MAC from scratch? (I want a link to the parts catalog), Can a MAC run 24mb of memory? Recently Intel developed the i7 which has no FSB does MAC have the same? Last but not least what are the costs differences between the two? I can build a very powerful PC for 2/3rds the cost of retail can that be said of MACS?

If we really look at the MAC deep down it is just "copying" the PC. They realized the PC has the market. MACS without the PC ability are nothing and only a handful of people would buy them without the PC element. So, let's put the credit where the credit is due. PC rules and MACS are just 2nd best.

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/23/2009 5:47:14 PM

Nikademus

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"2nd Best"

I'd say based on my experiences that which computer runs better depends on which specific application is being used. As mentioned, the Adobe program suite seems to be better written for OS-X and runs mostly without the slowdowns and crashes experienced with the Windows version. On the same token, the animation app "Maya" seems to be the opposite, with the port for OS-X being (according to my GF) deliberately made poor in comparison to the PC (Windows) version. This latter app hogs all of GF's IMac memory and doesn't allow other apps to run in the background otherwise it locks up the computer.

< Message edited by Nikademus -- 9/23/2009 5:50:29 PM >

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/23/2009 11:38:45 PM

V22 Osprey

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Guys,

Come on now.....a Mac is a PC.A mac just has a slicker look case, weird mouse with no right click, different OS and the big Apple logo on the side.They use the exact same parts.That said, without Companies like Intel, AMD, and Nvidia coming out with new hardware for PCs, Macs would nothing.I hate it when people classify Macs as separate from PCs, they are the exact same thing.That's like me building a custom computer, slick case, my own little logo and make my own OS and I can call it "iOsprey" and say it's better and separate from PCs.

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/23/2009 11:46:53 PM

GoodGuy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nikademus

...the Adobe program suite seems to be better written for OS-X and runs mostly without the slowdowns and crashes experienced with the Windows version.

CS3 never crashed on my Quad AMD (still using XP with SP3).

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/25/2009 12:23:27 PM

Marc von Martial

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*sigh*

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/25/2009 2:18:03 PM

Nikademus

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lol...

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 9/25/2009 7:29:47 PM

mllange

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http://hacknmod.com/hack/how-to-install-snow-leopard-on-your-pc/

Just install the O/S on your PC and there ya go.

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RE: Mac vs PC? - 11/26/2009 4:37:32 AM

vanmathi

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Macs are great for music and DJing and Partys and making videos and grapics. Also macs have better secity. They dont get viruses like windows. You can kind an mac for years. If you would like windows By a mac and just buy a window vista/XP software to operate those OS on your mac. And Windows they will be good for just any thing but they are not as cool and they get to many virus and repairs. Macs are SO easy. Google Why should I get a mac and you will agree
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RE: Mac vs PC? - 11/27/2009 6:21:02 AM

pepsi

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depends what u wanna do. if you want to do word processing,gaming,music storage. get a PC. If u want to do basic stuff and video and music editing, get a mac. Lol I like to ask mac users if they want to play minesweeper lol. If you do get a mac, please do not become a overly obssessed apple fanboy. both have pros and cons
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